# Men's Hair Loss > Hair Loss Treatments > Cutting Edge / Future Treatments >  TAKEAWAY FROM WCHR 2013 Edinburgh, UK @ Dr. NIGAM

## drnigams

*Made New...... Star Research Friend's*

Dr. Nigam with Dr. Gerd Lindner & Ken Washniek, CEO, Aderans, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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Dr. Nigam with Mike Philpott, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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Dr. Nigam with Dr. George Cotsarelis, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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Dr. Nigam with Valerie Randall, Chair person of Scientific Committee, & Dr. Costarelis, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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Dr. Nigam with Annika Vogte, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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She is focusing on nano and virus like particles to deliver specific molecules to targeted areas in hair follicle in vivo and specifically treating hair stem cells by targeted nano molecular therapies.

Dr. Nigam with Elaine Fuchs & Valeria Randall, at WCHR 2013, Edinburgh, UK


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Dr. Nigam with Rajesh Thangapazham at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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He is a very promising young researcher and he may become consultant to our Lab shortly. He has presented his paper at WCHR20103 tittled "Enhancing hair follicle neogenesis in bioengineered human skin substitute". His company has a collaboration with Dr. Cotsarelis. He is from Pennsylvania, USA

Dr. Nigam with Colin Jahoda, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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Dr. Nigam with Kurt Stenn, MD Vice President and Chief Scientific Officer, Aderans Research, at WCHR2013, Edinburgh, UK


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## UK_

What a legend!!!

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## clandestine

Well, I'm impressed.

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## bald fighter

w0000000w what a superstar  :Big Grin: 


now go back to your work with photoshopping  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## drnigams

And they were very kind and open to share and support , as i mail them my findings with new miniclincal experiments on 3D spheroidal DP culture,growth factors etc.
Jahoda corrected me by asking me to use dermal sheath cells rather dermal papilla cells alone with my HM and doubling.
I invited washniek to India,we will meet again at Sanfrancisco,USA at ISHRS,2013 ,may be i will be ready with my presentation by then.
Dr Gerd should be consultant to my lab, by next month.
Found a yound innovative researcher from pennsylvania Dr Rajesh(who presented his paper titled..Enhancing hair follicle neogenesis in bioengineered human askin substitutes) who's company has a collabration with cotsarelis.

Hellouser,i conveyed to most of them ,till how long it will be only research..it is high time we reach somewhere near cure. 
Some other TAKE AWAYS...
1)How to work on topical finasteride with special carriers to have consistent high local scalp concentrationand targetted delivery ,thus avoiding oral finasteride and it's side effects  in the near future.
2)Follicle testing research moving towards in vitro lab with follicle kept alive for atleast 15days,thus allowing the researchers to see effects of vrious molecules on the follicle growth,as against just (alien) mouse studies..As ralf paus from uk said mouse originated from asia and humans from africa.. 
Also more research experiments now carried with human skin created in lab,grafted into SICD mouse and implantation of pluripotent mouse keratinocytes and human cultured dp cells ..with successfull follicle regen in 6 weeks.
3)Donor doubling ,now confirmed by independent study by LIN,HUANG of Shantou university ,china...confirming that a bisected follicle with outer root sheath can grow it's own dermal papilla back in vitro in lab (with specail culture medium) and mouse..These guys have developed a special instrument to cut the follicle in vivo with a scissor like structure as punch.
I was fortunate to see major part of congress being focussed on DP culture models ..3d spheroidal,culture mediums with supplements..layered models,hanging drop models,capsules,scaffolds etc. This would help our lab move forward  with respect to trichogenic dp culture.  

Will  share many other take aways soon.. 




> What a legend!!!

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## UK_

Topical finasteride looks good, 71&#37; scalp DHT reduction with low systemic absorbtion, any ideas when this will be available Dr Nigam and where we can get our hands on it?

I think  the dermal sheath cells is a good shout from Jahoda, do you think you could apply the 3D spheroidal DP culture with Dermal SHEATH cells?

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## Henkeh91

Thanks Dr! I have the same question as UK_ regarding topical finas.

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## Arashi

> Thanks Dr! I have the same question as UK_ regarding topical finas.


 It depends on what they negotiate with the FDA. A single Phase III study mainly to show efficacy could be enough. If I remember correctly from the abstracts it were researchers in Asia who did the test, maybe that can be used in the negotiations with FDA. 

Either way, this should be available within 2 years, maybe sooner.
See: http://www.targethealth.com/PDF/Post...OralDrugsv.pdf

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## Arashi

Probably the more interesting question would be: is it easy to make this yourself ?  :Smile:

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## Artista

Dr Nigam, we are all so very appreciative of your efforts to educate us here on BTT. You have proven yourself to be a person of interest and I look forward to more of your experiences at the Conference ..Im very GLAD to hear that you will be at the San Fransisco Conference in October!! 
Dr , I would like to have a private conversation with you regarding the October Conference at your earliest convenience. Thank you.

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## hairy

Dr. Nigam you are the Amitabh Bachchan of the hair loss world!

Thanks for all your efforts posting here, and collaborating with all these researchers.  Seems like the researchers and scientists have less ego then HT surgeons on average.

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## Conpecia

Dr. Nigam: Thanks for your efforts!! Your work ethic is nothing short of phenomenal, and I commend you for your diligence and attempts to keep us informed.

Very excited about topical fin; if we can minimize systemic sides (particularly feminization) and maintain most of the efficacy of oral fin, I'll be back in business!! Do you happen to know a timeframe for topical fin?

Also: killer shades!

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## UK_

I think it's true that a lot of the HT surgeons are not interested in better treatments because it may impact their profession, I also think this is sickening and disgraceful behaviour, it's not just people with MPB that will benefit but burn victims and individuals with other forms of alopecia including people undergoing chemotherapy!

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## DepressedByHairLoss

> I think it's true that a lot of the HT surgeons are not interested in better treatments because it may impact their profession, I also think this is sickening and disgraceful behaviour, it's not just people with MPB that will benefit but burn victims and individuals with other forms of alopecia including people undergoing chemotherapy!


 Bro, I've been echoing these sentiments for the longest time and this statement is so obviously true to me.  It's all driven by money.

Also, on another topic, I do not even believe that topical finasteride would need FDA approval at all since it is already approved as a hair loss treatment.  It's kind of similar to how Spencer had a pharmacy make him a topical minoxidil concoction before it was approved by the FDA for hair loss (since minoxidil was already FDA-approved for another condition).

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## UK_

Yep, I really hope Dr Nigam can give us some information on where we can obtain the topical fin they've developed - I understand Dr Nigam was given some samples to test too!

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## Conpecia

> I think it's true that a lot of the HT surgeons are not interested in better treatments because it may impact their profession, I also think this is sickening and disgraceful behaviour, it's not just people with MPB that will benefit but burn victims and individuals with other forms of alopecia including people undergoing chemotherapy!


 Disgraceful as it may be, it's masochistic to support the death of your own career. Once the HT docs are outmoded it's not like they can just shift gears and be pediatricians. Their livelihood, family, etc. is at stake. All the specialized training they've done goes out the window. It makes sense that they would make it as hard as possible for us. But **** them. Science will win, and sooner rather than later. Dr. Nigam, Dr. Gho, Dr. Costarelis, and the other progressive researchers will be the big names moving forward. This is happening right now. New treatments are on the way. We just have to maintain the best we can.

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## UK_

> Disgraceful as it may be, it's masochistic to support the death of your own career. Once the HT docs are outmoded it's not like they can just shift gears and be pediatricians. Their livelihood, family, etc. is at stake. All the specialized training they've done goes out the window. It makes sense that they would make it as hard as possible for us. But **** them. Science will win, and sooner rather than later. Dr. Nigam, Dr. Gho, Dr. Costarelis, and the other progressive researchers will be the big names moving forward. This is happening right now. New treatments are on the way. We just have to maintain the best we can.


 I should have mentioned not all HT surgeons are like that, Dr Ziering for example is supporting Histogen and is also a HT surgeon, the thing that matters most is the patients, not lining your own pockets at the expense of the misery of millions of people.

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## TO YOUNG TO RETIRE

i think that Dr Nigam is going to be our center of attention the next days . 

 :Smile:

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## greatjob!

Thanks Dr Nigam for being our eyes and hears at these conferences, I appreciate you sharing the news. 




> I think it's true that a lot of the HT surgeons are not interested in better treatments because it may impact their profession, I also think this is sickening and disgraceful behaviour, it's not just people with MPB that will benefit but burn victims and individuals with other forms of alopecia including people undergoing chemotherapy!


 While I wish more HT surgeons would work on advancing better treatments, its not like they have any ability in preventing any future treatments from coming to market, so it really doesn't matter. They will either adapt or become obsolete. Anyways in almost any case very few doctors in any field are actively involved in research. Usually you are either involved in private practice or in research, very few doctors are involved in both.

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## Conpecia

> Thanks Dr Nigam for being our eyes and hears at these conferences, I appreciate you sharing the news. 
> 
> 
> 
> While I wish more HT surgeons would work on advancing better treatments, its not like they have any ability in preventing any future treatments from coming to market, so it really doesn't matter. They will either adapt or become obsolete. Anyways in almost any case very few doctors in any field are actively involved in research. Usually you are either involved in private practice or in research, very few doctors are involved in both.


 
Not true. They could invest in Gho's techniques for 50K and put serious efforts into donor regeneration. They could switch from FUT to FUE. All of that slows down the evolution.

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## Conpecia

534623 what's your opinion on topical fin? seems legitimate to me, but I'm not so bald yet and it won't matter to those looking for regrowth.

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## greatjob!

> Not true. They could invest in Gho's techniques for 50K and put serious efforts into donor regeneration. They could switch from FUT to FUE. All of that slows down the evolution.


 FUT will always exist until hair multiplication comes to market or until doctors like Gho start performing much much larger procedures. FUE is great but you simply can't get as many grafts over a person's lifetime as you can with strip, a NW6 with average density may be able to obtain say 8000 grafts from strip and then still be able to get more via FUE. While that same guy will probably only be able to get a max of say 5000 grafts from FUE alone. Then that same patient going to Gho will spent 10 years trying to get the same amount of grafts he could obtain from strip in 1 or two years. So while strip is not ideal, and I am not advocating for it, it has its purpose and will continue to do so until hair multiplication comes to market or doctors performing regeneration do much larger procedure. So suggesting all surgeons immediately abandon strip isn't going to happen and doesn't make sense with current technology.

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## TO YOUNG TO RETIRE

why it wont matter to those looking for regrowth? topical fin cannot regrow? only maintain?


> 534623 what's your opinion on topical fin? seems legitimate to me, but I'm not so bald yet and it won't matter to those looking for regrowth.

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## Conpecia

> FUT will always exist until hair multiplication comes to market or until doctors like Gho start performing much much larger procedures. FUE is great but you simply can't get as many grafts over a person's lifetime as you can with strip, a NW6 with average density may be able to obtain say 8000 grafts from strip and then still be able to get more via FUE. While that same guy will probably only be able to get a max of say 5000 grafts from FUE alone. Then that same patient going to Gho will spent 10 years trying to get the same amount of grafts he could obtain from strip in 1 or two years. So while strip is not ideal, and I am not advocating for it, it has its purpose and will continue to do so until hair multiplication comes to market or doctors performing regeneration do much larger procedure. So suggesting all surgeons immediately abandon strip isn't going to happen and doesn't make sense with current technology.


 
Ah, but you're arguing against yourself right? Wouldn't the current technology be different if those same FUT doctors had endorsed advancements in FUE instead of charging more per graft for FUT? Pretty sure we'd have seen vast improvements in FUE yield and time between procedures if FUE was the new standard. Of course we'll never know...

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## Conpecia

> why it wont matter to those looking for regrowth? topical fin cannot regrow? only maintain?


 yeah since fin is a dht-inhibitor it's widely considered to be a maintenance treatment, though some do experience mild regrowth. just thinking about it, if oral fin was a real regrowth treatment all of us who've been on propecia for 5+ years would be walking around with a lot more hair. generally people combine dht-inhibitors with growth stimulants like minoxidil.

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## clarence

> 3)Donor doubling ,now confirmed by independent study by LIN,HUANG of Shantou university ,china...confirming that a bisected follicle with outer root sheath can grow it's own dermal papilla back in vitro in lab 
> 
> 
> 
> 			
> 				(with specail culture medium)
> 			
> 		
> 
> ...


 Special culture medium yup... last month we still had a different name for it erm... _"illusion"_... something a bit like that....

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## youngin

Wasn't Histogen suppose to be presenting today? Nothing from them yet?

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## drnigams

You are mistaken..it is not about soaking the gafts ..but culturing them in lab ..on the lines of stemcell culture in the lab.
The control was in dmem media and the study group was cultured in vitro in lab like stemcell cuturing with different media..




> Special culture medium yup... last month we still had a different name for it erm... _"illusion"_... something a bit like that....

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## drnigams

http://www.google.com/patents/EP2153836A1?cl=en
The above link to patent for topical finasteride should help.
You can contact the company directly.
If we have any pharmacist ,skin permeation expert as forum member..they can be of help.
I will work on it..give me some time . 

[QUOTE=UK_;121800]Topical finasteride looks good, 71&#37; scalp DHT reduction with low systemic absorbtion, any ideas when this will be available Dr Nigam and where we can get our hands on it?

I think  the dermal sheat cells is a good shout from Jahoda, do you think you could apply the 3D spheroidal DP culture with Dermal SHEAThttp

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## ccmethinning

Hahahaha those pictures are hilarious. All the people Nigam is taking pictures with have that WTF look on their faces. Like "who the **** is this guy and why am I taking a picture with him?"

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## 534623

> Hahahaha those pictures are hilarious. All the people Nigam is taking pictures with have that WTF look on their faces. Like "who the **** is this guy and why am I taking a picture with him?"


 Are you sure?


Oh well, they will regret these (marketing-)snapshots [to impress kids] soon ...  :Embarrassment: 

By the way - is Dr. Cotsarelis losing his hair or is it just the lightning?
Anyway, it doesn't matter. The guy who will cure him is next to him...lol

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## Kiwi

> Hahahaha those pictures are hilarious. All the people Nigam is taking pictures with have that WTF look on their faces. Like "who the **** is this guy and why am I taking a picture with him?"


 Most conference photos are like that.

Good job Nigram. I hope you blow Dr Gho's technique to smithereens - if your technique becomes the gold standard you'll be our hero!!!

You can always move to a country like New Zealand that doesn't recognise archaic American patent laws ;P

Oh wait. You already do!!! Hazah!!!!

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## 534623

> Most conference photos are like that.


 No - that is not true ...

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## Arashi

> Hahahaha those pictures are hilarious. All the people Nigam is taking pictures with have that WTF look on their faces. Like "who the **** is this guy and why am I taking a picture with him?"


 LOL. But then again, it IS nice that he actually went there and fed back some things to this forum.

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## Conpecia

[QUOTE=drnigams;121938]http://www.google.com/patents/EP2153836A1?cl=en
The above link to patent for topical finasteride should help.
You can contact the company directly.
If we have any pharmacist ,skin permeation expert as forum member..they can be of help.
I will work on it..give me some time . 




> Topical finasteride looks good, 71% scalp DHT reduction with low systemic absorbtion, any ideas when this will be available Dr Nigam and where we can get our hands on it?
> 
> I think  the dermal sheat cells is a good shout from Jahoda, do you think you could apply the 3D spheroidal DP culture with Dermal SHEAThttp


 Looks like we could see a topical blend of minox and fin with this new "film" as a vehicle. That'd make things so easy just apply it and move on. Man this can't come soon enough.

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## rdawg

Would topical fin have to go through the same regulations being as finasteride is already proven safe?

wouldnt it just need a 1 year phase III kind of trial?

someone tell me how this would work, would love to get topical fin, not that i'm having issues with regular fin.

Wouldn't it work better too since it would be more localised/direct to the scalp?

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## FearTheLoss

> Would topical fin have to go through the same regulations being as finasteride is already proven safe?
> 
> wouldnt it just need a 1 year phase III kind of trial?
> 
> someone tell me how this would work, would love to get topical fin, not that i'm having issues with regular fin.
> 
> Wouldn't it work better too since it would be more localised/direct to the scalp?


 Hasson and Wong already get it for their patients....not sure what we can do in the USA

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## DepressedByHairLoss

> No - that is not true ...


 Haha, that cracked me up.  People like her have been tinkering with mice for decades but have not done a damn thing to benefit humans.

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## DepressedByHairLoss

I really do salute Dr. Nigam very much though.  He is really trying to give us less-invasive and just better options to regrow hair, and not just simply offering the same old tired FUT surgery.

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## drnigams

rdawg,
Doctors can prescribe off label use of topical finasteride since it is approved by FDA for oral use..
Like doctors prescribe lattise(a product of allergan) off label as it has been approved by FDA,USA for growing eyelashes.
Silicion  fillers have been cleared by FDA for opthalmic use,and doctors in USA are using it for permanent fillers for face through microdroplet technique.
In INDIA,doctors can compound and dispense a new formulation,provided every ingredient has an FDA approval and bought from FDA registered supplier.But cannot keep this formulation in the pharmacy for general public unless cleared by FDA for it's claims. 
That means ,i can compound and dispense to my patients from my clinic or by courier once i find the right solution and vehicle of topical finasteride.
Although this has to be for use of individual patient and not for sale in the market..  
If a company launches this product as a drug than minimum it has to do,is prove it's efficacy with trials before FDA allows it's claim...




> Would topical fin have to go through the same regulations being as finasteride is already proven safe?
> 
> wouldnt it just need a 1 year phase III kind of trial?
> 
> someone tell me how this would work, would love to get topical fin, not that i'm having issues with regular fin.
> 
> Wouldn't it work better too since it would be more localised/direct to the scalp?

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## MrBlonde

> rdawg,
> Doctors can prescribe off label use of topical finasteride since it is approved by FDA for oral use..
> Like doctors prescribe lattise(a product of allergan) off label as it has been approved by FDA,USA for growing eyelashes.
> Silicion  fillers have been cleared by FDA for opthalmic use,and doctors in USA are using it for permanent fillers for face through microdroplet technique.
> In INDIA,doctors can compound and dispense a new formulation,provided every ingredient has an FDA approval and bought from FDA registered supplier.But cannot keep this formulation in the pharmacy for general public unless cleared by FDA for it's claims. 
> That means ,*i can compound and dispense to my patients from my clinic or by courier once i find the right solution and vehicle of topical finasteride.
> Although this has to be for use of individual patient and not for sale in the market.. * 
> If a company launches this product as a drug than minimum it has to do,is prove it's efficacy with trials before FDA allows it's claim...


 So you will do your own testing to find the right solution?  We are talking months of testing and patient results then before you send out your own topical Fin?

How quickly do you think you can have batches ready to send?

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## Arashi

> rdawg,
> If a company launches this product as a drug than minimum it has to do,is prove it's efficacy with trials before FDA allows it's claim...


 Yup. Minimum is a phase III trial to prove efficacy. So probably a 2 year timeframe before we'll see it on the market.

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## drnigams

Blonde, my major focus of work at present is donor doubling and injections of growth factors,stemcells,and dp cultured cells..whatever time will be left ..i will work on thsi..but any guy into phd on skin permeation will be a better bet to prepare than me..i will also be discussing with experts in skin permeation,the swiss company and also annika voidt from germany ,who's research work is into targetted drug delivery... to prepare  the formulation.



> So you will do your own testing to find the right solution?  We are talking months of testing and patient results then before you send out your own topical Fin?
> 
> How quickly do you think you can have batches ready to send?

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## drnigams

Arashi,did you have a look at three studies i posted at hs proving our hypothesis of donor doubling...wherein lower follicle if amputated can regenerate it's own dermal papilla...infact there was a paper on unlimited follicle hair transplant  at WCHR...these findings confirm til HM comes doubling is the best solution...



> Yup. Minimum is a phase III trial to prove efficacy. So probably a 2 year timeframe before we'll see it on the market.

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## rdawg

> Yup. Minimum is a phase III trial to prove efficacy. So probably a 2 year timeframe before we'll see it on the market.


 essentially for on label yes, but off label we can get this stuff much sooner than that.

that's still not that far, but i'm not sure I got an answer to my other question, would the efficacy be better(at least in theory) than regular oral fin since it's more localised to the hair? or would it essentially have the same effect?

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## hairy

Legend!!!  Dr. Nigam, best wishes this week.  Hope you can collaborate with Dr. Jahoda and get some of these people to join you on an advisory basis.

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## clandestine

> Legend!!!  Dr. Nigam, best wishes this week.  Hope you can collaborate with Dr. Jahoda and get some of these people to join you on an advisory basis.


 Strong bump. Stop that.

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## Kalio

So whats the deal with this topical Finasteride I am reading about in this thread? Will it have no side-effects as opposed to the oral version of Finasteride?

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