# Other Discussions > Bodybuilding / Fitness / Nutrition >  Fatigue in the gym and muscle deterioration on finasteride

## BigThinker

Just kiddin'.

Hit 170 lbs for the first time in my entire life today -- up from 155 in mid-Jan.  Not sure about my bf&#37;, but it's not egregiously high.

Looking for people to be critical of my physique (especially Davey, since homeboy is pretty jacked and obviously well-versed on gains and getting cut.)

Looking for exercises that target the muscle groups you feel I'm lacking.  Until I go full time, I'm limited to a gym with 2 machines and free weights (keep that in mind with suggestions).

Anyways, sorry to have been a bit facetious with the thread title.  Give me the good, the bad, and the ugly (besides the hairloss  :Wink: ).

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## Proper

Are you looking to be bigger overall? Stronger? Not to look scrawny? Beach body? If bigger, I'd say you're doing well if you continue and keep upping the weights. Also, I think you would look overall better if your chest was bigger. Mawr bench! Also I think you'd look rockin' with more trap size. But I dont know what your goals are so I'm just stating what I believe would look smexy.

For me, I built my shoulders, traps, and arms fairly big and maybe somewhat unproportional for my frame but since im always at a low bodyfat, it looks good (looks good to me that is). Im still lacking a bit on chest but I've been straying a bit from the traditional bench and doing dumbell presses. It's actually been improving a lot faster (the shape of chest more defined like the line going through middle) than hitting the bench week after week but it does get harder adding those increments of ten pounds past the 70lb dumbells.

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## BigThinker

Yeah, I'm trying to get the tapered V-shaped upper body.  Really wanting to broaden my shoulders and increase my presence.  So, deltoids and traps are probably the most important.

Upper body in general I'm trying to blow up.  Trying to drop my BF a little bit - I have a gut right now.

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## Proper

Nice! I've been recently trying the same thing. I always trued workibg out for the tapered look but couldn't get it when I was trying for it. After I stopped caring, I started hitting heavy on tbar rows close grip and seated rows close grip. Ever since, my lats have been growing.

Before that I was always under the impression that the wide grips was where its at like wide grip pull ups, lat pull downs, wide grip bent over rows. I may have been performing the exercises wrong an plus when the wide grips I couldn't do as much weights as I did with close. Ever since upping the weights tremendously from wides to close, lats have been growing. Everyone responds differently to different exercises so it couldve been just me.

I don't think you have that much if a gut from what I'm seeing but if you plan on lowering bodyfat more like what you say, you'd look pretty awesome (no homo) And even more hardcore, once you get those delta and traps alone.

Here you go. CT FLETCHER!

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/video...Mw12079eDJXFx7

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## BigThinker

Ha, dude.  That video made my day.  Can't wait to get out of the pansy complementary gym in my building, and into a real gym.  Everything I'm doing now is just preparation for that.

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## Diesel15

> Just kiddin'.
> 
> Hit 170 lbs for the first time in my entire life today -- up from 155 in mid-Jan.  Not sure about my bf%, but it's not egregiously high.
> 
> Looking for people to be critical of my physique (especially Davey, since homeboy is pretty jacked and obviously well-versed on gains and getting cut.)
> 
> Looking for exercises that target the muscle groups you feel I'm lacking.  Until I go full time, I'm limited to a gym with 2 machines and free weights (keep that in mind with suggestions).
> 
> Anyways, sorry to have been a bit facetious with the thread title.  Give me the good, the bad, and the ugly (besides the hairloss ).


 If you're looking for more of the V-shape the easiest way by far is get a pull-up bar and actually use it.  Even if you can't do real pull-ups initially, do 10 sets of negatives (at least 5 seconds but longer if you can manage) every other day for 2 weeks and I promise you'll notice a difference.  Your pecs look like they could use some work as well.  Try decline dumbell presses.  The most effective chest building exercise I've ever tried.  I would also suggest adding some lower body work.  Squats and deadlifts are the most effective and will help you cut some fat.  Most guys on here tend to be more on the nerdy side so the explanation for this is simple and something I think you can relate to.  You are moving heavier weights a larger distance and thus doing more "work".  It recruits more muscle fiber to do more work and thus burns more calories and produces more after-burn.  Plus you'll have a much more balanced look than the guy with 18" biceps and 15" thighs.

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## BigThinker

I actually do have access to a pull-up bar and I never use it.  I'm sure I can do a fair amount of the real deal too.  Do you do multiple sets, one set with max reps, or as more of a burn-out sort of exercise ideally?

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## Diesel15

That's somewhat debatable.  What I've found to be the most effective is 3 sets.  I would start with a single set and establish what your max single set is.  I would take that number and subtract 2-3 reps and try to do 3 sets of at least that many.  I rest 120 seconds in between but you can play around with that.  The last set I always do a burnout and finish with 5 negatives.  You'll see some pretty rapid gains using this strategy initially if you're anything like me.  I've now started to mix in once a week a single set of one rep where I aim for 30 seconds up and 30 seconds down.  It doesn't seem like much but it's super intense and great for your biceps as well.

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## Aames

Yeah, I think you'll really notice better results when you have access to a full gym. You seem to have a good frame so I think you'll be able to get a nice v-taper once you build up lats, delts, etc. and lower your bf a bit. I would put you in the mid to high teens currently if I had to take a stab at it.

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## BigThinker

> Yeah, I think you'll really notice better results when you have access to a full gym. You seem to have a good frame so I think you'll be able to get a nice v-taper once you build up lats, delts, etc. and lower your bf a bit. I would put you in the mid to high teens currently if I had to take a stab at it.


 Yeah, I love free weights because they promote strengthening of your stabilizing muscles as well as perpetuate forearm and hand strength.  However, I find myself losing motivation while standing in front of a rack of dumbbells for 45 min straight.

My roommate has had massive gains in the last 6 months (130 -170 lb), so I'm excited to get a membership where he is at and following a comparable routine.  Plus, it's in Uptown Mpls, which is where all the young honeys are at -- there's something motivating about having girls around you while you lift, obviously.

Anyways, I've completely cut out empty calories from my diet and am decreasing my calorie intake overall.  I'm not "fat", but I do have excess.

Man, if I get cut and finasteride stops my hair loss, I'll be one happy hombre.

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## Proper

Im rootin for you.

You're right about the dumbells. While they do promote stability along with forearm strength, just hitting the barbell would intensify it much more because you can lift heavier. 

Yes, you can press 80 lbs dumbells but that just means you could be pressing 205ish on the bar. More weights, more weights! More!!! So from having 160 lbs pushing down on you, you now have 205.

Which is why squats and deadlifts are so radical. Razzle those dazzles!

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## dex89

> Many an extra rep has been done because I knew a cute cardiobunny was mirin' me from afar. It's definitely a good motivating factor.


 Competing for strength is also a great motivation. Nothing is more satisfying then lifting 20 pounds more then a huge Roided dude that is busting is balls on a work out routine.

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## BigThinker

> Competing for strength is also a great motivation. Nothing is more satisfying then lifting 20 pounds more then a huge Roided dude that is busting is balls on a work out routine.


 Dex!  What's up, my guy?  How's everything going with finasteride?

I'm getting close to two months already.

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## Aames

> Many an extra rep has been done because I knew a cute cardiobunny was mirin' me from afar. It's definitely a good motivating factor.


 Pathetic. I get extra reps when I remember that Zyzz watches over me from Mount Olympus.

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## Davey Jones

So what'cha mean by free weights?  What are your dumb bells up to?  And is there a good spot to deadlift?  If you have a bench, a good spot to deadlift, and dumbbells up to 100lbs (or 120lbs ideally), then your gym shouldn't hold you back much.

If I had to recommend one thing to anybody working out, it'd be to deadlift.  If you don't know where to start, go with this:

http://www.ontariostrongman.ca/resou...dl_program.xls

I don't actually have MS Office/OpenOffice on my computer right now, so I can't open that, but that's the one I downloaded when I started that program.  If I remember right, it's as simple as putting in your current max (and _maybe_ a projected max) and then doing exactly what it says.  Once a week, and make sure to warm up fairly well.  Romanian deadlifts, barbell rows, and lat pull downs are good accessory exercises if you've got some energy left to drain after that.   The deadlift is so lat heavy, you'll definitely get a V-taper.  And you'll get sick growth hormone benefits (from deadlift and any other big lift).  It sounds hard to believe, but deadlifting will make every single muscle in your body grow better, even the ones it doesn't specifically hit (and there really isn't a lot that deadlift doesn't hit anyway).  There is just no good reason to not be deadlifting.

If I had to give two pieces of advice, the second would be to look in to upper/lower splits.  And I could do a third, fourth, fifth, etc. all day, but if you want to keep things simple, start that deadlift program, like, tomorrow.  You'll start getting gains and you'll start craving it.  Nothing is better for the brain than a deadlift PR.  I recommend psyching yourself up really hard too.  It seems ****ing stupid, but if you're trying to hit a one rep max, imagine yourself as a ****ing vocano about to explode, throwing the bar in to ****ing outer space.  Or anything equally retarded.

I feel like I've got some pretty good diet advice too, but I was a fruitarian for 8 months, so no body listens to my bs anyway.  Just go deadlift!

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## BigThinker

Hey Davey,

Thanks, man.  I was excited to see your response.

The dumbbells max out at _50 pounds_, so basically worthless.

"It sounds hard to believe, but deadlifting will make every single muscle in your body grow better, even the ones it doesn't specifically hit" is not crazy at all, dude.  Same with squats.

But yeah, main thing is I have dumb bells up to 50 pounds, and I hate machines.   I hate guided motion.

I'm just going to get a gym membership.  Don't have time for that worthless complementary "get-small" gym.

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## Aames

> Hey Davey,
> 
> Thanks, man.  I was excited to see your response.
> 
> The dumbbells max out at _50 pounds_, so basically worthless.
> 
> "It sounds hard to believe, but deadlifting will make every single muscle in your body grow better, even the ones it doesn't specifically hit" is not crazy at all, dude.  Same with squats.
> 
> But yeah, main thing is I have dumb bells up to 50 pounds, and I hate machines.   I hate guided motion.
> ...


 Yeah, gyms like that are borderline useless for lifting. Find a fully-equipped real gym with barbells, squat-racks, etc. Then check out my resource thread to get your diet in order. Drop a message on my wall if you ever have any questions on nutrition. I have spent more time than I care to admit on nutrition/lifting forums over the past year.

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## dex89

> Dex!  What's up, my guy?  How's everything going with finasteride?
> 
> I'm getting close to two months already.


 Hey BigThinker, sorry for the late reply friend. Fin is holding it for me at the moment. I'm currently taking it every other week or 3 times a week. I was shedding for a while, because of stress but now I'm back to normal.

How's Fin treating you?

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## BigThinker

> Hey BigThinker, sorry for the late reply friend. Fin is holding it for me at the moment. I'm currently taking it every other week or 3 times a week. I was shedding for a while, because of stress but now I'm back to normal.
> 
> How's Fin treating you?


 Doing good, bro.  Can't tell if I have sides or not.  Seems like I might be less horny and more tired, but not enough for me to quit.  I'm still taking it everyday, but thinking about toning it down to every other day to see if I feel different.  Started minox last week.

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## BigThinker

Makin' gains bros.  I told someone I'd update this thread.  I'm up like 8 pounds since I started lifting (with lower body fat, for sure), which actually occurred after I started fin or there was at least a strong overlap.

So, balding brothers, get to the gym.  Even if you're in the early stages, you should be getting your finances in order, your body ready, and your style game on point.  Even if you don't end up bald, you'll be a better man than you were before.

Also, thanks Davey for helping convince me there could be life after baldness - even if I'm not there yet.

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## Proper

> Makin' gains bros.  I told someone I'd update this thread.  I'm up like 8 pounds since I started lifting (with lower body fat, for sure), which actually occurred after I started fin or there was at least a strong overlap.
> 
> So, balding brothers, get to the gym.  Even if you're in the early stages, you should be getting your finances in order, your body ready, and your style game on point.  Even if you don't end up bald, you'll be a better man than you were before.
> 
> Also, thanks Davey for helping convince me there could be life after baldness - even if I'm not there yet.


 EY MAN! YOU WANNA BUILD SOME MUSCLE?? YEAH?! Tthats good!... thats REAL good!! -Quoted from hodgetwins lol

Anyhow, lookin good dood!

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## BigThinker

> EY MAN! YOU WANNA BUILD SOME MUSCLE?? YEAH?! Tthats good!... thats REAL good!! -Quoted from hodgetwins lol
> 
> Anyhow, lookin good dood!


 Ha.  Thank, bro.  Most importantly I _feel_ good.  Little bit of exercise goes a long way.

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## darryls

dht is supposed to be more anabolic than testosterone and it effects strength so I could see how finasteride would lower gains.

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## Proper

> Ha.  Thank, bro.  Most importantly I _feel_ good.  Little bit of exercise goes a long way.


 Especially when you can flex in the mirror and feel powerful. Feel like droppin' a fool (immature mentality on my part lol). I feel like that everytime I come outta the gym.

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