# Men's Hair Loss > Hair Loss Treatments >  Dr Klein promox patients! Read if you need help.

## Jazz1

Ok I have some good news for patients of Dr oscar Klein, I been researching everyday in trying to find a doctor to prescribe us his formulations. Unfortunately most doctors are not interested, especially being from the uk. Dr kleins website and formulations have changed, they no longer sell more than 5% minoxidil and also they require a prescription for the other prescription ingredients. 

Now I know a lot of his patients will struggle to find a private doctor like me, but luckily I hit a good find yesterday. A US pharmacy actually formulate the same ingredients, if anything better and they formulate similar stuff to Dr lee. I been in touch with the doctor and they charge 60 odd dollars for 6 prescription formulas and the pharmacist can formulate any mixture, plus high grade minoxidil. 

As of now I'm in touch with them to come to a good price plan for all the ex patients like me, il keep you guys posted by next week for anyone interested as their pharmacist is away  :Smile: .

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## johnnyboots

> Ok I have some good news for patients of Dr oscar Klein, I been researching everyday in trying to find a doctor to prescribe us his formulations. Unfortunately most doctors are not interested, especially being from the uk. Dr kleins website and formulations have changed, they no longer sell more than 5% minoxidil and also they require a prescription for the other prescription ingredients. 
> 
> Now I know a lot of his patients will struggle to find a private doctor like me, but luckily I hit a good find yesterday. A US pharmacy actually formulate the same ingredients, if anything better and they formulate similar stuff to Dr lee. I been in touch with the doctor and they charge 60 odd dollars for 6 prescription formulas and the pharmacist can formulate any mixture, plus high grade minoxidil. 
> 
> As of now I'm in touch with them to come to a good price plan for all the ex patients like me, il keep you guys posted by next week for anyone interested as their pharmacist is away .


  Please let me know I got 1 bottle of lotion left

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## Never2late

Definitely interested.  I started using Dr Kleins products a couple of months ago and I'm almost out.

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## Jazz1

> Definitely interested.  I started using Dr Kleins products a couple of months ago and I'm almost out.


 Il let you know by next week  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

> Please let me know I got 1 bottle of lotion left


 100%, only down side you will probably pay 60 odd dollars for a prescription which will allow 6 refills. I don't know the product price yet but I will do my best to negotiate a good price of us. Il be in touch with them by Monday  :Smile: .

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## johnnyboots

> Il let you know by next week .


 Wtf?you got me on the pay me no mind list?

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## Never2late

> Il let you know by next week .


 Thank you.  Your effort is very much appreciated.

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## johnnyboots

> 100%, only down side you will probably pay 60 odd dollars for a prescription which will allow 6 refills. I don't know the product price yet but I will do my best to negotiate a good price of us. Il be in touch with them by Monday .


 Thanks brother

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## thechamp

> Ok I have some good news for patients of Dr oscar Klein, I been researching everyday in trying to find a doctor to prescribe us his formulations. Unfortunately most doctors are not interested, especially being from the uk. Dr kleins website and formulations have changed, they no longer sell more than 5% minoxidil and also they require a prescription for the other prescription ingredients. 
> 
> Now I know a lot of his patients will struggle to find a private doctor like me, but luckily I hit a good find yesterday. A US pharmacy actually formulate the same ingredients, if anything better and they formulate similar stuff to Dr lee. I been in touch with the doctor and they charge 60 odd dollars for 6 prescription formulas and the pharmacist can formulate any mixture, plus high grade minoxidil. 
> 
> As of now I'm in touch with them to come to a good price plan for all the ex patients like me, il keep you guys posted by next week for anyone interested as their pharmacist is away .


 Jazz do you think I'll be able to order 10 percent minoxdill from them ?

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## Jazz1

Yes Champ, guys everyone who knows me by now should clearly know I'm genuine. I always praised Dr Klein and his products but it's just a shame it's come to the end. I for can not obtain a prescription and the last thing I wanted was to stop his products. Since he passed away few weeks back all iv been doing every night and morning is researching. I'm just happy right now I have found a pharmacist in US who already formulate this stuff. The good part is the physicians will prescribe this at a minor cost. Fingers crossed I will have everything worked out with them on prices etc and we can all be happy using what worked best on us without it being taken away from us  :Smile: .

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## thechamp

> Yes Champ, guys everyone who knows me by now should clearly know I'm genuine. I always praised Dr Klein and his products but it's just a shame it's come to the end. I for can not obtain a prescription and the last thing I wanted was to stop his products. Since he passed away few weeks back all iv been doing every night and morning is researching. I'm just happy right now I have found a pharmacist in US who already formulate this stuff. The good part is the physicians will prescribe this at a minor cost. Fingers crossed I will have everything worked out with them on prices etc and we can all be happy using what worked best on us without it being taken away from us .


  what's the website?

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## Jazz1

> what's the website?


 
Il post all details once I work everything out with them by next week, don't worry fingers crossed all us ex patients can still carry on with the original formula plus obtain prescription for it at a low cost. Anyways speak tommorow need sleep as I got work morning.

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## Jazz1

Ok guys sent out a long email to them and their pharmacist they are responding promptly but the pharmacist will not be back till Monday. So if everything goes to plan we can have the original formulations made with high grade minoxidol. No more worry for us ex patients, we can carry on with our original formulations we were using, fingers crossed it all goes to plan il keep you guys posted  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

Update the pharmacist has responded, she has 31 years experience and 11 years in compound mixing, is well known I checked her up.

I'm posting her on Tuesday at my own cost both products, so fingers crossed the sooner they get them done  the sooner they can make us the old original formula. You guys owe me big time, I'm just glad that we have an alternative to use as the last thing I needed was dropping Promox to lose hairs!!!

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## johnnyboots

> Update the pharmacist has responded, she has 31 years experience and 11 years in compound mixing, is well known I checked her up.
> 
> I'm posting her on Tuesday at my own cost both products, so fingers crossed the sooner they get them done  the sooner they can make us the old original formula. You guys owe me big time, I'm just glad that we have an alternative to use as the last thing I needed was dropping Promox to lose hairs!!!


 So I can get my spray and lotion?

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## Jazz1

> So I can get my spray and lotion?


 Well fingers crossed and it's better for you as they based in US where I'm in the uk, that's what I really want aswell they already formulate the lotion and cream side of things. But the pharmacist is 100% confident she can formulate the spray, they use proper lab equipment il post full details once they confirm everything. Right now I need to post them the products I have on Tuesday, luckily I have some 10% DMI prescription spray left. I'm also trying to make sure they charge us the same price we payed Dr Klein, I'm going to tell them to lower cost as possible so all his ex patients can give them the business and we can carry on getting what we use currently.

I have given up on Dorrie at Dr kleins office, I been feeling low since he passed away, I been messaging Dorrie to help find a doctor and I had no luck! Also the fact they only selling 5% bloody minxodiol means us old patients could lose ground as some of us have been using high grade stuff for years!

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## johnnyboots

> Well fingers crossed and it's better for you as they based in US where I'm in the uk, that's what I really want aswell they already formulate the lotion and cream side of things. But the pharmacist is 100% confident she can formulate the spray, they use proper lab equipment il post full details once they confirm everything. Right now I need to post them the products I have on Tuesday, luckily I have some 10% DMI prescription spray left. I'm also trying to make sure they charge us the same price we payed Dr Klein, I'm going to tell them to lower cost as possible so all his ex patients can give them the business and we can carry on getting what we use currently.
> 
> I have given up on Dorrie at Dr kleins office, I been feeling low since he passed away, I been messaging Dorrie to help find a doctor and I had no luck! Also the fact they only selling 5% bloody minxodiol means us old patients could lose ground as some of us have been using high grade stuff for years!


 Wow sounds good,great work!

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## Jazz1

> Wow sounds good,great work!


 Fingers crossed, I'm going to post the products to tdothan they can make sure the texture is correct and better. I will get this done on Tuesday when I'm off work, buts it's great news and I'm just so happy I stumbled across that website, as I was getting more down since Dr Klein died and the fact Dorrie changed the formulas, plus requires a prescription!

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## doke

Hi Jazz is the compounding site medical wellness centre usa? as I have known about them a long time.
They will make up prescription products for you although im not really happy with over 5% minoxidil due to safety as it can play havoc with blood pressure, and also I have been told by some it may be know better than normal minox.
Guys try 5% minox with hydrocortisone with tretinoin mix and even add azelaic acid.
I hope jazz you can get us a formula made with 5% minox.
We know that there is a minoxidil sensitive formula with dr lewenberg which some have had success although its pricey, and theres mintop minox with tretinoin and azelaic acid available still.

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## thechamp

> Hi Jazz is the compounding site medical wellness centre usa? as I have known about them a long time.
> They will make up prescription products for you although im not really happy with over 5% minoxidil due to safety as it can play havoc with blood pressure, and also I have been told by some it may be know better than normal minox.
> Guys try 5% minox with hydrocortisone with tretinoin mix and even add azelaic acid.
> I hope jazz you can get us a formula made with 5% minox.
> We know that there is a minoxidil sensitive formula with dr lewenberg which some have had success although its pricey, and theres mintop minox with tretinoin and azelaic acid available still.


 Doke arnt people using cream with  hydrocortisone and reporting regrowth?

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## doke

hi champ I think that hydro plus retina a may help with minox or even without minox if you suffer from acne scalp.

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## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz is the compounding site medical wellness centre usa? as I have known about them a long time.
> They will make up prescription products for you although im not really happy with over 5% minoxidil due to safety as it can play havoc with blood pressure, and also I have been told by some it may be know better than normal minox.
> Guys try 5% minox with hydrocortisone with tretinoin mix and even add azelaic acid.
> I hope jazz you can get us a formula made with 5% minox.
> We know that there is a minoxidil sensitive formula with dr lewenberg which some have had success although its pricey, and theres mintop minox with tretinoin and azelaic acid available still.


 Well you got it correct, yes it is them but they use a well high profile pharmacy. Yes they will be able to make 5% but Dr kleins clinic is already selling 5% over the counter without prescription with DMI. Right now I need to mail there pharmacy the products on Tuesday when I'm off work, sooner the better.

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## Jazz1

Right guys looks like Doke has clocked who I contacted etc, so you can find the post here aswell as the clinic in US called medical wellness. They use a pharmacist called Murray Avenue Apothecary her details are below everything looks legit to me hence why i am wasting my time going through this stress  :Smile: .

Center:

PLEASE NOTE! They are only prescribing us the prescription if things go well.
http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com/

The pharmacist who already formulates same mixtures etc:

http://www.yelp.co.uk/biz/murray-ave...ary-pittsburgh

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/about-us.html

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## Eire1980

Hey Jazz,

good work out of you..fair play.

im based in Dublin. 
i would be very interested in this.
Did you take Fin orally?...Do you think there will be systematic affect from the topic or just locally in the scalp?
appreciate your thoughts
cheers

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## Jazz1

No worries, I do take FIN EOD but at the start I did have major sides. 3 years later I'm doing great. I add promox that has helped my hairline and hair where FIN internally only eliminates certain % scalp DHT. I know a guy from US who had sides from internal FIN now he uses promox lotion zero sides but keeping his hair.

I'm posting the products tomorrow to them so il keep you lot posted.

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## Eire1980

hey thanks for coming back on this, much appreciated..will keep a check on this thread..good work




> No worries, I do take FIN EOD but at the start I did have major sides. 3 years later I'm doing great. I add promox that has helped my hairline and hair where FIN internally only eliminates certain % scalp DHT. I know a guy from US who had sides from internal FIN now he uses promox lotion zero sides but keeping his hair.
> 
> I'm posting the products tomorrow to them so il keep you lot posted.

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## Jazz1

> hey thanks for coming back on this, much appreciated..will keep a check on this thread..good work


 Thanks I appreciate the kind words, like I Said I'm happy to have found an alternative it's all about time now the sooner the better as I only have 7 months supply of Promox lotion left and my prescriptions sprays finished!

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## thechamp

> No worries, I do take FIN EOD but at the start I did have major sides. 3 years later I'm doing great. I add promox that has helped my hairline and hair where FIN internally only eliminates certain % scalp DHT. I know a guy from US who had sides from internal FIN now he uses promox lotion zero sides but keeping his hair.
> 
> I'm posting the products tomorrow to them so il keep you lot posted.


 Jazz what sides did you have with fin?

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## Jazz1

> Jazz what sides did you have with fin?


 Major sides;

No erections,
Depression,
Trapped,
Panick attacks etc.

But I always found a way to counter them, and now 3 years later my body has adjusted nd I'm doing superb  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

Just update I managed to get out bed had day off work with a splitting headache! I posted the items to the pharmacist today which should arrive with her shortly.

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## inbrugge

Jazz, I appreciate the work bro.

I am using Minox for about 9 months now. I stopped for a month, and I'm now experiencing the worst hair loss of my life lol. Literally going bald right in fron of my eyes.

I purchased Ru & Neogenic. Now, I'm also considering Topical Fin.

Is there a place I can get some topical fin? Can I crush oral fin pills and mix it into my minox, will that be the same thing as topical fin? Would Minox or Neogenic be a good vehicle?

I would really appreciate your help man. I'm trying to jump on these new treatments before I completely go bald in the span of a few months.

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## Jazz1

Well just checked the site so to those who are running low and can't get a prescription than you can find alternative with these guys. Just to make things clear I have not discussed or negioted any prices yet for us guys, just waiting for them to tell me if they can formulate similar. But they told me they already for years been selling the same formulations etc see below. I still have 6/7 months Promox lotion left, but I had to drop Promox prescription spray, I'm waiting once they receive the stuff if they can make me the prescription spray for us. I'm also making this vey clear I have no link to these guys, in desperation I have had no choice but to search the Internet for alternative as I doubt il be able to buy Dr kleins prescription stuff again. If these guys can make me the same stuff il be more than happy, because I can carry on saving my hair through these treatments, just like he rest of you who use it. 

http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com/

http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html

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## Jazz1

I had a chance to speak with Susan today, sounds like a lovely lady. The parcel is tracked at the international sorting office so once she receives it than she can hopefully formulate it the same. But in mean time she told me she has already been formulating the same stuff, but iv asked if she can formulate same as Kleins texture would be great. So once she gets the parcel and gets this done than she will come to the price plan list for us, il be placing an order as soon as she formulates it  :Smile: . I tried calling wellness center they seemed busy, plus my credit run out as I was calling from the uk. But overall I feel happy as Susan sounds lovely and willing to help us,  :Smile: . I will keep you guys posted, I'm just thankfull to God I have found an alternative  :Smile: .

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## Never2late

I spoke with Susan as well.  I'm nearly out of promox so I placed an order on Tuesday.  On Wednesday I received a call from Susan to go over the options I selected to be compounded.  I must say that she was very nice and seemed extremely educated when it came to compounding minoxidil.  She steered me in the right direction when it came to a couple of things.  For example, she strongly recommended using propylene glycol as opposed to the dimethyl isosorbide.  She feels that the dimethyl isosorbide, being a solvent and a strong penetrant, has the potential to have all of the ingredients go systemic.  Not to mention that it is more expensive since they have to import it from South Africa.  So I decided to go with the ppg.  She's confident we will be very happy with the product they make.  I'll keep you posted.

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## Jazz1

> I spoke with Susan as well.  I'm nearly out of promox so I placed an order on Tuesday.  On Wednesday I received a call from Susan to go over the options I selected to be compounded.  I must say that she was very nice and seemed extremely educated when it came to compounding minoxidil.  She steered me in the right direction when it came to a couple of things.  For example, she strongly recommended using propylene glycol as opposed to the dimethyl isosorbide.  She feels that the dimethyl isosorbide, being a solvent and a strong penetrant, has the potential to have all of the ingredients go systemic.  Not to mention that it is more expensive since they have to import it from South Africa.  So I decided to go with the ppg.  She's confident we will be very happy with the product they make.  I'll keep you posted.


 
Perfect man, yes she's a lovely lady I'm just thankfull she's willing to help us guys who are left stranded. I'm waiting till she receives the Promox spray and lotion I sent her so she can make it same texture etc for me and the rest of us. Il be placing my order once she goes over the products in the lab when she gets my package.

I feel sad for one guy I was helping out few months back, we spoke on the phone today he had been using Promox lotion with good success. The time Dr Klein passed away he said he called the office and Dorrie was being funny with him not letting him talk to Dr Klein. Anyways he ended up buying Promox lotion refill again and things have been going down hill for him, he's losing hair everyday. He told me he reckons they sent him a shit batch or something, I pointed him in the right direction now so fingers crossed Susan formulates us good stuff that works.

I think you guys owe me Big time because if I never had contacted or researched everyday we would have all been screwed back to crappy 5% minoxidl and possibly losing hairs just like Dr lees patients did. 

 Make sure you keep us posted on the products from Susan, what formulation did you go for?

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## thechamp

Jazz I'm thinking of adding biotin to 5 percent minoxdill I'm a bit cautious with stronger,minoxdill with side effects does compounding the minoxdill make it less likely to get sides.

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## Jazz1

> Jazz I'm thinking of adding biotin to 5 percent minoxdill I'm a bit cautious with stronger,minoxdill with side effects does compounding the minoxdill make it less likely to get sides.


 Yes I beleive using a cream/lotion based does, that's why Dr Klein never sold 15% in liquid form neither do these guys. I remember buying Xandorx which I still have to this date, that shit was liquid form 15% and gave me the worst headache ever was too strong. But using 15% in lotion form is great no sides, the belgravia in the uk use 12.5% no sides in a cream form.

I would give Susan a call she can formulate you anything, and also be carefull with biotin too much can cause Acne.

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## thechamp

> Yes I beleive using a cream/lotion based does, that's why Dr Klein never sold 15% in liquid form neither do these guys. I remember buying Xandorx which I still have to this date, that shit was liquid form 15% and gave me the worst headache ever was too strong. But using 15% in lotion form is great no sides, the belgravia in the uk use 12.5% no sides in a cream form.
> 
> I would give Susan a call she can formulate you anything, and also be carefull with biotin too much can cause Acne.


 Well can they make it without azelic acid because when I used lipogaine with azelic acid I got fast heart rate ,how do you apply the lotion how much and what is Susan's contact ??

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## thechamp

> Yes I beleive using a cream/lotion based does, that's why Dr Klein never sold 15% in liquid form neither do these guys. I remember buying Xandorx which I still have to this date, that shit was liquid form 15% and gave me the worst headache ever was too strong. But using 15% in lotion form is great no sides, the belgravia in the uk use 12.5% no sides in a cream form.
> 
> I would give Susan a call she can formulate you anything, and also be carefull with biotin too much can cause Acne.


 Well can they make it without azelic acid because when I used lipogaine with azelic acid I got fast heart rate ,how do you apply the lotion how much and what is Susan's contact ??

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## thechamp

> Yes I beleive using a cream/lotion based does, that's why Dr Klein never sold 15% in liquid form neither do these guys. I remember buying Xandorx which I still have to this date, that shit was liquid form 15% and gave me the worst headache ever was too strong. But using 15% in lotion form is great no sides, the belgravia in the uk use 12.5% no sides in a cream form.
> 
> I would give Susan a call she can formulate you anything, and also be carefull with biotin too much can cause Acne.


 Well can they make it without azelic acid because when I used lipogaine with azelic acid I got fast heart rate ,how do you apply the lotion how much and what is Susan's contact ??

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## Never2late

> Perfect man, yes she's a lovely lady I'm just thankfull she's willing to help us guys who are left stranded. I'm waiting till she receives the Promox spray and lotion I sent her so she can make it same texture etc for me and the rest of us. Il be placing my order once she goes over the products in the lab when she gets my package.
> 
> I feel sad for one guy I was helping out few months back, we spoke on the phone today he had been using Promox lotion with good success. The time Dr Klein passed away he said he called the office and Dorrie was being funny with him not letting him talk to Dr Klein. Anyways he ended up buying Promox lotion refill again and things have been going down hill for him, he's losing hair everyday. He told me he reckons they sent him a shit batch or something, I pointed him in the right direction now so fingers crossed Susan formulates us good stuff that works.
> 
> I think you guys owe me Big time because if I never had contacted or researched everyday we would have all been screwed back to crappy 5% minoxidl and possibly losing hairs just like Dr lees patients did. 
> 
>  Make sure you keep us posted on the products from Susan, what formulation did you go for?


 I went with the 12.5% lotion with the .025 Retin A, 5% Azelaic Acid and the .25% Progesterone.  I'll see how this works out.  I skipped the .1% Finasteride for now.  I've been using the Polaris NR-11 a few times a week for the last 6 or so weeks.  I'm slowly getting back on Finasteride.  I took Propecia back in 2005-2006 for about 14 months.  I started getting sides so I stopped.  I tried it again about 4 years ago and the sides started again.  So now I'm trying to ease into it.  I'm not sure if it helps to use it two or three times a week topically but it has to be better than nothing.  I also use the Spiro S5 cream.  I take a few supplements that definitely help with inflammation as well.  So, we'll see how it goes.  I'll give this formulation 6 months and then see what kind of progress I've had.  Thanks for finding this Jazz.  I hope we can all benefit.

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## Jazz1

> I went with the 12.5% lotion with the .025 Retin A, 5% Azelaic Acid and the .25% Progesterone.  I'll see how this works out.  I skipped the .1% Finasteride for now.  I've been using the Polaris NR-11 a few times a week for the last 6 or so weeks.  I'm slowly getting back on Finasteride.  I took Propecia back in 2005-2006 for about 14 months.  I started getting sides so I stopped.  I tried it again about 4 years ago and the sides started again.  So now I'm trying to ease into it.  I'm not sure if it helps to use it two or three times a week topically but it has to be better than nothing.  I also use the Spiro S5 cream.  I take a few supplements that definitely help with inflammation as well.  So, we'll see how it goes.  I'll give this formulation 6 months and then see what kind of progress I've had.  Thanks for finding this Jazz.  I hope we can all benefit.


 That's great, out of interest how much did you pay? And what ML they selling you? Also what's price difference compared to Dr Klein?

How did you find the Polaris labs range? Any good?

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## Jazz1

> Well can they make it without azelic acid because when I used lipogaine with azelic acid I got fast heart rate ,how do you apply the lotion how much and what is Susan's contact ??


 Apply it to crown and temples, I do not know prices yet need discuss this properly for us, just waiting till they receive Dr kleins stuff I posted them.

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## Never2late

> That's great, out of interest how much did you pay? And what ML they selling you? Also what's price difference compared to Dr Klein?
> 
> How did you find the Polaris labs range? Any good?


  Well, actually they didn't give me an exact price but said it would be around $100.00.  That is considerably more than Dr Klein.  I think Dr Kleins Promox 5% was $60 plus $9.95 shipping fee.  I think, if memory serves me correctly.  But with this new formulation you only use it once a day if I'm not mistaken.  So I'm guessing this will last two months??  As far as Polaris Labs products are concerned, I like them.  The NR-11 is a nice product with some good ingredients.  It does contain 12% minoxidil sulphate.  I'm not sure if the sulphate version is really better or not.  I've read mixed reviews.  Their products are not cheap either.  With shipping to the U.S. I paid over $70.  This really annoys me because the product is made here in the U.S., shipped over to the distributor and then sent back here.  All because our FDA doesn't allow the sale of minoxidil formulations over 5%.  But overall, I think Polaris Labs makes a good product, IMO.  I'm certainly no expert though.

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## Never2late

> That's great, out of interest how much did you pay? And what ML they selling you? Also what's price difference compared to Dr Klein?
> 
> How did you find the Polaris labs range? Any good?


  One more thing.  When I found out I could no longer get Dr Kleins products I was going to use Polaris Labs.  I was going to alternate between the NR-11 and the NR-09.  I'm really just looking a bit of regrowth as I've maintained rather well over the past few years.  I started thinning in my late twenties, about 18 years ago.  I'm 46 now and I would say that I'm between a NW2 and a NW3.  With a little regrowth I will be ecstatic.  Being on Promox and the NR-11 for just a couple of months I'm already seeing tiny vellus hairs along my hairline.  Some have a bit of length to them too.  I haven't seen this in several years.  But I think the products from Susan will be really good.  The cost may be a bit higher but if they work then its worth it to me.  I tried calling earlier to get an exact price but they are closed until Tuesday.

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## Jazz1

> One more thing.  When I found out I could no longer get Dr Kleins products I was going to use Polaris Labs.  I was going to alternate between the NR-11 and the NR-09.  I'm really just looking a bit of regrowth as I've maintained rather well over the past few years.  I started thinning in my late twenties, about 18 years ago.  I'm 46 now and I would say that I'm between a NW2 and a NW3.  With a little regrowth I will be ecstatic.  Being on Promox and the NR-11 for just a couple of months I'm already seeing tiny vellus hairs along my hairline.  Some have a bit of length to them too.  I haven't seen this in several years.  But I think the products from Susan will be really good.  The cost may be a bit higher but if they work then its worth it to me.  I tried calling earlier to get an exact price but they are closed until Tuesday.


 
Yea this is the concern to us, the price I was paying $119 dollars for Promox lotion 100ML, if they can match the pricing and products I'm pretty sure they can obtain good business and clients. I will call them next week to discuss prices as i think we need to try and make sure it's same price.

Also Dr Klein done discounts example,

Promox kit 169 dollars:
60ml lotion
2x60ml sprays
For 100ml lotion kit was 189 dollars.

They sold 100ml lotion bottles for 119 dollars.

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## Jazz1

Right I just sent Susan a long message and all prices I also diverted the link below so she can see the prices. Hopefully she can come to a good price plan permanent for us Forum guys and ex Dr Klein patients:

I sent the link to hairsite that has all prices of Dr kleins.

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## Never2late

Some kind of discount would be really nice.  After all, look at all the extra business she would have.  Lets hope for the best

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## thechamp

What's Susan's contact ?

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## Jazz1

> Some kind of discount would be really nice.  After all, look at all the extra business she would have.  Lets hope for the best


 That's what I have emailed her, stating she can build a long term client business if she helps us guys out on the forum as we post the feed back. Anyways just sent her a long email of the discounts Klein did with proof. I'm pretty confident she can do her best to give us good deals, at the end of the day from her business point she wants more clients and we need the product. 

I really hope she can formulate something in a spray form aswell, fingers crossed once she gets the products of kleins I sent her she can go test them in her lab etc.

I'm also disappointed in Dr kleins office, I was heart Brocken when they told me I can no longer buy higher percent minxodiol let alone prescription formula. I tried every single day to find a doctor with zero luck, I even contacted Dorrie to beg her in finding us a doctor. I'm sure if Dorrie started making calls she could easily find a doctor to prescribe us Kleins formulations. I just fear that their  business won't do aswell anymore since he's dead, as changing the formulations Dr Klein created is going to have a big impact on us ex patients, just like it did with Dr lee. Using 15% minxodiol than down grading to 5% is a big impact, but I'm just glad we have an alternative. I really like Tony and Dorrie, but just a shame what's Happend, I think Dorrie needs to understand in what I'm telling her.

 I was originally going with polaris labs NR-10 but glad I found Susan who formulates the same stuff. Only question now is, will it be as effective and my answer is probably yes after researching her background.

----------


## Jazz1

> What's Susan's contact ?


 Her details are here:
412-421-4996

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/about-us.html

To get a prescription you need to email Dr Kadz at medical wellness center I think it's around 60 dollars for 6 months prescription.

Champ call Susan first and discuss what you need she's really lovely and helpfull in discussing your needs.

----------


## thechamp

> Her details are here:
> 412-421-4996
> 
> http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/about-us.html
> 
> To get a prescription you need to email Dr Kadz at medical wellness center I think it's around 60 dollars for 6 months prescription.
> 
> Champ call Susan first and discuss what you need she's really lovely and helpfull in discussing your needs.


 Does that mean we have to renew our prescription for 60 bucks every 6 months ?

----------


## Jazz1

> Does that mean we have to renew our prescription for 60 bucks every 6 months ?


 Yes, Unfortunatly i have no control over this and most doctors charge this Fee private check anywhere. Try finding a private doctor to precribe hairloss meds, it's very hard as I called around private clinics in US none of them were interested. I'm happy to pay this as I truly beleive in Dr Klein products, so if Susan can make us the same im happy as no other topical formulations on the market can beat this apart from RU58841. I tried every topical lotion potion and most of them are rubbish. 

I seriously wish some big company can mass produce and formulate Dr kleins products to sell world wide to everyone. If I had things my way Champ I would seriously help everyone out, I always spoke to Dr Klein. To anyone who knew Dr Klein knows how great this person was, he was always willing to help me out. Dr Klein had a true passion in helping his patients, although he had a business to run I truly believe he was more than just money. His passion was to help his patients, his product was the best on the market. I'm just still down about his death, not only have I lost great products, I have lost a great Doctor who was always willing to take time in helping me out.

----------


## Jazz1

Right I sent susan a very long email regarding prices, hairsite still has the prices but I found a better site that shows his discount deals.

Anyways here's reply  :Smile: , so good news hopefully we can come to a fixed term. 

"Wow Jazz!  You are pumped glad to see!
I see no reason why I can't match these prices.  Are all four of your emails the same?
I will have to go through them to pull the prices ok?
I will try to do that today ok?
Susan"

----------


## jp125

Hi Jazz1 - sorry I am new to this forum and not as clued up as many, so be prepared for some stupid questions!

Quick background is I used Propecia tablets with success for 9 months but gave up 6 months ago due to sides. 
I've started Minox 5% a few months ago but so far its not having any major success.

For someone like me (who is clueless) what is this combination you are talking about? What does it contain? And how can I get it - I'm in the UK.
I have aggressive diffuse thinning btw, which started two years.

thanks a lot

----------


## Jazz1

> Well, actually they didn't give me an exact price but said it would be around $100.00.  That is considerably more than Dr Klein.  I think Dr Kleins Promox 5% was $60 plus $9.95 shipping fee.  I think, if memory serves me correctly.  But with this new formulation you only use it once a day if I'm not mistaken.  So I'm guessing this will last two months??  As far as Polaris Labs products are concerned, I like them.  The NR-11 is a nice product with some good ingredients.  It does contain 12% minoxidil sulphate.  I'm not sure if the sulphate version is really better or not.  I've read mixed reviews.  Their products are not cheap either.  With shipping to the U.S. I paid over $70.  This really annoys me because the product is made here in the U.S., shipped over to the distributor and then sent back here.  All because our FDA doesn't allow the sale of minoxidil formulations over 5%.  But overall, I think Polaris Labs makes a good product, IMO.  I'm certainly no expert though.


 Quick question the NR-11 contains 0.1% finesteride, 12% minoxidol? When you used this alone did you see results?

----------


## thechamp

I'm to scared to try high strenthg minoxdill because I'm sensitive to all medecations,I might see if Susan can make a 8 percent minoxdill. With biotin might try that !

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm to scared to try high strenthg minoxdill because I'm sensitive to all medecations,I might see if Susan can make a 8 percent minoxdill. With biotin might try that !


 Get it made in cream form you will be ok.

----------


## thechamp

> Get it made in cream form you will be ok.


 What would you recommend jazz what strength , I can't take fin because of weight gain , and azelic acid didn't agree with me so what woul you recommend ?

----------


## doke

hi jazz im certain that dr klines new formulas contained procapil and some peptides is this formula the same from susan, also it was tested minoxidil that is at different strengths and 5% was the best for hair regrowth if it works for you but many people get no regrowth and sometimes more hairloss.
Also I think if you use 5% twice a day as in dr klines formula was good and what happened to his trials will we never know what the results were? I for one do not like prop gly as its so greasy in uk there is a no prop gly formula with medroxyprogestorone which is like putting water on the scalp.

----------


## Never2late

> Quick question the NR-11 contains 0.1% finesteride, 12% minoxidol? When you used this alone did you see results?


 Well, actually I was using it in combination with the Promox.  I've been using it for about 2 and a half months and I'm seeing a lot of little hairs.  Some are actually getting length and color to them.  I don't know if its due to the Promox or the NR11.  If you research the ingredients in the NR11 though you will see it has a lot of good stuff in it.  The only thing its missing is Retin A.  It does contain Retinol but that's a much weaker version of Retin A.  But it does contain minoxidil sulphate as opposed to just plain minoxidil.  I'm not sure if there is a significant difference though.  That is a question I would like to ask Susan.  My plan is to alternate the NR11 with 12% minox and the .1% finasteride and the formulation from Susan, which is 12.5% minox, azelaic acid, Retin A and Progesterone(which i think is an important additive). I think this will be an effective combination.  Six months from now if I want I can always increase the formulation from Susan.

----------


## Never2late

Hi Jazz
I have question for you.  What are your thoughts on topical finasteride?  The reason I ask is because I've tried many different things over the past 15 years.  Starting with Dr Lewenburgs formula with 2% minox and retin a, Propecia, Dr Lees formulations as well as regular Rogaine.  But I've never really had any regrowth until I started Promox and Polaris NR11.  Both of which contain .1% finasteride.  Like I said, I'm not even three months in and I'm seeing little hairs sprouting along the front where I haven't had hair in 10 years.  They are very small but they are there and its giving me hope.  Is it possible that topical finasteride is responsible for this?  Or is it simply the combination of all these ingredients?  I wish I knew.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz
> I have question for you.  What are your thoughts on topical finasteride?  The reason I ask is because I've tried many different things over the past 15 years.  Starting with Dr Lewenburgs formula with 2% minox and retin a, Propecia, Dr Lees formulations as well as regular Rogaine.  But I've never really had any regrowth until I started Promox and Polaris NR11.  Both of which contain .1% finasteride.  Like I said, I'm not even three months in and I'm seeing little hairs sprouting along the front where I haven't had hair in 10 years.  They are very small but they are there and its giving me hope.  Is it possible that topical finasteride is responsible for this?  Or is it simply the combination of all these ingredients?  I wish I knew.


 Yes topical formulation is important, I learned past 4 years attack the hairloss at every angle it's amazing as I added the prescription 10% Promox spray this year I started turning into a wolf. Just a shame very big shame that Dorrie at Kleins office has not done enough to make her patients happy. She can easily source a doctor it's a business that has built great success to all us who have used them. Now we are all screwed as no doctor will prescribe his products to us, unless they find one!

I just hope Susan can formulate it the same than I will be very happy  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> What would you recommend jazz what strength , I can't take fin because of weight gain , and azelic acid didn't agree with me so what woul you recommend ?


 
I can't help you, best to call her and ask as she knows better than me  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> hi jazz im certain that dr klines new formulas contained procapil and some peptides is this formula the same from susan, also it was tested minoxidil that is at different strengths and 5% was the best for hair regrowth if it works for you but many people get no regrowth and sometimes more hairloss.
> Also I think if you use 5% twice a day as in dr klines formula was good and what happened to his trials will we never know what the results were? I for one do not like prop gly as its so greasy in uk there is a no prop gly formula with medroxyprogestorone which is like putting water on the scalp.


 Trust me when I say Dr kleins products were the best I used, nothing and I mean nothing beats his formulations.

----------


## Jazz1

Here guys I still buy Dr kleins 5% minxodiol now which has no precription stuff in it to use at night! 

Any of you geeks help me out?

1. How much finesteride tablets at 1mg do I need to make 0.1% in 60ml? I read it's 60 but that's insane?

2. How much grams of azelaic acid do I need to make 1.5% in 60ml?

----------


## Jazz1

I figured it out, 

1.5 grams azelaic acid powder is 1.5% in 60ml
 Finesteride is 60mg per 60ml, problem is getting hold of the powder  :Frown: .

----------


## doke

hi jazz the azelaic acid flakes powder you can get here https://www.fludan.com

----------


## doke

hi has anyone tried polaris labs nr10 16% minoxidil with 1% finasteride which you only use once at night.

----------


## Jazz1

> hi jazz the azelaic acid flakes powder you can get here https://www.fludan.com


 Thanks, already bought it  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> hi has anyone tried polaris labs nr10 16% minoxidil with 1% finasteride which you only use once at night.


 Hey Doke it seems legit I found more reviews through google on some chineese forums, the reason I'm not using that yet is because I like the Ingredienets better in Promox.

----------


## Eire1980

Hi All- hope all are keeping well

I have been following the thread and hoping someone will be able to answer my question

I have been looking on polaris site - http://www.pharma-trading.com/products/index.html and i am wondering what the main difference is in NR 11 & NR 10 in terms of fin?

they both contain 0.1% Finasteride but in the NR 11 its says "a type II-selective 5alpha-reductase inhibitor provides a complete management finasteride related side effects"

i have a prescription for propecia but i am afraid to take it to be honest. 

appreciate the advice - thanks!

----------


## Never2late

> Hi All- hope all are keeping well
> 
> I have been following the thread and hoping someone will be able to answer my question
> 
> I have been looking on polaris site - http://www.pharma-trading.com/products/index.html and i am wondering what the main difference is in NR 11 & NR 10 in terms of fin?
> 
> they both contain 0.1% Finasteride but in the NR 11 its says "a type II-selective 5alpha-reductase inhibitor provides a complete management finasteride related side effects"
> 
> i have a prescription for propecia but i am afraid to take it to be honest. 
> ...


  NR10 is 16% minoxidil.  NR11 is 12% minoxidil sulphate.  Depending which reports you read you will find that some believe minoxidil sulphate is absorbed more efficiently.  I'm not sure.  The NR11 does contain Alfatradiol, which is a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor and a potassium channel opener.  The NR11 also contains copper peptides which are supposed to be beneficial for hair growth.  I use the NR11 but I don't know if it is better.  I believe they are both good products and ultimately, it is the minoxidil that does the majority of the hair growth.  All of the other ingredients just help it along a bit.  They both contain the same amount of finasteride, .1%.

----------


## Never2late

FYI, the best prices I've found for Polaris Labs I found on Minoxidil15Express.com.  They also have Genhair and Dualgen products.

----------


## Eire1980

> NR10 is 16% minoxidil.  NR11 is 12% minoxidil sulphate.  Depending which reports you read you will find that some believe minoxidil sulphate is absorbed more efficiently.  I'm not sure.  The NR11 does contain Alfatradiol, which is a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor and a potassium channel opener.  The NR11 also contains copper peptides which are supposed to be beneficial for hair growth.  I use the NR11 but I don't know if it is better.  I believe they are both good products and ultimately, it is the minoxidil that does the majority of the hair growth.  All of the other ingredients just help it along a bit.  They both contain the same amount of finasteride, .1%.


 thanks a million for coming back on this.
in terms of fin, both contain the same amount, however it makes out to me that the side affects of fin are managed better with NR 11 - or am i reading that wrong - see below

a type II-selective 5alpha-reductase inhibitor provides a complete management finasteride related side effects"


cheers

----------


## Never2late

> thanks a million for coming back on this.
> in terms of fin, both contain the same amount, however it makes out to me that the side affects of fin are managed better with NR 11 - or am i reading that wrong - see below
> 
> a type II-selective 5alpha-reductase inhibitor provides a complete management finasteride related side effects"
> 
> 
> cheers


 I understand what you are saying but I think the finasteride will be absorbed equally in either formulation.  Although in the reports I've read the jury is still out as to whether topical finasteride is absorbed as well as the tablet.  I used Propecia several years ago and developed sides after several months.  I've been using topical fin for almost three months currently and haven't 'noticed' any sides.  Does that mean the topical fin is just staying in my scalp and not being absorbed systemically?  Who knows.  This hair loss thing is a lot of trial and error.  But you have to give treatments plenty of time to work.  If you are hesitant to take fin internally you could try a high strength minoxidil w/fin and alternate it with another minoxidil w/o fin.  See how that works for you.  In fact, that's exactly what I'm doing right now.  Good luck

----------


## doke

hi jazz the problem we have is the ingredience  for promox and the trial product dr kline was working on we will never get his formula right as he made as it took him years to get it right, that's why its a shame dorrie is not more helpful.
What was the trial product results were they finished? or will we never know.

----------


## Jazz1

> hi jazz the problem we have is the ingredience  for promox and the trial product dr kline was working on we will never get his formula right as he made as it took him years to get it right, that's why its a shame dorrie is not more helpful.
> What was the trial product results were they finished? or will we never know.


 Hi I reckon Susan can formulate it the same as stated she's even selling the same formula for years with great success from her current clients. Dr Klein never formulated his products, it was and still is their current pharmacist. Any good pharmacist with good equipment can formulate the stuff so long as that person has great knowledge. I mean look at the belgravia Center they have their own Pharmacist formulate their products. In terms of Dr Kleins new trial you can forget it, now he's dead I don't think much will happen. I'm just upset, I like Tony and Dorrie but I really think they could have done more I'm sure Dr Klein would not want his clients suffering. I also can not believe how assholes most doctors are these days! None of them are willing to help!

I'm just thankful that I found Dr Kadz medical wellness Center and thankful Susan knows her stuff  :Smile:  only time will tell if her products work.

----------


## thechamp

> I understand what you are saying but I think the finasteride will be absorbed equally in either formulation.  Although in the reports I've read the jury is still out as to whether topical finasteride is absorbed as well as the tablet.  I used Propecia several years ago and developed sides after several months.  I've been using topical fin for almost three months currently and haven't 'noticed' any sides.  Does that mean the topical fin is just staying in my scalp and not being absorbed systemically?  Who knows.  This hair loss thing is a lot of trial and error.  But you have to give treatments plenty of time to work.  If you are hesitant to take fin internally you could try a high strength minoxidil w/fin and alternate it with another minoxidil w/o fin.  See how that works for you.  In fact, that's exactly what I'm doing right now.  Good luck


 Jaz the reason I don't try topical fin is because I gain weight from fin chances are it goes systematic and I'll gain weight again

----------


## Jazz1

> Jaz the reason I don't try topical fin is because I gain weight from fin chances are it goes systematic and I'll gain weight again


 This is what I have learned topical lotion formulation is much better and localised, liquid form penetrates into the blood stream. I could be wrong but judging from another guy who had internal FIN sides he never got sides from Promox lotion and had good success until recent Dr Klein passed away, he losing ground as he thinks Dorrie sent him a messed up batch! I also know another guy who used Promox spray form and had sides, so judging by both I beleive lotion or cream based stays localised. When I tried Xandorx 15% I still have this by Dr lee, I had the worst bloated face and headache. When I use Promox and belgravia cream/lotion I get 0 sides and Good results.

----------


## thechamp

> This is what I have learned topical lotion formulation is much better and localised, liquid form penetrates into the blood stream. I could be wrong but judging from another guy who had internal FIN sides he never got sides from Promox lotion and had good success until recent Dr Klein passed away, he losing ground as he thinks Dorrie sent him a messed up batch! I also know another guy who used Promox spray form and had sides, so judging by both I beleive lotion or cream based stays localised. When I tried Xandorx 15% I still have this by Dr lee, I had the worst bloated face and headache. When I use Promox and belgravia cream/lotion I get 0 sides and Good results.


   It will still go systematic I tried dut capsules in aloe Vera gel same thing goes systematic

----------


## goldnt

> This is what I have learned topical lotion formulation is much better and localised, liquid form penetrates into the blood stream. I could be wrong but judging from another guy who had internal FIN sides he never got sides from Promox lotion and had good success until recent Dr Klein passed away, he losing ground as he thinks Dorrie sent him a messed up batch! I also know another guy who used Promox spray form and had sides, so judging by both I beleive lotion or cream based stays localised. When I tried Xandorx 15% I still have this by Dr lee, I had the worst bloated face and headache. When I use Promox and belgravia cream/lotion I get 0 sides and Good results.


 Hey jazz how do you apply your topical lotion? Im not sure how you would do it if you had long hair. For example i would let the minox foam turn into a liquid and apply since most of the foam would of stayed on my hair. And you mention you want susan to make a promox replica,are you going to add the other ingredients they offer? Ive been on ru for a while and i think its time to change.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey jazz how do you apply your topical lotion? Im not sure how you would do it if you had long hair. For example i would let the minox foam turn into a liquid and apply since most of the foam would of stayed on my hair. And you mention you want susan to make a promox replica,are you going to add the other ingredients they offer? Ive been on ru for a while and i think its time to change.


 RU not working? She's already been selling the same formulation for years through the medical wellness center. Although Im waiting for her to receive the lotion and sprays I sent her, they arrived in Kennedy new York out for delivery. The sooner she gets these I wanted her to replicate the same texture etc, I only apply lotion to the temples, but trust me it's easier than you think. I would apply it temples, mid scalp and crown very simple to apply even with long hair just part and apply.

----------


## goldnt

> RU not working? She's already been selling the same formulation for years through the medical wellness center. Although Im waiting for her to receive the lotion and sprays I sent her, they arrived in Kennedy new York out for delivery. The sooner she gets these I wanted her to replicate the same texture etc, I only apply lotion to the temples, but trust me it's easier than you think. I would apply it temples, mid scalp and crown very simple to apply even with long hair just part and apply.


 Sadly its not. Its been working for me for about 8 months till one day i started having the tingling itchy warm sensation on my scalp that happened before i treated my hairloss. I know when something is not working when that happens, because hairloss always follows after those sensations. Bought 2 more batches after that to test it and nothing. Even increased the concentration of ru past 10% and nothing. I think im going to buy 1 more batch and hope it works and if not im going to have to hop on something else pref topicals. And alright ill follow this thread to see what you conclude from their product.

----------


## Jazz1

Who do you buy your RU from? I know the feeling as my scalp is like a timer when I stop FIN I get those same sides effects as you, itchy, tingling and burning scalp. I would consider trying 100mg RU in a vehicle like neogenic, but make fresh daily batches, 3ml neogenic and 100mg RU try that? If that does not work add internal FIN and DUT ontop. 

This mixture might not work as I find it an addition to a stronger anti androgen blocker like FIN and DUT. If everything else fails than maybe try spiro tablets but be carefull! I know a guy on hairlosshelp who's using spiro tablets but has gone from NW3 to NW1, but he has loss libido and not bothered.

----------


## goldnt

I buy from Kane, i know they have a good record so thats why i still have faith on them. Im going to buy 1 more batch hoping i just got bad batches. And yea i do 110mg daily fresh batches. With everclear and vegetable glycerinas vehicle, since pg gave me flakes. I know its not the vehicle that's giving me problems, as it worked for months. Before i threw out my ru i really wanted to make sure it didn't work (because its basically $200 bucks down the drain), so i even when up to 150-200mg batches for the heck of it. Still didnt work. As for sides ive never really gotten anything from ru when it worked or not. Im at the brink of trying fin but id rather wait a bit and see how you do with your new product. Quick question,if you use topical fin why do you bother with oral fin? I guess ive been affected from those scare mongering threads of fin.

----------


## Jazz1

> I buy from Kane, i know they have a good record so thats why i still have faith on them. Im going to buy 1 more batch hoping i just got bad batches. And yea i do 110mg daily fresh batches. With everclear and vegetable glycerinas vehicle, since pg gave me flakes. I know its not the vehicle that's giving me problems, as it worked for months. Before i threw out my ru i really wanted to make sure it didn't work (because its basically $200 bucks down the drain), so i even when up to 150-200mg batches for the heck of it. Still didnt work. As for sides ive never really gotten anything from ru when it worked or not. Im at the brink of trying fin but id rather wait a bit and see how you do with your new product. Quick question,if you use topical fin why do you bother with oral fin? I guess ive been affected from those scare mongering threads of fin.


 Oral FIN only inhibits certain amount of DHT some people still carry on slowly receeding. Topical and oral FIN or even spiro with the right vehicle is the key to good hair whilst on internal FIN. I seriously would try oral FIN see how you go? I would also email Kane to se if he is sending you good batches. If he is sending you good stuff than looks like your body become tolerant.

----------


## Jazz1

Just update for some of you guys who still buy promox 5% DMI but can not get hold of their prescription mixture. I found source available to buy azelaic acid flakes and finesteride powder at good prices. If you use spray prescription 3 times a day, than the mixture you need is below;

Finesteride powder from Kane=50 USD per 1 gram.
Azelaic acid flakes= 24 dollars 100 grams.

All you need to do is dump 60MG finesteride powder per 60ml promox for 0.1%  and dump 1.5 grams for 1.5% azelaic acid.

----------


## doke

> Sadly its not. Its been working for me for about 8 months till one day i started having the tingling itchy warm sensation on my scalp that happened before i treated my hairloss. I know when something is not working when that happens, because hairloss always follows after those sensations. Bought 2 more batches after that to test it and nothing. Even increased the concentration of ru past 10% and nothing. I think im going to buy 1 more batch and hope it works and if not im going to have to hop on something else pref topicals. And alright ill follow this thread to see what you conclude from their product.


 Hi If you see irishpride at the other hairloss site he had cases of complete baldness to regrowth with topicals and on ru and only to regrow it all back again and he documented this in pictures.
So is this what we have to do keep putting up with huge shedding then for it to regrow again.
I need to find out how irish is doing now I do now he has said ru has to keep being used.

----------


## doke

By the way guys do not go with any hype that Dr Klines promox was a cure and would work as there are many that have said it did nothing.
I myself never used any of Klines products but was talking with them on the trial they had but it would be good if jazz has got an all in one the same as promox that is not too expensive to try.

----------


## Jazz1

> By the way guys do not go with any hype that Dr Klines promox was a cure and would work as there are many that have said it did nothing.
> I myself never used any of Klines products but was talking with them on the trial they had but it would be good if jazz has got an all in one the same as promox that is not too expensive to try.


 We'll said, I find his products a great addition to the big3, it's for people who still carry on slowly losing ground. Like having the icing on the cake, I also found recently that s5 cream works with the right vehicle. I been recently using s5 cream, in the past it never worked but now it's working. The reason I think it's working because I apply it first than spray DMI promox over it. I reckon the DMI is helping penetrate it deep into the skin tissue to work.

----------


## doke

jazz how much per month is the formula going to be and is it all in one 5% or 15%?

----------


## Eire1980

Hi Guy's - i was thinking of going with NR-8, dp you know if the website below legit?

http://www.minoxidil15express.com/

if so whats with the once off shipping of £10.95

thanks!

----------


## Jazz1

> jazz how much per month is the formula going to be and is it all in one 5% or 15%?


 I'm still waiting to hear back on prices, plus I'm waiting for her to receive Dr kleins products anytime soon.

----------


## inbrugge

> We'll said, I find his products a great addition to the big3, it's for people who still carry on slowly losing ground. Like having the icing on the cake, I also found recently that s5 cream works with the right vehicle. I been recently using s5 cream, in the past it never worked but now it's working. The reason I think it's working because I apply it first than spray DMI promox over it. I reckon the DMI is helping penetrate it deep into the skin tissue to work.


 Hey, can someone summarize the difference between S5, DMI, and progesterone (spelling?)

I know about fin, dut, and ru. But I haven't really heard about the workimg mechanisms, safety factors, and differences behind these options.

I'm currently just using Minox, but I'm losing ground FAST. I want to get on some anti-androgens (highly prefer topical versus oral). However, with so many options I'm so confused. 

Can someone run down quickly what these are? Isn't one of them for castrating men?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey, can someone summarize the difference between S5, DMI, and progesterone (spelling?)
> 
> I know about fin, dut, and ru. But I haven't really heard about the workimg mechanisms, safety factors, and differences behind these options.
> 
> I'm currently just using Minox, but I'm losing ground FAST. I want to get on some anti-androgens (highly prefer topical versus oral). However, with so many options I'm so confused. 
> 
> Can someone run down quickly what these are? Isn't one of them for castrating men?


 No lol they won't castrate you, these topical we are on about work together to inhibit scalp DHT, the lady who formulates them is Susan a pharmacist. The previous guy who's now dead look him up is Dr Oscar Klein. If you want a good topical Hairloss product then it's the one Susan formulates etc.

----------


## Jazz1

Just to update you guys I emailed Susan on the weekend and she did say about a fixed price match etc. Anways I had no email back, I called their office seems Susan is away for a week due to family circumstances, must be because of her father passing away recently. Anways soon as I hear from her il keep  you lot updated. Also I will be placing my order with her once she gets and formulates the mixture as Kleins for me  :Smile: .

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## goldnt

Nice Jazz. Keep us updated. And where do you buy your s5 cream? Do you buy it from genhair?

----------


## Jazz1

> Nice Jazz. Keep us updated. And where do you buy your s5 cream? Do you buy it from genhair?


 ************  :Smile: , like I said above it never worked before only reason why I think it's working now is because I'm spraying DMI over the area, as in Promox 5% OTC

----------


## inbrugge

> Just to update you guys I emailed Susan on the weekend and she did say about a fixed price match etc. Anways I had no email back, I called their office seems Susan is away for a week due to family circumstances, must be because of her father passing away recently. Anways soon as I hear from her il keep  you lot updated. Also I will be placing my order with her once she gets and formulates the mixture as Kleins for me .


 Thanks for your work, Jazz. I'm really hoping to get started on one of these solutions. So will we all be able to order our preferred solution from her? (I'm in the US).

And what about a prescription? Will we need one, and if so, where do we get one? I really doubt my regular physician would give me such a prescription.

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for your work, Jazz. I'm really hoping to get started on one of these solutions. So will we all be able to order our preferred solution from her? (I'm in the US).
> 
> And what about a prescription? Will we need one, and if so, where do we get one? I really doubt my regular physician would give me such a prescription.


 Thanks,Yes she will provide you with any mixture if you check my previous posts in this thread I posted everything. You have to pay Dr Kadz at the medical wellness Center 60 odd dollars for 6 refills prescription that he emails to Susan to prescribe you the medications  :Smile: .

----------


## johnnyboots

> Thanks,Yes she will provide you with any mixture if you check my previous posts in this thread I posted everything. You have to pay Dr Kadz at the medical wellness Center 60 odd dollars for 6 refills prescription that he emails to Susan to prescribe you the medications .


  Hey jazz,so dr.kadz will know if I say I want promox 15 lotion etc.?and then she will take it from there ?

----------


## Never2late

Hi Jazz
I just received my formulation from Susan.  It comes in a 65 ml bottle.  According to the instructions you only use it once per day, 1 ml at a time.  All of the ingredients are listed on the bottle, it looks professional.  So this should last just over two months.  I didn't get the exact price but it was around $100.  I'm ok paying $50 a month if it is for a product that works.  If you can negotiate a better price that would be awesome.  Keep us updated

----------


## johnnyboots

> Hi Jazz
> I just received my formulation from Susan.  It comes in a 65 ml bottle.  According to the instructions you only use it once per day, 1 ml at a time.  All of the ingredients are listed on the bottle, it looks professional.  So this should last just over two months.  I didn't get the exact price but it was around $100.  I'm ok paying $50 a month if it is for a product that works.  If you can negotiate a better price that would be awesome.  Keep us updated


 Hey bro can u give me the email or phone for the prescription I wanna order the promox 15 lotion thanks

----------


## Never2late

> Hey bro can u give me the email or phone for the prescription I wanna order the promox 15 lotion thanks


 You have to go to www.medicalwellnesscenter.com.  Look for the link for the compounded minoxidil formulations.  Click on that and it will take you to page where you request a prescription.  You have to fill that out with the ingredients you want added to the minoxidil.  They will review your request and submit it to the compounding pharmacy.  Then the pharmacy will contact you.  It really is pretty easy and self explanatory.  Let me know if it works ok for you.

----------


## johnnyboots

> You have to go to www.medicalwellnesscenter.com.  Look for the link for the compounded minoxidil formulations.  Click on that and it will take you to page where you request a prescription.  You have to fill that out with the ingredients you want added to the minoxidil.  They will review your request and submit it to the compounding pharmacy.  Then the pharmacy will contact you.  It really is pretty easy and self explanatory.  Let me know if it works ok for you.


 Thanks you very much

----------


## Never2late

Btw, it does cost $49.95 for the doctor consultation.  That will also get you 6 refills on your prescription.  After 6 refills you will pay $60 for a years worth of refills.  Also, the price I paid was $90 for a bottle that will last for 2 months.  Your price will depend on the strength of the minoxidil and the added ingredients you want.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz
> I just received my formulation from Susan.  It comes in a 65 ml bottle.  According to the instructions you only use it once per day, 1 ml at a time.  All of the ingredients are listed on the bottle, it looks professional.  So this should last just over two months.  I didn't get the exact price but it was around $100.  I'm ok paying $50 a month if it is for a product that works.  If you can negotiate a better price that would be awesome.  Keep us updated


 Bingo, perfect I'm on the verge of trying to make her match Dr kleins prices so lets wait and see. As for the formulation she sent what's it like compad to Dr kleins lotion? Any chance of some pictures  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey bro can u give me the email or phone for the prescription I wanna order the promox 15 lotion thanks


 Hi yes, you just need follow that link in red Dr Klein patients on this website http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com, 

If you get stuck give me a shout direct email jass897@hotmail.com, you pay Dr kadz for the prescription and then you pay Susan for the formulation. I would get 15% made with azelaic acid as its a DHT blocker from studies etc. But like any minxoxidol it won't work that good unless you use a DHT blocker I highly suggest FIN.

----------


## Tarikko

Hey Jazz bro,

Hope all is well.

I checked the website and i am really tempted to order the promox solution.

However, i am quite terrified from topical finasteride... 

I know i can benefit from it a lot, but i have my wife and kids in the house... And it goes on the hair... once it is on the hair, God knows where it is gonna rub off... pillows, bed, sofa...

How can i make it safe?

If any knows as well, can you chime in with your opinions.

Thank you Jazz, you helped this community so much!!

----------


## Jazz1

Thanks Tarikko  :Smile:  always here to help, I will speak to Susan and Dr kadz as they will know more knowledge. To my understanding when I use prolix lotion it absorbs well into the skin within half hour. I do not know much about Susan's forumla maybe never2late can provide us how it absorbs?

----------


## thechamp

Jazz what the best ingredients I can add to minoxdill because I can't Handel fin  or azelic acid so what can I add?, biotin saw plamento caffeine?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz what the best ingredients I can add to minoxdill because I can't Handel fin  or azelic acid so what can I add?, biotin saw plamento caffeine?


 I would avoid saw palmetto, bition be carefull in case you suffer acne can give you acne aswell even if you don't suffer. I would give Susan a call when she's back as I really would not know, I always recommend the proven indigents to target hairloss at all angles.

----------


## Tarikko

> Thanks Tarikko  always here to help, I will speak to Susan and Dr kadz as they will know more knowledge. To my understanding when I use prolix lotion it absorbs well into the skin within half hour. I do not know much about Susan's forumla maybe never2late can provide us how it absorbs?


 Ok brother, thanks once again...

I really wanna get on this regimen, yet i donot wanna endanger my family. I am on oral Finasteride right now, but would like to switch to topical if there are no additional risks to my surroundings.

Salam bro

----------


## Jazz1

> Ok brother, thanks once again...
> 
> I really wanna get on this regimen, yet i donot wanna endanger my family. I am on oral Finasteride right now, but would like to switch to topical if there are no additional risks to my surroundings.
> 
> Salam bro


 
I doubt it brother you will be ok as it absorbs very well, have faithe  :Smile: , I will do my best to speak with Susan when she is back  :Smile: .

----------


## Tarikko

Ok Jazz, will wait for your feedback! <3

----------


## Never2late

> Bingo, perfect I'm on the verge of trying to make her match Dr kleins prices so lets wait and see. As for the formulation she sent what's it like compad to Dr kleins lotion? Any chance of some pictures .


 I ordered the 12.5% lotion but it is more like a cream.  I would say it is just slightly thicker than the Promox lotion.  It absorbs fairly quickly but not quite as quick as Promox lotion.

----------


## Never2late

Hey Jazz
I can't figure out how to upload a damn picture!!!  If you want to, give me your email and I'll email you a picture.  Thanks

----------


## doke

Guys there is also minoxidil max dualgen 15% minoxidil with finasteride and azelaic acid 5% retinol 0.25% and caffeine, no pg.And a pg version also a 6% minox with same ingredience.
I am wondering a lady runs this company maybe she also runs the site jazz is getting the topical made I might be wrong.

----------


## Swooping

Kane is going to launch similar formulations soon, all kinds of strengths with various ingredients.

----------


## Jazz1

> I ordered the 12.5% lotion but it is more like a cream.  I would say it is just slightly thicker than the Promox lotion.  It absorbs fairly quickly but not quite as quick as Promox lotion.


 Perfect, well I sent her the Promox spray and lotion I checked the tracking it says it's in Kennedy new York. I sent it tracked to her so once she gets the parcel hopefully she can try and make it the same texture etc.

Please keep us updated how the products works etc, I will be placing my order once she gets Kleins products I sent her so she can make it same type texture for me.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz
> I can't figure out how to upload a damn picture!!!  If you want to, give me your email and I'll email you a picture.  Thanks


 Yes perfect than il upload it here  :Smile: , jass897@hotmail.com

----------


## Jazz1

> Guys there is also minoxidil max dualgen 15% minoxidil with finasteride and azelaic acid 5% retinol 0.25% and caffeine, no pg.And a pg version also a 6% minox with same ingredience.
> I am wondering a lady runs this company maybe she also runs the site jazz is getting the topical made I might be wrong.


 I had the same feeling You could be right who knows, so long as I get good quality products I'm not bothered who runs what site lol. I don't want to buy that other dualgen stuff as liquid form gave me sides s in Xandorx. Plus I heard some bad things about Dualgen, the other two options I had was Polaris labs which is legit and Susan. I decided to use Susan as she can make me the same stuff as Klein.

----------


## Jazz1

> Kane is going to launch similar formulations soon, all kinds of strengths with various ingredients.


 This is good news, any information what formulations?

----------


## Jazz1

Guys sorry about the delay I'm still tracking the parcel daily it shows it's in Kennedy new York. Also Susan was away this week which means I have had no email reply regarding price deals and price matching. I did email her a long list of proof for Dr Kleins price list and deal he done.

----------


## Swooping

> This is good news, any information what formulations?


 SABA, minoxidil combinations with retin-a , etc. Don't know precisely, probably much like promox.

----------


## Jazz1

> SABA, minoxidil combinations with retin-a , etc. Don't know precisely, probably much like promox.


 Cool I already have the Saba combination, you can buy Dactokart cream and then use Promox which is better than Saba gel in my eyes.

Check my thread how i regrew my hairline back, I know it's Aloepcia areata but trust me when you have a weak hairline already from AGA growing it back is difficult. Suffering both diseases is hard to regrow, my combination here has proven how I regrew my hair, wounding, and mixture of all those ingredients have worked.

Over the years I have gained a lot of knowledge on these forums and always looking at different pathways. I enjoy helping people it's become a passion, I get satisfaction when someone is helped. Why because I learned the hard way, when my hair was falling not one Doctor/derm/tricologist helped me they were just ineterested in my consultation money. Luckily I joined the forums and started gaining information, trying so much junk. I will always be around and I will always be willing to help people in my free time  :Smile: . Mark is a great guy, he's the one who taught me hairloss has to be targeted at all angles.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...582&highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

Good news just checked the parcel I sent Susan it says it's been delivered  :Smile: .

----------


## inbrugge

Amongst Promox and Remox combinations: what additives do you recommend?

Hydrocortisone
Proestregen (sp)
Topical Fin
Azelaic Acid
DMI

Which ones would you NOT recommend.

Also, if I buy oral fin, crush it, and put same percentage into Rogaine, is that practically the same thing as Topical Fin?

----------


## Jazz1

> Amongst Promox and Remox combinations: what additives do you recommend?
> 
> Hydrocortisone
> Proestregen (sp)
> Topical Fin
> Azelaic Acid
> DMI
> 
> Which ones would you NOT recommend.
> ...


 I use all the above, but carefull using hydorcortisone daily long term as I now use it say once a month. I also recommend tretinoin to help stimulate stem cells, DMI is better if your allergic to PG. I can not recommend any as Promox contains all apart from hydrocortisone and all the mixtures have worked wonders for me. Also to add nothing is better than the BIG3, this mixture is an addition to the BIG3, for people looking for that extra edge of growth and thickness. It will only work if your halting hairloss on the BIG3. 

I would not crush FIN as finesteride tablets are coated with a filler film, crushing 60mg tablets in 60ml solution means more filler and more cost. If you wanted to make your own, Kane sells finesteride lab powder, 50 USD is 1gram the more you buy the more deals he provides.

----------


## inbrugge

Great answer, bro.

I'm on minox and keto shampoo. But, I'm avoiding oral fin because of side effects. I'm planning to provide the anti-androgen factor through topicals only. You don't think that would be a sufficient strategy?

Also, you mentioned that you had sides on fin (like everyone else). You said you managed to overcome them. How?

----------


## Jazz1

> Great answer, bro.
> 
> I'm on minox and keto shampoo. But, I'm avoiding oral fin because of side effects. I'm planning to provide the anti-androgen factor through topicals only. You don't think that would be a sufficient strategy?
> 
> Also, you mentioned that you had sides on fin (like everyone else). You said you managed to overcome them. How?


 Topicals are a good start, first of regenpure is a better Keto shampoo in my eyes and also S5 cream can help depending on how aggressive your hairloss.

A guy on here using promox lotion had 0 sides, maybe a lotion based is better as less is penetrated into the blood than liquid? I could be wrong.

Yes I did have major sides on FIN, I did not want to stop so I bought genhair finesteride spray this worked great as I used it every third day. I did have sides on this but enough to cope with sex and save my hair. I found the sides were a mind issue, if you stress more over the fact you have sides your brain signals the penis off. Controlling the mind for me and concentrating on dirty fantasies worked, off course relaxing yourself and not stressing. Horny goat weed also helps for libido. Fast forward 7 months i started losing hairs, two weeks later I was thinning fast so I jumped on 1mg FIN and had 0 sides. I have Been on internal FIN for 3 years now, I remember waking up around 8 months after internal FIN with 0 erections, I panicked as I didn't know what to do etc. My partner helped me out as she works in the medical field and use to sell Viagra. She told me to relax and not think about it, I did just that and I spent half a day in bed watching my favourite porn whilst trying my best to get an erection. It took me an hour to kick start my penis, like I said mind control  :Smile: , it's hard but the main factors are removing stress and anxiety than work on kick starting the mind. Sides can be real and I know exactly how people feel, it's like your trapped in a hole. The sides obviously get worse because people automatically stress over the sides and stress does not help with erections.

I seriously would not panick, because FIN is a wonder drug for hairloss. All my friends use it without sides, I would suggest trying 0.25mg every 2nd day to let your body adjust and see how you go.

----------


## inbrugge

Awesome answer again, bro. I'm thinking on starting with topical fin and see how my body and hair reacts to it. 

Then depending on that, I might start a low dosage of oral fin. However, just based on my logic, it seems like a better strategy to focus on the scalp. After all, we apply minoxidil on the scalp to reduce sides as well.

I also bought some Ru from Kane, so I will see how that goes as well. Is there a place to order Fin in the US without a prescription? I've heard or inhous... but I don't really know if it's trustable. I don't wanna receive knock off carnicogen pills from China.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey sorry for the late reply I been busy working long hours! Anyways I would avoid RU until last resort. Maybe try topical lotion form FIN, Susan can formulate it or try polaris labs, I'm from the uk so I would not know about prescription. The medical Wellnes Center can prescribe you anything but they charge a small fee.

----------


## Jazz1

Right guys Susan emailed me back, she's back in her office and will start working the prices etc. she has also received the products I sent her so I'm hoping she can make the same texture etc as Dr Kleins. I will be placing my order once these points are clear  :Smile: .

----------


## Hairismylife

> Right guys Susan emailed me back, she's back in her office and will start working the prices etc. she has also received the products I sent her so I'm hoping she can make the same texture etc as Dr Kleins. I will be placing my order once these points are clear .


 Can order overseas?

----------


## Jazz1

> Can order overseas?


 Yes.

----------


## Jazz1

Hi guys I have an full complete update on this now il post tommorow as I'm way too tired from my night shift at work. I will also be placing my order this week, and Susan also got the products I sent her etc. Anyways will post full update tommorow, iv done my bit now found an alternative for you guys who like me were stressing out and also i did my best to reduce prices like you guys suggested. Anyways have good evening will post the full update tommorow, as for the product il order it this week and will keep you guys updated how it's working for me etc  :Smile:

----------


## Jazz1

> I ordered the 12.5% lotion but it is more like a cream.  I would say it is just slightly thicker than the Promox lotion.  It absorbs fairly quickly but not quite as quick as Promox lotion.


 Hey mate any update, how's the product going and how do you feel about it so far?

----------


## Never2late

> Hey mate any update, how's the product going and how do you feel about it so far?


 Well, so far so good.  Like I said it is similar to Dr Kleins formulation.  The lotion from Susan is just slightly thicker, more like a cream.  But it does absorb well.  I haven't had any irritation, no redness, no itching.  So that's a good thing.  I'm just using it at night so I hope it does last for two months.  I'm hoping Susan can give a break on the price.  I paid a total of $95 with shipping.  I live in the same State so my shipping was only $5.  But I like it so far.  Please keep us updated with any pricing information.  Thanks Jazz

----------


## Hairismylife

actually what are the ingredients of promox lotion besides minox?

----------


## Jazz1

> actually what are the ingredients of promox lotion besides minox?


 Finesteride
Azelaic acid
Progesterone 
Biotinoyl Tripeptide.

----------


## Jazz1

> Well, so far so good.  Like I said it is similar to Dr Kleins formulation.  The lotion from Susan is just slightly thicker, more like a cream.  But it does absorb well.  I haven't had any irritation, no redness, no itching.  So that's a good thing.  I'm just using it at night so I hope it does last for two months.  I'm hoping Susan can give a break on the price.  I paid a total of $95 with shipping.  I live in the same State so my shipping was only $5.  But I like it so far.  Please keep us updated with any pricing information.  Thanks Jazz


 
Right that's good to hear I'm ordering mine on Friday  :Smile: .

I'm going post the email so everyone can see the pricing I tried my best but thats everything Susan can do. I'm still happy hope rest of you are happy, I'm just more happy now that i can buy a product to use than not buy anything to use  :Smile: .

Email from Susan, any questions email her direct or if I have time I can email her the questions as she said she's happy to answer any emails or phone calls.

Also I can not post on here Dr kleins pricing but go on hairsite the price ranges are there, also Anagen has full discount combo breakdown or just email me for the direct links jass897@hotmail.com. It is always best to call Susan direct and reference this thread to help her give better prices on combinations.

"So I just tried your 10% formula and all I smelled and felt is alcohol Jazz.* This is why we don’t do any solutions greater than 5% because they come out of solution.* When I poured yours through a filter I “caught” most of the Minoxidil in the filter.
Also, your 15% lotion is gritty.
And the third critique is that they are mislabeled without a proper RX label on them.* Perhaps the label is on an outer bag?
*
As I told you before, I hold my license and my expertise in extremely high expectation and we are going to provide an excellent product for you and the community.
They will not be disappointed, you will see.
*
Pricing wise, no problem, but we are generally going to be about $5 dollars more on most products.
A general blog might say,* “Discount for 3 or more of one product within the appropriate expiration date” (remember we sent ours for stability and efficacy testing and we can only get 30 days on a solution per USP standards and 180 days on cream or lotion.
Thanks Jazz,
Susan
*
Susan Merenstein, Pharmacist/Owner"

----------


## Jazz1

More emails,

"From: susan@maapgh.com
Hey Jazz,
We typically do 60ml bottles as our clients only use them up in 2 months.* We know a lot of Dr.Kleins patients were using twice a day but that is expensive and overkill in my humble opinion.
Each lotion or cream is good for 180days.* Even 5% without additives is 180days.
Thanks a million,
Susan"


Regarding the spray formula prescription it is best to give her a call. I'm just sticking with the lotion formula which I'm happy  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

I will be placing my order Friday so I will keep you guys informed on the product itself, as this is the first time I will be using something besides Dr kleins products. 

Also I do not want to mislead anyone but Dr kleins products are not a cure, they basically were the icing on the cake. Dr lee was the same case, but I beleive alongside the big3 these products Dr lee and Dr Klein created was the best thing to happen to many people among the community. I have tried everything even Dr proctors stuff, you name anything I have tried it and again the stuff that has worked on me can be seen in my hairloss regrowth thread.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...582&highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

> Well, so far so good.  Like I said it is similar to Dr Kleins formulation.  The lotion from Susan is just slightly thicker, more like a cream.  But it does absorb well.  I haven't had any irritation, no redness, no itching.  So that's a good thing.  I'm just using it at night so I hope it does last for two months.  I'm hoping Susan can give a break on the price.  I paid a total of $95 with shipping.  I live in the same State so my shipping was only $5.  But I like it so far.  Please keep us updated with any pricing information.  Thanks Jazz


 Hey mate I'm really tempted to try NR-11 aswell, any side effects? Also do you think its helping?

----------


## morehairline

Their website is down. How else can I contact them?

----------


## FearTheLoss

http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/

check out their low systemic absorption technology Jazz1...maybe we could get Susan to contact them and this pharmacy could formulate a topical dut that doesn't have any side effects.

----------


## thechamp

> http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/
> 
> check out their low systemic absorption technology Jazz1...maybe we could get Susan to contact them and this pharmacy could formulate a topical dut that doesn't have any side effects.


 Do you honestly think that it could stop dut going systematic ? I tried dut topically once got shortness of breath I squirted dut tablets in to alo vera

----------


## Jazz1

> Their website is down. How else can I contact them?


 You on about DR kleins website? I know but I'm not buying from them anymore as they won't sell the prescription stuff  since he died. If you go through the whole thread everything is posted where to buy it from now, an alternative to the exact same product Dr Klein sold.

Her details are here:
412-421-4996

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/about-us.html

To get a prescription you need to email Dr Kadz at medical wellness center I think it's around 60 dollars for 6 months prescription.

Website follow the Dr Klein link:

http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com/

Mention this thread to her when you are paying and when you fill your details with the medical wellness center make sure you put the exact ingredients before paying for the prescription. They will then email your prescription to Susan who will formulate you the same product you were using with Dr Klein.

----------


## Jazz1

> http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/
> 
> check out their low systemic absorption technology Jazz1...maybe we could get Susan to contact them and this pharmacy could formulate a topical dut that doesn't have any side effects.


 I will ask her on Monday for you as I was so busy with work I didn't get chance to order my products from her. I will 100% be placing my order on Monday as my Promox lotion is running low, I bought 6 Promox lotion when Dr Klein passed away but they are mixed and not as effective!! So I wasted money!

----------


## Jazz1

> Do you honestly think that it could stop dut going systematic ? I tried dut topically once got shortness of breath I squirted dut tablets in to alo vera


 Depends bro, i know people who had sides on topical FIN internally and liquid form, but the ones who used Dr kleins lotion did not have much or any side effects and had stopped their hairloss. I reckon lotion or cream based stays within the scalp and maybe does not penetrate into the blood. It is all about trying things to see if they work or not for you.

----------


## Jazz1

Guys people are getting confused so everything is in this post, if you are Dr kleins ex patient like me who is struggling to find a doctor and need his products desperate than see the details below where to buy alternative:

You need to buy 6 months prescription here. Follow the Dr Klein link and put in the exact ingredients you are using currently from Dr kleins products.

http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com/

Once you had payed for your prescription with the medcial wellness they will then email your prescription to Susan.

Susan has been selling the same products for years luckily I found these guys as an alternative. You can do a search on her background but her details are below, once she receives your prescription she will than formulate you the products, they are 5 dollars more than Dr kleins I did my best to reduce prices. Price lists if you guys have forgot are on hairsite website, typical Dr Klein sold 60ml prescription lotion 15% Promox for $84 Susan sell the same for $90.

Hope this helps, her details are below to order once you bought the prescription from the medical wellnes center:

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/about-...erenstein.html

LOCATION:
4227 Murray Ave. | Pittsburgh | PA | 15217
P: 412-421-4996 | 1-888-799-4247
F: 412-421-6500

----------


## Never2late

> Hey mate I'm really tempted to try NR-11 aswell, any side effects? Also do you think its helping?


 I like the NR-11.  No side effects though it does take a little while to dry.  I only use it three times a week as I'm just easing back into finasteride.  Several years ago I had side effects from Propecia after several months of use.  But overall I think the Polaris products are very good and I am alternating it with Susan's formulation.  I'm not quite three months in and I'm already seeing a lot of little vellus hair along the front, some of which are gaining length and a few actually have color.  Susan believes using her product once a day is enough but I would like to find something that I could use in the morning as well.  Something light that dries fast and doesn't leave my hair a mess.

----------


## Jazz1

> I like the NR-11.  No side effects though it does take a little while to dry.  I only use it three times a week as I'm just easing back into finasteride.  Several years ago I had side effects from Propecia after several months of use.  But overall I think the Polaris products are very good and I am alternating it with Susan's formulation.  I'm not quite three months in and I'm already seeing a lot of little vellus hair along the front, some of which are gaining length and a few actually have color.  Susan believes using her product once a day is enough but I would like to find something that I could use in the morning as well.  Something light that dries fast and doesn't leave my hair a mess.


 Thanks for the reply I might also add NR11 and use less of it, I need order Susan's product on Monday i hope it works aswell as Dr Klein!

If you want to add a minoxidil for morning that is not greasy I would add regaine foam it dries fast and is not greasy one bit.

Do you spray the NR11 on?

----------


## Never2late

> Thanks for the reply I might also add NR11 and use less of it, I need order Susan's product on Monday i hope it works aswell as Dr Klein!
> 
> If you want to add a minoxidil for morning that is not greasy I would add regaine foam it dries fast and is not greasy one bit.
> 
> Do you spray the NR11 on?


 Regaine foam?  Ok, I will try it....The NR-11 is a spray.  It sprays nice and evenly.  Good product.

----------


## Jazz1

> Regaine foam?  Ok, I will try it....The NR-11 is a spray.  It sprays nice and evenly.  Good product.


 Yea regaine foam is good for morning use, not greasy and dries fast, I might add that NR-11 bit first I need to buy Susan's stuff before my Promox finishes, il be ordering on Monday  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Update Susan replied to me:


Hi Jazz,
A couple of corrections.
You do not have to buy six months worth at a time.
We are charging*
49 for 5%
89 for 15%
79 for 12.5%
These prices include additives and are dispensed 65ml for solution and lotion.
60gm creams.
Each should last 60 days at ONE application per day of approx 1 ml or gm.
Using Finasteride twice a day will increase side effects to libido.(sex drive)

An RX is required from the Medical Wellness Center.
When they fax us an RX we contact (usually via email) the patient for verification of address and credit card.
Shipping costs are based on location and size of the package.
Thanks Jazz.
Susan

----------


## goldnt

Jazz thanks so much for all your help you've helped so many people including me. Thanks<3

----------


## lifelonglearning

Is it possible to get a 0.1 topical fin without minoxidil ??

----------


## Jazz1

> Is it possible to get a 0.1 topical fin without minoxidil ??


 
Yes but i would get azleaic acid aswell,as I was going to do this aswell for night time use as I was using Dr kleins kit, but I'm just sticking with morning use of the lotion and may add NR-11 for night use.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz thanks so much for all your help you've helped so many people including me. Thanks<3


 Thanks Bro, it's only fair to return back into the community when people on here and hairlosshelp have got me through hard times  :Smile: .

----------


## inbrugge

Hey Jazz, 

what formulation did you order from Susan? Which additives does it have? She also can provide DMI, Fin, Proe, Hydrocortisone, and all other ingredients Dr. Klein had?

My Ru experiment has failed due to side effects even at a very low dosage. I'm waiting for my body to return to its normal condition. Then I will see if my body can handle topical fin.

Do you know what lotion Susan/Dr Klein used? Maybe I can make my own mixture by buying Minox, Fin, etc online. I remember you said you mixed topical dut into aloe vera once?

At this point, I just want to freaking maintain what I have. It's depressing just watching your hair fall away with nothing to do about it.

----------


## doke

Any ideas on price yet and do you have to pay any fees on top before order?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, 
> 
> what formulation did you order from Susan? Which additives does it have? She also can provide DMI, Fin, Proe, Hydrocortisone, and all other ingredients Dr. Klein had?
> 
> My Ru experiment has failed due to side effects even at a very low dosage. I'm waiting for my body to return to its normal condition. Then I will see if my body can handle topical fin.
> 
> Do you know what lotion Susan/Dr Klein used? Maybe I can make my own mixture by buying Minox, Fin, etc online. I remember you said you mixed topical dut into aloe vera once?
> 
> At this point, I just want to freaking maintain what I have. It's depressing just watching your hair fall away with nothing to do about it.


 Sorry to hear when I had RU sides loss of libido my sides subsided very fast, I'm ordering mine today as Susan was not in yesturday.

The formulation I'm using is:
15% minoxidol 
0.1% finesteride
0.25% progesterone
0.025% tretinoin
Biotinoyl Tripeptide 3%

I would not mix your own with finesteride pills because they contain fillers that may block the absorption. Also I would try it in lotion/cream based as it may minimise side effects compared to liquid.

You also should consider Regenepure DR and NT, did Finesteride give you sides?

----------


## doke

> Sorry to hear when I had RU sides loss of libido my sides subsided very fast, I'm ordering mine today as Susan was not in yesturday.
> 
> The formulation I'm using is:
> 15% minoxidol 
> 0.1% finesteride
> 0.25% progesterone
> 0.025% tretinoin
> Biotinoyl Tripeptide 3%
> 
> ...


 Jazz is the above formula going to be all in one and how much will it be with post to uk?

----------


## Hairismylife

Jazz, I have two questions.
Why your lotion doesnt contain azelaic acid and you use it separately?
Can I use lower dosage minox as I am new to it and wanna start at low dosage to let my body adapt to it and is fin dosage below 0.1 possible and works?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz is the above formula going to be all in one and how much will it be with post to uk?


 https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

Read last post bro, I'm ordering mine today will let you know.
https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz, I have two questions.
> Why your lotion doesnt contain azelaic acid and you use it separately?
> Can I use lower dosage minox as I am new to it and wanna start at low dosage to let my body adapt to it and is fin dosage below 0.1 possible and works?


 My bad it does contain azelaic acid 1.5% forgot to mention it. Speak with Susan regarding what's best for you, I'm using all above additives and I'm very happy  :Smile: .

----------


## inbrugge

> Sorry to hear when I had RU sides loss of libido my sides subsided very fast, I'm ordering mine today as Susan was not in yesturday.
> 
> The formulation I'm using is:
> 15% minoxidol 
> 0.1% finesteride
> 0.25% progesterone
> 0.025% tretinoin
> Biotinoyl Tripeptide 3%
> 
> ...


 Thanks again for the reply Jazz.

I am using Regenepure DR and NT. However, I'm currently off everything for the rest of the week to let my body balance itself out before continuing any treatments.  

I did not have much loss of libido with Ru. No ED, testicle ache, etc. However, I had watery semen and I was reaching orgasm much quicker with less sensation. If it was ED, I would say maybe it's mental. But semen quality is directly related to body hormonal chemistry. Have you had this symptom before?

I have not tried Fin before. I really don't want to go oral. If I got these side effects topically, from Ru, at 10 mg per day, then I don't want an oral pill would do. I don't want to become an eunuch lol. I plan to have kids someday.

Also, I'm curious if you've had any minoxidil side effects? Increased body hair, decreased skin quality, dark undereyes, cardio issues? I'm using Rogaine for 9 months now. It's done nothing for my hair, but it has managed to give me hairs I never had before...on my arms, shoulders, hands, eyebrows, etc. Such bullcrap. Really tired of this. I'm tired of getting systematic side effects because of crap vehicles.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey il be honest I have had the best results while using Dr kleins products in my honest eyes the combination he has created has done wonders for me. I have regrown hair and currently saving my hair, finesteride is the bullet in the lotion, but I truly beleive the other ingredients alongside it work great.

----------


## Jazz1

Right guys I managed to place my order today for two bottles, Im carrying on with the exact same ingredients I have been using for the past 2 years from Dr kleins lotion.

Spoke to Susan the shipping for the uk is same as Dr kleins 35 dollars, so my two lotions will last me 4 months.

I will post the pictures once the products arrive, below is my ingredient list.

15% minoxidol
0.1% finesteride
1.5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesterone
0.025% tretinoin

Susan advised to use this at night time and once per day application is enough, where as Dr Klein recommended using his stuff 4 times a day! Susan explained more than once per day is just an overkill and waste of money. Obviously Susan is right because I never listened to Dr Klein I always used the lotion once per day, saves money.

----------


## Tarikko

Jazz brother,

how safe would it be to use it if you have your wife and kids at home? Keep in mind once it is on the hair it is hard to keep it off the sofa, bed, cushions....

Regards bro and hope you are keeping well!

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz brother,
> 
> how safe would it be to use it if you have your wife and kids at home? Keep in mind once it is on the hair it is hard to keep it off the sofa, bed, cushions....
> 
> Regards bro and hope you are keeping well!


 
Il send you a message on watts app bro.

----------


## Tarikko

Ok Jazz!  :Smile:

----------


## inbrugge

Jazz,

Did you get any Minox sides at 15%? Increased body hair, wrinkles, cardio issues, etc?

Also, do you know what the lotion base for promox/Susan consists of?

Another question. I have heard people using SABA gel? Do you know what it is? Have you used it? If so, why don't you use it anymore, it's any good, etc?

Finally, again for Fin side effects. Did you ever get watery semen as a side effect on Ru or Topical Fin or Oral Fin? Did it ever go away or you continued to use it regardless?


Thanks bro.

I wonder when you will receive your product. I would like to see what you think of Susan's products quality and effectiveness before I commit to this treatment.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz,
> 
> Did you get any Minox sides at 15%? Increased body hair, wrinkles, cardio issues, etc?
> 
> Also, do you know what the lotion base for promox/Susan consists of?
> 
> Another question. I have heard people using SABA gel? Do you know what it is? Have you used it? If so, why don't you use it anymore, it's any good, etc?
> 
> Finally, again for Fin side effects. Did you ever get watery semen as a side effect on Ru or Topical Fin or Oral Fin? Did it ever go away or you continued to use it regardless?
> ...


 

Hi I did have sides from using ******* 15% minoxidol which was in Liquid form! Never have I had sides or heard of anyone having sides from lotion/cream based minoxidol. The sides I had from liquid form were bloated face and headaches. But in cream form I use 12.5% + azelaic acid from belgravia at night and morning time I use the 15% Promox never given me side effects.

As for Saba gel it's easier to make your own I used Dactokart 1% hydorcortisone and 2% microconozate, to counter skin thinning its suggested to use Tretinoin which Promox already contains. See my thread below, although I stopped Dactokart as I'm still worried about long term skin thinning so I now use it once a month.

My thread:
https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...582&highlight=

I had major FIN sides again see my above thread, it's all about making your body adjust and mind control. I also have RU as back up, but RU at 5% gave me sexual sides as when I took FIN. 3 years later im on FIN 1mg EOD, reason why because I countered the sides and I also beleive topical FIN is good regime ontop of internal FIN. Fiensteride is the wonder drug for me I love it, without finesteride kiss your hair good bye, these other topicals I recommend are a great addition to the big 3 in helping regrow and maintain thick quality hair.

I called Susan today to ask a few questions for you members so anyone need questions answering let me know as I have a calling card with loads of minutes.

I can't speak for the product yet, but I can speak for Susan on her knowledge. I also looked them up if you check hairlosshelp they been around for along time way before 2007 and I read good reviews on threads. That's why I'm confident her product will work just aswell as Dr kleins.

----------


## inbrugge

Thank you again, Jazz. It seems my RU sides have cleared up so I think I will try a swab at Topical Fin now (and if things go okay then possibly oral).

Are you including DMI? I didn't see it up there. I thought DMI was one of Dr. Klein's critical chemicals for proper delivery.

----------


## Jazz1

> Thank you again, Jazz. It seems my RU sides have cleared up so I think I will try a swab at Topical Fin now (and if things go okay then possibly oral).
> 
> Are you including DMI? I didn't see it up there. I thought DMI was one of Dr. Klein's critical chemicals for proper delivery.


 Hey that's good news RU sides would subside quick. I would not use Dmi in your case, plus Dr kleins Dmi was only in his sprays not lotions. In your case I would try lotion/cream based as one guy on here used Dr kleins lotion without sides, but oral Fin gave him sides.

----------


## Jazz1

Just update my products were shipped yesterday so I will l keep you baldies updated with all pictures and how I feel on the products  :Smile: .

I also emailed Dr kleins office and this was the reply, I'm sorry guys but looks like our permenant solution to all Dr kleins ex patients is Susan now, I'm just gratefull we have an alternative and this woman is willing to help us.

Dr kleins office email,

"There is only one way to get pharmaceutical medication to treat hair loss. Any person that wishes to get medication...needs to go to the doctor. Im so sorry but we are not hiring or working with any physician. Our website will be up soon. Keep checking back. Thank you."

So to all you ex patients like me who need his products and help, see the below thread for everything.


https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

----------


## Justinian

I can't seem to find it, but how much do you apply daily? I'm trying to figure out how much finasteride is applied each application. 

Also, how does this work legally since finasteride is prescription and this is online?

Thanks.

----------


## Jazz1

> I can't seem to find it, but how much do you apply daily? I'm trying to figure out how much finasteride is applied each application. 
> 
> Also, how does this work legally since finasteride is prescription and this is online?
> 
> Thanks.


 
Read the link below everything is prescribed and approved before shipped, you can't just buy the product. Also you only use 1ml a day so everything is combined in one lotion, minoxidol and proven DHT blockers.

Read here how to order! as I'm not going to type everything again!! I done my hard part for you guys.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

----------


## Justinian

> Read the link below everything is prescribed and approved before shipped, you can't just buy the product. Also you only use 1ml a day so everything is combined in one lotion, minoxidol and proven DHT blockers.
> 
> Read here how to order! as I'm not going to type everything again!! I done my hard part for you guys.
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=


 Thanks. I read the thread and thought of that question after and didn't remember seeing anything about the daily amount. Also, I didn't see that they ship it so I was a little confused about how that worked.

So the daily amount is ~1 mL (or 1g depending on the density?). Since this solution is 0.1% finasteride, they are putting ~1mg finasteride in this solution? The daily dose of oral finasteride is 1mg. If I am understanding this correctly, then even in the worst case scenario that 100% goes systemic, then you are getting the recommended daily dose of finasteride.

----------


## inbrugge

Hey, quick question Jazz. Filling out the prescription from wellness center. What the heck is the difference between Minoxidil Cream and Lotion? Which one should I get. Isn't cream and lotion the same thing? What the heck.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey, quick question Jazz. Filling out the prescription from wellness center. What the heck is the difference between Minoxidil Cream and Lotion? Which one should I get. Isn't cream and lotion the same thing? What the heck.


 
What do you want to use? As in 12.5% minoxidol or 15%, I know 15% is made more of a cream. But don't worry just fill out what you want formulated, I wanted the exact same ingredients as Dr kleins prescription stuff if your going for the same than once your prescription is approved speak with Susan when you order. I told Susan I want the same type texture as Dr kleins stuff as I did post her the lotions and sprays, so she knows how to make it, just tell her you want the same as jazz she will know.

 If you want cream or lotion she can formulate either, what ingredients are you ordering? Did you use Dr kleins lotions?

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks. I read the thread and thought of that question after and didn't remember seeing anything about the daily amount. Also, I didn't see that they ship it so I was a little confused about how that worked.
> 
> So the daily amount is ~1 mL (or 1g depending on the density?). Since this solution is 0.1% finasteride, they are putting ~1mg finasteride in this solution? The daily dose of oral finasteride is 1mg. If I am understanding this correctly, then even in the worst case scenario that 100% goes systemic, then you are getting the recommended daily dose of finasteride.


 
0.1% is 1mg dosage so 1ml a day is sufficient enough to cover the recommended hairloss dosage.  They do ship worldwide, I'm in the uk and the shipping cost me around 35 dollars, but I tend to buy 6 months supply at once to save shipping.

I could be wrong but the past 4 years I have been around these forums on hairlosshelp speaking with people and experimenting on myself. I found liquid form of anything even 15% minxodiol I liquid form to give me sides like ******* which I still have to this date. 

Cream/lotion based has never given me sides, also a guy on here had sides from oral FIN, yet on Dr kleins lotions he's having success and 0 side effects,could be the cream or lotion based does not penetrate into the blood and stays local within the scalp.

----------


## inbrugge

> What do you want to use? As in 12.5% minoxidol or 15%, I know 15% is made more of a cream. But don't worry just fill out what you want formulated, I wanted the exact same ingredients as Dr kleins prescription stuff if your going for the same than once your prescription is approved speak with Susan when you order. I told Susan I want the same type texture as Dr kleins stuff as I did post her the lotions and sprays, so she knows how to make it, just tell her you want the same as jazz she will know.
> 
>  If you want cream or lotion she can formulate either, what ingredients are you ordering? Did you use Dr kleins lotions?


 I have never used Dr Klein's lotions before. I filled out the prescription from wellness center for:

12.5% Minox Lotion
0.1% Finasteride
1.5% Azelaic Acid
0.025% Tretinoin

I've skipped on Progesterone for now. And I went with 12.5% as well because I've only used 5% for now so going from that to 12.5 is already a huge increase. If I get no sides from the increased Minox or Topical Fin, I might go ahead with 15% Minox and include Progesterone as well for my next order.

Thanks again, Jazz. So now I will wait for my prescription to be approved and contact Susan so I will be amongst you guys as Promox users. Hopefully, I did everything correct on the prescription site as there was LOADS of text and I skimmed through some of them.

----------


## Jazz1

> I have never used Dr Klein's lotions before. I filled out the prescription from wellness center for:
> 
> 12.5% Minox Lotion
> 0.1% Finasteride
> 1.5% Azelaic Acid
> 0.025% Tretinoin
> 
> I've skipped on Progesterone for now. And I went with 12.5% as well because I've only used 5% for now so going from that to 12.5 is already a huge increase. If I get no sides from the increased Minox or Topical Fin, I might go ahead with 15% Minox and include Progesterone as well for my next order.
> 
> Thanks again, Jazz. So now I will wait for my prescription to be approved and contact Susan so I will be amongst you guys as Promox users. Hopefully, I did everything correct on the prescription site as there was LOADS of text and I skimmed through some of them.


 Cool you do know you have to pay 50 dollars for 6 month worth prescription? Once it is approved they will email you. They will then send your prescription to Susan, you can call her to pay for the products, price varies so yours should be around 80 dollars as you have one less ingredient than mine.

The combination is good, what are you currently using? Don't stop the 5%, I would alternate them say morning use this 12.5% and at night use 5%, that's how the belgravia clinic in the uk do it and they have so many success stories on their website with pictures.

----------


## inbrugge

> Cool you do know you have to pay 50 dollars for 6 month worth prescription? Once it is approved they will email you. They will then send your prescription to Susan, you can call her to pay for the products, price varies so yours should be around 80 dollars as you have one less ingredient than mine.
> 
> The combination is good, what are you currently using? Don't stop the 5%, I would alternate them say morning use this 12.5% and at night use 5%, that's how the belgravia clinic in the uk do it and they have so many success stories on their website with pictures.


 Yes, bro. I paid the money for the prescription. It says my order will be faxed to Murray Avenue Apothecary, which I think is Susan? I have not received any confirmation e-mail from the site yet, which is not good. Maybe they will send one out during the week.

I'm currently using Rogaine Liquid. Mainly once a day, sometimes twice. Also, I use Regenepure DR and NT. But I have lost a lot of ground in the last 2 moths. Hopefully, this new mixture with Fin, Azelaic Acid, and Tretinoin will halt hair loss and give some regrowth.

Considering the fact I already have minox in my system, how long till I can expect some results like reduced shedding or regrowth?

----------


## Jazz1

They closed on the weekend as I had to wait for the weekday to place my order, my suggestions is use 5% at night and use 12.5% morning. It's best not to keep an eye of shedding as it will just stress you out bro.

I have always said the best treatment is the big 3, now that you have ordered this you have the best combination. In my experience there is no topical medication better than the combination of Minoxidil, Tretinoin, and Azelaic Acid. However, I still feel there is no better product for the prevention and reversal of male patterned baldness than finesteride. I do believe using the combination of Finesteride and a topical solution is better than Finesteride alone. So you can not go wrong with what your ordered bro  :Smile: .

----------


## doke

Guys a word of warning do not use tretinion in the mornings if going out into the sun unless you cover your scalp as it will cause problems.

----------


## Jazz1

> Guys a word of warning do not use tretinion in the mornings if going out into the sun unless you cover your scalp as it will cause problems.


 I been ok, been using is past 2 years again I only use it on the temples the lotion. 

But maybe Doke has a good point every country is different, so night use will still be the same etc.

----------


## inbrugge

Good point, Doke. I've heard that before as well. I'm planning to use this at nights before sleeping so it shouldn't be an issue.

I spoke with the pharmacy today over the phone and confirmed my order. My solution should be shipping out this Wednesday. I'm contemplating ordering express shipment. I'm losing hair fast. I hope this stuff at least stabilies my hair loss.

One question, Jazz. How do I know I'm using only 1 ml. With Minox, the dropper has measurement labels on it. But with lotion, I assume I will be dabbing my fingers into it. I don't want to use too much by accident and finish the batch up too quickly or expose myself to too much Fin.

Also, do you think 1 mg daily fin TOPICAL is sufficient? I know additional is always better, but maybe this much topical will be enough.

I've lost so much ground just in 2 months, it's really crazy. This is really my last hope except oral fin or dut. And I doubt if this topical doesn't help me that internal Fin will be much better. I've always had hair loss, but it's now beginning to catch up to me. My hairline is really getting devastated and I can see I'm losing ground everyday. 

I don't know what changed but since going on Rogaine, I've had reduced hair loss like only 10 strands per day. But since the last 6 months and especially the last 2 it's really picked up. Losing like 50 hairs each day. I can scruffle my head and usually after the first shed the loss would stop. Now, the hairs just keep on falling. I really need this mix to do the job for me or I'm screwed. 

If you think it works, Jazz, how soon can I expect to see a reduce in shedding.

I really don't want to get a hair transplant. This really sucks. Can't beleive we still don't have anything to even stop hair loss, not even mentioning hair growth.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey il try my best to answer your questions as I'm at work using my iPhone. This mixture is the best way to target DHT, it can work just as well as internal FIN as a guy on here used Dr kleins lotion with success without the need of oral FIN.

Everyone responds different to meds, my friend recently started oral FIN and has stopped his shedding within week 2, where as others it can take few months. I stopped my shedding instant when I started FIN, best advice I can give is try it and see. To maximise your Hairloss maybe add oral FIN every other day and use this lotion mixture daily. But for now see how you go with this, I would also get a keto shampoo like regenepure DR and NT.

A guy in this thread is already using the formula he said it comes with the measuring syringe or spoon I think, so you will be ok using the correct amount. Mines been shipped so I might get it before you, il keep you updated bro.

----------


## Jazz1

To add I been on the big3 for 3 years oral FIN every other day and this mixture with FIN daily in the morning. I can not complain it's the best thing that's happend for my Hairloss this regime.

----------


## Jazz1

Right guys I'm still waiting on my delievery checking status daily etc, to the people who are using the products from Susan how is it going?

----------


## inbrugge

Still waiting as well. Was shipped last thursday. Hopefully, I can receive it in the next few days.

----------


## Jazz1

> Still waiting as well. Was shipped last thursday. Hopefully, I can receive it in the next few days.


 Cool keep me posted, mines been 9 days can take 2/3 weeks as Dr kleins stuff took the same time.

----------


## Plan C

> Cool keep me posted, mines been 9 days can take 2/3 weeks as Dr kleins stuff took the same time.


 Hi Jazz,

I currently use dut, RU, Regaine and Revita. Whilst these have dramatically slowed the receding at my hairline, they haven't managed to stop it completely. Are there any treatments that you think might improve my regime? I was considering trying some of Dr Klein's products, but I'm not sure if they will help me. Are there any in particular that you would recommend I try?

----------


## thatguy22

> Cool keep me posted, mines been 9 days can take 2/3 weeks as Dr kleins stuff took the same time.


 Hi Jazz, is there any hope of me getting in on this even though I was never a patient of Dr Klein? I'm really interested if there's any way please let me know. I'm willing to pay. thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz, is there any hope of me getting in on this even though I was never a patient of Dr Klein? I'm really interested if there's any way please let me know. I'm willing to pay. thanks


 Yes there is  :Smile:  email me if you need help on what ingredients I use in the lotion formulation, I'm still waiting for my parcel to arrive from Susan so will post pictures.

My email jass897@hotmail.com,

Or just follow the thread below how to order:

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz,
> 
> I currently use dut, RU, Regaine and Revita. Whilst these have dramatically slowed the receding at my hairline, they haven't managed to stop it completely. Are there any treatments that you think might improve my regime? I was considering trying some of Dr Klein's products, but I'm not sure if they will help me. Are there any in particular that you would recommend I try?


 You have the strongest regime going, how much RU are you using and what vehicle? Also how long have you been treating hairloss?

You could try Susan's formula, Dr kleins did give me growth and thickened my hairloss that was the lotions. Now hes dead I have had to find an alternative which is Susan see thread below. Good thing about Susan she can formulate anything in one mixture and better strenght.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

----------


## Plan C

> You have the strongest regime going, how much RU are you using and what vehicle? Also how long have you been treating hairloss?
> 
> You could try Susan's formula, Dr kleins did give me growth and thickened my hairloss that was the lotions. Now hes dead I have had to find an alternative which is Susan see thread below. Good thing about Susan she can formulate anything in one mixture and better strenght.
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=


 Thanks for replying.

I'm currently using 50mg RU in 3ml of Neogenic; prior to this, I was using 100mg RU in 1.5ml KB solution but I wanted to use RU straight after showering (since KB creates a film that blocks everything else out, it meant I couldn't use minox later in the evening).

My daily regime is as follows - quick shower in the morning, shower after work using Revita, apply 50mg RU in 3ml Neogenic immediately, apply Regaine foam once or twice later in the evening and take 0.5mg dut right before bed.

I was considering replacing one or both of my applications of Lipogaine but I don't know if that will make any difference. I desperately want to try either one of Dr Klein's or Polaris' products.

I emailed Polaris and they assured me that if I told them what I wanted, they could handle the sale via email. However, I don't know which one of their treatments is best.

Should I go from Klein or Polaris? Whatever you decide, please advise me on the correct treatment to buy.

----------


## Jazz1

I see you have a strong regime going on shame it's still slowly receding, problem you have with Polaris labs to benefit all the ingredients is use 2 of the products which can cost more money.

Dr Klein formula was formulated perfect with 5 ingredients mixed in, which is why when he passed away I have switched to try Susan's products as she makes the same formula as Dr Klein.

The formula I use is:

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride
1.5% azelaic acid 
0.025% tretinoin 
0.25% progesterone 

Polaris labs do great products but not better than Dr kleins mixture as they sell it separate in different products
If you need help ordering similar to dr kleins stuff email me jass897@hotmail.com.

----------


## Plan C

> I see you have a strong regime going on shame it's still slowly receding, problem you have with Polaris labs to benefit all the ingredients is use 2 of the products which can cost more money.
> 
> Dr Klein formula was formulated perfect with 5 ingredients mixed in, which is why when he passed away I have switched to try Susan's products as she makes the same formula as Dr Klein.
> 
> The formula I use is:
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finesteride
> 1.5% azelaic acid 
> ...


 Is that formula the same as the Promox that you used to use (I read your 'hairloss progress regrowth' thread)? If you think it's the best treatment available to me, I'll give it a go. I noticed that NR-11 by Polaris includes ingredients like copper peptide and retinol; are these less benefitial than the stuff in Klein's product?

I forgot to mention that prior to beginning to use RU and dut, I took fin for a year. I really am running out of options. Klein/ Polaris aside, is there anything else you would recommend adding to Revita/Regaine/dut/RU? Saba gel maybe?

----------


## Jazz1

Hi I can not really say if either will work on you as you currently are using the strongest regime!*

How long have you been treating hairloss? Is there no halt to hairloss? I mean polaris labs is a great range I have bought 3 boxs of NR-11 but I'm not using it yet. I'm waiting for Susan's product to arrive as it is the exact copy of Dr kleins lotions and to me Dr kleins formula products are the best. Since he passed away the only exact alternative to him is Susan.

You best hope is to try either one, have you tried upping RU dosage and keeping at higher dosage say 60mg? Also how long have you been on this regime?

Saba gel is only good if your halting hairloss, judging by what your telling me your still losing ground? Take a picture of your hairloss?

----------


## Jazz1

Right I just stumbled across your thread:

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=16442

Although your pictures are not clear you have great hair and I beleive meds are helping, although I can understand your fustration regarding your hairline. I would not stress as worst case you can have an FUE.

My advice is this:

1. Use RU as normal 
2. Use dut rotated with Fin as normal
3. Consider Susan's or polaris labs NR-10, me personally I'm more of fan of Dr Kleins formula hence why I went with Susan.
4. Carry on with your regaine twice a day, but what ever you add Susan's or polaris use this 10 minutes later on the temples only once morning.
5. Switch over to regenpure Dr and Nt.
6. Get a derma roller.

----------


## Plan C

> Right I just stumbled across your thread:
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=16442
> 
> Although your pictures are not clear you have great hair and I beleive meds are helping, although I can understand your fustration regarding your hairline. I would not stress as worst case you can have an FUE.
> 
> My advice is this:
> 
> 1. Use RU as normal 
> ...


 Thanks for getting back to me. My hair has deteriorated a fair bit since I posted that thread (e.g. a bald spot is appearing at my crown). I agree that my hair looks decent for the timebeing, but I can't stop my hairline slowly creeping back. Who knows how it will look in 1-2 years. I could get a transplant, but what would that actually achieve? I'd fill in the areas that have receded, but then the areas behind would begin to thin.

I already use a derma roller. What makes you say that Regenepure > Revita?

I plan to increase the amount of RU I use to 75mg. I'll probably order a Polaris product, simply because it's easier to arrange. Aren't you based in the UK? If so, how did you manage to get hold of NR11? And do you recon its better than NR10, 7 etc. ?

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for getting back to me. My hair has deteriorated a fair bit since I posted that thread (e.g. a bald spot is appearing at my crown). I agree that my hair looks decent for the timebeing, but I can't stop my hairline slowly creeping back. Who knows how it will look in 1-2 years. I could get a transplant, but what would that actually achieve? I'd fill in the areas that have receded, but then the areas behind would begin to thin.
> 
> I already use a derma roller. What makes you say that Regenepure > Revita?
> 
> I plan to increase the amount of RU I use to 75mg. I'll probably order a Polaris product, simply because it's easier to arrange. Aren't you based in the UK? If so, how did you manage to get hold of NR11? And do you recon its better than NR10, 7 etc. ?


 
Polaris labs have put good ingredients in seperate bottles that's what I'm more annoyed, they but azelaic acid in non finesteride lotions and bunged other ingredients in other lotions. If polaris labs works than you would ideally need to use NR-11, NR-07, NR-10, but I still prefer to use Susans hence why I have not bothered using the NR-11 yet. The thing with Dr Klein and Susan they have formulated every good ingredient into one bottle which is very simple to use and cheaper considering you don't have to buy different types etc.

I'm from London by the way, you can obtain polaris stuff by contacting trading pharma hope this helps  :Smile: .

----------


## Plan C

> Polaris labs have put good ingredients in seperate bottles that's what I'm more annoyed, they but azelaic acid in non finesteride lotions and bunged other ingredients in other lotions. If polaris labs works than you would ideally need to use NR-11, NR-07, NR-10, but I still prefer to use Susans hence why I have not bothered using the NR-11 yet. The thing with Dr Klein and Susan they have formulated every good ingredient into one bottle which is very simple to use and cheaper considering you don't have to buy different types etc.
> 
> I'm from London by the way, you can obtain polaris stuff by contacting trading pharma hope this helps .


 If I were to choose one of the NR treatments, which would you recommend?

----------


## Jazz1

> If I were to choose one of the NR treatments, which would you recommend?


 It would have to be all 3 I'm afraid that's why I'm not using them and using Susan's product, NR-08 because it has azelaic acid, NR-10 and NR-11. You could use NR-10 morning, NR-08 mid day and NR-11 night use to benefit all the ingredients, but it works out much more.

----------


## Plan C

> It would have to be all 3 I'm afraid that's why I'm not using them and using Susan's product, NR-08 because it has azelaic acid, NR-10 and NR-11. You could use NR-10 morning, NR-08 mid day and NR-11 night use to benefit all the ingredients, but it works out much more.


 How would I go about getting Susan's product? And would it replace applications of Regaine?

----------


## Jazz1

> How would I go about getting Susan's product? And would it replace applications of Regaine?


 Here,

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

You don't stop regaine you carry on using it normal but once a day use Susan's product 10 minutes later around temples hairline only?

----------


## Plan C

> Here,
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=
> 
> You don't stop regaine you carry on using it normal but once a day use Susan's product 10 minutes later around temples hairline only?


 I'm not clear on what formula I should ask her to mix up, as I never used Promox myself.

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm not clear on what formula I should ask her to mix up, as I never used Promox myself.


 The best formula Dr Klein formulated and I have been using for 2 years is below:

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride
1.5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesterone 
0.025% tretinoin

You could also add hydorcortisone and biotin to help thicken hair,

 if you order you need to write this above ingredients when you pay for the prescription from the medical wellness center. After you payed for the prescription they will forward 6 months prescription to Susan and you can pay Susan's for upto 6 months worth of product. Everything including her prices are in the above thread. I already sent her Dr Klein lotions I had left so she could make it same texture which she already has done, I'm just waiting for my products to arrive I will take pictures once I get them.

Just so you don't get confused you can not buy any products from Susan until you have got the prescription from the medical wellness center.

----------


## jimpc

> Polaris labs have put good ingredients in seperate bottles that's what I'm more annoyed, they but azelaic acid in non finesteride lotions and bunged other ingredients in other lotions. If polaris labs works than you would ideally need to use NR-11, NR-07, NR-10, but I still prefer to use Susans hence why I have not bothered using the NR-11 yet. The thing with Dr Klein and Susan they have formulated every good ingredient into one bottle which is very simple to use and cheaper considering you don't have to buy different types etc.
> 
> I'm from London by the way, you can obtain polaris stuff by contacting trading pharma hope this helps .


 I actually just stopped using NR-11 and switched to Susan. I love that the NR-11 is a spray and is a true liquid. However 2 weeks after using it I started to get a bald spot on the back of my head. It's the same shape as if I accidentally "misted" it with the spray applicator. When asking Susan for a spray she said it's impossible to put fin in a truly liquid form without using harsh chemicals. Two things Susan doesn't have is Alfatradiol and copper peptides. Do you think you could try to work your magic and get her to include those?

----------


## Plan C

> The best formula Dr Klein formulated and I have been using for 2 years is below:
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finesteride
> 1.5% azelaic acid
> 0.25% progesterone 
> 0.025% tretinoin
> 
> You could also add hydorcortisone and biotin to help thicken hair,
> ...


 Any suggestions on what % of hydro and biotin to use?

----------


## Rodfarva

I don't know how to subscribe to threads..

----------


## Jazz1

> If I were to choose one of the NR treatments, which would you recommend?


 I would go for NR-10 for your case as it's higher strength.

----------


## Jazz1

> I actually just stopped using NR-11 and switched to Susan. I love that the NR-11 is a spray and is a true liquid. However 2 weeks after using it I started to get a bald spot on the back of my head. It's the same shape as if I accidentally "misted" it with the spray applicator. When asking Susan for a spray she said it's impossible to put fin in a truly liquid form without using harsh chemicals. Two things Susan doesn't have is Alfatradiol and copper peptides. Do you think you could try to work your magic and get her to include those?


 I seriously would not bother with those ingredients as Dr Kleins
Mixture has worked on me for 2 years and hundreds other patients for years to me his mixture along with Susan's exact copy is the perfect formula. How are you finding Susan's product?

----------


## Jazz1

Ok to all Ex patients of Dr Klein please read here if need the exact same formula I done this for you guys who are lost like me  :Smile: . Dr Kleins office has stopped providing the products and won't prescribe anything without a doctor. No doctor is willing to help and they won't sell anything above 5% minoxidil meaning most of us are screwed.

But thanks to my research I have managed to find us Exact copy or even better from a pharmacist called Susan see below how to order:


https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

See my progress thread:
https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...582&highlight=

See
My other thread asking the doctors on here who did not help!!!!:

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...112&highlight=

----------


## jimpc

> I seriously would not bother with those ingredients as Dr Kleins
> Mixture has worked on me for 2 years and hundreds other patients for years to me his mixture along with Susan's exact copy is the perfect formula. How are you finding Susan's product?


 I guess I'm used to NR-11 so I'm a little biased. The NR-11 is a fully dissolved liquid. Susan's is a lotion that feels a little granular so I'm uncertain about the efficacy of the finasteride. It's like the difference between mixing sugar with cold water vs hot. It's as if she just crushed up the finasteride and put it in which is probably exactly what she did. I just can't wrap my head around it working. It'd be like if I crushed up finasteride and mixed it with water and put it on my head. Might as well have just sprinkled the powder on my head. With that being said I think if I do see results it will be because of the other ingredients and not the fin. Which I'm ok with as I already take it orally. Was Klein's granular? Are you finding the product you got from Susan to be granular?

Edit: Furthermore, I'm a DPA sufferer at the early/mid stages so I still have a lot of hair all over my head it's just all shedding and gradually thinning. The fact that it is a lotion makes it much harder to cover my whole scalp as my hair just sucks it all up.

----------


## Jazz1

Dr kleins was the same his lotion had a lot of un crushed minoxidil so it could be more so the minoxidil than the finesteride as finesteride is powder based and minoxidil is more like salt type crystals. Saying that I had same issue with Kleins but it worked perfect, I will be able to tell if Susan's works as my scalp and Hairloss starts itching etc when I stop promox. So if after my last promox I switch to Susan's I will know if it works otherwise I will switch to NR-10. I spoke to Susan she said shes had it lab tested and is 100% her product works as she has been selling this for years, I already researched the companies on Hairloss help dating back to 2007.

How long did you use NR-11? Also does Susan's dissolve good otherwise? What country you from?

----------


## Plan C

> Dr kleins was the same his lotion had a lot of un crushed minoxidil so it could be more so the minoxidil than the finesteride as finesteride is powder based and minoxidil is more like salt type crystals. Saying that I had same issue with Kleins but it worked perfect, I will be able to tell if Susan's works as my scalp and Hairloss starts itching etc when I stop promox. So if after my last promox I switch to Susan's I will know if it works otherwise I will switch to NR-10. I spoke to Susan she said shes had it lab tested and is 100% her product works as she has been selling this for years, I already researched the companies on Hairloss help dating back to 2007.
> 
> How long did you use NR-11? Also does Susan's dissolve good otherwise? What country you from?


 Please advise me on what % of hydrocortisone and biotin to request.

----------


## Jazz1

> Please advise me on what % of hydrocortisone and biotin to request.


 If you check my above regrowth thread I can tell you where buy hydrocortisone cheap as I used Dactokart which has 0.1% hydrocortisone and biotin use 3%.

----------


## jimpc

I'm in the USA in another state not far from her. Got the NR-11 off ebidz as per their site. Used it for 3 weeks until I noticed the balding on the back of my head. I have been shedding on the top of my head for 6 months, 3 months before taking any action with fin and minox and continuing 3 months after. So either DUPA is starting or I hit the back of my head with the NR-11 for 3 weeks straight causing a shed. I hope it's the latter. Susan's product dissolves completely. Don't even know it's their. I can just feel the granules when I put it on my finger. I know it's potent because my scalp feels much different than when just using Rogaine. I get a slight headache for about a half hour but I attribute that to the high concentration of minoxidil as that's a side effect. I just started using it today so I'll let you know in a couple weeks/month how it's working.

----------


## jimpc

With regard to the Alfatradiol and copper petides. Both are shown to reduce hairloss and/or improve skin. The NR-11 had that. That's why I chose it. For me the perfect combo would be minox, biotin, vitamin e, fin, alfatradiol, azelaic acid, tretinoin, and copper peptides. Not a fan of progesterone for the bad things that can happen if it goes systemic and grape seed extract stains.

----------


## Jazz1

I personally think the granules is the minoxidil crystals as dr kleins had the same, if your getting a slight headache that means it's working as I had minor sides at the start which subside after your body adjusts.

Also bare in mind any she'd is a very good sign, best you ignore shedding and carry on or the results  :Smile: .

I can't wait to use her product I just pray it works and I'm very confident like she is as you can research her background and the awards she has obtained so no doubt she knows her skills in pharmaceutical.

----------


## Jazz1

> With regard to the Alfatradiol and copper petides. Both are shown to reduce hairloss and/or improve skin. The NR-11 had that. That's why I chose it. For me the perfect combo would be minox, biotin, vitamin e, fin, alfatradiol, azelaic acid, tretinoin, and copper peptides. Not a fan of progesterone for the bad things that can happen if it goes systemic and grape seed extract stains.


 Honestly I would not stress as I have been using dr kleins product for 2 years with great success, tretinoin is superb for skin regeneration. You could add tricomin spray I use that as well which is copper peptide.

----------


## jimpc

Oh. I don't doubt that everything is in the bottle. One look at her yelp reviews and I know she's legitimate. I don't doubt that everything is in there I just doubt the efficacy of the delivery system of just crushing things up, putting them in a liquid and applying it. I think DS Labs dissolves everything so it's a homogeneous mixture. Regardless, the fin is just a bonus. The high level of minoxidil and other ingredients is really what I'm after. She's a true pharmacist, not someone who works at a CVS. She actually makes formulations. She's a dying  breed.

----------


## jimpc

I also wouldn't buy anything DS sells in the USA. We make them take everything good about their European products out. By DS labs I mean their Polaris division.

----------


## Jazz1

I emailed Susan regarding your concern her reply is below, also to all his ex patients like me they will know Dr kleins was gritty as we'll due to the minoxidil but it 100% worked.

Her reply;

"Plesae tell this person that we checked and it is not the Finasteride but may be a higher dose Minoxidil.
We saw your Minoxidil from Dr. Klein and it was not without grittiness Jazz.
We need this guys name to look at his formula.
But I am being told by my lab manager that it is not Finasteride afterall.
Thanks,
Susan"

----------


## jimpc

Awesome. YOU COULDN'T TELL HER TO GET COPPER PEPTIDES!? Lol kidding aside. She wouldn't be able to get the Alfatradiol anyway as I don;t think it's approved in the USA.

----------


## Jazz1

> I also wouldn't buy anything DS sells in the USA. We make them take everything good about their European products out. By DS labs I mean their Polaris division.


 FDA has screwed everyone over, just like they did to Dr lee.

----------


## Jazz1

> Awesome. YOU COULDN'T TELL HER TO GET COPPER PEPTIDES!? Lol kidding aside. She wouldn't be able to get the Alfatradiol anyway as I don;t think it's approved in the USA.


 I would seriously leave it as nothing beats finesteride, just add tricomin spray or folligen which is way stronger.

----------


## jimpc

> FDA has screwed everyone over, just like they did to Dr lee.


 The sad thing is. The FDA can be bought. I feel like the European equivalent actually tests the shit that it approves no money involved. Like this stuff is used in place of Minoxidil all over Europe and South America. Nope not here. Sorry Rogaine doesn't want that. Look at what happened to Lipogaine. You could get it on Amazon and all it had was azelaic acid added to minox. Doctors in the USA prescribe azelaic acid for people to use on their face for rosacea in the USA. But they can't put it in their product? c'mon.

----------


## jimpc

What's your process? How long after her solution should I spray the Tricomin?

----------


## Jazz1

> The sad thing is. The FDA can be bought. I feel like the European equivalent actually tests the shit that it approves no money involved. Like this stuff is used in place of Minoxidil all over Europe and South America. Nope not here. Sorry Rogaine doesn't want that. Look at what happened to Lipogaine. You could get it on Amazon and all it had was azelaic acid added to minox. Doctors in the USA prescribe azelaic acid for people to use on their face for rosacea in the USA. But they can't put it in their product? c'mon.


 
Azelaic acid flakes are so easy to obtain I just bought 200 grams worth from Canada to dump in my night use minoxidil.

----------


## Jazz1

> What's your process? How long after her solution should I spray the Tricomin?


 I use it hour before applying any other products after washing my hair, also tricomin doesn't  sting or stain like folligen spray. It makes my hair feel much fuller aswell takes about hour fully absorb and dry. Although I would say folligen is much better if you can handle it.

----------


## jimpc

> Azelaic acid flakes are so easy to obtain I just bought 200 grams worth from Canada to dump in my night use minoxidil.


 I don't want to do anything myself. The cost of having someone make it is fine for me. Btw I looked through your regrowth history. Question did you always have the triangle above your temple as your adult hairline or was that a consequence of MPB? The reason I ask is at like 19 I went from them going straight up to my hairline to triangles. I wasn't balding it was just my adult hairline. I didn't start getting DPA til 7 years later. So I'm like a norwood 1/1.5 and have always been but with diffuse thinning all over the top now. I like that you basically regained those lost triangles. Now that we're basically on the same regimine I was hoping to get them back and potentially go back to a juvenile hairline. Unless you recently lost them and now they're coming back. Get what I'm trying to ask you? Thanks for the chat!

----------


## Plan C

I'm not convinced I even need to ask for fin in my treatment... I already take dut ED, what's the point?

----------


## jimpc

There's some studies that show topical fin reduced DHT at the scalp by 40% more than taking fin. And this is topical vs oral not topical and oral vs oral. This is also why guys with low DHT can have MPB it's not about the amount of DHT in your body it's about the amount concentrated in your scalp and your follicles predisposition to it.

----------


## Jazz1

I get what your saying my temples were weak prior to AA, I did wounding through derma roller and my hairdresser cut slits with the cut throat around my temples to draw very slight blood. I also used all these products and it's worked  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm not convinced I even need to ask for fin in my treatment... I already take dut ED, what's the point?


 Your scenario is tricky as RU is the most powerful drug we have and your still losing, although I still think your hair is great maybe your MPB is hardcore. Like i stated it's all about trying it you won't know until you try it and you have nothing to lose.

----------


## Jazz1

> There's some studies that show topical fin reduced DHT at the scalp by 40% more than taking fin. And this is topical vs oral not topical and oral vs oral. This is also why guys with low DHT can have MPB it's not about the amount of DHT in your body it's about the amount concentrated in your scalp and your follicles predisposition to it.


 This, that's why people like me who use oral fin alongside topical formula have great results than someone using oral only.

----------


## Plan C

Well, on your advice, I'm going to go with the following:

15% minoxidil
0.1% finasteride
1.5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesterone 
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% hydrocortisone 
3% biotin

(As long as it is possible)

Really appreciate the pointers. I'll make sure I post updates regarding progress.

----------


## Plan C

> Your scenario is tricky as RU is the most powerful drug we have and your still losing, although I still think your hair is great maybe your MPB is hardcore. Like i stated it's all about trying it you won't know until you try it and you have nothing to lose.


 I've always responded well to minox though, so upping to 10% + might help.

----------


## jimpc

> I've always responded well to minox though, so upping to 10% + might help.


 Dude. I'm gonna be honest with you. Just looked through your photos. See a psychiatrist. You're not fighting MPB. You're fighting your adult hairline. That's probably why nothing is working. Please don't take offense. You are NOT going to keep your teenage hair.

----------


## Plan C

> Dude. I'm gonna be honest with you. Just looked through your photos. See a psychiatrist. You're not fighting MPB. You're fighting your adult hairline. That's probably why nothing is working. Please don't take offense. You are NOT going to keep your teenage hair.


 So the fact that my father's and grandfather's "adult hairlines" begin on the back of their heads still doesn't necessarily mean I'm going bald?

Made this point a million times but here goes... just because you're not yet a NW3 or 4, doesn't mean you're not going bald.

----------


## Jazz1

> Well, on your advice, I'm going to go with the following:
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finasteride
> 1.5% azelaic acid
> 0.25% progesterone 
> 0.025% tretinoin
> 0.1% hydrocortisone 
> 3% biotin
> ...


 That's the perfect topical formula although I use hydrocortisone once a week now, Dr klein always told me it's ok to use small percent when combined with tretinoin as it counteract skin thinning.

I'm still upset he's gone he seriously was the best Hairloss physician ever and he was going to trial a good regrowth formula this year, shame he's dead!!!!!

----------


## Jazz1

> I've always responded well to minox though, so upping to 10% + might help.


 No doubt higher percent works but it all depends on the quality, also cream based is the best as you get less sides. Even the belgravia Center formulate 12.5% and that's cream base in the uk with great success.

----------


## Jazz1

> So the fact that my father's and grandfather's "adult hairlines" begin on the back of their heads still doesn't necessarily mean I'm going bald?
> 
> Made this point a million times but here goes... just because you're not yet a NW3 or 4, doesn't mean you're not going bald.


 I know exactly how you feel, it's good your saving your hair now but I pray something works for you in time as your on a great regime.

----------


## jimpc

> So the fact that my father's and grandfather's "adult hairlines" begin on the back of their heads still doesn't necessarily mean I'm going bald?
> 
> Made this point a million times but here goes... just because you're not yet a NW3 or 4, doesn't mean you're not going bald.


 But you're not even a norwood 1. I think that's why everyone give you a hard time. i know it sucks to look at your family everyday and see them as bald, but you're not them. And you're on all this shit while you're still developing. I wouldn't even be on this stuff if I was going bald before 21 let alone 16 and then for 4 years. There isn't a doubt in my mind you've permanently messed up your hormones and have altered your growth because of this fixation. i don;t mean to be rude but someone has to say it to you.

----------


## FearTheLoss

my order just shipped! can't wait! I never tried dr kleins products, but I'm excited to see if this helps me...thanks jazz

----------


## Jazz1

> my order just shipped! can't wait! I never tried dr kleins products, but I'm excited to see if this helps me...thanks jazz


 No worries  still waiting on mine hope it arrives soon as my promox is running low. What's your current regime?

----------


## Plan C

> But you're not even a norwood 1. I think that's why everyone give you a hard time. i know it sucks to look at your family everyday and see them as bald, but you're not them. And you're on all this shit while you're still developing. I wouldn't even be on this stuff if I was going bald before 21 let alone 16 and then for 4 years. There isn't a doubt in my mind you've permanently messed up your hormones and have altered your growth because of this fixation. i don;t mean to be rude but someone has to say it to you.


 I didn't start using fin until I was basically 20, which isn't too early. What's the harm in applying minox once a day at the age of 16? It was at that age that my temples first started to go, just as my father had led me to expect, so I took action.

What's the alternative to the way I've handled hairloss? Wait for my hairline to be ruined and then start treatment? That's exactly what my brother is doing. He's 2 years younger than me and his hairline is more receded than mine. He's yet to use any treatments. This is all the evidence I need to know I've done the right thing.

With regard to 'permanently messing up my hormones' and 'altering my growth' ... I'm 6ft 2 and, despite using most available treatments, none of them have given me side effects. No sexual sides, no brain fog... Nothing. My performances at the gym haven't suffered whatsoever. I remember I went on holiday for a week and didn't take RU, dut etc. with me. By the end, I didn't feel at all different. Not one bit.

----------


## Plan C

> I know exactly how you feel, it's good your saving your hair now but I pray something works for you in time as your on a great regime.


 With the use of 75mg RU in Neogenic and this new Klein product, I'm optimistic I'll make progress. Again, thanks for all your advice.

----------


## Jazz1

> With the use of 75mg RU in Neogenic and this new Klein product, I'm optimistic I'll make progress. Again, thanks for all your advice.


 That's your last bet give it a go and give it some time  :Smile: , but go for the ingredients I told you as that's what i use, also get a derma roller.

----------


## Plan C

> That's the perfect topical formula although I use hydrocortisone once a week now, Dr klein always told me it's ok to use small percent when combined with tretinoin as it counteract skin thinning.
> 
> I'm still upset he's gone he seriously was the best Hairloss physician ever and he was going to trial a good regrowth formula this year, shame he's dead!!!!!


 To be fair, isn't 0.1% hydro a very small quantity anyway? I'm sure I've seen people using 1% and more.

----------


## Jazz1

> To be fair, isn't 0.1% hydro a very small quantity anyway? I'm sure I've seen people using 1% and more.


 Yes it is as I use 1% dactokort I got from my doctor In the uk, Dr Klein also sold it at lower dosage in his mixtures check hair site. He told me very small amount is fine so long as you add tretinoin, same as Saba gel which also has tretinoin.

----------


## Plan C

> Yes it is as I use 1% dactokort I got from my doctor In the uk, Dr Klein also sold it at lower dosage in his mixtures check hair site. He told me very small amount is fine so long as you add tretinoin, same as Saba gel which also has tretinoin.


 Hang on, so should I request 0.1 or 1?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hang on, so should I request 0.1 or 1?


 Stick to 0.1% as Dr Klein used 0.1%, see below:

PROMOX is clinically proven with 75% success rate. Read the entire hair loss clinical study for details.

60ml Lotion (2-4 week supply) per bottle. 

Contains: Minoxidil 15%, Azelaic Acid 1.5%, Progesterone 0.25%, Tretinoin 0.025%, Hydrocortisone 0.1%, Finasteride 0.1%

----------


## Plan C

> Stick to 0.1% as Dr Klein used 0.1%, see below:
> 
> PROMOX is clinically proven with 75% success rate. Read the entire hair loss clinical study for details.
> 
> 60ml Lotion (2-4 week supply) per bottle. 
> 
> Contains: Minoxidil 15%, Azelaic Acid 1.5%, Progesterone 0.25%, Tretinoin 0.025%, Hydrocortisone 0.1%, Finasteride 0.1%


 So the mixture I'm getting is essentially Promox + 3% biotin.

----------


## Jazz1

> So the mixture I'm getting is essentially Promox + 3% biotin.


 Yes but you need write these ingredients when paying prescription then tell Susan when she receives your script to make sure she makes those ingredient mixtures.

----------


## Plan C

> Yes but you need write these ingredients when paying prescription then tell Susan when she receives your script to make sure she makes those ingredient mixtures.


 Should I opt for minoxidil lotion or cream?

----------


## Jazz1

> Should I opt for minoxidil lotion or cream?


 Let her do it just say you want same texture as jazz, as I sent her Dr kleins formula so she's replicated me the same  :Smile: .

----------


## Plan C

> Let her do it just say you want same texture as jazz, as I sent her Dr kleins formula so she's replicated me the same .


 Okay, well on the inital ingredients bit I put lotion but I'll try and message her before the mixture is sent to me.

----------


## Jazz1

> Okay, well on the inital ingredients bit I put lotion but I'll try and message her before the mixture is sent to me.


 Don't worry so long as you put your ingredients and payed the prescription it's fine, once she gets your prescription from Dr kadz you can call her to pay for the products and request how you want it, I would go lotion as Dr kleins was lotion.

----------


## FearTheLoss

> No worries  still waiting on mine hope it arrives soon as my promox is running low. What's your current regime?


 PRP/CRP, minox 2x a day, dermarolling 1 time a week, praying.

----------


## Jazz1

> PRP/CRP, minox 2x a day, dermarolling 1 time a week, praying.


 What ingredient mixture you order from Susan?

----------


## Jazz1

Any updates from the guys using this? I'm still bloody waiting for mine to arrive in the uk!!

----------


## lilpauly

> Any updates from the guys using this? I'm still bloody waiting for mine to arrive in the uk!!


 sikh prince, i want to buy some,

----------


## Jazz1

> sikh prince, i want to buy some,


 Hey I need your help first, send me some links for US labs who sell finasteride powder?

Here bro you can order aswell  :Smile: :
https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

----------


## inbrugge

I received mine last Wednesday, Jazz. That was 1 week from exactly 1 week since my order was processed, but I am in the US so it's logical for it to arrive quicker down here. 

I haven't been super strict with my applications, so I've used it only about 3 times out of the 6 days I've had it. It is quite a liquidy cream. I was expecting something more gel like, but either ways it works out fine for me.

I squirt small dabs on my finger and rub it into my head. So far no noticeable difference or side effects. Time will tell.

I will post pictures later when I get around to it. Thanks again, Jazz, for arranging all this and guiding us through the purchasing process.

My only question is how do you ensure you're only using 1 mL. I squirt dabs on to my finger, but I have no idea if I'm using upto 3-4 mL at a time.

----------


## lilpauly

> Hey I need your help first, send me some links for US labs who sell finasteride powder?
> 
> Here bro you can order aswell :
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=


 hi man i dont know any labs that sell fin powder in USA.

----------


## Jazz1

> I received mine last Wednesday, Jazz. That was 1 week from exactly 1 week since my order was processed, but I am in the US so it's logical for it to arrive quicker down here. 
> 
> I haven't been super strict with my applications, so I've used it only about 3 times out of the 6 days I've had it. It is quite a liquidy cream. I was expecting something more gel like, but either ways it works out fine for me.
> 
> I squirt small dabs on my finger and rub it into my head. So far no noticeable difference or side effects. Time will tell.
> 
> I will post pictures later when I get around to it. Thanks again, Jazz, for arranging all this and guiding us through the purchasing process.
> 
> My only question is how do you ensure you're only using 1 mL. I squirt dabs on to my finger, but I have no idea if I'm using upto 3-4 mL at a time.


 
Oh great! I hope it works out the same for us like Dr klein! He was the man I'm serious his shit was the best out there I'm still upset he's dead. I hope mine arrives soon as it was shipped on the 20th, I will know for sure if this stuff works but I need to receive it first.

Did Susan not send any instructions? Or syringe? Measuring spoon?

----------


## Jazz1

> hi man i dont know any labs that sell fin powder in USA.


 I know Kane sells it, ok bro follow that link if you want to order same formula as Dr Klein.

----------


## Plan C

> I know Kane sells it, ok bro follow that link if you want to order same formula as Dr Klein.


 Susan got back to me - "The price is $89.00 for 60gm. Plus, to ship to UK is an additional $50.00 S&H fee."

How many applications is 60gm? Seems like a lot of money.

----------


## FearTheLoss

> Oh great! I hope it works out the same for us like Dr klein! He was the man I'm serious his shit was the best out there I'm still upset he's dead. I hope mine arrives soon as it was shipped on the 20th, I will know for sure if this stuff works but I need to receive it first.
> 
> Did Susan not send any instructions? Or syringe? Measuring spoon?


 
No measuring spoon or anything, just says apply 1ml a day..it's kinda hard to apply the lotion with long hair too..

----------


## FearTheLoss

I'm applying it at night, and to my receded temple points as well. I'm derma rolling once a week on one temple point and applying this to both every night..I'll keep you updated if there is a significant response different between the two.

----------


## Jazz1

> Susan got back to me - "The price is $89.00 for 60gm. Plus, to ship to UK is an additional $50.00 S&H fee."
> 
> How many applications is 60gm? Seems like a lot of money.


 It's about 60ml which will last you 2 months, to save on shipping I would buy 2 or 3 bottles that way you don't have to keep paying shipping If you buy one at a time.

I did my best with price as Dr kleins was the same price you can check hairsite to see his price list or anagen.

----------


## Jazz1

> No measuring spoon or anything, just says apply 1ml a day..it's kinda hard to apply the lotion with long hair too..


 There no pump squirt? I would get a measuring spoon of eBay theres loads of 1ml measuring spoons.

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm applying it at night, and to my receded temple points as well. I'm derma rolling once a week on one temple point and applying this to both every night..I'll keep you updated if there is a significant response different between the two.


 Ok perfect I checked my tracking it should be arriving soon, what's your current regime?

----------


## Jazz1

Guys I would not apply 1ml exact try apply Less and spread it around, dr Klein never come with measuring scoop just pump. Dr kleins 60ml lotion would last me over 2 months if used wisely.

http://www.*************/dr-klein/pr...ent-lotion.htm

----------


## FearTheLoss

> Ok perfect I checked my tracking it should be arriving soon, what's your current regime?


 prp/crp every 6 months w/greco, minox ev morning, promox every night, derma roll 1 time a week. 

Currently I am having some similar sides from this lotion as I did on finasteride, however, they don't seem to be as severe, so I'm going to stay on it for a few weeks and see what happens. I have testicular ache right now. Hopefully I'm not severely sensitive to anti androgens. 

Maybe using this at a low dosage will enable my body to adjust accordingly to fin in a higher dosage in the future.

----------


## Jazz1

Ah great regime does the PRP help I posted a thread long time back without any reply, if it helps I might get it done to maximise more growth.

As for the topical sides it will be less as I had the same issue at the start 4 years back, I had to use topical  genhair finesteride 0.25mg every third day and the sides were much less. After 6 months I added 1mg until my body adjusted and I was totally fine and have been ever since. My advice use less lotion for now say slightly less than 1ml that way it will last longer and save cost.  

I would give it time till your body adjust and horny goat weed tablets also helps, the key to removing sides is do not STRESS.

----------


## FearTheLoss

> Ah great regime does the PRP help I posted a thread long time back without any reply, if it helps I might get it done to maximise more growth.
> 
> As for the topical sides it will be less as I had the same issue at the start 4 years back, I had to use topical  genhair finesteride 0.25mg every third day and the sides were much less. After 6 months I added 1mg until my body adjusted and I was totally fine and have been ever since. My advice use less lotion for now say slightly less than 1ml that way it will last longer and save cost.  
> 
> I would give it time till your body adjust and horny goat weed tablets also helps, the key to removing sides is do not STRESS.


 Thanks Jazz!

and yes, so far I'm about a month out from my first injection of PRP/CRP and I can tell you that my shedding has completely stopped. Dr. Greco said this is good and he sees this in about 8/10 people who have the treatment done. He said most can maintain the hair they have with the therapy and a lot of them will regrow some as well, but you have to be reasonable with the results and understand that this treatment must be repeated every 6 to 12 months. I personally will be doing it every 6 months if it continues to stop my shedding. I'm not even kidding, my scalp as a whole feels much healthier since having it done. Just know that not all PRP is the same and Dr. Greco is the master of the PRP industry.

----------


## FearTheLoss

Also, I don't know if you saw my post in the cutting edge forum about a month back about low systemic technology, but I wonder if we should see if this pharmacy can use their technology to create a topical DUT without sides. What do you think?

----------


## Hicks

> Just know that not all PRP is the same and Dr. Greco is the master of the PRP industry.


 I looked into Greco. I could not find a way to compare PRP treatment to other dr. Treatments. Long story short I am going to Cole for PRP end of this month. It's also my 8th month mark from my HT.  PRP is expensive.  I was hoping to keep it $100 a month (so a treatment would cost $800 every 8 months.  

Sorry for off topic.  I use to get promox off Klein

----------


## Jazz1

> Also, I don't know if you saw my post in the cutting edge forum about a month back about low systemic technology, but I wonder if we should see if this pharmacy can use their technology to create a topical DUT without sides. What do you think?


 
Send me the link il email her no harm in asking, if she's a compounding pharmacist I'm sure she can  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> I looked into Greco. I could not find a way to compare PRP treatment to other dr. Treatments. Long story short I am going to Cole for PRP end of this month. It's also my 8th month mark from my HT.  PRP is expensive.  I was hoping to keep it $100 a month (so a treatment would cost $800 every 8 months.  
> 
> Sorry for off topic.  I use to get promox off Klein


 Problem now he is dead we can not get promox of Dr kleins office, the exact copy of his formula can still be bought though from Susan.

----------


## FearTheLoss

> Send me the link il email her no harm in asking, if she's a compounding pharmacist I'm sure she can .


 
http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/

----------


## Jazz1

I'm going to email her now for you  :Smile: , Good news my parcel has arrived I need to collect it from my local office tommorow will post pictures guys  :Smile: .

----------


## FearTheLoss

Interested to see what she says about this..

----------


## Jazz1

I emailed her and she said she can formulate anything as she has the equipment and over 30 years experience. She has pure finesteride lab powder in stock, il email the company see if they sell the cream?

----------


## Jazz1

I got my products today from Susan panick over!!!!!!!!! The bottles seem bigger than Dr kleins 60ml and the dispenser is the same as Dr Kleins. I'm just going work now will take pictures of both so you guys can compare. Il keep you lot updated as il start using them this weekend  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Quick question to the guys using Susan's product, is yours lotion or cream based? I think I may need to apply mine within syringe as its slightly watery lotion based.

----------


## Ulti1

Jazz can I put spiro in this? If so how much would you recommend ?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz can I put spiro in this? If so how much would you recommend ?


 I dont think spiro is needed as FIN is more powerfull, although genhair sell spiro cream cheap I would use spiro seperate.

----------


## Jazz1

Ok guys I'm going to apply Susan product today il keep you guys informed  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> prp/crp every 6 months w/greco, minox ev morning, promox every night, derma roll 1 time a week. 
> 
> Currently I am having some similar sides from this lotion as I did on finasteride, however, they don't seem to be as severe, so I'm going to stay on it for a few weeks and see what happens. I have testicular ache right now. Hopefully I'm not severely sensitive to anti androgens. 
> 
> Maybe using this at a low dosage will enable my body to adjust accordingly to fin in a higher dosage in the future.


 Quick question is your lotion watery type? How are you applying it?

----------


## Jazz1

Update today was the second day of my application I'm applying 0.75ml very morning, I had to use a 1ml dropper as the lotion is too liquid. I stopped my original promox bottle as I have half left, normally after stopping my scalp starts to itch and tingle followed by Hairloss 2/3 days later. I have been on promox lotion for 2 years. Anyways I spoke to Susan she stated my next batch she can make happy thick or thicker but suggested liquid type would penetrate much faster. 

Anyways so far my scalp has not itch or tingle so I'm going to give it over 72 hours 3/4 days that will give me enough time to judge the efficacy, so far it's doing the same work  :Smile: . I just pray it works the same, if it does than my next batch I might add more additives like vitamin e.

Im also going to try and see if they could do a better pricing like 50 dollars for years supply prescription and any deals on the product for you guys  :Smile: 

Il post pictures later before bed to compare both for you guys.

----------


## Jazz1

Image:

----------


## Jazz1

Right I have nothing but positive words to say about Susan and her product, today was my third day since switching over and no problems no Hairloss  :Smile: . When I would stop Promox my scalp would itch and Hairloss begin, none of this has happend when switching over so that goes to show the efficacy of Susan's product is legit.

Also someone asked me to contact Dr Andrews see if I could get better price of him, we'll turns out they use Susan's pharmacy and here's the email. I think it's fair I say we won't get better than Susan since Dr Klein passing away, I'm happy and will carry on with her  :Smile: .

http://www.hairmeds.com/questions_propecia.htm

Dr Andrews email:

"The pharmacy we have used for years is Murray Ave Apothecary Pharmacy .

They are well known for their expertise in compounding.

As far as pricing goes for the actual medication…$89.00 is a special pricing for all of the folks in the same situation as you find yourself.

We do not have control over the fees that the pharmacy sets forth, unfortunately.

As you specified…you are correct…the initial visit to connect with Dr McAndrew is $100.00 and the follow up visits at one year for refill authorization is $50.00."

----------


## Jazz1

Guys great news and I'm super happy now, the product works superb exactly like Dr kleins product I'm so happy and a lot of you guys asked about prices. 

Well guess what I done wohooooo, I made Susan reduce prices and they will be fixed permenant, she's matched Dr kleins prices and also she has done deals the more bottles bought at one go the better reduced prices  :Smile: . I also asked her to make products for the other clients who were using sprays and other formulas, I seriously can not thank God, if you do good things for people God does listen. I never would have thought since Dr Klein passing away i would be able to use his products or duplicate version again.

I also have some vital information regarding Dr Richard Lee as one of her boss worked with him so this means the ex patients of Dr lee may be able to buy his old formulated products through Susan  :Smile: .

----------


## FearTheLoss

> I emailed her and she said she can formulate anything as she has the equipment and over 30 years experience. She has pure finesteride lab powder in stock, il email the company see if they sell the cream?


 Any word on this?

----------


## Plan C

> Guys great news and I'm super happy now, the product works superb exactly like Dr kleins product I'm so happy and a lot of you guys asked about prices. 
> 
> Well guess what I done wohooooo, I made Susan reduce prices and they will be fixed permenant, she's matched Dr kleins prices and also she has done deals the more bottles bought at one go the better reduced prices . I also asked her to make products for the other clients who were using sprays and other formulas, I seriously can not thank God, if you do good things for people God does listen. I never would have thought since Dr Klein passing away i would be able to use his products or duplicate version again.
> 
> I also have some vital information regarding Dr Richard Lee as one of her boss worked with him so this means the ex patients of Dr lee may be able to buy his old formulated products through Susan .


 Any idea how long shipping usually takes to the UK for Susan's Dr Klein products? Placed my order yesterday.

----------


## Jazz1

> Any word on this?


 Sorry bro I forgot to ask again, but she did state she can formulate anything please remind me tommorow I will phone her for you  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Any idea how long shipping usually takes to the UK for Susan's Dr Klein products? Placed my order yesterday.


 I placed mine on the 20th September and it arrived I think 18 days later as customs had charged me! Next time I'm going to tell Susan to put SAMPLE as my receipt was in the box hence why they charge me! It all depends on customs if it gets stopped or not but minimum is less than 2 weeks and maximum is 3 weeks.

----------


## Jazz1

As above guys I have convinced her to reduce prices and do deals on more products bought in one go just like Dr klein, which worked a treat she agreed to help the community.

Also just to update I stopped Promox Saturday and been using her product once per morning, normally when I stop Promox my scalp would itch followed by hairloss. Well the dreaded panick is over as her product works the exact same as Dr kleins I could not be more happier. There's also a guy I'm trying to get hold of as he's lost ground fast since he run out of Dr kleins lotion, he was upset the last time we spoke so I'm trying to get in touch as this will work the same for him.

I also asked her to make 1ml syringes next time rather than the pump as the formulation is slightly less thicker than Kleins but watery. I prefer it watery now as I use a 1ml syringe and make small drops than massage it around, absorbs faster. Although she did state she can formulate it however I like, but I asked her to do it as she's the pharmacist on what she beleives is more effective. I guess she's right as Dr kleins lotions use to leave some residue behind even though it worked great.

----------


## Plan C

> I placed mine on the 20th September and it arrived I think 18 days later as customs had charged me! Next time I'm going to tell Susan to put SAMPLE as my receipt was in the box hence why they charge me! It all depends on customs if it gets stopped or not but minimum is less than 2 weeks and maximum is 3 weeks.


 So I should ask her to put sample on the box?

----------


## Jazz1

> So I should ask her to put sample on the box?


 Has she shipped it? Tell her to put sample on everything and email you the receipt as my receipt was in the box! That's why bloody customs charged me!

I will call her tommorow to help us UK guys save money from greedy customs for the future.

----------


## Plan C

> Has she shipped it? Tell her to put sample on everything and email you the receipt as my receipt was in the box! That's why bloody customs charged me!
> 
> I will call her tommorow to help us UK guys save money from greedy customs for the future.


 They're making the formula as we speak. I've emailed her with what you've just told me, hopefully I can avoid this issue.

----------


## Jazz1

> They're making the formula as we speak. I've emailed her with what you've just told me, hopefully I can avoid this issue.


 Yea it's avoidable if yours gets stopped in customs they will see it as an sample, anything with a price mark customs rob us!

----------


## FearTheLoss

Jazz, were you able to get ahold of her? 

Here's what I'm talking about**: http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/

Thanks, FTL

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz, were you able to get ahold of her? 
> 
> Here's what I'm talking about**: http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/
> 
> Thanks, FTL


 Hey just got of the phone for you, I'm going to email her the link now. I also contacted the company for you I asked if it can be combined and how to obtain it  :Smile: .

----------


## inbrugge

Hey Jazz. Good work on the creabilis. That's very important. If we can get something from there, it would definitely be a game changer. Let's see what they say.

I've now been usıng Susan's Lotion for about 2 weeks. I have some good news and bad news.

Good news is my shedding has almost fully stopped. I'm seeing only 1-2 full hairs fall out per day and maybe 4-5 smaller ones. Previously, I was losing between 10-30 full hairs per day. It was depressing.

Now, for the bad news...You guessed it, the sides. I can still get it up whenever I want, but the erections are not nearly as powerful, the ejaculate is more watery, and the guy down stairs feels not so alive during the day unless I'm specifically trying to get it up. But, I'm assuming these would go away if I stop, so I can somewhat tolerate these. (I had a short stint on Ru with simlar sides that went away after 1 week of stopping Ru).

However, I'm also having enlarged puffy nips which I cannot tolerate on the long term. So I'm taking a break for a week and will start again with smaller doses. I want my hair, but I don't wanna walk around with a full head of hair and a pair of knockers.

I think a big problem is that I ended up using way too much of the lotion. Maybe 2-4 times more. I'm a diffuse thinner so I can easily get carried away trying to cover my whole scalp. I've asked previously here how to make sure I'm using only 1 mL per application, but I didn't get any answers. It's not like Rogaine that has a measurement on the dropper. I'm squirting little amounts on my finger tips and maybe after 4-5 squirts it can end up being 3 mL or more. Who knows? 

So please help with this somebody. How to make sure I'm using only 1 mL of lotion per applicatin. I tried using the Rogaine liquid dropper but that was a major fail. It would be nice, though, to have some sort of dropper instead of my fingers.

----------


## Jazz1

Thank you for the kind words makes me happy  :Smile: , I can help you as I have been there with bad sides when I started finesteride. If you could email me jass897@hotmail.com I will go more into this In detail with you. Please bare with me as I'm waiting for new iPad leads, using a phone is hard!

Also I understand your point, the product works perfect for me but I could not stand the pump application as the lotion was more watery although Susan did say she could alter the texture to be more thicker next time and is also adding 1ml syringes from now on. After using it I'm happy with it being watery.

I'm using this type 1ml syringe here's a picture very easy to apply and I'm using 0.75ml working great since I made the switch. Buy a 1ml syringe they very cheap from the chemist and that way you can measure the exact perfect dosage. 

The syringe pictured below is perfect, I slowly let 1-2 drops then massage around with my fingers until I cover my main points.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz, were you able to get ahold of her? 
> 
> Here's what I'm talking about**: http://www.creabilis-sa.com/lse/
> 
> Thanks, FTL


 
I'm still waiting a reply as they don't work weekends, also that company never replied to me.

----------


## Jazz1

Also to clarify a few things I was using Dr kleins kit ie lotion morning and prescription spray night time. I have dropped the spray and to be honest Susan's product once per morning is doing the job perfect no need to waste extra money for night time prescription spray. So I now just use regaine foam at night, also to the ones who still fancy the kits as I had a guy email me to help him order both on one prescription. Here is the reply below from Dr kadz;

"We made a separate link for former Dr Klein patients that allows one to get multiple hair loss products -equivalent to what one was using with Dr Klein - so for one consult fee can get multiple strength minoxidil products and acetyl glutathione"

----------


## Jazz1

Please guys if your using Susan's product and made the switch from Dr Klein like me you will know its much better and works exactly the same, she has saved me from depression as the product is amazing, no hairloss no scalp itch. If you have time please email her or create a testimonial on her site as she deserves credit, we should be gratefull she has helped us as there is no one else!

----------


## Jazz1

Oh I also forgot to mention Dr Joan Kadz  from medicall wellness center for prescribing us the product  :Smile: .

----------


## goldnt

> Oh I also forgot to mention Dr Joan Kadz  from medicall wellness center for prescribing us the product .


 Hey Jazz

Turns out the problem i had with ru was the vehicle i changed back to the original eth/pg vehicle and its much better. However i still lose a bit more than i should so im planning to go on this. Do you have any side effects from the topical fin? Its only 1% right? Could you tell me all the ingredients you use? I decided to try fin recently and got hit hard with sides and rode with it for a bit and i couldn't handle it. I guess im just one the few who cant use it. My testicles did start shrinking with in a week . I naturally have low dht and so im guessing with fin it dropped it to unsafe levels.

----------


## goldnt

I changed the vehicle in the first place because the pg from the vehicle plus the pg minox gave me severe dandruff. even prescription keto shampoo couldnt deal with it.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz
> 
> Turns out the problem i had with ru was the vehicle i changed back to the original eth/pg vehicle and its much better. However i still lose a bit more than i should so im planning to go on this. Do you have any side effects from the topical fin? Its only 1% right? Could you tell me all the ingredients you use? I decided to try fin recently and got hit hard with sides and rode with it for a bit and i couldn't handle it. I guess im just one the few who cant use it. My testicles did start shrinking with in a week . I naturally have low dht and so im guessing with fin it dropped it to unsafe levels.


 I use the following also I had major sides on FIN the key is making your body adjust I can guide you in more detail just email me jass897@hotmail.com.

The ingredients I use are:

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride
1.5% azelaic acid
0.025% progesterone
0.25% tretinoin 

Good thing you can get finesteride lowered to 0.05% to start with and let you body adjust than get it formulated higher etc.

----------


## Lumbergh

Jazz1 - thanks for this thread. I'm obviously a newbie around here, but hoping you could answer a question or two for me. Below is a little background info.

I was never using Dr. Klein or Dr. Lee's products, I just happened to stumble upon this thread looking for something new to use out of frustration. My main area of concern is my crown, been thinning for the last 7 years or so, roughly the size of a fist. I have just been using the Big 3 for the last year, but with very little regrowth (hard to say if it's doing a good job maintaining or not). At the same time, I don't have the time, or the budget, to have 20 different products in my daily routine. I recently considered quartering 5 mg of finasteride. If I were to use the ingredients you list above, would you say that is too much and stick to 1mg, or it shouldn't be an issue? You also suggest the formula above at night and continue to use Rogaine foam in the morning?

Thank you for any answers you can help with. Just from reading this thread it seems like you've helped so many others in the community. Kudos to you, sir!

----------


## Plan C

> I use the following also I had major sides on FIN the key is making your body adjust I can guide you in more detail just email me jass897@hotmail.com.
> 
> The ingredients I use are:
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finesteride
> 1.5% azelaic acid
> 0.025% progesterone
> 0.25% tretinoin 
> ...


 You warned me earlier in this thread about the customs charge imposed on your order and that it could be avoided by labelling everything as 'samples' and not including a receipt with the order.

Even though I notified Susan of this and asked her to make the necessary arrangements, she clearly didn't as I've been given a customs charge of £50. Not happy.

----------


## Jazz1

Sorry guys I just got out of hospital bad food poisoning I will reply later, Plan c I'm sorry mate I tried telling Susan Unfortunatly due to legal reasons of her business she could not write 'Samples' looks like I'm also going to be effected like wise. To be Honest I rather pay the customs charge than have no product to use at all and it should not have been £50 pounds? How many did you order as I only payed £18 for 2 bottles I ordered.

I do not get why Susan can not do it as Dr Klein office never included receipts etc they just emailed me the invoices etc. As above I did speak with her and that's the response I got, I will try having another word see if there's a way around for us UK guys.

----------


## Plan C

> Sorry guys I just got out of hospital bad food poisoning I will reply later, Plan c I'm sorry mate I tried telling Susan Unfortunatly due to legal reasons of her business she could not write 'Samples' looks like I'm also going to be effected like wise. To be Honest I rather pay the customs charge than have no product to use at all and it should not have been £50 pounds? How many did you order as I only payed £18 for 2 bottles I ordered.
> 
> I do not get why Susan can not do it as Dr Klein office never included receipts etc they just emailed me the invoices etc. As above I did speak with her and that's the response I got, I will try having another word see if there's a way around for us UK guys.


 Bought 2 bottles. Very unhappy.

----------


## Jazz1

> Bought 2 bottles. Very unhappy.


 I will try having another word.

----------


## Plan C

> I will try having another word.


 I'm more pissed off with the Royal Mail. How can my customs charge be more than twice yours when we ordered the same thing!?

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm more pissed off with the Royal Mail. How can my customs charge be more than twice yours when we ordered the same thing!?


 I know the feeling that really does not make any sense and I can see this being a regular issue for us guys. I would contact them and query the charge? I have just emailed Susan with the below, I will keep you updated on the response;

"Hey Susan bit of an issue some UK guys are complaining, I know there's ways around this like emailing them the receipt etc. He is not very happy as customs has charged him nearly 100 dollars for clearing the 2 lotions he bought. Can there be a way to not include receipts etc in the box? And rather have them emailed by invoice etc?

This will effect some UK customers wanting to purchase lotions because of customs charges etc, I know it can be avoided very easily.?"

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz1 - thanks for this thread. I'm obviously a newbie around here, but hoping you could answer a question or two for me. Below is a little background info.
> 
> I was never using Dr. Klein or Dr. Lee's products, I just happened to stumble upon this thread looking for something new to use out of frustration. My main area of concern is my crown, been thinning for the last 7 years or so, roughly the size of a fist. I have just been using the Big 3 for the last year, but with very little regrowth (hard to say if it's doing a good job maintaining or not). At the same time, I don't have the time, or the budget, to have 20 different products in my daily routine. I recently considered quartering 5 mg of finasteride. If I were to use the ingredients you list above, would you say that is too much and stick to 1mg, or it shouldn't be an issue? You also suggest the formula above at night and continue to use Rogaine foam in the morning?
> 
> Thank you for any answers you can help with. Just from reading this thread it seems like you've helped so many others in the community. Kudos to you, sir!


 This is my regime everyone is different so it is really all about trying what works and suits each person.

My regime is the Big 3, I use Regiane foam twice a day than 10 minutes later I apply the above lotion mixture on the temples only. I wash my hair twice a day with Regenepure Dr and Nt and I take internal FIN every other day. My hair has been great forthe past 4 years using the above method and I could not be more happier.

----------


## Plan C

> I know the feeling that really does not make any sense and I can see this being a regular issue for us guys. I would contact them and query the charge? I have just emailed Susan with the below, I will keep you updated on the response;
> 
> "Hey Susan bit of an issue some UK guys are complaining, I know there's ways around this like emailing them the receipt etc. He is not very happy as customs has charged him nearly 100 dollars for clearing the 2 lotions he bought. Can there be a way to not include receipts etc in the box? And rather have them emailed by invoice etc?
> 
> This will effect some UK customers wanting to purchase lotions because of customs charges etc, I know it can be avoided very easily.?"


 I appreciate you having a word. Hopefully I can get to the bottom of this with the Royal Fail ASAP.

Also - I hope your case of food poisoning is okay now! Had it before myself and its not pleasant.

----------


## Lumbergh

> This is my regime everyone is different so it is really all about trying what works and suits each person.
> 
> My regime is the Big 3, I use Regiane foam twice a day than 10 minutes later I apply the above lotion mixture on the temples only. I wash my hair twice a day with Regenepure Dr and Nt and I take internal FIN every other day. My hair has been great forthe past 4 years using the above method and I could not be more happier.


 Thank you for the response. I'm fairly new to looking at products outside of the Big 3. I also read a little bit about the RU solution from anagenic. 

Would it be wise to stop taking Fin orally all together if I added that? So thinking my routine when then be RU, the solution discussed in this thread, and Rogaine foam at night. 

Apologize if any of my questions have been addressed already and I missed them.

Thanks again.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys you will have to bare with me I love helping people but I'm still not well my heads spinning from food poisoning since I got out of hospital, give me few days till I'm better I will respond promise.

----------


## goldnt

> Hey guys you will have to bare with me I love helping people but I'm still not well my heads spinning from food poisoning since I got out of hospital, give me few days till I'm better I will respond promise.


 Hope you feel better. Take as long as you need pal.

----------


## lilpauly

Sikh prince I'm going to order ! Btw customs charging is not fair , them bastards

----------


## inbrugge

hope you get better jazz

----------


## Jazz1

Thanks guys probiotics have saved me and stopped my diarrhea, I still feel light headed but should be ok tommorow and will respond to everyone tomorrow  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Sikh prince I'm going to order ! Btw customs charging is not fair , them bastards


 I know they charged me aswell!!

----------


## Jazz1

Right guys I still had a box of Dr kleins box shipment and in 2 years I never got charged by customs with Dr Klein. I checked the box the only way around it and how Dr Klein avoided long delays and custom charges was he wrote "SAMPLE LOTIONS", I have emailed Susan explaining there is a way around and could she please help us avoid the long delay and customs charges which can easily be avoided. I will do my best to see if she can help us in the way Dr Klein did to avoid these delays and silly custom charges.




See below a box from Dr Klein:

----------


## Jazz1

Quick update guys and to the people who emailed me I will respond tommorow as I'm getting better now thanks to my probiotics, Susan has emailed me and she going to see what she can do. I will post and update the emails I have from her, she's honestly a great Lady and I know if she can help she will so lets see  :Smile: .

----------


## Plan C

> Quick update guys and to the people who emailed me I will respond tommorow as I'm getting better now thanks to my probiotics, Susan has emailed me and she going to see what she can do. I will post and update the emails I have from her, she's honestly a great Lady and I know if she can help she will so lets see .


 You're not going to believe this...

I contacted HMRC and asked about my £50 customs charge. They informed me that Susan had put a value of $356 on the outside of my order! Why on earth would she do that? I was charged the correct amount for my 2 bottles (around £150), which definitely does not equate to $356...

I'm going to have to have stern words with Susan once her store opens.

----------


## Jazz1

> You're not going to believe this...
> 
> I contacted HMRC and asked about my £50 customs charge. They informed me that Susan had put a value of $356 on the outside of my order! Why on earth would she do that? I was charged the correct amount for my 2 bottles (around £150), which definitely does not equate to $356...
> 
> I'm going to have to have stern words with Susan once her store opens.


 
Oucccchhhh!, I would give her a direct call and discuss this! Not good! If you guys call her to express the feelings than maybe it would also help me trying to explain about writing "Sample" and not putting prices on the box to void custom charges.

----------


## Jazz1

Right I have emailed Susan she will look into this, but I do not think she would deserve to be spoken with stern words as she has helped us this far and I'm very gratefull that I can still buy a product since Dr Klein passed away.

Do give her a call but try be nice and polite as I'm sure there's an understanding to all this and I'm sure she can help as she's very professional mannered polite lady.

----------


## Jazz1

Hope this helps and Unfortunatly this is the best she can do in terms of customs, from her point I understand as she has to declare pricing otherwise she would be out of pocket for lost parcels. She also explained about the difference between her and Dr Klein, how he did things illegally and unprofessional. She stated she has and always will remain professional, Unfortunatly the below is the best she could do. My products were valued at nearly 200 dollars I was charged £18, I beleive USA customers are ok it's only the abroad customers would be effected depending which country the goods are shipped.

Paul you still have the box sent? Could you post a picture of the pricing? Maybe Royal are lying?

"Ok, I have spoken with my shipping coordinator and she says Paul ****** is the only other Paul we shipped to GB and his declared value (right off the printer) was only 115 US dollars ,NOT 356.
I am willing to put Hair loss lotion or cream and leave off Minoxidil Lotion or Cream on the front of the package but according to USPS we are required by law to label the front of the package.
We can email receipts to the hair loss people and not put a receipt in the bag.* I do not wish to flag my pharmacy and since we properly label our products our name is on the RX label.
*
Hope this helps,
Susan"

----------


## Plan C

> Hope this helps and Unfortunatly this is the best she can do in terms of customs, from her point I understand as she has to declare pricing otherwise she would be out of pocket for lost parcels. She also explained about the difference between her and Dr Klein, how he did things illegally and unprofessional. She stated she has and always will remain professional, Unfortunatly the below is the best she could do. My products were valued at nearly 200 dollars I was charged £18, I beleive USA customers are ok it's only the abroad customers would be effected depending which country the goods are shipped.
> 
> Paul you still have the box sent? Could you post a picture of the pricing? Maybe Royal are lying?
> 
> "Ok, I have spoken with my shipping coordinator and she says Paul ****** is the only other Paul we shipped to GB and his declared value (right off the printer) was only 115 US dollars ,NOT 356.
> I am willing to put Hair loss lotion or cream and leave off Minoxidil Lotion or Cream on the front of the package but according to USPS we are required by law to label the front of the package.
> We can email receipts to the hair loss people and not put a receipt in the bag.* I do not wish to flag my pharmacy and since we properly label our products our name is on the RX label.
> *
> Hope this helps,
> Susan"


 I've just spoken to her - don't worry I was nice. Also my name isn't Paul. Susan also seemed to think that I am Paul but she checked her records and realised that I am someone else... Not sure what was going on there.

Susan looked into what happened and realised that there had been an error down there end. She offered me a $40 dollar refund, which I accepted.

She also informed me of all of the changes they are making that you mentioned above and the issues with pricing etc. To be honest, I am just grateful that she is willing to make the lotion for us and I passed this sentiment on to her.

Issue over. I'll pay the customs charge and see if the stuff is any good.

----------


## Jazz1

I'm glad things are sorted and I'm glad you thanked her shit happens, but trust me you won't be disappointed by her product as I made the switch and it's the best thing just like Dr kleins Promox  :Smile: .

Anyways guys please feel free to message me I'm slowly replying to my emails now, il do my best to help anyone  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Guys/ladies I'm getting a lot of emails and I think one girl or lady ordering from Susan I can't recall how many emails or people I'm trying to help. If your that girl/lady please email me as I might be recommending this lotion that's for men, you probably need lower dosage if your new client lady.

Susan said it sounded like a girls name Parsha or something, if it's a guy then you need the finesteride in the formula if it's a girl than you shouldn't be using 15%! Either way email me again so I can guide you.

----------


## Jazz1

GUYS! just to make it clear Susan can not write 'Samples' on the boxs she has made this clear to me! Sorry!

----------


## johnnyboots

Jazz does Susan have a direct phone line or u can give me her email,thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz does Susan have a direct phone line or u can give me her email,thanks


 Yea sure she might be tied up as she's always busy when I call her, anything I can help you with as I have asked her a lot of questions already?

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...446&highlight=

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/about-...erenstein.html
4227 Murray Ave. | Pittsburgh | PA | 15217
P: 412-421-4996 | 1-888-799-4247
F: 412-421-6500

----------


## johnnyboots

Thanks Jazz ordered a few months ago I wanted the promox type I must of filled it out wrong .also interested in gluthathione u mentioned .

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks Jazz ordered a few months ago I wanted the promox type I must of filled it out wrong .also interested in gluthathione u mentioned .


 Do you need help filling it out again? I know the ingredients as I use Promox ingredient formula. what are you currently using? How's it going?

Yes I read up on Glutathione and she told me she can formulate seperate lotion with biotin for me, so I will place it on my next order.

----------


## johnnyboots

> Do you need help filling it out again? I know the ingredients as I use Promox ingredient formula. what are you currently using? How's it going?
> 
> Yes I read up on Glutathione and she told me she can formulate seperate lotion with biotin for me, so I will place it on my next order.


  Ended up forgetting trentonin added grapeseed and biotin,feel it has helped but I'm pissed I screwed up

----------


## johnnyboots

So I figure if I call her directly it would be easier I placed order with another woman who was very nice

----------


## Jazz1

> Ended up forgetting trentonin added grapeseed and biotin,feel it has helped but I'm pissed I screwed up


 Oh crap, you need to email Dr kadz at the medical wellnes center as Susan can not give you tretinoin without a prescription. Give them a call and ask her, see what she says.

----------


## Jazz1

> So I figure if I call her directly it would be easier I placed order with another woman who was very nice


 Did you use Promox before?

----------


## johnnyboots

> Did you use Promox before?


 Just gonna reorder the right way lol, so just give Katz a email?will he know promox ingredients ?can I call her directly I paid for prescription earlier

----------


## Jazz1

> Just gonna reorder the right way lol, so just give Katz a email?will he know promox ingredients ?can I call her directly I paid for prescription earlier


 They won't know the exact ingredients but I know all the formulas, what is it exactly you want promox lotion ingredients? What ingredients lotion did you currently order?

I'm sure they can edit your prescription and re email Susan. Before you email them tell me what you need so I can tell you the correct mixture?

http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com
wellnessmd@yahoo.com

Promox lotion contained:

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride
1.5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesterone
0.025% tretinoin.
Tripeptide biotinoyl-L 3%.

----------


## Parsia

> Guys/ladies I'm getting a lot of emails and I think one girl or lady ordering from Susan I can't recall how many emails or people I'm trying to help. If your that girl/lady please email me as I might be recommending this lotion that's for men, you probably need lower dosage if your new client lady.
> 
> Susan said it sounded like a girls name Parsha or something, if it's a guy then you need the finesteride in the formula if it's a girl than you shouldn't be using 15%! Either way email me again so I can guide you.


 Hello Jazz , Sorry if I get back to you later, I haven't use my account here for about 1 year and half and I was near to register to answer you then I've noticed that I had an account and need to reset pass and etc. Anyhow , my name is Parsia , and I know you from a year ago in this forum , first I want to say I was the guy who talks with Susan and thanks for your concern buddy , So I'm not a girl : lol ( I know its not your fault , many do the same mistake because of how my first name look like ) , Second , I was thinking to remove fin from Promox because I really have some doubt if it works very well , and right know I use fin orally 0.5 mg , thats why I asked susan to remove that from " Jazz forumla " , Third regard to DR.Klein dead , I just want to say the only reason that I didn't buy any product from him was because he was not very honest with me , he gave me a fake discount on the phone and then I told him its even more expensive than your website price!!! how it come to be a discount? then he changed his words and said he did a mistake. In addition what was the reason to use a product 4 times in a day? I asked him this question and he got angry and told me you should use it 4 times or you don't get result. 
Because of all these reasons I changed my mind and canceled my order with him last year. Furthermore , I Know you are a helpful guy and you got very good result with that and I respect to you , just wanna share with you and other guys that the only reason that I didn't given a shot to " promox " was because I had doubt in DR.KLEIN honestly . If you have any comment or explain about promox please let me know , how about use the same of your regimen without fin topical since I already have it orally ,have any suggestion?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey yes I remember you now and I remember telling you not to listen to Dr Klein as I never used his products 4 times a day your right it was an overkill and expensive if you did.

The good part about Susan she's straight up honest and knowledgeable and stated clearly there's no need to waste money you only need it once per day.

Now have you placed your order with Susan? What ingredients did you add if so? That way I can go by helping you. Also post your full regime below and how is your Hairloss?

----------


## Parsia

> Hey yes I remember you now and I remember telling you not to listen to Dr Klein as I never used his products 4 times a day your right it was an overkill and expensive if you did.
> 
> The good part about Susan she's straight up honest and knowledgeable and stated clearly there's no need to waste money you only need it once per day.
> 
> Now have you placed your order with Susan? What ingredients did you add if so? That way I can go by helping you. Also post your full regime below and how is your Hairloss?


 Thanks Jazz for your concern and your quick respond . Right now I use :
1- Rogaine foam 5 % 2x daily
2- Finpecia ( Finasteride ) 0.5mg daily
3- Prox-n ( on hairline at night)
4- Nizoral shampoo rotate with Pura d'or argan oil shampoo 
5- Biotin 5000mg and Multiviatimin . 

Here is my whole regimen and I just want to get the same as yours but just not make sure about fin , since I already start it in my regimen and I really not sure about topical fin , So whats your suggestion Jazz?

----------


## Parsia

I forgot to add say that I haven't place my order yet and I have hairloss from when I was 18 , now I'm 31 and I think I'm in narwood 3-3.5 , my hairloss was not very agressive in these 13 years.  I got good result with lipogaine few months ago but I have stopped it unfortunately , In addition I always used the product on and off before because I wasn't enough patient but this time I really want to keep going on them , because I learn from my mistakes.

----------


## Jazz1

Right that is a really good regime don't stop! Has your hairloss stabilised at that regime or are you still losing ground? If your losing ground than I would add 0.1% finesteride to the mixture, if your not losing ground than I would go without finesteride in the mixture.

----------


## Parsia

> Right that is a really good regime don't stop! Has your hairloss stabilised at that regime or are you still losing ground? If your losing ground than I would add 0.1% finesteride to the mixture, if your not losing ground than I would go without finesteride in the mixture.


 Dear Jazz , I have started this regimen recently( about two weeks) , so honestly I can't say about losing ground because of shedding process , I really like to know if fin topical works or not ? Honestly I'm not too sure that fin works topically , I know there are few studies about that but since I used polaris-NR10 and don't see that much of regrowth I have doubt about it , whats your personal opinion about this issue ? but for sure Retin-A and azelaic acid would work , Minoxidil 15 % is something which is still not very clear for me regard to more regrowth ! whats your thoughts?

----------


## Plan C

> Right that is a really good regime don't stop! Has your hairloss stabilised at that regime or are you still losing ground? If your losing ground than I would add 0.1% finesteride to the mixture, if your not losing ground than I would go without finesteride in the mixture.


 Bottles arrived today. How do you apply the stuff? I have 1ml pipettes but it looks pretty thick (especially with hydrocortisone in there).

----------


## Jazz1

> Bottles arrived today. How do you apply the stuff? I have 1ml pipettes but it looks pretty thick (especially with hydrocortisone in there).


 
Yes I beleive the added hydorcortisone makes the lotion thicker etc, did you not get a syringe 1ml. I would extract 1ml obviously shaking very well and then apply to your main areas of concer.

----------


## Jazz1

> Dear Jazz , I have started this regimen recently( about two weeks) , so honestly I can't say about losing ground because of shedding process , I really like to know if fin topical works or not ? Honestly I'm not too sure that fin works topically , I know there are few studies about that but since I used polaris-NR10 and don't see that much of regrowth I have doubt about it , whats your personal opinion about this issue ? but for sure Retin-A and azelaic acid would work , Minoxidil 15 % is something which is still not very clear for me regard to more regrowth ! whats your thoughts?


 Dr kleins products worked he has so many ex clients like me because the fact his products worked. I have Polaris NR-11 and NR-10 I posted pictures I never used them as I found Susan since Dr Klein passed away. Polaris labs does not appeal much to me, the NR-10 has to much gritty un mixed minoxidil, It doesn't look very effective to me  :Smile: .

See picture below as proof I have them all:
Polaris, Promox(we can't buy anymore), Susan's product.



My personal opinion nothing ever beat Dr Klein stuff since he Is dead the closest thing we now have is Susan. I'm just very thankfull i found her as her product works exactly the same as Dr Klein. Also bare in mind no doctor formulated these products they are sent to a compounding pharmacist to formulate, not every person can formulate products to be effective. I contacted different pharmacist in US before finding Susan, most of them said they couldn't mix all the ingredients with anything over 5% minoxidil. Dr kleins pharmacist had different ways and Susan knows her ways to mix them correctly to work together etc.

----------


## Plan C

> Yes I beleive the added hydorcortisone makes the lotion thicker etc, did you not get a syringe 1ml. I would extract 1ml obviously shaking very well and then apply to your main areas of concer.


 I've tried extracting 1ml but the stuff is so thick it gets stuck in the syringe. Not sure if getting hydrocortisone included was a wise decision as the mixture might now be too thick to penetrate my scalp properly.

----------


## Jazz1

> I've tried extracting 1ml but the stuff is so thick it gets stuck in the syringe. Not sure if getting hydrocortisone included was a wise decision as the mixture might now be too thick to penetrate my scalp properly.


 Do you have a pump squirt with it? Take a picture, sounds like its the hydorcortisone that's made it thicker etc but I'm sure it will work the same as they been selling the stuff for years.

----------


## Jazz1

Guys I just want to thank the people who email me with kind words, it's positive nice words that make me happy to carry on helping people  :Smile: , thank you God bless all.

----------


## Plan C

My experience of this stuff has not been great so far. All I have noticed is that a) applying my usual RU in Neogenic mixture today felt like somebody was tattooing my temples (think Susan's product must be irritating my scalp) and b) Susan's stuff is so thick that a lot of it remains on my head, rather than being absorbed.

Some of this is probably my fault for opting to have 3% biotin added to the usual formula.

----------


## Jazz1

> My experience of this stuff has not been great so far. All I have noticed is that a) applying my usual RU in Neogenic mixture today felt like somebody was tattooing my temples (think Susan's product must be irritating my scalp) and b) Susan's stuff is so thick that a lot of it remains on my head, rather than being absorbed.
> 
> Some of this is probably my fault for opting to have 3% biotin added to the usual formula.


 The irritation is from Tretinoin I have had the same irritation at the start 2 years back when I first applied Dr kleins lotion. When I would apply Regaine foam over the areas I applied Dr kleins products it would sting for a few seconds, that's because tretinoin irritates the skin. It took a month or two until my scalp adjusted to tretinoin. You can search threads on hairlosshelp about tretinoin in Promox irritating the scalp, Sandman advised me to carry on and I did, he was right things adjusted etc.

The tretinoin is a key in the mixture because it helps penetrate the ingredients more deeper so they work more effectively in the derma papila, also tretinoin is known to interrupt the DHT synthesis., aswell as stimulate regrowth from the irritation give it time you probably end up happier if you see regrowth.

Watch this video by Dr Klein:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2Tc9IeWDa3M

----------


## Plan C

> The irritation is from Tretinoin I have had the same irritation at the start 2 years back when I first applied Dr kleins lotion. When I would apply Regaine foam over the areas I applied Dr kleins products it would sting for a few seconds, that's because tretinoin irritates the skin. It took a month or two until my scalp adjusted to tretinoin. You can search threads on hairlosshelp about tretinoin in Promox irritating the scalp, Sandman advised me to carry on and I did, he was right things adjusted etc.
> 
> The tretinoin is a key in the mixture because it helps penetrate the ingredients more deeper so they work more effectively in the derma papila, also tretinoin is known to interrupt the DHT synthesis., aswell as stimulate regrowth from the irritation give it time you probably end up happier if you see regrowth.
> 
> Watch this video by Dr Klein:
> 
> http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2Tc9IeWDa3M


 This is all good to know, thanks. Applying alcohol-based stuff on the areas of irritation currently burns like hell but I've never given up on a treatment and I don't intend to now. I have probably been applying too much of Susan's too, which has probably made it worse. If you could indicate how much of the mixture you use a day, this would be helpful.

----------


## Jazz1

> This is all good to know, thanks. Applying alcohol-based stuff on the areas of irritation currently burns like hell but I've never given up on a treatment and I don't intend to now. I have probably been applying too much of Susan's too, which has probably made it worse. If you could indicate how much of the mixture you use a day, this would be helpful.


 I was like you panicking and complaining to dr Kleins clinic at the start when I first used Promox but Sandamn explained on hairloshelp it's the tretinoin and takes few months to adjust, your right it's the alcohol content irritating the skin because of the tretinoin removing slight layer. The tretinoin is required especially when using hydorcortisone to counter skin thinning even though it's a very tiny dosage.

I use 1ml a day more than enough to cover my temples although recently I started adding some to the crown and now my crowns stinging lol but my temples are fine because I been using Promox past 2 years on just the temples.

If you find you can't measure the mixture with a syringe on eBay they sell measuring spoons cheap, just get an 1ml measuring spoon  :Smile: . Also make sure your spreading the lotion and rub it around so thin layers are covered on your main points.

----------


## doke

Hi even Dr Lewenbergs 2% minoxidil with 0.25% tretinoin caused my scalp problems. I know he has a new sensitive version but he states you really neen to only spray the lotion at about 8 ins away from the scalp, and do not massage just use it like a hair spray as otherwise you will cause irritation.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi even Dr Lewenbergs 2% minoxidil with 0.25% tretinoin caused my scalp problems. I know he has a new sensitive version but he states you really neen to only spray the lotion at about 8 ins away from the scalp, and do not massage just use it like a hair spray as otherwise you will cause irritation.


  The problem most hairloss people face from tretinoin is panick, just like when I first used Promox I panicked and wanted to bin it! Until I listened to Sandmans thread, he was right after few months my scalp adjusted and I experienced growth.

Examples:
http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.co...in-humans.html

----------


## Plan C

> The problem most hairloss people face from tretinoin is panick, just like when I first used Promox I panicked and wanted to bin it! Until I listened to Sandmans thread, he was right after few months my scalp adjusted and I experienced growth.
> 
> Examples:
> http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.co...in-humans.html


 Should I not use Susan's stuff today to give my skin a chance to recover? It's visibly red and sore.

----------


## Jazz1

> Should I not use Susan's stuff today to give my skin a chance to recover? It's visibly red and sore.


 Give it a days rest, but don't apply neogenic where you use Susan's product around the temples.

----------


## Plan C

> Give it a days rest, but don't apply neogenic where you use Susan's product around the temples.


 I have to use Neogenic on my temples... I mix it with RU, which I can't afford to drop.

----------


## Jazz1

> I have to use Neogenic on my temples... I mix it with RU, which I can't afford to drop.


 I'm not stating drop your regime, just adjust your regime slightly away from the area you apply Susan's product until your scalp adjusts. Applying neogenic Ru mixture won't have any different effect if you apply slightly away from your temples  :Smile: .

----------


## Plan C

> I'm not stating drop your regime, just adjust your regime slightly away from the area you apply Susan's product until your scalp adjusts. Applying neogenic Ru mixture won't have any different effect if you apply slightly away from your temples .


 Didn't want to miss my daily RU application so I used Neogenic on the sore areas. Most pain I've ever been in. Won't be doing that again haha!

----------


## Jazz1

> Didn't want to miss my daily RU application so I used Neogenic on the sore areas. Most pain I've ever been in. Won't be doing that again haha!


 Trust me when I say I had the same feeling when starting Promox everything was good until my evening application of regaine foam over the areas I applied Promox. The dam Regaine stung so bad I panicked, than read its the tretinoin. I carried on and over the month or two my scalp adjusted to the tretinoin and I also started seeing results around 3rd month loads of baby hairs sprouting around the hairline  :Smile: .

Now I don't have any issues even when applying Regaine night use, but recently I started using Susan's product very slightly on the crown to maximise more growth but more on my temples. Eveytime I apply my Regaine on the crown and temples it only stings on the crown lol because it's not used to the tretinoin in that area. So overtime my crown will also adjust to the tretinoin.

----------


## inbrugge

If I want to order a second batch of Susan's product but make a modification, do I have to get a new prescription? I.e. I wanna remove or significantly lower fin amount in my product? 

I understand if I wanna increase it, I should get a new prescription. But for lowering our, I should be ok, right?

----------


## Parsia

> If I want to order a second batch of Susan's product but make a modification, do I have to get a new prescription? I.e. I wanna remove or significantly lower fin amount in my product? 
> 
> I understand if I wanna increase it, I should get a new prescription. But for lowering our, I should be ok, right?


 Hi Inbrugge , I have a question , what was your experience after use susan product for the first batch ? Does it make any regrowth or difference than normal minoxidil? Sorry if I don't answer your question because I don't know., just curious about results.

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## Jazz1

> If I want to order a second batch of Susan's product but make a modification, do I have to get a new prescription? I.e. I wanna remove or significantly lower fin amount in my product? 
> 
> I understand if I wanna increase it, I should get a new prescription. But for lowering our, I should be ok, right?


 
You don't need a new prescription if your lowering the dosage, only I you increase you need a higher dosage. I would go for 0.05% or 0.025% finesteride until your body adjusts as 0.1% maybe too high for now  :Smile: .

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## doke

Hi jazz just had an email from tony at hairgrowth md and it says they are no longer going to take prescriptions from doctors and mightbe going to resell promox and remox so are they going to get there own medical doc to prescribe for us?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi jazz just had an email from tony at hairgrowth md and it says they are no longer going to take prescriptions from doctors and mightbe going to resell promox and remox so are they going to get there own medical doc to prescribe for us?


 I really do not know what they are doing, last email Dorrie sent me was they not working with  any Doctors. Any chance you can post it up here? Email them back please and ask them as I had no luck with response?

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## Jazz1

When all this Happend I found them a doctor before finding Susan and this was the response i got!

"There is only one way to get pharmaceutical medication to treat hair loss. Any person that wishes to get medication...needs to go to the doctor. Im so sorry but we are not hiring or working with any physician. Our website will be up soon. Keep checking back. Thank you."

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## buck

Two questions….

#1) I'm wondering if anyone ordered the Acetyl Glutathione for the extra $50

#2) Is Susan's the same amount as Dr. Klein's? They're saying that it should last two months, but I don't think my Dr. Klein's lasted that long. Wondering if I'm using too much? How does it last for everyone else?

I just ordered 15% minoxidil for $89.

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## Jazz1

I'm going to order Glutathione with 3% biotin for that price on my next order so I will let you know how well it helps etc. She did state it would be a seperate lotion for that price with added biotn.

Dr kleins 60ml use to last me about 2 months all depends how much was squirted through the pump. Susan's product I use a 1ml dropper, some days I have used 0.50ml and some days 1ml both seem effective but 1ml covers more main areas.

I ordered the exact same as Dr kleins and it has been doing a superb job so far, no scalp itch no Hairloss everything seems to be working. I believe if you added hydrocortisone the mixture is thicker. 

What ingredients did you add on your lotion? And what products did you use from Dr Klein?

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## Parsia

> Two questions….
> 
> #1) I'm wondering if anyone ordered the Acetyl Glutathione for the extra $50
> 
> #2) Is Susan's the same amount as Dr. Klein's? They're saying that it should last two months, but I don't think my Dr. Klein's lasted that long. Wondering if I'm using too much? How does it last for everyone else?
> 
> I just ordered 15% minoxidil for $89.


 I know I shouldn't answer your question by a question ! lol , But I just like to hear more from patients who got result from DR.KLEIN , I know jazz got very good result. but how about you buck? Do you think you got more result than minoxidil 5 %? Thanks.

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## Seuxin

Hello,

Is there a way to buy a Retinoid cream in order to gain new hair on temples ? Or...bad idea ?

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## Johns33

> Two questions….
> 
> #1) I'm wondering if anyone ordered the Acetyl Glutathione for the extra $50
> 
> #2) Is Susan's the same amount as Dr. Klein's? They're saying that it should last two months, but I don't think my Dr. Klein's lasted that long. Wondering if I'm using too much? How does it last for everyone else?
> 
> I just ordered 15% minoxidil for $89.


 good questions id like to know also

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## Justinian

Hey Jazz, thanks for organizing this for everyone.

Do you know if there is any problem ordering this with only a handful of the ingredients? I want to try just azelaic acid, finasteride, biotin, vitamin e, and grape seed, as a DHT blocking formula (possibly adding minoxidil in later on). 

I'm also thinking about getting a before/after DHT test to see if the fin is being absorbed.

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## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, thanks for organizing this for everyone.
> 
> Do you know if there is any problem ordering this with only a handful of the ingredients? I want to try just azelaic acid, finasteride, biotin, vitamin e, and grape seed, as a DHT blocking formula (possibly adding minoxidil in later on). 
> 
> I'm also thinking about getting a before/after DHT test to see if the fin is being absorbed.


 Anything can be formulated by Susan it's just a matter of getting the prescription from The Medical Wellnes Center. What are you currently using now?

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## doke

I have contacted the medical centre and susan and had no reply to making a lewenberg sensitive  formula which is 2% minoxidil plus tretinoin in a spray bottle?

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## Justinian

> Anything can be formulated by Susan it's just a matter of getting the prescription from The Medical Wellnes Center. What are you currently using now?


 Just nizoral. But I am getting PRP done in a few weeks. I really want to split up when I start the topical formula and PRP, in order to gauge effectiveness of each, but I'd have to wait a while for that.

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## LeonardoD

Do we have any scientific reports to support that this solution is working or is it entirely based on silly forum anecdotes and the producers recommendations?

Do you have any scientific reports supporting that a higher concentration of minoxidil is more successful? I'm quite sure I read a few studies implying that anything above 5% isn't going to be significantly better if any at all. It's only oral minoxidil that is superior to the regular topical solution.

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## johnnyboots

Hey jazz ordered the aceytl gluthione from Susan and reordered my lotions.dropped your name lol

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## Jazz1

> I have contacted the medical centre and susan and had no reply to making a lewenberg sensitive  formula which is 2% minoxidil plus tretinoin in a spray bottle?


 I tried calling Susan today she's away till next week, Dr kadz is always busy and she only prescribes medication not formulates them. I will give her a call for you on Monday or send her an email, I'm sure she can formulate it for you  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

> Just nizoral. But I am getting PRP done in a few weeks. I really want to split up when I start the topical formula and PRP, in order to gauge effectiveness of each, but I'd have to wait a while for that.


 What formula or ingredients do you want to use? The same ingredients I'm using like Promox? I would not jump on 15% minoxidil if you have not use it before, I advise starting on a 5% mixture and again if you have not use finesteride I suggest using a lower dosage in the formula until you build tolerance and let your body adjust.

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## Jazz1

> Hey jazz ordered the aceytl gluthione from Susan and reordered my lotions.dropped your name lol


 Keep me updated please on Glutathione as I will order that on my next order, did you add biotiin to the mixture? think It was same price and biotin helps thicken the follicles.

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## buck

Parsia, I didn't notice a big change going to 15%. With 15%, though, I only apply once a day.

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## Jazz1

> Do we have any scientific reports to support that this solution is working or is it entirely based on silly forum anecdotes and the producers recommendations?
> 
> Do you have any scientific reports supporting that a higher concentration of minoxidil is more successful? I'm quite sure I read a few studies implying that anything above 5% isn't going to be significantly better if any at all. It's only oral minoxidil that is superior to the regular topical solution.


 
I do not have any evidence nope, but Dr Klein has proved his claims by his product and years and years of the clients he built. I speak highly for the mixture because it works well for me, Chris my friend on hairlosshelp tried every minoxidil on the market no success, until he started Promox DMI 10% this year and he started getting regrowth.

On the plus note the mixture of ingredients are not snake oil rubbish, it contains finesteride, azelaic acid, tretinoin, progesterone, biotinoyl Tripeptide all know to do the following:


Minoxidil - hair growth stimulant

Tretinoin - enhance penetration

Hydrocortisone - anti-inflammatory

Azelaic Acid - DHT inhibitor

Progesterone - Anti-androgen

Spironolactone - Anti-androgen


Dr Richard Lee also proved his mixture of high grade minoxidil concusion to be very effective than standard 5% crap.

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## Jazz1

> Parsia, I didn't notice a big change going to 15%. With 15%, though, I only apply once a day.


 What did you use from Dr Klein? I found Dr kleins 10% DMI prescription spray to be more effective than the 15% lotion, maybe because the spray would cover the whole scalp very easy.

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## johnnyboots

> Keep me updated please on Glutathione as I will order that on my next order, did you add biotiin to the mixture? think It was same price and biotin helps thicken the follicles.


  Yes got it with biotin,she said use it once a  day prior to using minoxdil.I will keep u updated,and thanks again.

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## hellohair

is there any way to order Dr. Klein's product without prescription/consultation?

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## buck

> What did you use from Dr Klein? I found Dr kleins 10% DMI prescription spray to be more effective than the 15% lotion, maybe because the spray would cover the whole scalp very easy.


 Now you tell me! lol I was using the 15% lotion/ cream.

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## Parsia

> is there any way to order Dr. Klein's product without prescription/consultation?


 Thats what I'm looking for that too, So far I think the answer is no , but we may wait to see whats his website would be offer in the future ! If there is any.  anyone have any suggestion?

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## Jazz1

> Yes got it with biotin,she said use it once a  day prior to using minoxdil.I will keep u updated,and thanks again.


 Keep me updated please if the vellus hairs thicken up from the biotin  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

> is there any way to order Dr. Klein's product without prescription/consultation?


 Currently there's is no way to obtain Dr kleins product without a Doctor prescribing them, also they told me they no longer selling 15% minoxidil.

Although Doke has the email from Dr kleins office they might start selling Promox again, but currently they not even taking any prescriptions for the prescription formula.

This is the only thread to help the people in need of the formula, I made the switch to Susans formula hence me creating this thread to help others. I have nothing but positive words for her formula because it works exactly the same as Dr kleins Promox 15% lotion.

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## Jazz1

> Now you tell me! lol I was using the 15% lotion/ cream.


 I was using both first year and half I used the Promox lotion 15%, earlier this year I added the Promox kit which consisted of the 10% DMI sprays aswell.

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## Jazz1

> Thats what I'm looking for that too, So far I think the answer is no , but we may wait to see whats his website would be offer in the future ! If there is any.  anyone have any suggestion?


 Doke has the email, Tony replied:

"Hi 
I know Dr. Klein would want us to keep helping his patients. It’s a work he dedicated his life to.* We are in the process of negotiations so we should know more very soon. Thanks for hanging in there with us.
Thanks
Tony"

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## Plan C

> What did you use from Dr Klein? I found Dr kleins 10% DMI prescription spray to be more effective than the 15% lotion, maybe because the spray would cover the whole scalp very easy.


 Then why did you tell me to get 15% minox haha!

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## Jazz1

> Then why did you tell me to get 15% minox haha!


 That's because Susan does not sell the spray type formula like Dr Klein, the lotion works the same as the spray. The only benefit I feel to the spray that Dr Klein sold was it would cover the whole area of the scalp and much easier to apply.

Susan's product works exactly the same, the only downside i wish she could have sold the kits like Dr klein.

I use to apply the 15% lotion in the morning and 10% DMI spray at night from Dr Kleins kits.

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## doke

Hi all just had a reply from tony and they are saying that Dr Klines promox formulas will be available to order again on a patient by patient order.

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## Jazz1

> Hi all just had a reply from tony and they are saying that Dr Klines promox formulas will be available to order again on a patient by patient order.


 Only ex patients allowed to order?

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## doke

I think that would be shooting themselves in the foot if they did that, i think they will be letting everyone order once they access you as i read it.

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## Parsia

> I think that would be shooting themselves in the foot if they did that, i think they will be letting everyone order once they access you as i read it.


 Thats a really good news doke , thanks for giving us update , thats exactly what I was waiting for , to buy his products from his phamracists with more variety . I'd appreciate it. Please give us updated , I sent them email a few days ago but didn't get respond.

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## Jazz1

That's great news, on the other hand I feel Susan's lotion alone does the job as I seem to be holding my hair from just morning lotion application.

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## inbrugge

hey jazz,

i had written you an email. thanks for your response. i'm back on susan's stuff again now trying to control how much i apply. hopefully this time i won't have sides.

anyways, i was wondering what do you know about copper peptides. is it worth trying? is there a way I can include it in susan's mixture? thank you

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## Jazz1

> hey jazz,
> 
> i had written you an email. thanks for your response. i'm back on susan's stuff again now trying to control how much i apply. hopefully this time i won't have sides.
> 
> anyways, i was wondering what do you know about copper peptides. is it worth trying? is there a way I can include it in susan's mixture? thank you


 Ok good luck keep me posted I think you will be ok, copper peptides are great but tricomin is very weak. I still have some folligen cream, this stuff made my vellus hairs thicker but I could not handle the sides IE stings like hell! Also when I had an AA patch on my beard folligen turned my fine white hairs into thick terminal hairs in a few weeks. It's weird it does not sting on my face! Only the scalp.

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## inbrugge

and you said it would have been better for me if i added progesterone? my main concern with fin, more than erectile problems, is growing man tits. that's the reason why initially stopped, because i was having puffy nipples, so how would progesterone, used by transgenders, NOT make that worse?

Thank you

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## Jazz1

> and you said it would have been better for me if i added progesterone? my main concern with fin, more than erectile problems, is growing man tits. that's the reason why initially stopped, because i was having puffy nipples, so how would progesterone, used by transgenders, NOT make that worse?
> 
> Thank you


 
I really would not know bro, I was told progesterone is in both men and woman, it is a good hormone as we age it depletes.

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## Jazz1

Any updates how you guys are doing who made the switch? Sorry I been busy at work hence why I have not replied much.

Some days I use 0.50ml/0.75ml rather than 1ml and it still does the job, no scalp itch, no Hairloss seems to be working exactly the same at even that low application, saves me money  :Smile: .

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## inbrugge

i'm back on it. This is my second week. Not having any over the top side effects, obviously not as strong as I used to be downstairs and I'm still concerned about if I'm getting any gyno effects. But I'm gonna try to stick this out this time. If this can hold me where I'm at for 2 years then I should be ok. I believe we will have some thing else by then, at least CB or Replicell or Histogen or something. My shedding hasn't stopped so far but I believe it should in a couple of days. 

Also, minox is giving my the shitty side effect of hair everywhere on my arms and hands and poor skin quality on my face. This really makes me wanna quit minox and just go on fin or ru alone. I have to remove the hair from my hands and the insides of my arms like every other day. They are like on crack, they grow so fast it's really crazy. It seems everytime I remove them, they grow back immideately. It feels like my body hair is absorbing ALL of the minox and leaving nothing fr my scalp lol.

I'm seriously considering a FUE this seriously ever in my life. I'm concerned though about when Replicel and other treatments come out with reversal, but I won't be able to restore my own natural hair line because I've altered it with Fue.

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## ADP

I ordered by way of a prescription from Susan but it was stopped at customs Canada and returned. Anyone have this issue? Anyone not have this issue from Canada?

Susan said she has other Canadian customers and didn't experience this problem before. I haven't either. How to resolve this problem? 

BTW - It was shipped with USPS then Canada Post

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## Jazz1

> i'm back on it. This is my second week. Not having any over the top side effects, obviously not as strong as I used to be downstairs and I'm still concerned about if I'm getting any gyno effects. But I'm gonna try to stick this out this time. If this can hold me where I'm at for 2 years then I should be ok. I believe we will have some thing else by then, at least CB or Replicell or Histogen or something. My shedding hasn't stopped so far but I believe it should in a couple of days. 
> 
> Also, minox is giving my the shitty side effect of hair everywhere on my arms and hands and poor skin quality on my face. This really makes me wanna quit minox and just go on fin or ru alone. I have to remove the hair from my hands and the insides of my arms like every other day. They are like on crack, they grow so fast it's really crazy. It seems everytime I remove them, they grow back immideately. It feels like my body hair is absorbing ALL of the minox and leaving nothing fr my scalp lol.
> 
> I'm seriously considering a FUE this seriously ever in my life. I'm concerned though about when Replicel and other treatments come out with reversal, but I won't be able to restore my own natural hair line because I've altered it with Fue.


 I hope the lowered dosage works out for you mate, think positive as you never know with Replicel in Japan things could fast forward.

Keep me updated and any help you need let me know, if I can help in any way from my knowledge I will. I would consider getting some Zinc and horny goat weed to help counter any side effects.

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## Jazz1

> I ordered by way of a prescription from Susan but it was stopped at customs Canada and returned. Anyone have this issue? Anyone not have this issue from Canada?
> 
> Susan said she has other Canadian customers and didn't experience this problem before. I haven't either. How to resolve this problem? 
> 
> BTW - It was shipped with USPS then Canada Post


 
That's so not good, have you contacted them to make an enquiry?

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## ADP

Yes, we are going back and forth with what to do next but running out of options.

If it went thru for others, it would be nice to know what was different. Maybe it was a different courier service or they did something that I can't think of. The issue is that its a prescription drug and that can only be imported by someone like a doctor or pharmacist or clinic ....

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## Jazz1

> Yes, we are going back and forth with what to do next but running out of options.
> 
> If it went thru for others, it would be nice to know what was different. Maybe it was a different courier service or they did something that I can't think of. The issue is that its a prescription drug and that can only be imported by someone like a doctor or pharmacist or clinic ....


 
That's Crazy! Mine got stopped in the uk by customs, they released it but charged me a Fee! I don't get why they sending it back if you have had a prescription prescribed.

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## Parsia

Folks . Have a good news that DR.Klein website looks updated ( not completely ) for new orders , So I think if you get patient you can get the promox again . Here is the link : http://www.remoxotc.info/

Again you can't order it now , But I just track their website to see if any changes happens . If you go to his website you don't see any change but you should click to order and then new pages coming for you. Just wanna give you update.

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## Jazz1

Hi guys I got an email from The Medical Wellness center and they offering all you guys a discount and a chance to try their prouducts from Susan.

Details are below  :Smile: :


"I want to thank you for all your support*

I would like others to have the same opportunity and then make an informed decision. * I know once anyone learns to love a product, one becomes very loyal and reluctant to try anything else*

I would like to give others the opportunity to try the products and then make a decision for themselves*

I'm offering a special that can start immediately and for the whole month of December. * *Anyone that is a former Dr Klein patient* I am offering a FREE introductory three month consult and Susan is offering a 20% discount on all products on the customized minoxidil website*

They just have to make sure they clearly indicate on form that they are former dr Klein patients or they learned about this promotion from Jazz either directly or indirectly by reading your posts*

I'm so confident in the program I offer and that the products Susan compounds are superior , I want others to have the opportunity to experience the products and make their own decision.*

Thanks again for all your support*

The PROMOTION code for the DISCOUNT is:

"HOLIDAY"

Details to order:
http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com/

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## Plan C

Jazz, quick question - did you shed at all when you first switched to Klein's formula and did it make your scalp itch? Finding it difficult to distinguish between shedding/ irritation and genuine hair loss.

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## Jazz1

> Jazz, quick question - did you shed at all when you first switched to Klein's formula and did it make your scalp itch? Finding it difficult to distinguish between shedding/ irritation and genuine hair loss.


 I never really noticed apart from growth and thickness was very noticeable in the first 3 months.

Why what's wrong?

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## lilpauly

Thanks jazz I'm going to give this s try . Which formula do u use ?

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## Plan C

> I never really noticed apart from growth and thickness was very noticeable in the first 3 months.
> 
> Why what's wrong?


 Getting dandruff and light shedding.

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## Jazz1

> Getting dandruff and light shedding.


 You stop DUT? If not could be minor shed from the lotion which would be expected when using higher minoxidol, or seasonal just ride it out bro.

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## Jazz1

> Thanks jazz I'm going to give this s try . Which formula do u use ?


 The same as Dr kleins lotion mixture bro, they can add small dose hydorcortisone for more growth. 

Let me know if you need help bro I will always have time for you, you are the one who gave me all this knowledge and help over the years  :Smile: .

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## Plan C

> You stop DUT? If not could be minor shed from the lotion which would be expected when using higher minoxidol, or seasonal just ride it out bro.


 Using dut every other day now. Doubt that would initiate a shed this quickly.

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## Jazz1

Probably the lotion or seasonal shed, ride it out i reckon you will be fine  :Smile: .

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## lilpauly

> I use the following also I had major sides on FIN the key is making your body adjust I can guide you in more detail just email me jass897@hotmail.com.
> 
> The ingredients I use are: Jazz can she adjust ingredients ? 
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finesteride
> 1.5% azelaic acid
> 0.025% progesterone
> 0.25% tretinoin 
> ...


  jazz can she chane the Ingredients ? I will send u a email

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## Plan C

> Probably the lotion or seasonal shed, ride it out i reckon you will be fine .


 Out of interest, what order do you use your treatments? I currently take a shower, apply RU, apply the 15% forumla later and then finally apply Regaine. However, the Regaine tends to sting my scalp a little using it soon after the 15% stuff.

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## Jazz1

> jazz can she chane the Ingredients ? I will send u a email


 Yes bro she can formulate anything  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

> Out of interest, what order do you use your treatments? I currently take a shower, apply RU, apply the 15% forumla later and then finally apply Regaine. However, the Regaine tends to sting my scalp a little using it soon after the 15% stuff.


 I shower than dry my hair, apply regaine foam and after about 10 minutes I apply the lotion in the morning. At night I apply regaine foam but have no stinging, at the start I had stinging which takes a few months for your scalp to adjust due to the tretinoin  :Smile: .

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## Jazz1

Update from an email I received from The Medical Wellnes Center for anyone looking to order and gain the discount:


Hi Jazz,
We are receiving a couple of the free trial consults, but they are really submitting the wrong form.** We have always had a minoxidil link in the middle of the page for our clients, but we put a special link for Dr. Klein patients and the very top of the page www.medicalwellnesscenter.com. And now it says "Holiday Special"** - the direct link is 
http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html, but the main page they go to is www.medicalwellnesscenter.com and then click on the first Holiday Special Dr. Klein link.*** 

The reason this is important is we offer more options and multiple prescriptions for one consult fee ( or free trial) for Jazz referrals and Dr. Klein patients.
*
Thank you,
Dr. J Katz

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## Plan C

> I shower than dry my hair, apply regaine foam and after about 10 minutes I apply the lotion in the morning. At night I apply regaine foam but have no stinging, at the start I had stinging which takes a few months for your scalp to adjust due to the tretinoin .


 Okay, thanks. I may try using Regaine foam before the lotion and see how that goes.

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## Parsia

> Update from an email I H
> *
> Thank you,
> Dr. J Katz


 Hi Jazz , whats going on bro ? How have you been?
So there is not any need to pay for prescription anymore ? and the price for your lotion ( Promox DMI ) would be something aroun 70$? 
And you have any update from dr.klein products coming back?

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## Plan C

Jazz - I think it was you who recommended getting 925ml Revita bottles to save money. I got my first one today and the shampoo is murkier in colour and much thicker than the stuff that comes in the normal 180ml bottle. Have you noticed this before?

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## thechamp

Jazz do you think Tracy could mix up a topical sequol for us join the s equol thread please ?

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## Jazz1

> Jazz - I think it was you who recommended getting 925ml Revita bottles to save money. I got my first one today and the shampoo is murkier in colour and much thicker than the stuff that comes in the normal 180ml bottle. Have you noticed this before?


 Where did you buy your bottle? I can take pictures of mine if you like? Also bare in mind your scalp and hair needs to be wet, apply shampoo to your palm and wet some water mixture than apply on your wet scalp this will help lather easily.

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## Jazz1

> Jazz do you think Tracy could mix up a topical sequol for us join the s equol thread please ?


 Who's Tracey lol? Link me bro.

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## johnnyboots

Jazz if u contact Susan about a s-equol product let me know I would be intersted.thanks

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## Jazz1

> Jazz if u contact Susan about a s-equol product let me know I would be intersted.thanks


 Ok who's in charge of this S-equol? How many people interested? If you can create a thread I can than contact her, the more people you have I'm sure she will do a good price for everyone.

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## lilpauly

> Ok who's in charge of this S-equol? How many people interested? If you can create a thread I can than contact her, the more people you have I'm sure she will do a good price for everyone.


  sikh prince ghk to!

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## Jazz1

> sikh prince ghk to!


 I use Tricomin bro, Folligen is better but burns my skin lol, I joined Stop AGA today. The admin wanted me to join ask my advice, you still on there? I'm going tell him you the main man who helped me  :Smile: .

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## Plan C

> Where did you buy your bottle? I can take pictures of mine if you like? Also bare in mind your scalp and hair needs to be wet, apply shampoo to your palm and wet some water mixture than apply on your wet scalp this will help lather easily.


 I bought it at luxuriouslook.co.uk I'm sure I've read elsewhere of other people finding that sometimes their Revita is bright orange and other times it's murky and thick. Apparently they have issues with their quality control.

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## lilpauly

> I bought it at luxuriouslook.co.uk I'm sure I've read elsewhere of other people finding that sometimes their Revita is bright orange and other times it's murky and thick. Apparently they have issues with their quality control.


  ds labs changes formula

----------


## Jazz1

> I use Tricomin bro, Folligen is better but burns my skin lol, I joined Stop AGA today. The admin wanted me to join ask my advice, you still on there? I'm going tell him you the main man who helped me .


 


> I bought it at luxuriouslook.co.uk I'm sure I've read elsewhere of other people finding that sometimes their Revita is bright orange and other times it's murky and thick. Apparently they have issues with their quality control.


 Sounds legit, I never had issues with mine always done the job plus smells superb. Anyways how is your hair now?

----------


## Plan C

> Sounds legit, I never had issues with mine always done the job plus smells superb. Anyways how is your hair now?


 I've only been using Susan's lotion for a month plus I've just switched to using RU in ethanol/pg rather than neogenic so I'm gonna give it a month and then give an update.

----------


## Jazz1

> I've only been using Susan's lotion for a month plus I've just switched to using RU in ethanol/pg rather than neogenic so I'm gonna give it a month and then give an update.


 Takes 3/6 months minimum to see any type of results, although mine were within 3 months when I first used Dr kleins lotion.

----------


## Jazz1

> Update from an email I received from The Medical Wellnes Center for anyone looking to order and gain the discount:
> 
> 
> Hi Jazz,
> We are receiving a couple of the free trial consults, but they are really submitting the wrong form.** We have always had a minoxidil link in the middle of the page for our clients, but we put a special link for Dr. Klein patients and the very top of the page www.medicalwellnesscenter.com. And now it says "Holiday Special"** - the direct link is 
> http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html, but the main page they go to is www.medicalwellnesscenter.com and then click on the first Holiday Special Dr. Klein link.*** 
> 
> The reason this is important is we offer more options and multiple prescriptions for one consult fee ( or free trial) for Jazz referrals and Dr. Klein patients.
> *
> ...


 Bump this they are doing free consults for certain period anyone interested.

----------


## Plan C

> Takes 3/6 months minimum to see any type of results, although mine were within 3 months when I first used Dr kleins lotion.


 I'm sure I've asked you this before, perhaps even in this thread, but do you use susan's lotion or regaine first during the day?

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm sure I've asked you this before, perhaps even in this thread, but do you use susan's lotion or regaine first during the day?


 I apply regaine first and then wait 10 minutes before applying the lotion on the temples only, the foam is used on the whole scalp.

----------


## Eire1980

Jazz - i am thinking about trying this - i do have a fear of fin but my crown is starting to show now so thinking of taking the leap...Do we still need to go down the prescription route to obtain.
i would like to start with 0.25% Fin is this possible?...appreciate the feedback - thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz - i am thinking about trying this - i do have a fear of fin but my crown is starting to show now so thinking of taking the leap...Do we still need to go down the prescription route to obtain.
> i would like to start with 0.25% Fin is this possible?...appreciate the feedback - thanks


 The prescription route is currently free and Susan is doing 20% of at the moment, only few months I think. Yes you can change the dosages with them just write the correct dosage when you fill out the prescription.

----------


## Hicks

I haven't heard lots about this compound but I went ahead and completed the form.  

They need to make a link for best selling product. I found this part confusing. Holiday is the code.

Jazz can you make procedure so if a death or shut down happens we could find a new compounding and Doctor for prescription faster? 

they also offered Latisse .03 separate from Susan.

----------


## Jazz1

> I haven't heard lots about this compound but I went ahead and completed the form.  
> 
> They need to make a link for best selling product. I found this part confusing. Holiday is the code.
> 
> Jazz can you make procedure so if a death or shut down happens we could find a new compounding and Doctor for prescription faster? 
> 
> they also offered Latisse .03 separate from Susan.


 Hey I know it's a bit confusing they giving free consults currently for holiday special, I have found another doctor in emergency I have the website at home. Both doctors use Susan as their compounding pharmacist, the main concern is the doctor as there are so many compounding pharmacist in US. So currently we have emergency options just incase, what ingredients did you add in your lotion?

----------


## lilpauly

Mine arrived today , I like it ! Moving forward I will have ghk copper peotides in mine , ect.

----------


## Hicks

> what ingredients did you add in your lotion?


 pretty much everything except grape seed. I wasn't sure about that. I'll let you know when it comes in.  I didn't know there was a difference between lotion and cream. i had to get clarification that azelaic acid is in the cream.

----------


## Jazz1

> Mine arrived today , I like it ! Moving forward I will have ghk copper peotides in mine , ect.


 What did you add bro, you have e most amount of hair lol you seriously don't need anything else, I would have just added tretinoin. Oh by the way bro i started again with those oils as my female friend is getting regrowth from oils, synergy effects work you were right.

----------


## Jazz1

You go with 15% minoxidl? Where are you looking to apply temple region? I avoided grape seed as its probably weak DHT, hydorcortisone is a better option with tretinoin as I went with the exact ingredients as Dr Kleins lotion.

----------


## Hicks

Yes 15%

----------


## lilpauly

> What did you add bro, you have e most amount of hair lol you seriously don't need anything else, I would have just added tretinoin. Oh by the way bro i started again with those oils as my female friend is getting regrowth from oils, synergy effects work you were right.


 vitamin e.01%, and gs 1%, i like it because its a cream and it absorbs very well. i will talk to susan and hopefully she can add ghk for me the next time, i hate using kirkland mixed ghk in the morning!  jazz im hoping susan can get me duta pills! i cant get them from inhouse anymore!!! i hope i can get the generic to save money, i  need to call her on monday. i also got medicated toothpaste

----------


## Parsia

> vitamin e.01%, and gs 1%, i like it because its a cream and it absorbs very well. i will talk to susan and hopefully she can add ghk for me the next time, i hate using kirkland mixed ghk in the morning!  jazz im hoping susan can get me duta pills! i cant get them from inhouse anymore!!! i hope i can get the generic to save money, i  need to call her on monday. i also got medicated toothpaste


 Hi Lilpauly , You can take Dut from all day chemist , they have fin also with the lowest price which I have ever found , I got my fin from them and really satisfied from their service. I know you live in NY , I'm living in U.S too. Good luck bro.

----------


## Jazz1

> Yes 15%


 Keep me updated how things go, what's your current regime?

----------


## Jazz1

> vitamin e.01%, and gs 1%, i like it because its a cream and it absorbs very well. i will talk to susan and hopefully she can add ghk for me the next time, i hate using kirkland mixed ghk in the morning!  jazz im hoping susan can get me duta pills! i cant get them from inhouse anymore!!! i hope i can get the generic to save money, i  need to call her on monday. i also got medicated toothpaste


 Hey bro I'm sure she can as The medcial wellness states they can prescribe DUT, I had another guy update me his hair is growing back and has stopped falling from the lotion.  I'm thankfull to God bro I found them as I had seriously run out of Promox when Dr Klein passed away, Susan saved me  :Smile: .

You bro are a legend without you I would be lost, you gave me this knowledge about synergy effect you were 100% right, I never doubted you from day one when some people laughed at you. Oh by they way I joined SAGA you see my thread? Admin asked me to join very nice I love it  :Smile: .

Oh bro I started drinking Mixture of Honey, Tumeric and black seed. These help with internal inflammation and nourish the hair  :Smile: .

----------


## lilpauly

> Hey bro I'm sure she can as The medcial wellness states they can prescribe DUT, I had another guy update me his hair is growing back and has stopped falling from the lotion.  I'm thankfull to God bro I found them as I had seriously run out of Promox when Dr Klein passed away, Susan saved me .
> 
> You bro are a legend without you I would be lost, you gave me this knowledge about synergy effect you were 100% right, I never doubted you from day one when some people laughed at you. Oh by they way I joined SAGA you see my thread? Admin asked me to join very nice I love it .
> 
> Oh bro I started drinking Mixture of Honey, Tumeric and black seed. These help with internal inflammation and nourish the hair .


  awesome jazz! I will contact her , I'm also going to start taking indian herbs for my health ,

----------


## Jazz1

One guy who ordered from her recently told me he read a review on her site and I checked, she formulated topical DUT for someone see here;

"I just wanted to write and let you know that the dutasteride topical you made for me was extremely effective.* I wanted to drag it out so I applied it once per day with minoxidil for the other application (I had been using minoxidil twice per day).* Within the 60 days, I have regrown an astounding amount of hair, I kid you not.* My temples are substantially fuller and what was once a bit of a bald spot is no more. Just wanted you to know that your efforts were worth it.* I have learned of a few people who are mixing one capsule per day with 30 ml of aloe and using it with good results.* I'll give that a try to see if I can keep what your mixture has given me and perhaps grow more. 
Again, thank you... 

A.S."

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/hairloss.html

I wonder if it's very effective?

----------


## inbrugge

> vitamin e.01%, and gs 1%, i like it because its a cream and it absorbs very well. i will talk to susan and hopefully she can add ghk for me the next time, i hate using kirkland mixed ghk in the morning!  jazz im hoping susan can get me duta pills! i cant get them from inhouse anymore!!! i hope i can get the generic to save money, i  need to call her on monday. i also got medicated toothpaste


 What is gs?

I want to make a compound with minoxidil 7.5%, tretinoin, ghk, vitamin b12, c, and e. 

Is this feasible? Will that many things mess up stability and effectiveness of the lotion? 

Are topical vitamins effective?

----------


## Hicks

> pretty much everything except grape seed. I wasn't sure about that. I'll let you know when it comes in.  I didn't know there was a difference between lotion and cream. i had to get clarification that azelaic acid is in the cream.


 Make sure azeliac acid is added to your product if you want it. It's my understanding that it's always added to the liquid not the lotion or cream. I think there was a communication breakdown on that.  Either way always confirm the ingredients you want are in the product.  Mine should be in around the first of the year.

----------


## lilpauly

> What is gs?
> 
> I want to make a compound with minoxidil 7.5%, tretinoin, ghk, vitamin b12, c, and e. 
> 
> Is this feasible? Will that many things mess up stability and effectiveness of the lotion? Grape seed 
> 
> Are topical vitamins effective?


  gs = grapeseed

----------


## inbrugge

> gs = grapeseed


 thanks, bro. i'm about to order a new lotion so can you please help me out real quick?

1. i wanna include vitamin c and e into my regimen. do you think that will work topically? or i should use them only as oral supplements?

2. what do you know about hyarulic acid? is that good for the hair in long term?

3. do you think a mixture of minoxidil, tretinoin, vitamin c, vitamin e will be good? or will that be too much for one mixture and mess up the efficiency and stability of the lotion?

4. better to get cream or lotion? what the hell is the difference?

thank you

----------


## lilpauly

E


> thanks, bro. i'm about to order a new lotion so can you please help me out real quick?
> 
> 1. i wanna include vitamin c and e into my regimen. do you think that will work topically? or i should use them only as oral supplements?
> 
> 2. what do you know about hyarulic acid? is that good for the hair in long term?
> 
> 3. do you think a mixture of minoxidil, tretinoin, vitamin c, vitamin e will be good? or will that be too much for one mixture and mess up the efficiency and stability of the lotion?
> 
> 4. better to get cream or lotion? what the hell is the difference?
> ...


 1. I think taking then oral or topical will be both effective  
2. Never heard of it bro3. You can mix all together with no problems . 4. I'm not sure what the difference is. I think I got the cream . Lol .

----------


## Hicks

Lotion is in a pump bottle and cream is in a jar from what I gathered.  Not sure what application is better or easier to work with.  Pretty sure I got the cream.  I was in a hurry when I called.

----------


## Jazz1

> Lotion is in a pump bottle and cream is in a jar from what I gathered.  Not sure what application is better or easier to work with.  Pretty sure I got the cream.  I was in a hurry when I called.


 
You received your order yet? Measuring spoon or syringe are cheap get either one depending what she sent you.

----------


## Hicks

> You received your order yet? Measuring spoon or syringe are cheap get either one depending what she sent you.


 Should be in next week.  I'm 2 hours from Pittsburgh, I should of jumped in my truck and picked it up.

----------


## Jazz1

> Should be in next week.  I'm 2 hours from Pittsburgh, I should of jumped in my truck and picked it up.


 Man your so lucky your local my bloody parcel took 3 weeks to the uk!

----------


## inbrugge

Guys,

What do you think about this mix? Will it be stable?

Minoxidil 7.5-10%
Tretinoin
Vitamin C
Vitamin E

One of Susan's contacts said they didn't have experience with adding Vitamin C, so they couldn't comment.

And what about Grape Seed Extract? Will that be good for the mixture as well? Does it stain or make the cream hard to use? 

If yall can help, I'll appreciate it. I need to get back on tretinoin and Minox >5% quick so I'm itching to put a new order in.

----------


## Seuxin

Hello,

I think it's compatible, yes.

No, i advice you to add :

-Taurine
-Azelaic Acid
-Adenosine
-Zinc Sulfate 

Second step is to find your vehicle ( maybe directly minox ! )
Third step....is not easy....is to find the right dosage per day ( how mg/day).

Let we know your result please  :Wink:

----------


## Jazz1

I will reply later  :Smile: .

----------


## johnnyboots

Gonna email Susan about adding those things.

----------


## Seuxin

About this Susan Topical, can we buy it directly, or, need it a prescription online ?
What's price for one month ?

Any link in order to buy ?

Thanks.

YES, susan could add this ( Vitamine C, E, zinc sulphate...)

----------


## Jazz1

> Update from an email I received from The Medical Wellnes Center for anyone looking to order and gain the discount:
> 
> 
> Hi Jazz,
> We are receiving a couple of the free trial consults, but they are really submitting the wrong form.** We have always had a minoxidil link in the middle of the page for our clients, but we put a special link for Dr. Klein patients and the very top of the page www.medicalwellnesscenter.com. And now it says "Holiday Special"** - the direct link is 
> 
> http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html, 
> 
> but the main page they go to is www.medicalwellnesscenter.com and then click on the first Holiday Special Dr. Klein link.*** 
> ...


 
Happy New year guys,

Bump, I kindly asked them to extend the period for another week and they agreed, so anyone looking to order take advantage as I'm placing mine again. Also to add don't forget to put HOLIDAY as the code otherwise they will charge for the consult  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

I placed another order today for my lotions I'm very happy, I also bought seperate lotions Glutathione, vitamin E and vitamin c.

----------


## Jazz1

> Update from an email I received from The Medical Wellnes Center for anyone looking to order and gain the discount:
> 
> 
> Hi Jazz,
> We are receiving a couple of the free trial consults, but they are really submitting the wrong form.** We have always had a minoxidil link in the middle of the page for our clients, but we put a special link for Dr. Klein patients and the very top of the page www.medicalwellnesscenter.com. And now it says "Holiday Special"** - the direct link is 
> 
> 
> http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html
> 
> ...


 
Also to add they have extended Holiday special until end of January, don't forget to add HOLIDAY as the code for free consult.

----------


## abrorcasanova

Jazz1, what would you suggest would be a good lotion formula excluding Fin? I am allergic to pg, so anything without is a welcome thought!

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz1, what would you suggest would be a good lotion formula excluding Fin? I am allergic to pg, so anything without is a welcome thought!


 How is your hairloss currently? Are you using anything? All depends on your case Susan has formulated stuff for previous clients I think she used Glycerin if I'm right, or you could add DMI.

----------


## abrorcasanova

unfortunately rapidly progressing, I had quite good results with Kirkland minox 5% but the flaking and itching was annoying as hell, then Kirkland foam made things worse, then due to circumstances for 1.5 month used 2% lost a lot of ground, now using Rogaine 5% and only keep losing hair, maybe its a new shedding period don't know. 

What is DMI?

----------


## lilpauly

^ I tried Kirkland Minox again recently and once again I got the flakes , and couldn't stop itching . I use susan lotion and its execellent

----------


## abrorcasanova

> ^ I tried Kirkland Minox again recently and once again I got the flakes , and couldn't stop itching . I use susan lotion and its execellent


 Lilpauly would you be able to give a suggestion what mix best to order? would 7% minox suffice, don't want 15% straight away? what can be added to that?

----------


## Jazz1

You do not intend to use Finesteride? Just minoxidil alone? Have you had any tests to determine your hairloss type?

----------


## Jazz1

Hi Guys just to bump this thread with some Vital information for people who are ordering or taking advantage of the Holiday special;

The Medical Wellnes Center have extend the Holiday special until end of January the code for free consult is "HOLIDAY" please follow the details below to take advantage.

Also please give Susan a call to check if they ship to your country, some people are filling out prescriptions and than later told they can not have the product shipped due to customs. 

I have spoken to Susan regarding certain countries effected and she stated if the customer is willing to order at their own risk than she would be willing to provide the product. Again please check if your country is effected before filling out any online prescription with The Medical Wellnes Center.

Here's a direct link for the Holiday special;

Update from an email I received from The Medical Wellnes Center for anyone looking to order and gain the discount:


Hi Jazz,
We are receiving a couple of the free trial consults, but they are really submitting the wrong form.** We have always had a minoxidil link in the middle of the page for our clients, but we put a special link for Dr. Klein patients and the very top of the page www.medicalwellnesscenter.com. And now it says "Holiday Special"** - the direct link is 

http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html

but the main page they go to is www.medicalwellnesscenter.com and then click on the first Holiday Special Dr. Klein link.*** 

The reason this is important is we offer more options and multiple prescriptions for one consult fee ( or free trial) for Jazz referrals and Dr. Klein patients.
*
Thank you,
Dr. J Katz

----------


## abrorcasanova

> You do not intend to use Finesteride? Just minoxidil alone? Have you had any tests to determine your hairloss type?


 Nope no test and I am nw2 with crown loss, not really want to try fin as I already got chronic prostate issues unfortunately. I am willing to try RU, but really want minox combo. 

Would you suggest anything? 

Thanks!

----------


## Jazz1

> Nope no test and I am nw2 with crown loss, not really want to try fin as I already got chronic prostate issues unfortunately. I am willing to try RU, but really want minox combo. 
> 
> Would you suggest anything? 
> 
> Thanks!


 RU58841 can be bought from Kane shop, I seriously would consider FIN first as even RU gave me side effects. What about trying a low dosage Finesteride? Something like 0.025%?

----------


## Jazz1

Another update email Susan sent me to help you guys, slight change:

Base formula:
Minoxidil (offered in 5%, 12.5%, 15% and 30%.)
AA 5%
RA 0.025%
Finasteride 0.1%
*
NOTES:
Minoxidil is available:
30% CREAM ONLY
12.5% LOTION ONLY
15% CREAM and LOTION ONLY
5% SPRAY LIQUID AND LOTION ONLY
NOTE: IN THE 5% SPRAY IS MINOXIDIL 5%, FINASTERIDE 0.1% AND AA 5%-NO OTHER ADDITIVES!!!!!
WE OFFER A 5% MINOXIDIL FOAM WITH NO ADDITIVES
*
General additives to everything BUT 5% spray liquid and foam are:
Progesterone 0.25%
Hydrocortisone 0.1% (NOT 1%)
BIOTIN 1.3%
DMI
*
Also another update:

MINOXIDIL AND ADDITIVES
The following are basic ingredients that have proven scientific validity in hair loss when applied topically:
 Minoxidil – while the exact mechanism of action is unclear, minoxidil is the gold standard ingredient for treating androgenic alopecia
 Finasteride – a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor, stops the conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone (DHT). *Added topically, finasteride works synergistically with the other ingredients to halt further hair loss and promote thickening and re-growth with lower incidence of systemic side effects than oral use
 Azelaic Acid – a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor, stops the conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone (DHT)
 Retinoic Acid (Tretinoin)– a vitamin A derivative, promotes growth and development of new skin and aids in absorption of other active ingredients
 Progesterone – a hormone naturally occurring in both men and women that acts as a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor
 Hydrocortisone – a corticosteroid that reduces inflammation, can be added if needed to prevent irritation from higher dose minoxidil
 Vitamin E – antioxidant and follicle softener, also increases blood circulation (all our minoxidil creams and lotions contain vitamin E at 0.1%)
 We do not recommend adding grape seed extract to a topical formulation because of concerns with staining and there is no scientific literature to prove efficacy.
***We recommend an oral grape seed extract supplement instead of topical use
*
In addition to our custom minoxidil formulations, we have a combination acetyl-glutathione and biotin liquid for daily use.
*
We are formulating 3 adjunct OTC topicals to be used before applying the Minoxidil:
Acetyl Glutathione with vitamin C and E.
Progesterone 3% leave-in treatment
Acetyl Glutathione 3% with Biotin 1.3%
*
 Biotin – a B vitamin that strengthens the hair from the root to increase hair anchoring and targets DHT to prevent hair loss
 Acetyl-Glutathione – potent anti-inflammatory and antioxidant, stimulates mitochondria, breaks down DHT, and detoxifies environmental xenoestrogens which are commonly found in fragrances, bath and body products, personal care products, and cleaning and laundry products.
*
*
Hair health involves the follicle. *1/3 of hair is in the growing phase, 1/3 is in hair loss phase, and 1/3 is in the process of development to maturity. *The goal is to protect the DNA and prevent free radicals from breaking down the cells in the follicle. *To that end we recommend use of antioxidants, SLS-free shampoo/conditioner (Check out our line of NON-TOXIC STIMULATING shampoos and conditioners on our hair loss page), and avoidance of pesticides/chemicals in food and water, and eating healthfully.
*
*
Oral supplements recommended for management of hair loss:
Murray Avenue Apothecary’s DHT/Hormone Balancer Caps-contains Saw Palmetto (alternative to finasteride) with other DHT balancing ingredients for hair loss and prostate health.
Grape seed extract – a concentrate of flavanoids, linoleic acid, vitamin E and oligomeric proanthocyanidins (OPCs), the last two constituents are known to stop hair loss and promote hair regrowth. *
Other oral supplements include Vitamin E Succinate, Zinc Methionine, , Acetyl Glutathione-exclusive to Murray Avenue Apothecary, Linolenic Acid-Borage oil or Evening Primrose oil, Fish Oil, MAA Easy Absorb Iron -with Iron Bis-Glycinate, Thyroid Support, Vitamin B Complex and Biotin Forte


Find this thread for all information:

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

----------


## Seuxin

Great....

But where to buy this topical ?
I dont find the good website.

Have you a link please ? Do we need a prescription ?

I would like to buy a custom minox with these ingredient.

Thanks.

----------


## Jazz1

> Great....
> 
> But where to buy this topical ?
> I dont find the good website.
> 
> Have you a link please ? Do we need a prescription ?
> 
> I would like to buy a custom minox with these ingredient.
> 
> Thanks.


 Everything is explained here:

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

If you need help my emails there, how is your hairloss currently? Is there anything your using now?

----------


## MCAC

Hi all,

New here, Jazz I have been following your thread and have ordered from Susan, waiting for my order. I was a long time Dr Klein patient and was shocked by the sudden loss. The only thing I am concerned about is that Susan cannot put  biotinoyl tripeptide 1 in the formula. There was a time when Dr Klein switch pharmacists and did not add that and my frontal hair started to fall out. Then he went back to his old pharmacist and my hair got better. I don't know much about that ingredient. Seems to be in those eyelash growth things but I think its a key ingredient as to why his formula worked. I had it with it in it and without and that is the only thing that changed. I had bottles stored and ran out about a month ago and used one of the old bottles without biotinoyl tripeptide 1 and same result. BTW I used the foam..My question to the group and to you Jazz is what do you think of this? Can your backup get that ingredient? Has anyone else had this result that used Dr Klein for a long time? I really think that biotinoyl tripeptide 1 was a key to my frontal hair growth. Thoughts?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey what ingredients did you add with Susan and what was you using with Dr Klein? I been using Susan's lotion without  Biotinoyl Tripeptide and my hair is doing great, if anything my hairs are growing longer around the hairline. The quality of her mixture must be working better on me, she has had it lab tested for efficacy.

I personally believe there nothing better topically than Fin/AA/progesterone/tretinoin/hydrocortisone  to combat androgens and DHT. Although I have recently placed another order and going to trial something new; Acetyl Glutathione, Vitamin E and Vitamin C.

----------


## Jazz1

MCAC- I been researching tonight and found out Revita COR conditioner which I have a full 1L bottle here at home  :Smile: , has Biotinyl Tripeptide 1.

----------


## MCAC

Jazz.. Sorry sleeping all day, getting over a cold. From Klein I used the foam Promox 5% for I don't know how long over 4 years.. From Susan I got the the lotion minus Hydrocortisone. Plus I am trying out the foam as well. I have googled till I'm blind looking for that Biotinyl Tripeptide 1... You never mentioned if your back up could get that?
Yes I saw that revita had that but they never list how much like Klein did. I am still searching for Biotinyl Tripeptide 1 from compound pharmacies. I have a call out to one, who will get back to me in a few days.
I am lucky that my Dr. will write a script for it so that part costs nothing. How long have you been on Susans?  Have you posted pics?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey I Been using her product since October and yes I have been taking pictures since which I will update my other thread. There are other ways to obtain Biotinyl Tripeptide 1 which is Revita COR, Procapil, I will check later for more. 

Yes i did ask Susan and she claimed it is similar to biotin which she uses in her lotions if required etc......

----------


## Parsia

> Another update email Susan sent me to help you guys, slight change:
> 
> Base formula:
> Minoxidil (offered in 5%, 12.5%, 15% and 30%.)
> AA 5%
> RA 0.025%
> Finasteride 0.1%
> *
> NOTES:
> ...


 Very good explanation jazz , thanks for details bro.

----------


## Parsia

Guys , I just wanna give you an update : It looks that dr.klein website is ready to take orders now , before that they just working on the website and the promox and other solutions was not ready to order , but now it seems they are ready to take orders after 2 months of they announce that his formula will be come back , Because you all looking for his products this is the website that you can order his formula's : 
http://www.hairgrowthmd.com/store.php?crn=66
I haven't use his products yet but because my friend jazz and also some others recommended that I'm very excited to try that in future , although I have good result with my lipogaine so far . So there are many different options of solutions from lotion ,liquid and foam on website ! sounds great.

----------


## Parsia

> Jazz.. Sorry sleeping all day, getting over a cold. From Klein I used the foam Promox 5% for I don't know how long over 4 years.. From Susan I got the the lotion minus Hydrocortisone. Plus I am trying out the foam as well. I have googled till I'm blind looking for that Biotinyl Tripeptide 1... You never mentioned if your back up could get that?
> Yes I saw that revita had that but they never list how much like Klein did. I am still searching for Biotinyl Tripeptide 1 from compound pharmacies. I have a call out to one, who will get back to me in a few days.
> I am lucky that my Dr. will write a script for it so that part costs nothing. How long have you been on Susans?  Have you posted pics?


 HI macc , its great to see one of dr.klein product user here, would you please tell me more about your result ? how was your progress when you use promox foam? or how was your overall satisfaction of it ? did you have any regrowth?

----------


## LeonardoD

Are you gonna use Dr Klein's website again Jazz? When you're running out of Susans compounds?

----------


## Jazz1

I just placed another order with Susan, i seem to be using less now and saving money, plus I'm getting some good growth around my temples. I have been taking pictures and her lotions do work  :Smile: .

----------


## MCAC

> HI macc , its great to see one of dr.klein product user here, would you please tell me more about your result ? how was your progress when you use promox foam? or how was your overall satisfaction of it ? did you have any regrowth?


 Hey,

I got a good result with promox foam I got some frontal growth and it slowed down the fall out. I'm losing ground now plus I'm now on Synthroid for thyroid so that does not help. As I said I think biotinoyl tripeptide 1 is important with frontal growth but can't find a pharmacy that carries it. I also think that even though Klein had it on hid label, I think even he stopped using it cause he could not get it because I did much better in the first few years. I would have loved to lab test it.

----------


## Parsia

> Hey,
> 
> I got a good result with promox foam I got some frontal growth and it slowed down the fall out. I'm losing ground now plus I'm now on Synthroid for thyroid so that does not help. As I said I think biotinoyl tripeptide 1 is important with frontal growth but can't find a pharmacy that carries it. I also think that even though Klein had it on hid label, I think even he stopped using it cause he could not get it because I did much better in the first few years. I would have loved to lab test it.


 I see , thanks a lot for your answer Maac , I'm not sure if you know that or not , Promox is ready again to order from dr.klein website , they came back to business again , Its really interesting that the price of foam is really good and much cheaper than liquid since it is 150ml and its like 72 dollars. I still don't know the reason . Wish you the best.

----------


## MCAC

> I see , thanks a lot for your answer Maac , I'm not sure if you know that or not , Promox is ready again to order from dr.klein website , they came back to business again , Its really interesting that the price of foam is really good and much cheaper than liquid since it is 150ml and its like 72 dollars. I still don't know the reason . Wish you the best.


 Yes without the biotinoyl tripeptide 1, without it I have lot a lot in 1 month in the front. Waiting on Susan's to come in the mail but she can't get that either. I'm Bummed.

----------


## MCAC

Hey spoke to Tony today from Dr Klein's office and they are back up minus the biotinoyl tripeptide 1 for now. Good news is that they are working on getting that back in. He said a couple of months!! So the exact formula will be back!!

----------


## Eire1980

Can someone provide the website for kleins products please?

----------


## Parsia

> Can someone provide the website for kleins products please?


 Sure it is : http://www.hairgrowthmd.com/ 

Then you should make the account and fill the consult form and make your orders.

----------


## MCAC

> Can someone provide the website for kleins products please?


 https://www.hairgrowthmd.com/

----------


## Plan C

Jazz, how long did it take for you to grow decent length hairs from using klein's/ susan's formula? The vellus hairs at my temples have started to very gradually grow in length since using susan's treatment and I was wondering how long it might take for them to reach a good length?

----------


## Plan C

Also, in what conditions do you store your bottles of susan's formula? I ask because mine started very thick but have gradually become runny.

----------


## atob

help.... please

jazz, seems you've put a lot of effort into finding someone new- but that website for the consult is really poor, and then there are no price lists. assuming I need to email separately. plus didn't seem like the server went secure ie https., finally you may have received you order but others haven't and it seems the onus is on the buyer to pay excess customs charges.. not comfortable ordering with all of this in mind.

so ive posted on a couple of sites and individual threads... I just want to get a minox solution or cream, high quality, no pg with AA. to deliver to uk. 

can I order from hairgrowth.com if im a new user based in the UK?
what about dualgen from minoxmax?
does anyone know where I can get a European supplier of raw minoxidil powder? so will then make myself...

any help, appreciated

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz, how long did it take for you to grow decent length hairs from using klein's/ susan's formula? The vellus hairs at my temples have started to very gradually grow in length since using susan's treatment and I was wondering how long it might take for them to reach a good length?


 Hey funny you say this because my Vellus hairs have started to grow I never ever noticed this until I started Susan's lotion I have been taking pictures. 

Also I have been using hair oils to try and extend they length which seems to be helping, and I order Acetyl gutaatione/vitamin E and vitamin C mixture to ry and extend the other ones.

I can't say bro as this is the first time it's ever happend to me i beleive Susan's mixture is quality stuff or it could be the fact the lotion is penetration deeper because it is more so liquid.

How is your hairloss now?

----------


## Jazz1

I store mine in my room cupboard, I prefer it runny as at the started I found it awkward but I mastered how to apply one drop at a time and massage around.

----------


## Jazz1

> help.... please
> 
> jazz, seems you've put a lot of effort into finding someone new- but that website for the consult is really poor, and then there are no price lists. assuming I need to email separately. plus didn't seem like the server went secure ie https., finally you may have received you order but others haven't and it seems the onus is on the buyer to pay excess customs charges.. not comfortable ordering with all of this in mind.
> 
> so ive posted on a couple of sites and individual threads... I just want to get a minox solution or cream, high quality, no pg with AA. to deliver to uk. 
> 
> can I order from hairgrowth.com if im a new user based in the UK?
> what about dualgen from minoxmax?
> does anyone know where I can get a European supplier of raw minoxidil powder? so will then make myself...
> ...


 
Hey it's very straight forward I can help you if you need assistance, I'm in the uk aswell so just email me il give your my number if you need guidance, jass897@hotmsil.com.

As for hairgrowth they not currently shipping internationally and i personally do not recommend Dulagen and other crap as their quality is probabaly poor. I bought Polaris stuff and their cream was poor quality very gritty. The only suggestion I recommend is a proper pharmacist comoundeded regulated minoxidol.

See the other thread below shows some price range, it may be cheaper if your not adding additives. 

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

----------


## losthair85

Hey Jazz, I am planning to order from Susan and have some quick questions...I appreciate all your help!


1. can u please clarify whether you add hydrocortisone in your Susan mixture? If you do, what percentage do u use?


2. I read the entire thread, and in your post on page 37, you did NOT mention hydrocortisone in Dr. Klein's mixture. Was it?



3. Also, do you place your orders for a cream or a lotion? I think lotion would be thinner, am I correct in saying that?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, I am planning to order from Susan and have some quick questions...I appreciate all your help!
> 
> 
> 1. can u please clarify whether you add hydrocortisone in your Susan mixture? If you do, what percentage do u use?
> 
> 
> 2. I read the entire thread, and in your post on page 37, you did NOT mention hydrocortisone in Dr. Klein's mixture. Was it?
> 
> 
> ...


 Hey bro I use to add hydrocortisone but I now use a cream from my doctor as I use it less now as I'm very happy with my regrowth, so there's no need for me to add this to my lotion.

The percentage you need if you purchase from Susan is 0.1% hydrocortisone but make sure you add 0.025% tretinoin to counter any side effects.

As for Dr Kleins mixture I did at the start use hydrocortisone in his mixture but now I use Dactokort cream In the U.K. which is free for me, it contains hydrocortisone.

I place my order for the lotion as I prefer it more liquid type, easily absorbed fast and it's not greasy, you just need a dropper syringe.

What are you looking to add in your mixture? What are you currently using now and how is your Hairloss?

----------


## Plan C

> I store mine in my room cupboard, I prefer it runny as at the started I found it awkward but I mastered how to apply one drop at a time and massage around.


 Opened my second bottle because the first one was getting really runny and it's slightly pink in colour... Also smells more fragrant. Weird.

----------


## losthair85

> Hey bro I use to add hydrocortisone but I now use a cream from my doctor as I use it less now as I'm very happy with my regrowth, so there's no need for me to add this to my lotion.
> 
> The percentage you need if you purchase from Susan is 0.1% hydrocortisone but make sure you add 0.025% tretinoin to counter any side effects.
> 
> As for Dr Kleins mixture I did at the start use hydrocortisone in his mixture but now I use Dactokort cream In the U.K. which is free for me, it contains hydrocortisone.
> 
> I place my order for the lotion as I prefer it more liquid type, easily absorbed fast and it's not greasy, you just need a dropper syringe.
> 
> What are you looking to add in your mixture? What are you currently using now and how is your Hairloss?


 Thanks for the response Jazz.....

Currently I am on:

 dut 0.5 twice a week and propecia 1mg all other days
I also alternate between rogaine foam 5% and minoxidil 5% liquid once daily.
Shampoo: Niz 2%/ T-sal each once a week

I am Ok with my anti DHT regimen. 

What I am struggling with is possible inflammation and itching with the rogaine/minoxidil. I have tried different combos (I have been on them for over a year), different timing (twice daily vs once daily), different shampoos...but I think they are just too harsh for me and I don't think skin irritation is helpful. Having said that, while I didn't regrow with minoxidil/rogaine, but it may have helped thicken the exisiting hair I had.

So basically I am looking for a different preparation and hoping its  not as rough on me. 


Maybe I am allergic to PG, that's my guess. Maybe I should go with the glycerin base. 

Then again, what do you think of the importance of DMI? I guess the question is are a PG/DMI base much more effective at delivering the ingredients than just the glycerin base? Anyone have any thoughts on this? Seems like the website now does not allow for a glycerin/DMI base anymore.



And yeah.... I am wondering if I should go with a separate cream like u for hydrocortisone (and apply it 1% once weekly)..... my worry is the hydrocort might make Susans mixture too thick like some people may have reported? What do you think? If I go with a separate hydrocort only once weekly, do I still add tretinoin to susans mixture? 





Keep up the good work, you are a great resource for this community.

----------


## Plan C

> Thanks for the response Jazz.....
> 
> Currently I am on:
> 
>  dut 0.5 twice a week and propecia 1mg all other days
> I also alternate between rogaine foam 5% and minoxidil 5% liquid once daily.
> Shampoo: Niz 2%/ T-sal each once a week
> 
> I am Ok with my anti DHT regimen. 
> ...


 Just my 2 cents - of the 2 minoxidil products you are using, it will be the liquid that is irritating your skin. I experienced the same thing until I switched to foam only. As for ditching certain treatments because they cause inflammation - I usually suffer from some flaky skin when I use RU in ethanol/pg, but I apply a little E45 cream to the affected areas before work and it immediately clears the irritation up until I next apply RU. I don't know how badly treatments tend to affect your scalp but a high-quality moisturiser can usually fix the damage in no time.

----------


## losthair85

> Just my 2 cents - of the 2 minoxidil products you are using, it will be the liquid that is irritating your skin. I experienced the same thing until I switched to foam only. As for ditching certain treatments because they cause inflammation - I usually suffer from some flaky skin when I use RU in ethanol/pg, but I apply a little E45 cream to the affected areas before work and it immediately clears the irritation up until I next apply RU. I don't know how badly treatments tend to affect your scalp but a high-quality moisturiser can usually fix the damage in no time.


 Thanks Plan C!

I definitely appreciate your input. And will look into trying that approach. I have Cerave cream here in the US, which is pretty darn good. We don't have E45 unfortunately.

Do you feel like there was any drop off in results when you switched entirely to foam? I need to convince myself that there isn't. lol.


How are things going with susans lotion? 

Do you think its less irritating? Do you think it goes on better than liquid minox (esp in terms of drying/grease factor)? Did you ask for the lotion or the cream?


And finally what made you switch away from regular minox?

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for the response Jazz.....
> 
> Currently I am on:
> 
>  dut 0.5 twice a week and propecia 1mg all other days
> I also alternate between rogaine foam 5% and minoxidil 5% liquid once daily.
> Shampoo: Niz 2%/ T-sal each once a week
> 
> I am Ok with my anti DHT regimen. 
> ...


 That is a good regime you have going on, are you looking to regrow some hair? How are your temples?

Hey as mentioned by Plan C I would drop the liquid minoxidol and carry on with the foam, as the liquid version also gave me itchy annoying scalp. When did you add the liquid and foam? Were they added the same time? Also have you considered Regenpeure Dr and Nt, great shampoo to add with great ingredients to help keep your scalp environment clean and healthy.

DMI (Dimethyl Isosorbide) is a very good compound, if your looking to gain some regrowth than I would also add tretinoin. The only downside with tretinoin is it may cause minor irritation at the start, this normally subsides after 1/2 months. The more ingredients you add it will be more beneficial as they are all proven to work synergistically than alone. I personally would add hydorcortisone to the mixture as its all included in the one price, so no extra charge to add all the ingredients

Again I never had any irritation on Susan's mixture apart from the tretinoin at the start and slight head rush due to 15% minoxidol. All the side effects I experienced have now disappeared and I seem to have gained more positive results when I switched over to her lotion, temple vellus hairs are growing longer.

Yes you are correct from my understanding people who added hydorcortisone to the mixture have had a slightly thicker lotion/cream. But saying that it is still very effective as the liquid lotion, as a guy has been updating me on his hairloss via watts app and is very happy he uses the Hydocortisone mixture. I'm sure Susan could try her best in making it more liquid like mine, best to phone her before your lotion/cream mixture is made. If your worried about irritation I would best give Susan a call, she is very helpfull and more knowledgable than me regarding vehicle irritation  :Smile: .

Thank you for the kind words, I'm only trying to keep up with my promise I made to GOD, I was helped 5 years back by the hairloss forum community so I'm just repaying my promise to help others  :Smile: , no need to thank me thank the forum members.

----------


## Plan C

> Thanks Plan C!
> 
> I definitely appreciate your input. And will look into trying that approach. I have Cerave cream here in the US, which is pretty darn good. We don't have E45 unfortunately.
> 
> Do you feel like there was any drop off in results when you switched entirely to foam? I need to convince myself that there isn't. lol.
> 
> 
> How are things going with susans lotion? 
> 
> ...


 If liquid minox is better than the foam, it's barely noticeable. The fact that foam a) doesn't irritate my skin and b) dries so much faster makes it definitely worth using.

Susan's formula is the first thing I've used that has managed to make vellus hairs at my temples grow in length. Whether or not they'll become terminal remains to be seen. On the other hand, the main reason I started using it was because I hoped applying finasteride topically would prevent more hairloss (wasn't aiming for regrowth), which I'm not sure it has.

I got her formula in lotion form. On the first day of using it, I applied far too much and, due to the tretinoin content, it made my skin raw and painful. 3 months on, however, and I can apply as much as I want without any irritation. As Jazz mentioned, your body adjusts.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey Plan C quick question did your lotions arrive thick white cream? I just got my new package and all bottles seem to be thick and white in texture. I don't know if this is down to the freezing cold weather conditions from when being shipped to the uk. 

The good part as my order was more 6 bottles due to adding another 3 bottles of Acetyl Glutsthione, I never got hit by customs this time  :Smile: .

What's your regime again?

----------


## Jazz1

> Also, in what conditions do you store your bottles of susan's formula? I ask because mine started very thick but have gradually become runny.


 Did the same bottle become runny?

----------


## Plan C

> Hey Plan C quick question did your lotions arrive thick white cream? I just got my new package and all bottles seem to be thick and white in texture. I don't know if this is down to the freezing cold weather conditions from when being shipped to the uk. 
> 
> The good part as my order was more 6 bottles due to adding another 3 bottles of Acetyl Glutsthione, I never got hit by customs this time .
> 
> What's your regime again?


 Hi Jazz,

The lotion in both bottles I ordered was originally thick and white, in fact I remember expressing concerns about their viscosity a number of months ago in this very thread. Fortunately, they do become more runny over time.

My regime is:
100mg RU in ethanol/pg ED
Avodart EOD
Regaine foam once ED
Susan's lotion once ED
Revita + Jason Thin to Thick shampoo once ED

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz,
> 
> The lotion in both bottles I ordered was originally thick and white, in fact I remember expressing concerns about their viscosity a number of months ago in this very thread. Fortunately, they do become more runny over time.
> 
> My regime is:
> 100mg RU in ethanol/pg ED
> Avodart EOD
> Regaine foam once ED
> Susan's lotion once ED
> Revita + Jason Thin to Thick shampoo once ED


 Ok would you say the lotion works? As my new bottles arrived thick white cream texture, where as last time was lotion watery.

----------


## Plan C

> Ok would you say the lotion works? As my new bottles arrived thick white cream texture, where as last time was lotion watery.


 As mentioned earlier, I think it's adding length to vellus hairs at my temples.

----------


## Jazz1

> As mentioned earlier, I think it's adding length to vellus hairs at my temples.


 Thanks for the reply as I'm less panicky now due to the thickness of the mixture hope it works the same as my before lotion.

Oh has your hair stopped receeding? Your from the uk right? Good news I never got hit by customs this time and my order was more at cost.

----------


## Plan C

> Thanks for the reply as I'm less panicky now due to the thickness of the mixture hope it works the same as my before lotion.
> 
> Oh has your hair stopped receeding? Your from the uk right? Good news I never got hit by customs this time and my order was more at cost.


 Hi, I am from the UK and that's great news. I got a hefty customs charge last time.

I got my hair cut the other day and it's pretty clear the receding hasn't stopped. As a result, I started using ethanol/pg as my vehicle for RU, rather than Neogenic. Interestingly, I might be getting sides for the first time as a result. I've suffered from bad brainfog since making the switch, which isn't useful because I'm currently trying to write a uni assignment! On the other hand, it might mean that I've at last found a treatment that has some effect on me.

----------


## Jazz1

Yes tell me about it last time they charged me £18 by parcel force, Great sides mean less hair fall.

How do you apply your cream lotion? Seems like I have to start again as I was happy with the lotion watery mixture. I hope mine turns more watery as it was easier to use.

----------


## Jazz1

Right guys just an update from me and for anyone else finding it hard to measure the lotions who has a thicker white texture cream.

I had a 0.50ml measuring spoon at home, so 3 squirts from the pump will make 0.50ml, I'm going to be sticking with 4 squirts as that's enough to cover my temples and last me  :Smile: .

So to sum things up for the people who can not be bothered to measure the lotion etc and prefer to use the pump;

3 squirts will make 0.50ml
6 squirts will make 1ml.

----------


## Plan C

> Yes tell me about it last time they charged me £18 by parcel force, Great sides mean less hair fall.
> 
> How do you apply your cream lotion? Seems like I have to start again as I was happy with the lotion watery mixture. I hope mine turns more watery as it was easier to use.


 I basically just applied it directly to my temples and waited for it to dry. Even though it's really thick, it didn't tend to leave residue on my scalp so I recon it gets absorbed regardless.

And yeah, I agree that getting sides is sort of a good sign, especially because nothing else has seemed to affect me. But this brainfog is pretty bad so I hope it fades with time.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey the sides should fade over time as I had the same issue at the start, on the other hand does your temples suffer from the dreaded MPB itch?

Right guys i had Susan formulate me this mixture with added vitamin C so I could trial on myself, I'm using it on my temples to see if I notice any effect on my vellus hairs.

This article drew me into adding vitmain C, as Acetyl glutathione and vitamin E have huge impact on Hairloss from my research. I pray maybe one day I come across a cure to Help us all, that's my mission I'm constantly researching I believe one day a topical Mixture will block our genes allowing us to grow hair and be happy.

You have more than likely heard for many years about the benefits of having enough vitamin C in your diet, but did you know that this vitamin can also promote healthy hair growth and actually stimulate regrowth after hair loss?

Losing hair does not have to be a permanent thing, and there are many natural treatments for premature balding, including using vitamin C.

What is Vitamin C?
Vitamin C or ascorbic acid is an essential nutrient for humans. Its active form is L-ascorbate or L-ascorbic acid.

While Vitamin C is synthesized in almost all plants and animals, certain mammals including humans cannot synthesize the vitamin. Therefore, Vitamin C must be ingested in humans either through diet or supplements.

The recommended daily intake allowance of Vitamin C is still in contention but experts agree that a range of 45 mg to 400 mg is required and considered safe. However, a daily dose of up to 2 g is permissible.

Although scurvy is the main symptom associated with Vitamin C deficiency, hair loss is also a derivative sign of this deficiency. A low blood level of the vitamin is strongly correlated with dry and splitting hairs which, of course, quickly fall off.

Because Vitamin C is important for the synthesis of collagen, a deficiency of the vitamin leads to scurvy which is a presentation of weakened collagen on the skin.

In a similar manner, the production of tyrosine is dependent on the vitamin, and tyrosine is important for the maintenance of the structural integrity of hair strands and the cells of hair follicles.

Another known property of Vitamin C which can contribute to its ability to encourage hair regrowth is its action as an antioxidant. This is important in promoting skin health and preventing oxidative damage to the cells of hair follicles.

Since it also boosts the immunity, Vitamin C is a general champion of good health.

Facts about Vitamin C
There are many reasons why vitamin C is so good for us, and why it can be used to treat hair loss.

For one thing, vitamin C is water-soluble, so the body does not store it and accumulate too much in your system.

Here are some more interesting facts about this vitamin:

Vitamin C is loaded with anti-oxidant properties, just like vitamin E and zinc. These anti-oxidants reduce the damage that is caused by free radicals that are formed when food is converted into energy by the body. These free radicals can do a lot of damage to your hair, which is one reason why we need to make sure that we have enough of this vitamin in our diets.
When you have enough vitamin C in your system, you will have the nutrients you need to help produce collagen, which is necessary for healthy skin, bones, ligaments, muscles and blood tissues.
Vitamin C can also help reduce scar tissues and promote the healing of wounds. It is essential for healthy teeth and bones, and of course, hair.
The DKK-1 Link
The blood level of circulating androgens is important to the mechanism of hair loss. For example, a high level of DHT (dihydrotestosterone), a product of testosterone has been identified as the chief cause of androgenic alopecia.

Male hormones and their metabolites such as DHT bind to certain receptors of an important group of cells in the skin, the papilla cells. Papilla cells are chiefly responsible for transporting nutrients to other cells in hair follicles.

These cells play a key role in the events leading to balding or alopecia. When they are blocked by male hormones, they cannot effectively feed the hair follicles; therefore, hair production slows down.

To test whether Vitamin C has any positive effect in the reversal of hair loss, a group of Korean researchers from Kyungpook National University took some papilla cells from the skin of balding men and exposed them to a derivative of Vitamin C.

The derivative used was Ascorbic acid 2-phosphate which is used in many topical cosmetic products and which is converted to Vitamin C in the cell.

The idea to try Vitamin C salt on actual hair cells was born out of a prior research in which the group of researchers demonstrated that ascorbic acid 2-phosphate boosts hair growth.

To explain their findings, the researchers drew attention to the fact that androgens such as DHT are known to activate the dickkopf-1 gene which in turn produces a protein called DKK-1. The DKK-1 is sometimes called the baldness protein since it is found mostly in skin cells in people undergoing hair loss.

The study showed that as the DKK-1 protein level rose, the papilla cell population dropped. Just as these papilla cells died, the cells responsible for synthesizing the outer root sheath of hair strands stopped functioning. This quickly led to a sharp drop in hair growth and more hair loss.

However, when the Vitamin C salt was added to the papilla cells taken from balding people, the production of the DKK-1 protein was inhibited.

There was, however, an additional benefit: the vitamin also led to an increase in the production of IGF-1, a growth factor, in the papilla cells. Both of these effects lead to a reversal of hair loss.

Still, further studies are needed to determine what form of Vitamin C will provide the most benefit for people experiencing hair loss and whether topical preparations or supplements will better serve them.

Meanwhile, an important proof has been established directly correlating Vitamin C as effective in inhibiting the actions of androgens in relation to hair loss. That, in itself, is a major milestone since androgens, especially DHT, are known to a major cause of hereditary alopecia and hair loss in steroid users.

----------


## LeonardoD

How do you guys get it through customs? Tretinoi is an RX drug even in UK. Please explain  :Smile:  - I am looking to purchase, but I doubt it will get through customs.

----------


## losthair85

Hey Jazz

I lost a lot of ground when I quit all hair loss meds for about 1.5 years. So I am about NW 3/4.

Yeah, I am looking for regrowth. Susan's lotion sounds promising based on the synergistic ingredients as you mentioned. Thanks for the tips on the hydrocort, I will include it in the mixture. I think I will try the DMI/PG mixture and see what happens.

And yes, I was actually following your posts a lot recently, and noticed that you use the Regenepure shampoo, I am going to order that too.

If I can think of anymore questions, I will let u know......many thanks!

----------


## losthair85

> If liquid minox is better than the foam, it's barely noticeable. The fact that foam a) doesn't irritate my skin and b) dries so much faster makes it definitely worth using.
> 
> Susan's formula is the first thing I've used that has managed to make vellus hairs at my temples grow in length. Whether or not they'll become terminal remains to be seen. On the other hand, the main reason I started using it was because I hoped applying finasteride topically would prevent more hairloss (wasn't aiming for regrowth), which I'm not sure it has.
> 
> I got her formula in lotion form. On the first day of using it, I applied far too much and, due to the tretinoin content, it made my skin raw and painful. 3 months on, however, and I can apply as much as I want without any irritation. As Jazz mentioned, your body adjusts.


 
Your insight has been very helpful Plan C. 

Going to drop the liquid minox in favor of this product, and see what happens....thanks so much for answering my questions.

----------


## Jazz1

> How do you guys get it through customs? Tretinoi is an RX drug even in UK. Please explain  - I am looking to purchase, but I doubt it will get through customs.


 Luck, last time I got hit by customs but this time I was ok  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz
> 
> I lost a lot of ground when I quit all hair loss meds for about 1.5 years. So I am about NW 3/4.
> 
> Yeah, I am looking for regrowth. Susan's lotion sounds promising based on the synergistic ingredients as you mentioned. Thanks for the tips on the hydrocort, I will include it in the mixture. I think I will try the DMI/PG mixture and see what happens.
> 
> And yes, I was actually following your posts a lot recently, and noticed that you use the Regenepure shampoo, I am going to order that too.
> 
> If I can think of anymore questions, I will let u know......many thanks!


 Hey no worries any questions just hit me up il do my best to answer, as for this Vitamin C mixture lets see, you never know  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Your insight has been very helpful Plan C. 
> 
> Going to drop the liquid minox in favor of this product, and see what happens....thanks so much for answering my questions.


 Wise choice  :Smile: .

----------


## LeonardoD

But what do they do then? Just seize the product and slap you? That's 150 dollars down the toilet man.

----------


## Jazz1

> But what do they do then? Just seize the product and slap you? That's 150 dollars down the toilet man.


 No, last time it never got seized they checked the value and sent me a customs bill of £18 for 2 lotion bottles. This time i had 6 bottles and it arrived within 10 dad without any charge  :Smile: .

----------


## LeonardoD

Okay.

I got a reply from the authorities. They did a check on Susans website etc. and Sadly it's illegal in my country to import medications from other places than EU countries, if it medicin is of a pharmaceutical degree... ffs

----------


## Jazz1

> Okay.
> 
> I got a reply from the authorities. They did a check on Susans website etc. and Sadly it's illegal in my country to import medications from other places than EU countries, if it medicin is of a pharmaceutical degree... ffs


 Where you from?

----------


## LeonardoD

Denmark... the most controlled country when it comes to medical products... even Saw Palmetto is banned here.

----------


## Jazz1

> Denmark... the most controlled country when it comes to medical products... even Saw Palmetto is banned here.


 Wow, man I feel for you sometimes I wish in the UK we had compounding pharmacists like US, seems like US has all the good perks!

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I'm just updating from an email Susan sent me;

When there are too many ingredients to fit on the label we put it under the directions (please read!).
Typically putting the Biotin in the RX minox topical as when there are too many ingredients the efficacy decreases as it is impossible to absorb so many in one formulation.

This is why they increased the dose on the Acetyl Glutathione with Biotin to 3% of each ingredient WITH Vitamin E as well.
The Vitamin C is 20% and should be alternated with the Acetyl Glutathione /Biotin/Vitamin E formula every night.
*
They now have their own shampoo/conditioner and Progesterone leave in formula as well.
*
Also the website link to their *hairloss page at http://www.maapgh.com/hair.html *where you can get all the information you need on their adjunct hair loss formulas.
*

----------


## thebigB

I was wondering, since Dr. Klein's site is now taken over and back up and running if Susan is still the preferable source?

----------


## doke

I was asked by the kline site to fill in a form which I did and never heard anymore that was before Christmas?

----------


## johnnyboots

I'm sticking with Susan,I like  her and believe she is honest .Not to say the promox group is not.She bailed us out when we were in need.

----------


## Jazz1

> I was wondering, since Dr. Klein's site is now taken over and back up and running if Susan is still the preferable source?


 I'm going to Carry on as I have noticed a positive change, my vellus hairs around the temples are gaining length. Plus she has saved me from depression and hard times, so I owe her my business.

----------


## Jazz1

> I was asked by the kline site to fill in a form which I did and never heard anymore that was before Christmas?


 What you currently using?

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm sticking with Susan,I like  her and believe she is honest .Not to say the promox group is not.She bailed us out when we were in need.


 I agree without her I would have probably lost most my gains from Promox, as when Dr Klein passed away I bought the remainder stock. The after batch must have been mixed and never worked on me, I started itching and shedding, i still have 6 full bottles! 

The guy below also bought the after batch when Dr Klein passed away and lost all his Promox gains, I tried helping him but struggled to get in touch when I found Susan.

We spoke the other day as he saw this thread, he's lost most his hair and now just bought Susan's stuff after seeing this thread.

I have nothing bad to say about Tony or Dr Klein, I'm just thankful to GOD for helping me find Susan as an alternative during hard times.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/member...954-Kenkieth16

JohnnyBoots how is your Hairloss? How you finding Susan's products, anything positive?

----------


## thebigB

thanks Jazz and others,

what formulation would you recommend? Also do you think i should add saba gel in addition?
and how would you work it in?

this is my current regimen / history
(looking for some gains at in hairline, as one side is diffuse):

My history
Finasteride 2.5 mg / daily 5 days a week)
Dut .5mg (2 days a week, days not taking fin)
rogaine (foam am, liquid pm)
nizoral 2% 3 days a week

My current new regimen (for last 1 month)
finasteride 2.5 mg eod
Dut 0.5mg eod
rogaine (foam am, liquid pm)
emu oil + rosemarry oil (once a day, a couple hours before evening shower)
Ru58841 50mg (mixed with 2ml of neogenic), 1 hour after evening rogaine)
indian oils 2 times a week (entire head)
revita shampoo - 5 days / week

----------


## Jazz1

Hey bro I will reply later as I'm at work and it's hard to read and reply on a small screen.

I will explain later but I would not buy Saba gel as you can get Saba gel and topical additives that are more potent than Saba gel alone in this mixture.

----------


## Jazz1

> thanks Jazz and others,
> 
> what formulation would you recommend? Also do you think i should add saba gel in addition?
> and how would you work it in?
> 
> this is my current regimen / history
> (looking for some gains at in hairline, as one side is diffuse):
> 
> My history
> ...


 
Right you do have a serious Regime in my eyes, from my personal research these past 5 years is RU58841 is the most powerfull anti androgen. I have tried RU topcical and the stuff is some serious potent topical, I have kept this as last resort in my freezer.

I would not bother with Saba gel as from my understanding it is Hydocortisone and Tretinoin combined. The lotion mixture I use has both added plus more ingredients, now in your case it's hard to judge as you just added RU58841, this may alone give your some growth.

What is the current state of your hairloss? And why the strong regime?

----------


## johnnyboots

> I agree without her I would have probably lost most my gains from Promox, as when Dr Klein passed away I bought the remainder stock. The after batch must have been mixed and never worked on me, I started itching and shedding, i still have 6 full bottles! 
> 
> The guy below also bought the after batch when Dr Klein passed away and lost all his Promox gains, I tried helping him but struggled to get in touch when I found Susan.
> 
> We spoke the other day as he saw this thread, he's lost most his hair and now just bought Susan's stuff after seeing this thread.
> 
> I have nothing bad to say about Tony or Dr Klein, I'm just thankful to GOD for helping me find Susan as an alternative during hard times.
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/member...954-Kenkieth16
> ...


  Pretty good hair getting better and thicker.
Also just ordered her progesterone leave in and her shampoo and conditioner .

----------


## Jazz1

> Pretty good hair getting better and thicker.
> Also just ordered her progesterone leave in and her shampoo and conditioner .


 Nice, keep me posted on the shampoo and let me know the ingredients, I might order it aswell  :Smile: .

----------


## thebigB

> Right you do have a serious Regime in my eyes, from my personal research these past 5 years is RU58841 is the most powerfull anti androgen. I have tried RU topcical and the stuff is some serious potent topical, I have kept this as last resort in my freezer.
> 
> I would not bother with Saba gel as from my understanding it is Hydocortisone and Tretinoin combined. The lotion mixture I use has both added plus more ingredients, now in your case it's hard to judge as you just added RU58841, this may alone give your some growth.
> 
> What is the current state of your hairloss? And why the strong regime?


 I am a NW 2...
However my left temple there is some diffuse thinning behind my hairline which really bugs me. As it prevents me from putting my hair up. Think lilpauly's before pic.
So I wanted to see what could be achieved to sure this up and eliminate the diffused thinning. Which is why I recently made some changes to be more aggressive. I would be happy to be a solid NW 2.

----------


## thebigB

> I am a NW 2...
> However my left temple there is some diffuse thinning behind my hairline which really bugs me. As it prevents me from putting my hair up. Think lilpauly's before pic.
> So I wanted to see what could be achieved to sure this up and eliminate the diffused thinning. Which is why I recently made some changes to be more aggressive. I would be happy to be a solid NW 2.


 
was thinking a quick addition i could work into regimen would be:
emu oil + rosemarry oil (instead of once a day, a couple hours before evening shower) 
alternate this to 4 days a week
with the other days being the saba gel?

OR

a susan formulation, though not sure how i would work that in with my neogenic and ru (as i apply this at night and not sure i trust for this to penetrate a lotion or vice versa).

----------


## Jazz1

> was thinking a quick addition i could work into regimen would be:
> emu oil + rosemarry oil (instead of once a day, a couple hours before evening shower) 
> alternate this to 4 days a week
> with the other days being the saba gel?
> 
> OR
> 
> a susan formulation, though not sure how i would work that in with my neogenic and ru (as i apply this at night and not sure i trust for this to penetrate a lotion or vice versa).


 My advice would be simple, in terms of oils the four essential oils that work are lavender, rosemary, thyme and cedarwood to stimulate growth. The oils I prefer to use is the Divine herbal oil as it contains all oils mixed into one bottle. I first read about these oils on ************ you can track the thread and see I posted on a thread created by someone back in 2012. Now people dismissed these oils as being snake oils, but for sure they are 100% not snake. Lilpauly Mark is right hair oils will help but won't stop MPB, for the past 3 years I have tracked the oil feedback on eBay and other forums, all I have read is 100% positive feedback, mainly woman. I myself have recommended these to 2 woman based on the reviews and both woman are getting regrowth and less hair fall. So my conclusion and the reason I use these is because they probably work mainly on people who have halted hairloss or are diffuse slow thinning.

Now as for your regime if you check previous posts, Plan C is using the exact same regime as you but with added Susan's lotion. The only positive point he has noticed with adding Susan's lotion is his vellus temple hairs are gaining length, again everyone responds different to treatments.

If I was in your shoes I would weigh two options:

1. Carry on with RU58841 + Neogenic see how you go,
2. Drop RU58841 and neogenic(leave as last option when FIN/DUT stops working), add a lotion mixture like Susan's.

No way would I add both as this can be costly and you may not know what works, considering RU is very powerfull topical.

The ingredients in Susan's lotion you could try:
15% minoxidil 
0.1% finesteride
5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesteone
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% Hydocortisone.

Could add DMI for more penetration.

Here's the oils I use, I also mix pure emu oil with them.

----------


## thebigB

thanks a lot for the thoughtful reply.
Since I am a few weeks into adding the neogenic + RU, i am considering to carry on with that. (  I figure i can always go to DUT daily, instead of alternating with fin)

I actually been blending all the oils myself(indian oils with the essential oils) twice a week . Making about 2 weeks worth at a time. But this looks like it could be a much easier alternative that i will give a shot.

Do you think it could be beneficial to throw in 2 or 3 days a week saba gel. Also would be same if i just applied a bit of scalpacin then immediately after a little 0.025% tretinoin gel? Or is there a better way to mix or get pre-made?

----------


## Jazz1

> thanks a lot for the thoughtful reply.
> Since I am a few weeks into adding the neogenic + RU, i am considering to carry on with that. (  I figure i can always go to DUT daily, instead of alternating with fin)
> 
> I actually been blending all the oils myself(indian oils with the essential oils) twice a week . Making about 2 weeks worth at a time. But this looks like it could be a much easier alternative that i will give a shot.
> 
> Do you think it could be beneficial to throw in 2 or 3 days a week saba gel. Also would be same if i just applied a bit of scalpacin then immediately after a little 0.025% tretinoin gel? Or is there a better way to mix or get pre-made?


 Hey will reply tonight as I'm going work now.

----------


## Parsia

> My advice would be simple, in terms of oils the four essential oils that work are lavender, rosemary, thyme and cedarwood to stimulate growth. The oils I prefer to use is the Divine herbal oil as it contains all oils mixed into one bottle. I first read about these oils on ************ you can track the thread and see I posted on a thread created by someone back in 2012. Now people dismissed these oils as being snake oils, but for sure they are 100% not snake. Lilpauly Mark is right hair oils will help but won't stop MPB, for the past 3 years I have tracked the oil feedback on eBay and other forums, all I have read is 100% positive feedback, mainly woman. I myself have recommended these to 2 woman based on the reviews and both woman are getting regrowth and less hair fall. So my conclusion and the reason I use these is because they probably work mainly on people who have halted hairloss or are diffuse slow thinning.
> 
> Now as for your regime if you check previous posts, Plan C is using the exact same regime as you but with added Susan's lotion. The only positive point he has noticed with adding Susan's lotion is his vellus temple hairs are gaining length, again everyone responds different to treatments.
> 
> If I was in your shoes I would weigh two options:
> 
> 1. Carry on with RU58841 + Neogenic see how you go,
> 2. Drop RU58841 and neogenic(leave as last option when FIN/DUT stops working), add a lotion mixture like Susan's.
> 
> ...


 Hello jazz , whats up buddy ? Regards to our conversation about divine herbal oil , which feedbacks did you find on ebay ? All I found was just 
feedback to seller , So I unfortunately don't find the reviews about the product quality and regrowth , If you can guide me to that I would be happy. and as you know I use lipogaine and we make a deal to stay on that for 6 months and then add promox ( either susan or klein ) , but what do you think about adding RU as well ? just as reminder I already on fin 0.5mg and lipogaine .

----------


## LongWayHome

Can someone please tell me where the hell can I get that Susan's lotion?
Where can I actually read about it? contact her? buy it? 
One person that can give me 30 seconds of his time.
Where's Hellouser when you need him.

----------


## Parsia

> Can someone please tell me where the hell can I get that Susan's lotion?
> Where can I actually read about it? contact her? buy it? 
> One person that can give me 30 seconds of his time.
> Where's Hellouser when you need him.


 Sure , Sorry if you don't find that , People help here , especially jazz try to help a lot , 

http://xenicalwtloss.hypermart.net/C...INDEXpage.html

http://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com/

So you can find more information about the order on this thread. feel free to ask me if you have any question.

----------


## Plan C

> Can someone please tell me where the hell can I get that Susan's lotion?
> Where can I actually read about it? contact her? buy it? 
> One person that can give me 30 seconds of his time.
> Where's Hellouser when you need him.


 Right here we have the reason why this thread is 59 pages long..

----------


## doke

Guys I have come to the conclusion that Dr Klines promox is no different to using genuine regaine or rogaine in us and that is through the bald truth with spencer as what he uses works and the only thing I would say is try to use with an antiandrogen such as ru topical or propecia oral.
Im glad I was not conned into buying promox from Dr Kline and saved my money.
The only thing that may help in the product is minoxidil and perhaps tretinoin although that stuff messed up my scalp.

----------


## Plan C

> Guys I have come to the conclusion that Dr Klines promox is no different to using genuine regaine or rogaine in us and that is through the bald truth with spencer as what he uses works and the only thing I would say is try to use with an antiandrogen such as ru topical or propecia oral.
> Im glad I was not conned into buying promox from Dr Kline and saved my money.
> The only thing that may help in the product is minoxidil and perhaps tretinoin although that stuff messed up my scalp.


 I dunno how you've managed to reach that conclusion. For starters, its a 15% minoxidil solution, rather than 5, so on that basis alone it is different to Regaine. Plus I haven't heard a single bad word said about the stuff apart from it can cause irritation, which your scalp usually adjusts to within a month.

Are you too frightened to try it?

----------


## doke

Hi plan theres no proof that higher than 5% minoxidil even works and in some cases could be dangerous as its a blood pressure drug even 5% you can get nasty side effects that's why its been taken off the market.
As said I am warning like spencer that higher doses of minoxidil work better than 5% and to be honest I have tried different companies and higher strengths and they did not work as good as the genuine product even Kirkland was not as good for me as regaine so im back on this mixed with ru.

----------


## LongWayHome

> Right here we have the reason why this thread is 59 pages long..


 Oh really?
Instead of being a smart*** just answer the question, or maybe not if it makes you feel someone? feel in charge for once in your miserable life?
is that it?  :Smile: 

Anyway, I've used many things, including 15% from time to time, and it actually felt like it's doing something.
Maybe it was only in my mind, made me feel good about using it I dont know, but I'm pretty sure it did something better than the 5% alone.

----------


## Plan C

> Oh really?
> Instead of being a smart*** just answer the question, or maybe not if it makes you feel someone? feel in charge for once in your miserable life?
> is that it? 
> 
> Anyway, I've used many things, including 15% from time to time, and it actually felt like it's doing something.
> Maybe it was only in my mind, made me feel good about using it I dont know, but I'm pretty sure it did something better than the 5% alone.


 Instead of a being a lazy sod, try reading the thread like everyone else? Or are you so dense that you need someone to walk you through it?

As for 'feeling in charge'... Wtf are you talking about?

----------


## Jazz1

> Can someone please tell me where the hell can I get that Susan's lotion?
> Where can I actually read about it? contact her? buy it? 
> One person that can give me 30 seconds of his time.
> Where's Hellouser when you need him.


 https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

If you need help just email me jass897@hotmail.com.

----------


## Jazz1

> Guys I have come to the conclusion that Dr Klines promox is no different to using genuine regaine or rogaine in us and that is through the bald truth with spencer as what he uses works and the only thing I would say is try to use with an antiandrogen such as ru topical or propecia oral.
> Im glad I was not conned into buying promox from Dr Kline and saved my money.
> The only thing that may help in the product is minoxidil and perhaps tretinoin although that stuff messed up my scalp.


 Everyone is different, when I first researched Promox 3 years back there was very few people using the products and the ones who did try it had mixed reviews. My own personal view is the mixture 100% works better than your general 5% minoxidil, ask the people using Susans product currently they are all like me getting good results, wait till you see Aaron's results from Susan's mixture and the regime I have guided him to use. The same would go for Dr Richard Lee, just hit the search button people praised his mixtures as the BEST  :Smile: .
The ones who listened to me regarding Tretinoin and irritation know exactly what I meant, about this subsiding after few months, initialy I had stinging at the start which is enough to put anyone of with panick. Again you could add coconut oil at the start to help calm and moisture the irritated scalp, but as mentioned this subsides after few months.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi plan theres no proof that higher than 5% minoxidil even works and in some cases could be dangerous as its a blood pressure drug even 5% you can get nasty side effects that's why its been taken off the market.
> As said I am warning like spencer that higher doses of minoxidil work better than 5% and to be honest I have tried different companies and higher strengths and they did not work as good as the genuine product even Kirkland was not as good for me as regaine so im back on this mixed with ru.


 That's the issue most the general 15% crap that was sold like Dulagen is RUBBISH, I never heard any good reviews on the general crap sold on the market today as they all probabaly mixed wrong + greasy, for one being Polaris Labs I bought their stuff and the cream was so dam GRITTY. There was not much negative words to be said about Dr Ricahrd Lee, because his formula was properly formulated, try comparing the general market crap to properly formulated pharmacist mixture. You PAY for what you get, pay cheap price expect poor quality lol.

----------


## Jazz1

> Oh really?
> Instead of being a smart*** just answer the question, or maybe not if it makes you feel someone? feel in charge for once in your miserable life?
> is that it? 
> 
> Anyway, I've used many things, including 15% from time to time, and it actually felt like it's doing something.
> Maybe it was only in my mind, made me feel good about using it I dont know, but I'm pretty sure it did something better than the 5% alone.


 What are you currently using now? What 15% did you try? In my eyes the only decent 15% around and I have tried all I can post pictures right now to Proove this is;

1.Dr Lee *******
2.Dr Klein
3.Susan

I have bought the general 15% crap on the market and trust me they do not compare to a proper compounded lotion. I wish the UK had better options like USA, we here in the UK have useless pharmacist who can not compound jack all!

----------


## Jazz1

> Instead of a being a lazy sod, try reading the thread like everyone else? Or are you so dense that you need someone to walk you through it?
> 
> As for 'feeling in charge'... Wtf are you talking about?


 He seems confused, anyways here's the other thread I posted to help you guys, let's try being more positive guys after all I'm very gratefull I found Susan to save my hair when Dr Klein passed away.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

----------


## thebigB

> thanks a lot for the thoughtful reply.
> Since I am a few weeks into adding the neogenic + RU, i am considering to carry on with that. (  I figure i can always go to DUT daily, instead of alternating with fin)
> 
> I actually been blending all the oils myself(indian oils with the essential oils) twice a week . Making about 2 weeks worth at a time. But this looks like it could be a much easier alternative that i will give a shot.
> 
> Do you think it could be beneficial to throw in 2 or 3 days a week saba gel. Also would be same if i just applied a bit of scalpacin then immediately after a little 0.025% tretinoin gel? Or is there a better way to mix or get pre-made?


 a penny for your thoughts  :Smile:

----------


## doke

I do think minoxidil without an antiandrogen may cause more hairloss in  some people as minox causes better blood flow to the scalp but in turn the blood has dht in it which  as said speed up hair loss with extra dht this was said many years ago.
So propecia is a must with minoxidil or topical antiandrogen which includes ru or cb when its available in a strength that works.
That's why Dr Kline used spiro and progesterone with his mix which I think ru is better.

----------


## Jazz1

> a penny for your thoughts


 I would personally go with a mixture of 0.1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/DMI, I believe Saba gel
Is no way better than this combination. My friend who still has AA tried hydrocortisone and still has AA, where as I used 1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/2% microconozate and then sprayed 10% DMI mixture over this which worked. When I used them separate none of them worked, when combined along with cutting wheat I had major growth.

As stated wait till you guys see Aaron pictures, the regime I recommended has worked on his MPB he has major regrowth around his temples. I am a boy on a mission my dream is to try finding ways and cure for this nasty disease, I pray one day God gives me the signs so I can help everyone for free.

----------


## Jazz1

> I do think minoxidil without an antiandrogen may cause more hairloss in  some people as minox causes better blood flow to the scalp but in turn the blood has dht in it which  as said speed up hair loss with extra dht this was said many years ago.
> So propecia is a must with minoxidil or topical antiandrogen which includes ru or cb when its available in a strength that works.
> That's why Dr Kline used spiro and progesterone with his mix which I think ru is better.


 I agree RU is very powerful if you check my previous posts I suggest RU58841 is the most powerful
Anti androgen on the market.

But with this current lotion mixture it contains DHT and Anti Androgen blockers, I always stated if you have halted Hairloss than this mixture would be like the icing on the cake.

Breakdown;

Finesteride - DHT blocker

Minoxidil - hair growth stimulant

Tretinoin - enhance penetration

Hydrocortisone - anti-inflammatory

Azelaic Acid - DHT inhibitor

Progesterone - Anti-androgen

Spironolactone - Anti-androgen

DMI - (Dimethyl Isosorbide) - increase penetration deep into tissue.

----------


## doke

whats happened to the kline site as they were going to start selling the formulas again and since filling in a form they emailed me I never heard anymore.

----------


## Jazz1

> whats happened to the kline site as they were going to start selling the formulas again and since filling in a form they emailed me I never heard anymore.


 I do not know bro last email I had was they we're trying to sort things out and currently they not shipping international.

What is your current regime? What is the current state of your Hairloss? What is your aim in regards to trying these mixtures?

----------


## doke

Im waiting for more ru powder from anagen and mix with minox lotion seems to be halting my hairloss.
Also just bought from boots uk anagain which is shampoo and topical lotion based on organic pea sprouts.

----------


## thebigB

> I would personally go with a mixture of 0.1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/DMI, I believe Saba gel
> Is no way better than this combination. My friend who still has AA tried hydrocortisone and still has AA, where as I used 1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/2% microconozate and then sprayed 10% DMI mixture over this which worked. When I used them separate none of them worked, when combined along with cutting wheat I had major growth.
> 
> As stated wait till you guys see Aaron pictures, the regime I recommended has worked on his MPB he has major regrowth around his temples. I am a boy on a mission my dream is to try finding ways and cure for this nasty disease, I pray one day God gives me the signs so I can help everyone for free.


 
in terms of the mixture( 0.1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/DMI ) did you just get all the ingredients and apply one directly after the other. Im not sure where to get DMi?
How do you recommend I go about making/applying the mixture? Or do you get this pre-made?

Does it matter to apply minoxidil directly after or before the mixture? Or can i use the mixture 4 hours before my evening shower, than after shower use minox?

thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Im waiting for more ru powder from anagen and mix with minox lotion seems to be halting my hairloss.
> Also just bought from boots uk anagain which is shampoo and topical lotion based on organic pea sprouts.


 I read good research on pea is it similar to this check my old thread; keep me posted please.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...act&highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

> in terms of the mixture( 0.1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/DMI ) did you just get all the ingredients and apply one directly after the other. Im not sure where to get DMi?
> How do you recommend I go about making/applying the mixture? Or do you get this pre-made?
> 
> Does it matter to apply minoxidil directly after or before the mixture? Or can i use the mixture 4 hours before my evening shower, than after shower use minox?
> 
> thanks


 Hey I will reply tonight as I'm at work now and its hard explaining in detail on the iPhone lol.

----------


## Kenkieth16

> I agree without her I would have probably lost most my gains from Promox, as when Dr Klein passed away I bought the remainder stock. The after batch must have been mixed and never worked on me, I started itching and shedding, i still have 6 full bottles! 
> 
> The guy below also bought the after batch when Dr Klein passed away and lost all his Promox gains, I tried helping him but struggled to get in touch when I found Susan.
> 
> We spoke the other day as he saw this thread, he's lost most his hair and now just bought Susan's stuff after seeing this thread.
> 
> I have nothing bad to say about Tony or Dr Klein, I'm just thankful to GOD for helping me find Susan as an alternative during hard times.
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/member...954-Kenkieth16
> ...


 

Yea guys hes right. & jazz the product just came in today! Ive JUST applied it litterally mins ago lol. Im going to deff keep You & Everyone updated to let them know of its working . Im going to update a picture every 2 months until a year to see my progress. 

Also if anyone has questions feel free to ask me  :Big Grin:

----------


## Jazz1

> Yea guys hes right. & jazz the product just came in today! Ive JUST applied it litterally mins ago lol. Im going to deff keep You & Everyone updated to let them know of its working . Im going to update a picture every 2 months until a year to see my progress. 
> 
> Also if anyone has questions feel free to ask me


 Wicked bro please take pictures to help others  :Smile: , I can't remember what ingredients did you add? Trust me you won't be dissapointed you need to see Aarons pictures he sent me through watts app, amazing. One thing bro get some 5% Kirkland foam and Regenepure Dr if you can afford these  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> in terms of the mixture( 0.1% hydrocortisone/0.025% tretinoin/DMI ) did you just get all the ingredients and apply one directly after the other. Im not sure where to get DMi?
> How do you recommend I go about making/applying the mixture? Or do you get this pre-made?
> 
> Does it matter to apply minoxidil directly after or before the mixture? Or can i use the mixture 4 hours before my evening shower, than after shower use minox?
> 
> thanks


 I use to buy everything seperate but now Susan mixs everything in one lotion which is much easier etc. No one sells DMI spray and most of the other ingredients are prescription so can be obtained through a cream for example Dactokort which has 0.1% Hydocortisone and 2% microconozate.

I use to apply these all seperate and allow at least half hour before applying Minoxidil, but seems like Susan mixs everything in one lotion which still allows everything to work synergistically and no need to wait around.

I always apply topicals after a fresh shower and clean scalp, I wash my hair twice a day morning time I use Revita and night time I use Regenepure Dr and Nt.

----------


## ledhead

Would love to try their products but the prices are insane...

----------


## Jazz1

> Would love to try their products but the prices are insane...


 I did my best in trying to reduce prices, I can have another word if you like, see if anything else can be done for us forum members. Again Susan has kindly offered discount if we buy 6 months worth, which is 3 bottles. Also do not forget the prices are less on lower dosage minoxidil and the additives that can be added are part of the minoxidil fixed price. I have sympathy for people wishing to try something out of their price range, that's why I did my best in trying to reduce prices as some people on low income can not afford certain products.

What are you wanting to try 15% or less?

----------


## ledhead

3 bottles is 6 months worth? How much do you apply daily? I would like to try 15%.

----------


## Kenkieth16

> Wicked bro please take pictures to help others , I can't remember what ingredients did you add? Trust me you won't be dissapointed you need to see Aarons pictures he sent me through watts app, amazing. One thing bro get some 5% Kirkland foam and Regenepure Dr if you can afford these .


 
All the ingredients from dr kliens formula, the list you gave me. And yea i will buy some minox ! Apply 5% in the morning & the 15% at night.

----------


## Kenkieth16

> Would love to try their products but the prices are insane...


  The price isnt that bad. But I understand where yure comming from & jazz is right, its cheaper to buy it in bulk. But for me i just bought a 1month supply, BUT i can easily streach a 1 month bottle for 2-3 months. Thats why I mentioned in the last post I would update pictures 2-3 months. 

So i payed $89 for 1month divide that into 2 is is $44 && 3 is $29
So 29 dollars a month isnt bad for me at all.  :Smile:  lol 
So just use it wisely bro

----------


## Jazz1

> 3 bottles is 6 months worth? How much do you apply daily? I would like to try 15%.


 Yes each bottle is around 60ml and the recommended dosage is 1ml per day I apply 1ml daily sometimes less now and I use 5% regaine foam rotated. I mainly use the lotion around my temples and hairline, even 0.050ml is enough to cover both my temples. 

Do not forget within the 15% fixed price you can add the following additives;

0.1% finesteride
5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesteone
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% Hydocortisone 
DMI.

----------


## Jazz1

> All the ingredients from dr kliens formula, the list you gave me. And yea i will buy some minox ! Apply 5% in the morning & the 15% at night.


 Perfect bro and you need a good shampoo Ketaconazole based, I reckon in no time you should start getting regrowth again  :Wink: .

----------


## Jazz1

> The price isnt that bad. But I understand where yure comming from & jazz is right, its cheaper to buy it in bulk. But for me i just bought a 1month supply, BUT i can easily streach a 1 month bottle for 2-3 months. Thats why I mentioned in the last post I would update pictures 2-3 months. 
> 
> So i payed $89 for 1month divide that into 2 is is $44 && 3 is $29
> So 29 dollars a month isnt bad for me at all.  lol 
> So just use it wisely bro


 Well said  :Smile: .

----------


## doke

Jazz how do you go about buying from susan to start with and have any of you before and after pics using susans products?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz how do you go about buying from susan to start with and have any of you before and after pics using susans products?


 Bro I have been taking pictures I will try posting tonight after work, as stated my temple hairs are gaining some length and in general my hair is thick. You can not really compare my pictures as I made the switch from Dr Klein and my hair was pretty good.
Here's my regrowth thread if you have not seen;

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...ead&highlight=

Aaron sent me his pictures via watts app and trust me you will be amazed, again I'm not posting his pictures as he is doing that himself once he's confident to have fully regrown his hair. He has just added Folligen cream to try making some vellus hairs terminal.

Check this thread below which I posted on how to order, if you get stuck just email me jass897@hotmail.com I normally make time to reply to my emails after work.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

----------


## doke

Many thanks jazz I forgot to add are you or have you tried ru?

----------


## Jazz1

> Many thanks jazz I forgot to add are you or have you tried ru?


 Hey yes bro I have tried RU58841 at 5% gave me sexual sides, which is a good thing as it helped with my hairloss. I realised from hairlosshelp from the old time posters to keep DUT than RU as last resort. So now I keep 5G of RU from Anagen in my freezer fresh batch every year and I also keep Neogenic as the vehicle for emergency if FIN ever stops working.

----------


## doke

Jazz I see your pics and your loss as you are way younger than me is not too bad but you regrew that bald spot on crown would you say what you use is better than ru and minox together?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz I see your pics and your loss as you are way younger than me is not too bad but you regrew that bald spot on crown would you say what you use is better than ru and minox together?


 As stated previously RU58841 in my eyes is the most powerful tool we have against Hairloss. My spots never grew back when I added the igrow and 10% promox DMI which I started in January 2014, they only grew back when I added the combination of 1% hydrocortisone/2% microconozate plus cutting wheat/Derma roller in March 2014.

Also to add I applied the cream first than sprayed the 10% DMI over the areas I applied the cream, probably the DMI helped absorb the hydrocortisone deep beneath the tissue.

Now here is the funny part people may criticise it was the 1% hydrocortisone that worked, I very less doubt this as my Tenant tried this alone and it never worked he still has AA. I still stand by Mark as he has been 100% right from day one, you have to target Hairloss at all angles, synergy effect.

----------


## Jazz1

Susan has just added some new product range to her hairloss category for anyone interested in organic hairloss shampoo and conditioner;

http://www.maapgh.com/hair.html

More information can be found on her website aswell as her other Great products such as Acetyl Glutathione, Vitamin E, Biotin, progesteone, Vitamin C mixtures.


Shampoos and Conditioners for
Hair Care and Hair Loss
*
Daily Shampoo 8oz 
This shampoo is formulated with refreshing Aloe Vera gel, calendula oil, chamomile extract, and pure & natural essential oils. Sea Buckthorn helps add balance and strength while the Orange Essential Oil blend works as an antioxidant. This shampoo with its natural ingredients gently cleanses your hair leaving it soft and manageable. It is free of parabens & sulfates with no harmful chemicals and is a gentle shampoo for frequent use for all hair types.
Directions: Wet hair, then massage shampoo into scalp and hair concentrating on the ends of the hair, work into a rich lather, then rinse. Best to follow with Daily Conditioner.
Ingredients: Purified water, certified Organic aloe vera gel, coconut wax, corn sugars, MSM, vegetable protein, vitamin B complex, vitamin C, vitamin E, sea buckthorn, saw palmetto extract, vegetable glycerin, certified organic chamomile extract, guar gum, certified organic lavender hydrosol, certified organic jojoba oil, wintergreen oil, l-arginine, potassium sorbate, kelp extract, calendula extract, comfret extract, rosemary extract, sage extract, soap bard extract, orange essential oil blend.

Daily Conditioner 8oz 
This conditioner is a light conditioner perfect for all hair types. Sea Buckthorn helps add balance and strength, while the Orange Essential Oil blend works as an antioxidant. This conditioner provides manageable hair, helps condition the scalp and leaves your hair healthy and silky. It is also free of parabens & sulfates with no harmful chemicals.
Directions: Apply all over hair, focusing mostly on the ends. Leave in as desired, and then rinse. Use daily to strengthen hair root to tip.
Ingredients: Purified water, coconut oil blend with emulsifiers and sugars, coconut fatty acid cream base, guar gum, MSM, aloe vera extract, vitamin B5, vitamin C, vitamin E, biotin, sea buckthorn, rosemary extract, sage extract, horsetail extract, amino acid complex, vegetable glycoprotein, orange essential oil blend.

Stimulating Shampoo for Hair Loss Therapy 8oz 
This shampoo contains peppermint, L-Arginine (an amino acid), eucalyptus and rosemary. Their revitalizing and nourishing properties increase circulation, adding strength and body. The Wintergreen Oil and Eucalyptus Oil blend stimulates and rejuvenates hair follicles. This shampoo is an invigorating formula used to revitalize dull and lifeless hair while increasing elasticity to prevent breakage. It is also free of parabens & sulfates with no harmful chemicals.
Directions: Wet hair, then massage shampoo into scalp and hair concentrating on the ends of the hair, work into a rich lather, then rinse. Best to follow with Stimulating Conditioner.
Ingredients: Purified water, certified organic aloe vera gel, coconut wax, corn sugars, MSM, vegetable protein, vitamin B complex, vitamin C, vitamin E. saw palmetto extract, vegetable glycerin, certified organic chamomile extract, guar gum, certified organic lavender hydrosol, certified organic jojoba oil, wintergreen oil, l-arginine, eucalyptus oil, kelp extract, calendula extract, comfret extract, sage extract, soap bark extract, soap wart extract, peppermint tea tree essential oil blend.

Stimulating Conditioner for Hair Loss Therapy 8oz
This conditioner formula contains Wintergreen Oil, L-Arginine (an amino acid), and Rosemary. Their revitalizing and nourishing properties increase circulation, adding strength and body. Increased circulation helps promote fuller, stronger and more vibrant hair. The Rosemary Extract blend helps stimulate hair follicles, encouraging hair growth. This conditioner is an invigorating formula of peppermint, rosemary and eucalyptus for fuller, stronger hair with radiant shine. It is also free of parabens & sulfates with pure and natural essential oils.
Directions: Massage conditioner through clean, damp hair. Leave on for 1-2 minutes, then rinse. For best results, start with Stimulating Shampoo.
Ingredients: Purified water, certified organic aloe vera juice, coconut wax, corn sugars, coconut fatty acid cream base, MSM, vitamin B5, l-arginine, certified organic jojoba oil, willow bark extract, niacin, wintergreen oil, saw palmetto extract, vegetable glycerin, certified organic chamomile extract, eucalyptus oil, guar gum, peppermint tea tree essential oil blend.

Progesterone Leave-In Treatment 8oz 
This treatment contains organic chamomile extract, organic sage extract, organic nettle extract, and organic lavender extract to strengthen, protect, and repair distressed hair adding shine and manageability. It also contains Progesterone. Organic chamomile revitalizes as it conditions the hair and scalp. Organic nettle extract adds natural gloss, and may be a good “tonic” for the hair. This treatment is an ultra-light formula that detangles hair while offering all-day defense without dulling residues. Daily use will leave hair feeling smooth and manageable, adding strength and shine. It is also free of parabens & sulfates with pure and natural oils. Progesterone is an alpha-reductase inhibitor which decreases production of DHT, the stronger Testosterone associated with Hair Loss. This product may also prevent hair loss by limiting excess DHT.
Directions: After shampoo and conditioner, squeeze any excess water out of hair and lightly towel dry. Massage a dime size dab into scalp once daily. Leave in for 15 minutes, then rinse.
Ingredients: Progesterone USP, purified water, organic aloe vera gel, coconut wax, palm oil compound, vitamin B5, comfrey extract, organic jojoba oil, canola oil compound, organic rosemary extract, organic horsetail extract, organic nettle extract, organic lavender extract, biotin, soy protein, vitamin C, potassium sorbate, glycerin, grapefruit essential oil blend.
*
*
What’s in our shampoos and conditioners?
MSM- methylsulfonylmethane - MSM provides sulfur, a fundamental building block of joints, cartilage, skin, hair and nails, and methyl groups, which support many vital biochemical processes in the body, including energy production. MSM is a naturally-occurring nutrient found in small amounts of many foods. It has anti-inflammatory and pain reducing properties, and can block pain response in nerve fibers. MSM can also reduce scar tissue by altering the cross linking process in collagen to allow tissue repair and healing to take place.
Omega 3 - There is a strong link between Omega 3 and skin health. Omega 3 fats play a significant role in reducing inflammation on our skin and in our bodies. Omega 3 helps to replenish oils on the skin that may be lost from exposure to wind and sun causing skin dryness or flaking. There are also various skin conditions that can benefit from Omega 3 including eczema, dermatitis and psoriasis. Moreover, the detoxification properties of Omega 3 help to make the skin look brighter and more radiant.
Borage Seed Oil - Borage seed oil is one of the richest sources of GLA (Gamma-Linoleic Acid), a therapeutic Omega-6 essential fatty acid and has been studied for its benefit of dry skin, eczema and psoriasis.
Sea Buckthorn - Sea buckthorn contains palmitoleic acid, also a Omega-7 fatty acid and is rich in vitamins such as C, E and amino acids. Omega 7 is also present in human skin making Sea Buckthorn a natural choice for moisture replenishment in hair and body. Sea Buckthorn will help promote hair growth, renew dry hair, add shine and has U-V blocking properties.
Broccoli Seed Oil - While Broccoli is usually thought of as a healthy vegetable and fibrous plant, its seed contains an interesting and beneficial fatty acid. This fatty acid’s composition closely resembles silicone but is plant derived. It gives shine and gloss to dull and lifeless hair. Broccoli seed oil is becoming increasingly popular as an organic option to silicone in all natural hair care products where shine and luster is needed.
Macadamia Nut Oil - Also rich in Omegas, Macadamia nut oil is a highly nutritive and emollient oil. It closely resembles sebum, the oil our bodies and scalp naturally produce. We use Macadamia nut oil in our restorative hair care products for its compatibility with the body and restoration to hair in need of nourishment.

What’s NOT in it?
No Artificial Fragrances - We use only essential oils, the pure essence of a plant. Essential oils have been found to provide both psychological and physical benefits when applied to the skin.
No Sodium Lauryl Sulfate - Sodium Lauryl Sulfate is a harsh detergent that strips the skin's moisture barrier (which is linked to immunity and skin health) and may cause serious health problems during testing. It is also known to form nitrosamines, a potent carcinogen.
No Parabens - Parabens are chemicals, such as methyl, propyl, butyl and ethyl and can be found in 90 percent of all skin care products and cosmetics. Studies suggest they may interfere with the body's endocrine system, which is made up of glands that produce and secrete hormones. Parabens can also imitate the estrogen hormone, influencing high levels in the body, which may be linked to breast cancer.
Gluten Free - Our Vitamin E is not sourced from wheat germ but instead is sourced from soy; a consideration to our customers who are sensitive to wheat products.
Vegan - No animal ingredients in our products.
No Harmful Chemicals - We use the purest all natural and organic ingredients available. All of the ingredients are simple and recognizable.

----------


## Eire1980

Jazz..can susan formulas be changed to suit individuals or are they set ingredients? .cheers

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz..can susan formulas be changed to suit individuals or are they set ingredients? .cheers


 Hey anything can be changed and formulated lower ingredients, some guys are using lower dosage 0.05% finesteride.

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## MJC1967

After a month of using Susan's this is my report. Her foam is 50ml Dr Klein was 150ml. Her base for the foam is not as good very liquidy. Went through it in about 2 weeks. If you are using this for a small spot maybe you can get a lot more. I also used the lotion and again did not last and was hard to spread over a larger area. Prices are a lot more cause you need a lot more. The lack of biotinyol hurts as well and it seems you cannot get that product from the USA at this time. That was key to front and side growth. I am now trying the Glutathione product as well which is another 49.95 for a small bottle. So far not very impressed at how long everything lasts. I am ordering from Tony at Kleins again and should get my 150ml 10% foam Monday or Tuesday. I will also give the Glutathione update after more time. Also trying the vitamin C serum as well. So exhausting all options at the moment.

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## Jazz1

Hey sorry to hear that unfortunately for most of us this is the only option we have and from my experience so far I'm very happy as I'm getting more results. As for the lotion I tend to
Use 0.050ml which works the same as 1ml.

Have you been losing ground since? Any chance you could post pictures of her foam lets see how big it looks?

----------


## MJC1967

Hey Jazz I will try to get some pictures this weekend, just to update I ordered 100ml still not 150 and the she will not put everything into the foam either, but got it for 79 but won't ship for a week. I had a long conversation with Kleins new Doc, I like her. They are now based out of Florida. What is your email Jazz?

----------


## Parsia

Hi Guys , Have an update to you.

I have talked to tony today , regards my order , since I fill the consultation form and nobody called me back.

He gave me a number of doctor which looks located in Florida , I Asked him many question regarding to Promox.

They working with a new pharmacist now and he told me its a very big pharmacy , I also google it and see that on google map and it

looks very legit , I also told him that jazz introduced me to promox , He is a very nice guy and he told me there is not any discount now 

, He told me the shipping cost is around 10 $ which is good. I asked him about  biotinyl tripeptide-1 and he said they don't have it now 

and they will still work on it , He promised me the new pharmacist will make the promox like past ( before DR.Klein died ) , the name of

the doctor who made it now is  :Big Grin: R.TRACY Leonhardt 

I just wanna give you guys update , and thanks again jazz for helping all us through this thread and your hard work.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz I will try to get some pictures this weekend, just to update I ordered 100ml still not 150 and the she will not put everything into the foam either, but got it for 79 but won't ship for a week. I had a long conversation with Kleins new Doc, I like her. They are now based out of Florida. What is your email Jazz?


 Jass897@hotmail.com, your lucky to be based in US, yes please would be nice to see comparison of size.

I'm confused I thought she did 50ml only? What additives did you add?

----------


## Jazz1

I just emailed her to see exactly what has been going on and see if anything can be done to help you further.

----------


## MJC1967

**update** I just spoke to Susan again and after a long discussion and because of her high standards she is going to hold off on the foam until further testing can be done. She is super nice on the phone and 100% goes out of her way to make you happy. I think I am going to try the cream at a higher dose minox next and definitely going to keep using the Glutathione mix. I will update again in another month or so.

----------


## Jazz1

What are you currently using? I would stick with the lotion mixture as honestly I'm getting the exact same results with more noticeable hairs gaining length around my temples from when I was using promox.

----------


## doke

jazz im perplexed you say ru caused you problems reading a lot of data ru is not supposed to go systemic at 5% as that's why when testing took place it was flutamide that was the problem.
Now please can you tell me what of susans products do you use? how much does it cost you per month? and finally do I have to pay a consultation fee if so what is the cost? and how do I order can it be done by email as I did contact her once with no reply?

----------


## Jazz1

> jazz im perplexed you say ru caused you problems reading a lot of data ru is not supposed to go systemic at 5% as that's why when testing took place it was flutamide that was the problem.
> Now please can you tell me what of susans products do you use? how much does it cost you per month? and finally do I have to pay a consultation fee if so what is the cost? and how do I order can it be done by email as I did contact her once with no reply?


 
Hey Doke I have Always been sensitive to hairloss medication and as stated I truly beleive RU is our final bullet.

I currently use the same mixture As Promox;

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride
5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesteone 
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% Hydocortisone.
Although on my next order I will add DMI.

I always buy 3 bottles as that is the maximum I can purchase from Susan in one go, her product is lab tested for efficacy and expriry, each bottle expires after 180 days. If you purchase 3 bottles each costing $89 all the additives which will last you 6 months, plus you get discount for buying 3. The prescription from The Medical Wellnes Center is $49 for 6 month supply, so allowing you to purchase 3 bottles.

If your looking to order email me so I can give you my number as I'm from London that way I can help you out etc, jass897@hotmail.com

----------


## Parsia

> Hey Doke I have Always been sensitive to hairloss medication and as stated I truly beleive RU is our final bullet.
> 
> I currently use the same mixture As Promox;
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finesteride
> 5% azelaic acid
> 0.25% progesteone 
> 0.025% tretinoin
> ...


 Hello Jazz , they have run the special for prescription 49 $ to make it free for holiday , Can we still use that promotion or has it ended?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hello Jazz , they have run the special for prescription 49 $ to make it free for holiday , Can we still use that promotion or has it ended?


 She did offer to extend it untl end of January, I believe today is the last day  :Frown: .

----------


## Parsia

> She did offer to extend it untl end of January, I believe today is the last day .


 Thanks Jazz , Oh no , You know I use lipogaine with good result but I was thinking to use both lipogaine and promox together , Once in the morning and once in the evening , I hope she will extend it again , Otherwise I may give a shot and try dr.klein promox. Take Care Jazz.

----------


## doke

> Hey Doke I have Always been sensitive to hairloss medication and as stated I truly beleive RU is our final bullet.
> 
> I currently use the same mixture As Promox;
> 
> 15% minoxidil
> 0.1% finesteride
> 5% azelaic acid
> 0.25% progesteone 
> 0.025% tretinoin
> ...


 Many thanks jazz I am tempted to try it are you tempted to get back on ru perhaps a smaller dose.

----------


## Jazz1

> Many thanks jazz I am tempted to try it are you tempted to get back on ru perhaps a smaller dose.


 Hey Doke after researching and being a member On hairlosshelp for the past 4 years I come to the conclusion from the old members that RU58841 is a last resort. Most of them used FIN for years until things started to go downhill, they than switch to DUT which had prolonged them another 5-7 years. Now most of them are on RU58841, this is there last option left to save their hair. 

So I'm going to hold out as I need to prolong and try saving my hair most my life, I always try thinking positive about better treatments in the next 5 years but I rather play safe just incase this does not happen.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys this year I have been dreaming and thinking Big, my dream before I die is to try and find a cure for this nasty disease and give this FREE to everyone. Now I know sometimes dreams do not come true but there's no harm in thinking positive! 

I was on the phone to Susan and she has been constantly researching about MPB, shes trying to research in synergy effects as hairloss is more than one factor. She's onto something so who knows, we discussed few interesting points, PDG2, DKK-1, T3, SODs etc. 

I will keep you guys informed, let's pray she can come up with something good to help cure this disease.

----------


## Parsia

> Hey guys this year I have been dreaming and thinking Big, my dream before I die is to try and find a cure for this nasty disease and give this FREE to everyone. Now I know sometimes dreams do not come true but there's no harm in thinking positive! 
> 
> I was on the phone to Susan and she has been constantly researching about MPB, shes trying to research in synergy effects as hairloss is more than one factor. She's onto something so who knows, we discussed few interesting points, PDG2, DKK-1, T3, SODs etc. 
> 
> I will keep you guys informed, let's pray she can come up with something good to help cure this disease.


 We all happy to have you here Jazz , You know how much I like you , I read every post of you and sometimes just come online to check

If you post anything , I personally really appreciated all you helped me these last couple of months , I feel more better from all 

Information you gaved me , Take Care bro and wish you the best  :Smile:  So Long.

----------


## Plan C

> Hey guys this year I have been dreaming and thinking Big, my dream before I die is to try and find a cure for this nasty disease and give this FREE to everyone. Now I know sometimes dreams do not come true but there's no harm in thinking positive! 
> 
> I was on the phone to Susan and she has been constantly researching about MPB, shes trying to research in synergy effects as hairloss is more than one factor. She's onto something so who knows, we discussed few interesting points, PDG2, DKK-1, T3, SODs etc. 
> 
> I will keep you guys informed, let's pray she can come up with something good to help cure this disease.


 We all appreciate your efforts

----------


## Jazz1

> We all appreciate your efforts


 Thank you, pray to God be positive one day we will find a CURE for all of us ourselves  :Smile: .

Oh watch my next thread as I still am typing away to create, how I helped save my friends mum who had terminal full body cancer at 66.

----------


## Jazz1

Right for the past few weeks I have been discussing about more topical lotions to target hairloss at all angles. Mark was right from day one and I have discussed with Susan about more variety products since she is the compounding pharmacist with vast experience along with her team.

She has been trying to help me in finding ways to combat hairloss and I think she is superb in every aspect of listening, especially to my concerns about wanting to help others!

Anyways she has been looking into proven studies and Dr Klein had been looking into the same aspect of products to target hairloss.

I received an email from her and I was extremely excited when she mentioned about formulating topical Melatonin, fingers crossed we can have another great topical formulated by her along with the other topicals she has recently added to her site;


http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/hair.html

MELATONIN DOWNREGULATES ANDROGEN RECEPTOR ACTIVITY 

*Another potentially useful agent for hair loss prevention and/or treatment may be right under our noses. Recent studies out of prostate research have shown melatonin to downregulate androgen and estrogen receptor activity, the activity of which is directly related to hormonal hair loss. Studies in various animal species have shown a dramatic increase in hair and fur production in response to the administration of melatonin.
*****
Differential regulation by melatonin of cell growth and androgen receptor binding to the androgen response element in prostate cancer cells.
Rimler A, Lupowitz Z, Zisapel N.
Department of Neurobiochemistry, The George S. Wise Faculty of Life Sciences, Tel Aviv University; Tel Aviv 69978 Israel.
OBJECTIVES: The pineal hormone melatonin inhibits the growth of benign human prostate epithelial cells and the androgen-dependent prostate cancer LNCaP cells. In the androgen-nonresponsive prostate carcinoma PC3 cells melatonin inhibits cell growth only at high but not low cell density. We have recently found that melatonin causes nuclear exclusion of the AR and attenuates it transcriptional activity in LNCaP cells as well as PC3 cells stably transfected with a wild type AR expressing vector (PC3-AR). The aim of this study was to investigate whether melatonin inhibits effects of AR on cell growth in PC3-AR cells and whether inhibition of AR DNA binding is involved. METHODS: The effects of androgen, melatonin and their combination on the growth of the PC3-AR cells and on AR DNA binding in PC3-AR and LNCaP cells were studied. RESULTS: DHT suppressed cell growth in the PC3-AR cells and enhanced AR binding to the androgen responsive element (ARE). Melatonin had no effect on cell growth in the absence of DHT but counteracted the androgen-induced inhibition at low androgen concentrations. Melatonin did not suppress and even slightly enhanced the capacity of AR binding to the ARE in the PC3-AR as well as in LNCaP cells. CONCLUSIONS: Attenuation by melatonin of AR activity in the prostate cancer cells is not due to suppression of AR binding to the ARE, and is presumably caused by its effects on AR protein interaction and intracellular trafficking.
***** 
Melatonin elicits nuclear exclusion of the human androgen receptor and attenuates its activity.
Rimler A, Culig Z, Levy-Rimler G, Lupowitz Z, Klocker H, Matzkin H, Bartsch G, Zisapel N.
Department of Neurobiochemistry, The George S. Wise Faculty of Life Sciences, Tel Aviv University, Tel Aviv, Israel.
BACKGROUND: The androgen receptor (AR) promotes growth and functionality of androgen sensitive benign and cancer tissues. The pineal hormone melatonin is an androgen protagonist in vivo and in vitro. The interference of melatonin in the AR cascade was explored. METHODS: The effects of melatonin on AR expression, level, agonist and androgen-response element (ARE) binding, reporter gene activity and intracellular localization were explored in prostate cancer LNCaP cell line. RESULTS: Melatonin increased immunoreactive AR cells in the absence and presence of dihydrotestosterone. Despite this increase and maintenance of AR agonist binding capacity, the androgen-induced reporter gene activity and suppression of AR-mRNA were attenuated.
***** Immunocytochemical analysis and subcellular fractionation studies revealed nuclear exclusion of AR by melatonin. 
CONCLUSIONS: The melatonin-mediated nuclear exclusion of the AR may explain the attenuation of AR activity in the prostate cancer cells. This is the first demonstration of a hormone-induced mislocalization of the AR in prostate epithelial cells and may represent a novel route for regulating AR activity. Copyright 2001 Wiley-Liss, Inc.
***** *The doses used to downregulate androgen receptor activity is very high, and involved the equivilant of 1mg per every kilogram of bodyweight. However the sleep effects of melatonin are not dose dependent, (3mg works as well as 50mg.), and the same possibly apply to androgen receptor activity as well.

----------


## Reign

Hi Jazz,

May want to show her this as well if she hasn't seen it: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed...latonin%20hair

Topical melatonin for treatment of androgenetic alopecia.

Authors
Fischer TW1, Trüeb RM, Hänggi G, Innocenti M, Elsner P.

Int J Trichology. 2012 Oct;4(4):236-45.

Abstract
BACKGROUND: In the search for alternative agents to oral finasteride and topical minoxidil for the treatment of androgenetic alopecia (AGA), melatonin, a potent antioxidant and growth modulator, was identified as a promising candidate based on in vitro and in vivo studies.

MATERIALS AND METHODS: One pharmacodynamic study on topical application of melatonin and four clinical pre-post studies were performed in patients with androgenetic alopecia or general hair loss and evaluated by standardised questionnaires, TrichoScan, 60-second hair count test and hair pull test.

RESULTS: FIVE CLINICAL STUDIES SHOWED POSITIVE EFFECTS OF A TOPICAL MELATONIN SOLUTION IN THE TREATMENT OF AGA IN MEN AND WOMEN WHILE SHOWING GOOD TOLERABILITY: (1) Pharmacodynamics under once-daily topical application in the evening showed no significant influence on endogenous serum melatonin levels. (2) An observational study involving 30 men and women showed a significant reduction in the degree of severity of alopecia after 30 and 90 days (P < 0.001) based on questionnaires completed by investigators and patients. (3) Using a digital software-supported epiluminescence technique (TrichoScan) in 35 men with AGA, after 3 and 6 months in 54.8% to 58.1% of the patients a significant increase of hair density of 29% and 41%, respectively was measured (M0: 123/cm(2); M3: 159/cm(2); M6: 173/cm(2)) (P < 0,001). (4) In 60 men and women with hair loss, a significant reduction in hair loss was observed in women, while hair loss in men remained constant (P < 0.001). (5) In a large, 3-month, multi-center study with more than 1800 volunteers at 200 centers, the percentage of patients with a 2- to 3-fold positive hair-pull test decreased from 61.6% to 7.8%, while the percentage of patients with a negative hair-pull test increased from 12.2.% to 61.5% (P < 0.001). In addition, a decrease in seborrhea and seborrheic dermatitis of the scalp was observed.

CONCLUSIONS: Since safety and tolerability in all of the studies was good, the topical application of a cosmetic melatonin solution can be considered as a treatment option in androgenetic alopecia.

----------


## ledhead

Jazz what do you recommend I try? I currently use RU in Neo and minoxidil. Hairline needs the most help and I am a diffuse thinner. NW2.5ish

Something that dries fast would be nice. If I could add RU to it it would be a big plus too.

----------


## ledhead

What's the difference between the Promox and Remox IV? They both appear to have the same ingredients.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz what do you recommend I try? I currently use RU in Neo and minoxidil. Hairline needs the most help and I am a diffuse thinner. NW2.5ish
> 
> Something that dries fast would be nice. If I could add RU to it it would be a big plus too.


 Hey Plan C here uses both RU58841 and Susan's lotion mixture, I'm not in a place to suggest products as RU in my eyes is the most powerfull tool we have currently.

----------


## Jazz1

> What's the difference between the Promox and Remox IV? They both appear to have the same ingredients.


 Hey I do not use Promox anymore since Dr Klein passed away I now use Susan's mixture which consists of the following;

15% minoxidol 
0.1% finesteride
5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesteone
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% Hydocortisone 
DMI.

How is your hairloss currently? Are you still thinning or has the loss stabilised? Post your full regime including RU.

----------


## doke

Hi Jazz I wonder can medical wellness center formulate a 2% tretinoin sensitive formula minoxidil? also I know you live in uk do you have to pay a customs charge or can you send orders as a gift which then you do not pay import charge?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz I wonder can medical wellness center formulate a 2% tretinoin sensitive formula minoxidil? also I know you live in uk do you have to pay a customs charge or can you send orders as a gift which then you do not pay import charge?


 I'm not sure I will call Susan to find out but I think 2% maybe be way too strong as 0.025% stings my scalp! 

As for customs all depends as the first time I got hit but the second time I was fine, I think she changed the package wording slightly which may have helped.

----------


## doke

Hi Jazz I did not mean tretinoin 2% but minoxidil? I think that the lewenberg formula is 2% minox with 0.25% tretinoin but it would be better to also add hydrocortisone as well.

----------


## doke

I forgot lewenberg does a sensitive formula as well.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz I did not mean tretinoin 2% but minoxidil? I think that the lewenberg formula is 2% minox with 0.25% tretinoin but it would be better to also add hydrocortisone as well.


 Yes adding Hydocortisone is beneficial and I'm sure she can formulate 2%, I will find out today.

----------


## doke

Many thanks jazz have you seen baldspot com take a look at the pictures of regrowth.

----------


## Jazz1

> Many thanks jazz have you seen baldspot com take a look at the pictures of regrowth.


 Send me a link please  :Smile: .

----------


## doke

> Send me a link please .


 Hi Jazz I hope this link works  www.baldspot.com

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz I hope this link works  www.baldspot.com


 Thanks il check it later  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Anyone wish to track Andy Hairloss he works with me  :Smile: .

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...growth-Journey

----------


## balding1983

I think Susan's product has a good mixture of ingredients. What would be great is of the mixture contained androgen receptor blocker like Spironolactone. I have tried the topical spironolactone before and it wasn't very practical to use. If it come in the lotion with the other ingradients, it would be awesome. 
Is this possible?

----------


## Jazz1

Guys sorry I been away had so much stress recently but things are finally getting sorted, I will reply to any emily and questions in next few days, thanks.

----------


## Jazz1

> I think Susan's product has a good mixture of ingredients. What would be great is of the mixture contained androgen receptor blocker like Spironolactone. I have tried the topical spironolactone before and it wasn't very practical to use. If it come in the lotion with the other ingradients, it would be awesome. 
> Is this possible?


 The problem with Spiromolactone it is very weak anti androgen, you are better of ordering from ************ as genhair seems to have vanished.

What is your current regime?

----------


## nick400

Jazz i am interested in these products. Where do i start?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz i am interested in these products. Where do i start?


 You start here bro  :Smile: ,

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=

Tell me more about what you are currently using? So I can try my best to help you from my experience  :Smile: .

----------


## nick400

> You start here bro ,
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...%21&highlight=
> 
> Tell me more about what you are currently using? So I can try my best to help you from my experience .


 I used fin for about 2 and a half years. Used minoxidil for about 2 years on and off. I stopped fin about 9 months ago. Stopped minoxidil over a year and a half ago. I stopped fin because of sexual side effects. I stopped minoxidil because of bloated face and dark circles. I am currently on nothing and have lost alot of ground. Will getting on this treatment get some of my hair back i lost from stopping treatment?

----------


## Jazz1

> I used fin for about 2 and a half years. Used minoxidil for about 2 years on and off. I stopped fin about 9 months ago. Stopped minoxidil over a year and a half ago. I stopped fin because of sexual side effects. I stopped minoxidil because of bloated face and dark circles. I am currently on nothing and have lost alot of ground. Will getting on this treatment get some of my hair back i lost from stopping treatment?


 Right that explains your rapid loss, I know a guy Aron in the uk is using the lotion mixture and he has regained all his hair back from when stopping his previous treatment. All depends do you wish to add topical Finetseride? Maybe start on a lower dosage like 0.025% Finetseride in the lotion mixture, take some horny goat weed and zinc daily to help counter sides. As for the bloated face I'm going by what Aron has told me he used Belgravia treatment and had bloated face, since using Susan mixture at 5% and now 7.5% he has been totally fine. So I would go with 5% minoxidil mixture as that would work out much cheaper for yourself and most probably help with your concerns.

You could go with:

5% minoxidil
0.025% Finetseride
5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesteone
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% Hydocortisone 

As stated the 5% minoxidil is at a fixed price so adding all the additives is part of their fixed price range!

----------


## nick400

> Right that explains your rapid loss, I know a guy Aron in the uk is using the lotion mixture and he has regained all his hair back from when stopping his previous treatment. All depends do you wish to add topical Finetseride? Maybe start on a lower dosage like 0.025% Finetseride in the lotion mixture, take some horny goat weed and zinc daily to help counter sides. As for the bloated face I'm going by what Aron has told me he used Belgravia treatment and had bloated face, since using Susan mixture at 5% and now 7.5% he has been totally fine. So I would go with 5% minoxidil mixture as that would work out much cheaper for yourself and most probably help with your concerns.
> 
> You could go with:
> 
> 5% minoxidil
> 0.025% Finetseride
> 5% azelaic acid
> 0.25% progesteone
> 0.025% tretinoin
> ...


 would topical fin give me the same side effects? so with that regimen would i need to add RU as well, or is that regimen enough to prevent future hairloss + regrowth

----------


## Jazz1

> would topical fin give me the same side effects? so with that regimen would i need to add RU as well, or is that regimen enough to prevent future hairloss + regrowth


 I am going by my own experience and by few others, when I first took oral Fin I had major sides, by using a lower dosage topically I had minimal sides, which  I could bare but also save my hair. I used 0.025% topically and was able to allow my body to adjust until I could eventually jump on 1mg. You do not need RU58841 as that's an over kill and plus it's more potent, I would leave RU as last resort that's what I have done.

During the time you used Finesteride for 2 and half years did you experience sexual sides this whole time? Or just after 2 years? how bad we're your side effects?

----------


## Dimoxynil

Hey Jazz, just ordered a 15% lotion from Susan on the website you sited. I haven't received a confirmation email from them yet. Is that normal ? I live in the UK so perhaps I will receive it during US working hours ? Thanks Jazz

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, just ordered a 15% lotion from Susan on the website you sited. I haven't received a confirmation email from them yet. Is that normal ? I live in the UK so perhaps I will receive it during US working hours ? Thanks Jazz


 Hey did you pay for the prescription and the products or just the prescription from The Medicall Wellnes Center?

What do you currently use for Hairloss and what additives have you added in the 15% mixture? 

Oh by the way I'm from London, to help you further I need to know what you have ordered or filled out etc? Also post your current regime so I can help and guide you to get the maximum regrowth and thickness.

Send me an email if you want to talk via Watts App considering your in the uk; jass897@hotmail.com

----------


## Jazz1

I just spoke to Tonya for you she has had your prescription come through this morning so will be in touch. As above did you not want to add finesteride? What are you currently using? Here's her email, send her an email direct or call them to discuss your order to make payment etc.
As stated before I would buy 3 bottles if your international like me as this last you 6 moths plus you get 10% discount and save on shipping if you was to order regular.

tonya@maapgh.com
Uk Tel: 001-412-421-4996

----------


## nick400

> I am going by my own experience and by few others, when I first took oral Fin I had major sides, by using a lower dosage topically I had minimal sides, which  I could bare but also save my hair. I used 0.025% topically and was able to allow my body to adjust until I could eventually jump on 1mg. You do not need RU58841 as that's an over kill and plus it's more potent, I would leave RU as last resort that's what I have done.
> 
> During the time you used Finesteride for 2 and half years did you experience sexual sides this whole time? Or just after 2 years? how bad we're your side effects?


 It was about after a year i got the side effects. Is there a contact number in which i can talk further about this

----------


## Jazz1

> It was about after a year i got the side effects. Is there a contact number in which i can talk further about this


 Yea sure email me jass897@hotmail.com.

----------


## Dimoxynil

> Hey did you pay for the prescription and the products or just the prescription from The Medicall Wellnes Center?
> 
> What do you currently use for Hairloss and what additives have you added in the 15% mixture? 
> 
> Oh by the way I'm from London, to help you further I need to know what you have ordered or filled out etc? Also post your current regime so I can help and guide you to get the maximum regrowth and thickness.
> 
> Send me an email if you want to talk via Watts App considering your in the uk; jass897@hotmail.com


 I live in London also. Atm I'm on Fin (.25 mg EOD) min (5%) and niz ( 2-3 times per week) just got the email. What sort of results do you normally get with these minoxidil formulas ?

----------


## Jazz1

> I live in London also. Atm I'm on Fin (.25 mg EOD) min (5%) and niz ( 2-3 times per week) just got the email. What sort of results do you normally get with these minoxidil formulas ?


 Right and how is your Hairloss currently? Stable? Depending if you have stabilised your loss with Finesteride. Majority people I know who have been using these mixtures like me have had great results. 

I'm just at work now so will reply in more detail tonight, as stated it is better for you to buy 3 lotion bottles to last you 6 months and if you do make sure they give you 10% discount!

----------


## Dimoxynil

I'm basically a NW3, getting thin. I think fin has stabilised my loss but I'm on a small dosage (.25 mg EOD) which I think will need to be increased if I want to keep it stable. 

When I was younger I was a good responder to minoxidil but it's effects at 5% now probably do very little. I'm willing to try this minox formula. What sort of results are achievable if any ? Thanks

----------


## Jazz1

Right from my own experience I personally do not think minoxidil loses it's effect I think the lower dosage is not probably helping enough to counter the miniaturisation of DHT long term. I would recommend purchase Regenepure Dr shampoo to rotate with nizoral. If you feel you can handle higher dosage FIN and your Hairloss has stabilised than I think these mixtures will help a lot as they contain growth stimulants, anti androgens and DHT blockers.

----------


## Dimoxynil

> Right from my own experience I personally do not think minoxidil loses it's effect I think the lower dosage is not probably helping enough to counter the miniaturisation of DHT long term. I would recommend purchase Regenepure Dr shampoo to rotate with nizoral. If you feel you can handle higher dosage FIN and your Hairloss has stabilised than I think these mixtures will help a lot as they contain growth stimulants, anti androgens and DHT blockers.


 Thanks for the advice. Regenepure was something I was looking into yes.

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for the advice. Regenepure was something I was looking into yes.


 I highly recommend it best shampoo I have ever used! Hope it all works out let me know if you need further assistance  :Smile: .

----------


## doke

Hi Jazz and all a few years ago i tried the lewenberg formula standard and after a couple of days my scalp was red and itchy, as you know jazz i did ask you about a 2% minox with tretinoin but to be fair i think Dr Lewenbergs sensitive formula is just right i have been using about 8 days and so far no irritation and thats using 4 sprays per day.
It does not need to be rubbed in just using like a hair spray, but need to keep it 8-10'' away from scalp it is so easy to use and you need to apply it 4-5 hours apart so you can take it with you and just mist it.
It is not greasy and does not mess up your hair in anyway i do notice small hairs already appearing but need to use for at least 3 months the Dr Does say that you can reduce application when the hair regrowth is stable.
I do know in the hairsite interview with the doctor he says that tretinoin cannot just be added to minoxidil because it becomes unstable he had to perfect it on his patients to get it right and of course over the years was able to offer a lower price and a sensitive formula.
I am on the contract of two bottles per month which in uk including post is £63 and the order through fed express was so quick i received the following week with tracking.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey Doke I hope it works out for you and Dr Klein use to work for Dr Lewenberg as that's what a member Stevo on Hairlosshelp told me. Keep me updated how things go, stay positive I'm sure it will work out for you  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

This is one product I have been dying to try and add to my regime, I have been constantly researching and before Dr Klein passed away I think he was going to do trials on topical Melatonin.

Anyways good news after several emails begging Susan to formulate this for the hairloss community she was convinced by the studies to add his on her wesbite for us guys  :Smile: .

We now have an option to BUY topical Melatonin, so for anyone interested here are the details I will deffinatly be ordering this next month when my funds are better  :Smile: .

http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/hair.html

Studies;


http://193.175.223.222/media/custom/1595_3456_3.PDF


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/23766606/

http://www.pubfacts.com/detail/23766...netic-alopecia.


Int J Trichology. 2012 Oct;4(4):236-45. doi: 10.4103/0974-7753.111199. 
Topical melatonin for treatment of androgenetic alopecia. 
Fischer TW, Trüeb RM, Hänggi G, Innocenti M, Elsner P. 
Source 
Department for Dermatology, Allergology and Venereology, University of Lübeck, Lübeck, Germany. 
Abstract 
BACKGROUND: 
In the search for alternative agents to oral finasteride and topical minoxidil for the treatment of androgenetic alopecia (AGA), melatonin, a potent antioxidant and growth modulator, was identified as a promising candidate based on in vitro and in vivo studies. 
MATERIALS AND METHODS: 
One pharmacodynamic study on topical application of melatonin and four clinical pre-post studies were performed in patients with androgenetic alopecia or general hair loss and evaluated by standardised questionnaires, TrichoScan, 60-second hair count test and hair pull test. 
RESULTS: 
FIVE CLINICAL STUDIES SHOWED POSITIVE EFFECTS OF A TOPICAL MELATONIN SOLUTION IN THE TREATMENT OF AGA IN MEN AND WOMEN WHILE SHOWING GOOD TOLERABILITY: (1) Pharmacodynamics under once-daily topical application in the evening showed no significant influence on endogenous serum melatonin levels. (2) An observational study involving 30 men and women showed a significant reduction in the degree of severity of alopecia after 30 and 90 days (P < 0.001) based on questionnaires completed by investigators and patients. (3) Using a digital software-supported epiluminescence technique (TrichoScan) in 35 men with AGA, after 3 and 6 months in 54.8% to 58.1% of the patients a significant increase of hair density of 29% and 41%, respectively was measured (M0: 123/cm(2); M3: 159/cm(2); M6: 173/cm(2) (P < 0,001). (4) In 60 men and women with hair loss, a significant reduction in hair loss was observed in women, while hair loss in men remained constant (P < 0.001). (5) In a large, 3-month, multi-center study with more than 1800 volunteers at 200 centers, the percentage of patients with a 2- to 3-fold positive hair-pull test decreased from 61.6% to 7.8%, while the percentage of patients with a negative hair-pull test increased from 12.2.% to 61.5% (P < 0.001). In addition, a decrease in seborrhea and seborrheic dermatitis of the scalp was observed. 
CONCLUSIONS: 
Since safety and tolerability in all of the studies was good, the topical application of a cosmetic melatonin solution can be considered as a treatment option in androgenetic alopecia.

----------


## FearTheLoss

I would try it but $30 for 30ml is an absolute rip-off. You can buy quality melatonin for $4 for an entire bottle.

----------


## Jazz1

> I would try it but $30 for 30ml is an absolute rip-off. You can buy quality melatonin for $4 for an entire bottle.


 I already have a cheaper version i boight online for internal use, but so far I can't find any topical melatonin?

----------


## Justinian

So the website says they don't take request from Arkansas, Illinois, and Florida. I had everything planned out and was ready to order. Must be some dumb laws...

----------


## Jazz1

> So the website says they don't take request from Arkansas, Illinois, and Florida. I had everything planned out and was ready to order. Must be some dumb laws...


 There seems to be case with everyone in regards to Florida, they did state they will be opening a clinic in Florida, where are you from?

----------


## Justinian

> There seems to be case with everyone in regards to Florida, they did state they will be opening a clinic in Florida, where are you from?


 Central florida

----------


## Jazz1

> Central florida


 I'm going to email them again for you and see if anything can be done.

----------


## lilpauly

Before

----------


## lilpauly

Now

----------


## Jazz1

Lilpauly also known as Mark truly AMAZING guy he was the one who taught me a lot through my hairloss journey. Today, thanks to him I'm here helping people as much as I can, amazing regrowth bro keep up the good work  :Smile: . 

Cheers to Synergy effect 2015  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Central florida


 There anyway your own Doctor can prescribe you the ingredients and send Susan the script? As The Medical Wellnes Center will not prescribe to anyone in Florida, although Susan will sell to anyone so long as an valid script is provided.

The good news The Medical Wellnes Center will be opening a clinic in Florida, I seriously do not understand these rules?

----------


## buck

Hey Jazz, have you tried the glutathione?

----------


## warner8

I'm using the glut with biotin now; it goes on a bit warm. i just started using it along with susans compounded minox (12.5.5 minox, AA, Retin, cortisone)  for little over a week now, so its too early to tell on either product. i am curious about the topical melatonin, and most likely purchase it just to throw everthing at it at once.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, have you tried the glutathione?


 I did buy it on my last order recently when I bought another 3 lotion bottles, but I asked for Vitamin C to be mixed together. I was refunded the money as the mixture vitamin C and glutathione do not work well mixed together. They work better individual hence why they have started formulating them seperate, so il wait till my next order as I'm from the UK.

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm using the glut with biotin now; it goes on a bit warm. i just started using it along with susans compounded minox (12.5.5 minox, AA, Retin, cortisone)  for little over a week now, so its too early to tell on either product. i am curious about the topical melatonin, and most likely purchase it just to throw everthing at it at once.


 Nice, do you not use any DHT blockers, finesteride?

----------


## warner8

1 mg fin

----------


## Jazz1

> 1 mg fin


 Sweet that's the main bullet, I hope things work out for you bro  :Smile: .

----------


## Hicks

2 months on Susans stuff and I"m doing a heck of a shed.  I use it 3 times a week. I hope it's the higher min.  I am also 5 months out from a PRP treatment.  I hear you see results from PRP in 5.5 months so I doubt it's the PRP doing it. I'm doing another PRP treatment in 4 months with ACELL this time. 

This thread is crazy long.

----------


## Jazz1

> 2 months on Susans stuff and I"m doing a heck of a shed.  I use it 3 times a week. I hope it's the higher min.  I am also 5 months out from a PRP treatment.  I hear you see results from PRP in 5.5 months so I doubt it's the PRP doing it. I'm doing another PRP treatment in 4 months with ACELL this time. 
> 
> This thread is crazy long.


 Hey what ingredients are you using again? What's your full regime? Could be possible shed due to the lotion, all depends what you are currently using.

----------


## Hicks

Murray Avenue = Minox 15%, AA 5%, Fin 0.1%, R.A. 0.025%, HC   (This is what's on the bottle)
Lipogaine every night
Fin- 1mg daily at night
Nizoral Mon Tues Fridays with Revivogen Conditioner

This seems to happen sense I started Susans stuff.  However I did switch to Regenepure NT Shampoo about the same time.  (I use Regenepure DR to replace the Nizoral some days.)

----------


## Jazz1

Good regime, how long you been on lipgaine? Also Regenepure DR is eh more important one since it contains ketaconazole. I think you maybe going through a shed, stay positive it should come back much better  :Wink: .

----------


## warner8

I have not seen a massive shed with susans formula. What I do see is my skin peeling from the effects of the retinol. That is the only change I've seen thus far.




> Good regime, how long you been on lipgaine? Also Regenepure DR is eh more important one since it contains ketaconazole. I think you maybe going through a shed, stay positive it should come back much better .

----------


## Jazz1

> I have not seen a massive shed with susans formula. What I do see is my skin peeling from the effects of the retinol. That is the only change I've seen thus far.


 Seems normal as I had skin peel at the start along with redness and slight stinging, as mentioned in my previous posts this normally subsides after few months. Ideally coconut oil helps if you feel the need to moisture your scalp  :Smile: .

----------


## Hicks

> Good regime, how long you been on lipgaine? Also Regenepure DR is eh more important one since it contains ketaconazole. I think you maybe going through a shed, stay positive it should come back much better .


 Lipgaine 2 years. 

Yeah,  I want sure if anyone experienced this.

----------


## Jazz1

> Lipgaine 2 years. 
> 
> Yeah,  I want sure if anyone experienced this.


  I think some people did shed, I never really bothered keeping an eye on my shed as this would automatically make you feel negative. I would ride it out and see how you go, shedding whilst on new treatments is a good sign  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Susan hairloss FAQ

https://dub124.afx.ms/att/GetAttachm...a5e&oneredir=1



1. What is the consistency of lotion vs. cream?
Lotion is pourable, and cream is more thick. Over time, a lotion could thin down in which we reccommend shaking the bottle with each use. Cream, however, maintains consistency - it does not thin down over time.
2. How often is it applied?
Daily - NOT twice a day
3. How many sprays = 1 ml?
6 sprays
Remember: No Minoxidil over 5% solution due to limited solubility. We do NOT reccommend using both Oral Finasteride and Topical Finasteride together to limit side effects.
How to use other adjunct hair products with Minoxidil Treatments
Melatonin - Apply to the hairline and temples (thickening of hair enhances, growth phase of hair)
Alternate Antioxidant product Acetyl-Glutathione/Biotin 3% and Melatonin 0.1% topical
A-G/Biotin 3%, Vitamin C Serum 20%, or Melatonin 0.1%
-PM at bedtime - First apply one of the above pre-treatments to scalp areas on dry hair around the temples and hairline. Rub in well, wait 5 minutes, then apply Minoxidil treatment
- In the AM, shower, then apply Progesterone Leave-In Treatment three times a week for 10-15 minutes. Wash with Stimulating Shampoo and Conditioner.

----------


## nave13579

Hey Jazz,

My original regime was just 1mg fin every day.  I initially avoided minox due to the mess and not wanting to deal with two applications daily and greasy hair / scalp etc.  Also I was scared as I heard that sometimes it isn't very effective for hairlines.  

However, after 8 months, I decided I wanted to get off fin.  It gave me pretty bad mental side effects - constantly feeling depressed / sad / defeated.  This was a hard way to live for me.

I went down to fin twice a week for almost a month and I feel so much better and happy and confident (minus the hair loss).  But obviously now i am afraid of my hair falling out more rapidly without the fin.

So now I am back up to 1mg fin EOD.  And for about a week now, nightly application of Susan's 15% lotion around my hairline, mixed with:

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride
5% azelaic acid
0.025% progesterone
0.25% tretinoin 

I have noticed a small shed already beginning and more perpetual itchiness around my hairline.

My question is, do you think this itchiness is from Susan's mixture? Or is it maybe from taking fin less regularly?
Also any recommendations and comments are much encouraged!


Thanks very very much for everything you've done on site and thread!

----------


## Jazz1

Hey I will reply tomorrow promise, as I work shifts i need to be up early tomorrow.

----------


## Plan C

> Hey I will reply tonight,  I am at work now .


 Jazz, is there any way I can message you privately about something?

----------


## keisomo

> Hey Jazz,
> 
> My original regime was just 1mg fin every day.  I initially avoided minox due to the mess and not wanting to deal with two applications daily and greasy hair / scalp etc.  Also I was scared as I heard that sometimes it isn't very effective for hairlines.  
> 
> However, after 8 months, I decided I wanted to get off fin.  It gave me pretty bad mental side effects - constantly feeling depressed / sad / defeated.  This was a hard way to live for me.
> 
> I went down to fin twice a week for almost a month and I feel so much better and happy and confident (minus the hair loss).  But obviously now i am afraid of my hair falling out more rapidly without the fin.
> 
> So now I am back up to 1mg fin EOD.  And for about a week now, nightly application of Susan's 15% lotion around my hairline, mixed with:
> ...


 Hey Nave...

I felt compel to reply to you as my first post not only because you're a fellow Torontonian but I had the same issue using the exact same formula last month.  :Smile:  I also had itching all over the scalp after using it for a couple of weeks. I stop and it went away. I tried it again second time and itch came back. Susan called me and nicely offered me a 30ml sample with less aggressive ingredients:  10%Minox, 5%AA and .01HC. It's been two weeks and no itch whatsover. I've now waiting to hear back from her whether I need to redo my prescription and if I should add RA and PROG. I don't need FIN because I'm already taking proscar.

Too bad now I have 3 bottles of expensive hair product i can't use...the thing we do to keep our hair.  :Smile: 

Good luck Nave...

----------


## Hicks

I should clarify I take 1.25 fin 4 days then use Susan's stuff on the days I don't take fin. truthfully it's very hard to see your progress change without pictures.  I guess I should start doing that.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I'm sorry i am a bit behind and I hate making excuses, but at the same time I hate replying from my iPhone! After tommorow I will have 3 days free from work, again working shift work is difficult , as I prefer to reply on my iPad or laptop than my bloody iPhone spell corrector!

I will reply thoroughly tommorow as I will have free time and not be tired  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys will be free late tonight and will take time to reply, I do apologise life's been very hectic due to my car project and work!, have good evening  :Smile: .

----------


## Justinian

> There anyway your own Doctor can prescribe you the ingredients and send Susan the script? As The Medical Wellnes Center will not prescribe to anyone in Florida, although Susan will sell to anyone so long as an valid script is provided.
> 
> The good news The Medical Wellnes Center will be opening a clinic in Florida, I seriously do not understand these rules?


 I missed this reply, thanks for looking into it.

I got a 6 month supply of minoxidil a week or two ago. After that gets close to running out I'll consider getting a prescription for this lotion, depending on my results using just minoxidil. If I'm one of the ~20-30% of super responders I might just stick with normal minoxidil.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz,
> 
> My original regime was just 1mg fin every day.  I initially avoided minox due to the mess and not wanting to deal with two applications daily and greasy hair / scalp etc.  Also I was scared as I heard that sometimes it isn't very effective for hairlines.  
> 
> However, after 8 months, I decided I wanted to get off fin.  It gave me pretty bad mental side effects - constantly feeling depressed / sad / defeated.  This was a hard way to live for me.
> 
> I went down to fin twice a week for almost a month and I feel so much better and happy and confident (minus the hair loss).  But obviously now i am afraid of my hair falling out more rapidly without the fin.
> 
> So now I am back up to 1mg fin EOD.  And for about a week now, nightly application of Susan's 15% lotion around my hairline, mixed with:
> ...


 Hey sorry for the late reply, firstly 1mg EOD is sufficient enough to stop DHT and remove any MPB itch associated with DHT. 

The shedding is expected so i would not worry to much as any minoxidol application will allow you to go through shedding phases due to cycles. The itchiness could well be associated with tretinoin, is the itchiness in the areas you apply Susan's lotion? Did you experience any itchiness prior to starting any treatments, for example when you was losing hair. 

I would not worry too much if the itchiness is associated with tretinoin as this normally subsides, tretinoin normally causes temporary irritation, normally subsides after few months. Ideally you could use coconut oil regular to moisture your scalp, I find this helps counter any irritation associated with tretinoin.

If you experience any side effects try using Horny goat weed and zinc tablets daily, the main key factor is DO NOT stress over any side effects, as any anxiety and stress will make your symptoms worse!

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Nave...
> 
> I felt compel to reply to you as my first post not only because you're a fellow Torontonian but I had the same issue using the exact same formula last month.  I also had itching all over the scalp after using it for a couple of weeks. I stop and it went away. I tried it again second time and itch came back. Susan called me and nicely offered me a 30ml sample with less aggressive ingredients:  10%Minox, 5%AA and .01HC. It's been two weeks and no itch whatsover. I've now waiting to hear back from her whether I need to redo my prescription and if I should add RA and PROG. I don't need FIN because I'm already taking proscar.
> 
> Too bad now I have 3 bottles of expensive hair product i can't use...the thing we do to keep our hair. 
> 
> Good luck Nave...


 
Sounds like an irritation from Tretinoin/RA, as stated in my previous posts tretinoin is very good for cell renewal and helps counter side effects from Hydocortisone! Normally irritation subsides after a few months, ideally using coconut oil daily helps counter stinging/irritation. I been using tretinoin for 2 years now in the formula, at the start I had irritated/red inflammed skin, after few months I was totally fine and happy with the regrowth  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> I should clarify I take 1.25 fin 4 days then use Susan's stuff on the days I don't take fin. truthfully it's very hard to see your progress change without pictures.  I guess I should start doing that.


 I take it you use Lipgaine daily? Only reason I ask is you need an minoxidl application daily. You noticed any changes whilst on your regime?

----------


## Jazz1

> I missed this reply, thanks for looking into it.
> 
> I got a 6 month supply of minoxidil a week or two ago. After that gets close to running out I'll consider getting a prescription for this lotion, depending on my results using just minoxidil. If I'm one of the ~20-30% of super responders I might just stick with normal minoxidil.


 What's your full regime? There's no point using minxodil alone if you suffer from MPB.

----------


## Justinian

> What's your full regime? There's no point using minxodil alone if you suffer from MPB.


 I've got everything pretty much planned out. I'm 24 and a NW2.5-3 with diffuse thinning. My main goal is to keep what I have until I'm 30. I've thought about it a lot and what bothers me most is the age at which it's happening to me, not that it's happening in general. Also, by the time I'm 30, I'm confident we will have much better treatments available.

I started Nizoral 5 months ago, and had a PRP session 4 months ago. I've noticed a very slight thickening throughout and a few new terminal hairs at the hairline. I also have a ton of fine hairs in my temples, although I'm not 100% sure they are new ones from my treatments, since I never monitored my hair that closely before the last few months.

My logic is that Minoxidil on average keeps hair above the baseline for ~5+ years, as I have seen studies indicating this is the case. I'm going to use Minoxidil for 4-6 months and then go from there. If it works very well, I will wait it out until better treatments come or just until I am older and may care less about hair loss. If it just works okay and/or I notice my hair getting worse after reaching a peak, I'm going to consider this formula and/or RU. I'm willing to take the risk of not going on a DHT inhibitor for a year as my hairloss is not super aggressive. I may get more PRP treatments too, as I believe they help somewhat, and repeat treatments may help even more.

I know Fin isn't that dangerous and I believe a large percentage of the sides are placebo affect, but I'm still not willing to use it for personal reasons as I do not wish to alter my hormones. I might consider it eventually if I can keep my DHT in the recommended range (I had it measured a month ago and it's right in the middle of the recommended range).

Well that was longer than I expected to write... if you see any holes in my logic I'm willing to re-consider my plan.

----------


## Hicks

> I take it you use Lipgaine daily? Only reason I ask is you need an minoxidl application daily. You noticed any changes whilst on your regime?


 Lipgaine is daily, but only once at night. I'm not sold that twice a day is effective vs the cons.  Regardless of what's going on now it's way better than 2 years ago. Keep you guys in the loop.

----------


## Jazz1

> Lipgaine is daily, but only once at night. I'm not sold that twice a day is effective vs the cons.  Regardless of what's going on now it's way better than 2 years ago. Keep you guys in the loop.


 Cool I hope it works out for you, anything you do try should be used for a minimum of 6 months  :Smile: .

----------


## diffuse

> Hey sorry for the late reply, firstly 1mg EOD is sufficient enough to stop DHT and remove any MPB itch associated with DHT. 
> 
> The shedding is expected so i would not worry to much as any minoxidol application will allow you to go through shedding phases due to cycles. The itchiness could well be associated with tretinoin, is the itchiness in the areas you apply Susan's lotion? Did you experience any itchiness prior to starting any treatments, for example when you was losing hair. 
> 
> I would not worry too much if the itchiness is associated with tretinoin as this normally subsides, tretinoin normally causes temporary irritation, normally subsides after few months. Ideally you could use coconut oil regular to moisture your scalp, I find this helps counter any irritation associated with tretinoin.
> 
> If you experience any side effects try using Horny goat weed and zinc tablets daily, the main key factor is DO NOT stress over any side effects, as any anxiety and stress will make your symptoms worse!


 
Hey Jazz,
Do you think that Horny goat weed and zinc and l-arginine can help with the sides of finasteride i also consider taking yohimbe? (low libido, hard to maintain erection)

Thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz,
> Do you think that Horny goat weed and zinc and l-arginine can help with the sides of finasteride i also consider taking yohimbe? (low libido, hard to maintain erection)
> 
> Thanks


 Hey yes I personally think this can help, as when I suffered serious side effects 3 things worked for me;

1. Mind control, less stress and anxiety! Key point
2. Horny goat weed 3 times per day.
3. zinc between 50/100mg per day.

Also thinking it your biggest fantasy/removing stress is the number one point in removing side apeffects, as it all got to do with Brain chemistry and pathways your body is not use to this drug you need to allow time even if it means using a far lower dosage. What dosage are you currently using?

----------


## diffuse

> Hey yes I personally think this can help, as when I suffered serious side effects 3 things worked for me;
> 
> 1. Mind control, less stress and anxiety! Key point
> 2. Horny goat weed 3 times per day.
> 3. zinc between 50/100mg per day.
> 
> Also thinking it your biggest fantasy/removing stress is the number one point in removing side apeffects, as it all got to do with Brain chemistry and pathways your body is not use to this drug you need to allow time even if it means using a far lower dosage. What dosage are you currently using?


 I've already posted my story to another thread but nobody gave a single f*ck. I started using RU 2 months ago, got from Kane, made a 600mg batch (70/30 ethanol ppg) for 10 days so it's 60 mg daily. I'm sensitive to anti androgens I experienced low libido and hard to maintain erection after 1,5 months I reduced my dosage to 40mg now it's kind of ok...if i miss an application it's 100% again. 
I have a few questions: 
1. Have you ever heard of Dutasteride mesotherapy? ( study: http://www.odermatol.com/wp-co...20effect-Sobhy%20N.pdf ) There's doctor here who has been doing it for 7 years with some before after pics and he claims that it's working, some of his pics are messy but there are some real also... I've started using it May, 2014, in january 2015 i decided to do it on my own i'm not afraid of needles and it's much cheaper. The doctor injected to the scalp 1mg of dut every month with mesogun, now i inject it every 2 weeks, also used minoxidil and had a full head of hair!!!!, when i started using dut meso the doc told be to stop minox because dut will do the job (been on minox for 9 months gave me a lot of regrowth) and ive been trough a terrible shed, lost almost everything in 3 months and i went straight back on it and had an amazing regrowth again. Around christmas my hair started shedding bad and in 1,5 month I lost almost half of my hair (that's why I started using RU). So I was back where i started. Now it's getting better I hope it's gonna be the same. I don't know if this dutasteride mesotherapy woking or not. I'm turning 23 in august I'm a diffuse thinner all over, or atleast i am when my hair is f*cked up. 
2. I'm considering addig fin but i'm afraid because RU already gave my sides.... this dutasteride mesotherapy thing and RU+MINOXwould maintain my hair??, maybe EOD or 1mg 3x times a week will help and i can something against low libido and erection issues. I also ordered yohimbe to increase my sexual performance. I've taken fin for about 2 week 1,25 mg ED 2 years ago but (my hair wasn't that bad back then) I dropped because i had libido issues, not much or i don't know that is was real not.

Some photos:

Baseline: 

September, 2013 
http://photouploads.com/images/fotfwf.jpg 
http://photouploads.com/images/fot1.jpg 

May,2014 on Spectral DNC-L and minox foam, started DUT meso 
Hair was good but i knew that minox only wont keep my hair..

http://photouploads.com/images/img8345.jpg 

September to November, 2014 Stopped minox then re started, and DUT meso 
Shedding damage and regrowth. 
http://photouploads.com/images/img7483.jpg 

28 February, 2015 Shedding again.. 

http://photouploads.com/images/fullsivcv.jpg 

29 March, 2015 Getting better, still improving 

http://photouploads.com/images/img8344.jpg 


So this is my story. 

Thanks Jazz i really appreciate your help!

----------


## Seuxin

Hey guy's what about topical finasteride ? Usefull or not ?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey i will reply later tonight.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey bro your story is inspiring and I'm sorry I missed your thread my life style is hectic, reminds me of myself when I gave up last year and booked a transplant with Dr feriduni, some how i pulled through and glad I never stopped, where at certain times I felt like giving up.

You seem to be on the right track, in my view when I used RU58841 I found the chemical to be stronger than Fin at 5%' however anything orally seems more stronger half life than topicals. I need to think thoroughly in what route would best suit you as it seems very tricky, give me a few days to research more for you if you're willing to wait.

Currently my advice would be stick to the correct regime that is working for you IE go back to square one as your first regime was working great! I would stick to one brand minoxidil only, DO NOT switch brands! Also carry on with RU at your correct dosage that has worked. I seriously would ignore what others say, even these STUPID doctors! As they go by literature and not self experience, that's one thing I learned about doctors and dermatologist. The mistake you made is listening to the STUPID doctor, stating to stop minxodil! You was on the right track from the start! Go back to your original regime, and see how things go, if things go well I can recommend some cheap and effective things you could add ontop.

----------


## Hicks

I agree switching minoxidil brands and even shampoo seemed to put my hair in a tail spin. Even the stuff from Susan seems to make my hair shed but I am now 13 months out from a 2800 graft HT and it could be those hairs are just getting thicker making the thinner native hair look smaller like its shedding?? Who knows.  Regardless my hair is way better now than 2 years ago.

----------


## Trouse5858

Why is switching minox brands ill advised? 2 months ago I switched from Rogaine foam to liquid minox because I thought it would penetrate the scalp better. Now you guys got me nervous.

----------


## warner8

funny, I've been on Susans lotion mix for about 3 weeks, and have not seen any great shed to report. i am also using her biotin-glutathion mix, and i just got the melatonin in the mail today




> I agree switching minoxidil brands and even shampoo seemed to put my hair in a tail spin. Even the stuff from Susan seems to make my hair shed but I am now 13 months out from a 2800 graft HT and it could be those hairs are just getting thicker making the thinner native hair look smaller like its shedding?? Who knows.  Regardless my hair is way better now than 2 years ago.

----------


## Parsia

> I've already posted my story to another thread but nobody gave a single f*ck. I started using RU 2 months ago, got from Kane, made a 600mg batch (70/30 ethanol ppg) for 10 days so it's 60 mg daily. I'm sensitive to anti androgens I experienced low libido and hard to maintain erection after 1,5 months I reduced my dosage to 40mg now it's kind of ok...if i miss an application it's 100% again. 
> I have a few questions: 
> 1. Have you ever heard of Dutasteride mesotherapy? ( study: http://www.odermatol.com/wp-co...20effect-Sobhy%20N.pdf ) There's doctor here who has been doing it for 7 years with some before after pics and he claims that it's working, some of his pics are messy but there are some real also... I've started using it May, 2014, in january 2015 i decided to do it on my own i'm not afraid of needles and it's much cheaper. The doctor injected to the scalp 1mg of dut every month with mesogun, now i inject it every 2 weeks, also used minoxidil and had a full head of hair!!!!, when i started using dut meso the doc told be to stop minox because dut will do the job (been on minox for 9 months gave me a lot of regrowth) and ive been trough a terrible shed, lost almost everything in 3 months and i went straight back on it and had an amazing regrowth again. Around christmas my hair started shedding bad and in 1,5 month I lost almost half of my hair (that's why I started using RU). So I was back where i started. Now it's getting better I hope it's gonna be the same. I don't know if this dutasteride mesotherapy woking or not. I'm turning 23 in august I'm a diffuse thinner all over, or atleast i am when my hair is f*cked up. 
> 2. I'm considering addig fin but i'm afraid because RU already gave my sides.... this dutasteride mesotherapy thing and RU+MINOXwould maintain my hair??, maybe EOD or 1mg 3x times a week will help and i can something against low libido and erection issues. I also ordered yohimbe to increase my sexual performance. I've taken fin for about 2 week 1,25 mg ED 2 years ago but (my hair wasn't that bad back then) I dropped because i had libido issues, not much or i don't know that is was real not.
> 
> Some photos:
> 
> Baseline: 
> 
> ...


 Oh My God , Your hair has changed a lot during these times , You got very good regrowth , then loosing ground a lot and then regaining that,. Your picture was really amazing. thanks for posting them , Do you think Dut makes your density and hair back ?

----------


## diffuse

Seroiusly I don't know what gave the density back, but i think my recent shed was due to minox because i restarted in September after a 3 months break so it's like starting with a clean paper and when i was on it for 9 months it gave me a shed around six months..I'm responding really good to minox i think.

My current regimen is:
Minox foam in the morning
40mg RU in 2 ml to cover my whole scalp at night
Spectral DNC-L and Simply right minoxidil 5% liquid at night
1mg Dutasteride injected to the scalp every 2 weeks

My hair is getting better day by day i'm going to show you photos when it has reached the peak, but i consider to take fin 0,5mg EOD or 3-4 times a week to give a final bullet to my hairloss.

----------


## noisette

> Seroiusly I don't know what gave the density back, but i think my recent shed was due to minox because i restarted in September after a 3 months break so it's like starting with a clean paper and when i was on it for 9 months it gave me a shed around six months..I'm responding really good to minox i think.
> 
> My current regimen is:
> Minox foam in the morning
> 40mg RU in 2 ml to cover my whole scalp at night
> Spectral DNC-L and Simply right minoxidil 5% liquid at night
> 1mg Dutasteride injected to the scalp every 2 weeks
> 
> My hair is getting better day by day i'm going to show you photos when it has reached the peak, but i consider to take fin 0,5mg EOD or 3-4 times a week to give a final bullet to my hairloss.


 Sorry for my poor english writing bro, I wish you a good amount of hair with some regrowth on balding areas.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey as above I would seriously avoid switching Brands on either medication even oral Finetseride! I will reply tommorow as I need to be up early for work.

----------


## keisomo

> Sounds like an irritation from Tretinoin/RA, as stated in my previous posts tretinoin is very good for cell renewal and helps counter side effects from Hydocortisone! Normally irritation subsides after a few months, ideally using coconut oil daily helps counter stinging/irritation. I been using tretinoin for 2 years now in the formula, at the start I had irritated/red inflammed skin, after few months I was totally fine and happy with the regrowth .


 Hey Jazz1,

Firstly, like many others, thanks for finding Susan. Thanks for the information about coconut oil to help with itching, did some readings and search on amazon, it has pretty good rating and is actually eatable as well?  :Smile:  Do you apply the coconut oil immediately after Minox or a few hours later... I'm going to order some coconut oil today to try out to help battle itching, if it does, I'll remove the Hydrocortisone since it's not really for hairloss prevention.

----------


## warner8

for those that use susans compounded formula, how long before you saw regrowth if any?

----------


## Jazz1

I'm back! Finally they changed the forum settings!

----------


## Jazz1

> for those that use susans compounded formula, how long before you saw regrowth if any?


 Some people noticed 2/3 months, how long has it been for you? Some it can be 6 months depending how miniaturised or dead the follicles are etc. I take it you did add tretinoin?

----------


## warner8

> Some people noticed 2/3 months, how long has it been for you? Some it can be 6 months depending how miniaturised or dead the follicles are etc. I take it you did add tretinoin?


 12% minox
AA
retinin A
Hydrocortisone

 I have been on it little over a month now. I think I've experienced a good shed. I did not buzz my hair off for 3 days, and boy did it look bad. it looked like i lost a bunch of hair on my frontal and temple areas. I've also been on fin 10 months now.

I'm also using her biotin plus glut topical, and the melatonin topical from murray ave/susan as well

----------


## Jazz1

> 12% minox
> AA
> retinin A
> Hydrocortisone
> 
>  I have been on it little over a month now. I think I've experienced a good shed. I did not buzz my hair off for 3 days, and boy did it look bad. it looked like i lost a bunch of hair on my frontal and temple areas. I've also been on fin 10 months now.
> 
> I'm also using her biotin plus glut topical, and the melatonin topical from murray ave/susan as well


 Shedding is a good sign, one month is way too soon, what brand Finesteride are you using? Prior to getting Susan's mixture did your Hairloss halt by Finesteride?

----------


## warner8

Jazz, i really hope it is working, and just not my baldness over powering the fin. i buy a generic fin from costco in the usa. no idea of the brand. 
I don't expect any hair growth in a month, but i was curious, as I now have balding patches i think from being on susans formula for the month. hopefully they will fill in by the end of the summer. i have to buzz my hair everyday to keep my balding as un-noticeable as possible, although i am sure ppl can fig it out. i hate it when ppl ask why i don't grow my hair out.....i just want to shout at them, its bc I'm balding you ideots. 

i had really good growth when i started using just generic minox from wall mart 6 years ago when i was 24. the minox stopped working on my hair right as i turned 27. i thought maybe it was bc i had switched to minox foam which i had been using for 3 months, and switched back to the generic liquid. what i interpreted as shedding from the minox, was really shedding from the DHT levels in my scalp overpowering the minox; so while i was thinking the minox was working, i was really losing ground. it took me until i saw some family  photographs just how bald my scalp was that i started with the generic fin, which will be a full year of fin this may. it stabilized my hairloss i feel, and maybe a little growth, but nothing major like minox obviously. I've been on the fin and generic 5% min liquid since last may, but did not get growth with the minox even when i combined the fin. after much research, i decided to up my percent of minox to 12 and began using susans formula with the fin, aa, tretonin and cortisone. i also added the melatonin, and glut + biotin.





> Shedding is a good sign, one month is way too soon, what brand Finesteride are you using? Prior to getting Susan's mixture did your Hairloss halt by Finesteride?

----------


## Jazz1

Right, seems like Finesteride is responding very well on you, so my guess your probably going through a shed being on the higher % minoxidil.

I would carry on with your regime and allow at least 6 months as shedding is expected. One question do you use a Ketaconozole shampoo? If not get some Regenepure DR version, good shampoo that contains Ketaconozole.

----------


## warner8

whats the benefit to ketaconazole? reduced dht in the scalp. I'm sensitive to strong perfume smells, so i don't use shampoo with all those extra ingredients that make it smell good;




> Right, seems like Finesteride is responding very well on you, so my guess your probably going through a shed being on the higher % minoxidil.
> 
> I would carry on with your regime and allow at least 6 months as shedding is expected. One question do you use a Ketaconozole shampoo? If not get some Regenepure DR version, good shampoo that contains Ketaconozole.

----------


## Jazz1

> whats the benefit to ketaconazole? reduced dht in the scalp. I'm sensitive to strong perfume smells, so i don't use shampoo with all those extra ingredients that make it smell good;


 Correct, what about Nizoral, that smells plain?

----------


## warner8

i think I'm like some other users where the ketoconzole made my hair fall out  :Frown: 




> Correct, what about Nizoral, that smells plain?

----------


## Jazz1

> i think I'm like some other users where the ketoconzole made my hair fall out


 Lol, Nizoral is very harsh, trust me try Regenepure Dr and a good conditioner  :Wink: .

----------


## warner8

ok jazz, will order it off amazon, how many times per week should i use, and how long do i let it sit on the scalp? also do i wash the entire scalp, or just the balding areas?




> Lol, Nizoral is very harsh, trust me try Regenepure Dr and a good conditioner .

----------


## Eire1980

> This is one product I have been dying to try and add to my regime, I have been constantly researching and before Dr Klein passed away I think he was going to do trials on topical Melatonin.
> 
> Anyways good news after several emails begging Susan to formulate this for the hairloss community she was convinced by the studies to add his on her wesbite for us guys .
> 
> We now have an option to BUY topical Melatonin, so for anyone interested here are the details I will deffinatly be ordering this next month when my funds are better .
> 
> http://www.murrayavenuerx.com/hair.html
> 
> Studies;
> ...


 @Jazz - anywhere to get this in Europe?...shipping cost of $50 is a joke..have you a link for the internal one...I sleep really bad so was hoping to use this for hair and sleep

cheers :Cool:

----------


## Ostash

wow what a long thread,  cliff notes?   :Smile:

----------


## Jazz1

> ok jazz, will order it off amazon, how many times per week should i use, and how long do i let it sit on the scalp? also do i wash the entire scalp, or just the balding areas?


 Hey I would wash the entire scalp, I tend to do a pre cleanser wash than use Regenepure DR left on my scalp for minimum 10 minutes, maximum 15. I been washing my hair twice per day for 2 Years, morning I use Revita, night time I use Regenepure Dr, use wisely!

----------


## Jazz1

> @Jazz - anywhere to get this in Europe?...shipping cost of $50 is a joke..have you a link for the internal one...I sleep really bad so was hoping to use this for hair and sleep
> 
> cheers


 Hey some people have mentioned other sources selling this stuff, there's plenty on eBay that sell internal tablets for Europe just type it on eBay. Again this mixture designed by Susan was for topical Hairloss use, maybe if you bought couple of bottles you may save the Shipping than buying the stuff regular, I tend to order different stuff when I buy my lotions from her as this saves me shipping.

----------


## Jazz1

> wow what a long thread,  cliff notes?


 Super Hairloss Lotion with Finesteride, DHT blockers, Anti Androgen blocker, custom high grade Growth stimulant mixture  :Smile: . Why what's your current regime?

----------


## Eire1980

> Hey some people have mentioned other sources selling this stuff, there's plenty on eBay that sell internal tablets for Europe just type it on eBay. Again this mixture designed by Susan was for topical Hairloss use, maybe if you bought couple of bottles you may save the Shipping than buying the stuff regular, I tend to order different stuff when I buy my lotions from her as this saves me shipping.


 thanks for coming back on this - cheers

any opinion on Progesterone Leave-In Treatment 

Progesterone is an alpha-reductase inhibitor which decreases production of DHT, the stronger Testosterone associated with Hair Loss. This product may also prevent hair loss by limiting excess DHT.

how is this different from FIN or is it?...would you be open to the same side effects?

----------


## Parsia

> Hey some people have mentioned other sources selling this stuff, there's plenty on eBay that sell internal tablets for Europe just type it on eBay. Again this mixture designed by Susan was for topical Hairloss use, maybe if you bought couple of bottles you may save the Shipping than buying the stuff regular, I tend to order different stuff when I buy my lotions from her as this saves me shipping.


 Hey Bro .
what do you mean by internal tablets on ebay jazz?
do you mean fin or minox ?

----------


## Jazz1

I will reply tommorow I'm bit drunk now  :Smile: .

----------


## Parsia

> I will reply tommorow I'm bit drunk now .


 Lol , this one was so funny !!!!

----------


## nave13579

Hey I've been using Susan's formula for a few weeks now before bed.  However I was thinking that since I shower in the morning, and therefore do not apply Susan's formula on a freshly cleaned scalp / hairline am I losing efficacy? 

Thanks!

----------


## warner8

i use her formula too, i always try my best to use on a clean scalp, so there is less oily/sebum/dead skin build up that would decrease penetration. the formula aint cheap, so you want to make sure it works as best as possible




> Hey I've been using Susan's formula for a few weeks now before bed.  However I was thinking that since I shower in the morning, and therefore do not apply Susan's formula on a freshly cleaned scalp / hairline am I losing efficacy? 
> 
> Thanks!

----------


## Eire1980

> I will reply tommorow I'm bit drunk now .


 Still alive..how's the hangover 😊

----------


## diffuse

Hey Jazz!

Which finasteride are you using and what dosage?

I'm ordering now, I think i will buy finpecia and start with 0,5mg 3x times a week then EOD and after 1-2 month 1mg EOD.

And if i use yohimbe with fina it won't affect my hair?

Thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> thanks for coming back on this - cheers
> 
> any opinion on Progesterone Leave-In Treatment 
> 
> Progesterone is an alpha-reductase inhibitor which decreases production of DHT, the stronger Testosterone associated with Hair Loss. This product may also prevent hair loss by limiting excess DHT.
> 
> how is this different from FIN or is it?...would you be open to the same side effects?


 Hey I can not comment on this alone as I always used progesteone in the mixture with other additives, although I would say currently there is nothing better than Finesteride apart from RU58841  :Smile: . Although I do not rule out progesteone being bad, as males also produce progesteone which is a good hormone to help balance the body.

Why can you not use Finesteride?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey I've been using Susan's formula for a few weeks now before bed.  However I was thinking that since I shower in the morning, and therefore do not apply Susan's formula on a freshly cleaned scalp / hairline am I losing efficacy? 
> 
> Thanks!


 Hey what is your full regime? What mixture are you using % wise+additives?

I apply her lotion in the morning much more convenient as the higher % keeps me awake throughout the day, seems more logical  :Wink: .

----------


## Jazz1

> i use her formula too, i always try my best to use on a clean scalp, so there is less oily/sebum/dead skin build up that would decrease penetration. the formula aint cheap, so you want to make sure it works as best as possible


 I agree, I wash my hair twice per day using cleansers and than two great shampoo Regenepure DR and Revita  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz!
> 
> Which finasteride are you using and what dosage?
> 
> I'm ordering now, I think i will buy finpecia and start with 0,5mg 3x times a week then EOD and after 1-2 month 1mg EOD.
> 
> And if i use yohimbe with fina it won't affect my hair?
> 
> Thanks


 
Hey I use Brand Merc propecia EOD at 1mg, Finpecia is fine so long as you stick to one Brand from day one! Switching brands can cause a disaster! What's your current regime?

----------


## Jazz1

Sorry guys I replied late the bloody forum settings keep changing, so annoying!

----------


## diffuse

I'm the guy with those huge sheds i've posted pictures also  :Smile: 
RU 50mg +minox+nizoral+dutasteride mesotherapy but i will drop this mesotherapy thing and hop on fin..

----------


## Jazz1

Hey send me the link please? I'm finding it hard to currently use this forum on my iPad as they have changed the settings back to mobile settings!

----------


## Hicks

> Hey send me the link please? I'm finding it hard to currently use this forum on my iPad as they have changed the settings back to mobile settings!


 Switching the format is a good way to stop lurking on this site and focus more on my REAL life   :Smile:

----------


## diffuse

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...l=1#post202185

Here i am Jazz

----------


## Jazz1

> Switching the format is a good way to stop lurking on this site and focus more on my REAL life


 The forum is still the same! So annoying as I prefer the old format when using my iPad!

----------


## Jazz1

> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showth...l=1#post202185
> 
> Here i am Jazz


  Hey mate I will have to check on a computer as the forum settings are not back to normal!

----------


## Plan C

Jazz - I think I've asked this before but would you recommend continued use of Regaine alongside Susan's product? If so, which would you apply first each day?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz - I think I've asked this before but would you recommend continued use of Regaine alongside Susan's product? If so, which would you apply first each day?


 Hey I always carried on with Regaine foam as I coppied the tactics from the Belgravia hairloss clinic. I first apply Regaine foam around whole scalp, than allow 5/10minutes and apply Susan's 15% around my temples  :Smile: .

How is your hairloss now?

----------


## warner8

hi Jazz, i've been on susans fomula for 2 months now. Had what looks like a big shed, and waiting for regrowth. I also use her glut plus bitcoin, and melatonin 1%. 

I only use 12% minox in my formula (plus AA, retain a, cortisone) , as I was wanted to see how much i could tolerate jumping from a 5%. After this bottle is over, should I go to 15%?

----------


## Eire1980

Topical melatonin anyone in the UK or ireland used it?...@jazz did you buy this mate?..I'm worried it won't pass customs..thanks

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys sorry I have not been around much I will reply tommorow on my iPad, job+shift work is hectic life style  :Frown: .

----------


## warner8

jazz, do u also use regular 5% minox in addition to susans formula and at a separate time in the day , or do u just use susands formula once daily.


> Hey guys sorry I have not been around much I will reply tommorow on my iPad, job+shift work is hectic life style .

----------


## Jazz1

> hi Jazz, i've been on susans fomula for 2 months now. Had what looks like a big shed, and waiting for regrowth. I also use her glut plus bitcoin, and melatonin 1%. 
> 
> I only use 12% minox in my formula (plus AA, retain a, cortisone) , as I was wanted to see how much i could tolerate jumping from a 5%. After this bottle is over, should I go to 15%?


 Hey firstly do you use a DHT blocker like Finetseride/Dutesteride or RU58841?

In Regards to your question I would avoid jumping to 15%, as that will cause another shed and you will be shedding again and waiting for regrowth again! Plus 12.5% is cheaper!

Do you still use 5% minoxidil rotated with Susans 12.5% mixture?

What's your full Regime?

----------


## Jazz1

> Topical melatonin anyone in the UK or ireland used it?...@jazz did you buy this mate?..I'm worried it won't pass customs..thanks


 Where do you live? My Prescritpion 15% lotion mixtures always pass customs but sometimes I get hit with charges in the UK.

I Will buy the new range of products on my next order as I still have 4 month lotion left to use! There no point me ordering now as I have to pay extra shipping and than maybe get hit by bloody customs!

----------


## Jazz1

> jazz, do u also use regular 5% minox in addition to susans formula and at a separate time in the day , or do u just use susands formula once daily.


 
I use 5% Regaine in conjunction to her formula, I first apply 5% Regaine foam all over, than allow 10 minutes before applying her 15% additive lotion ONLY at the temples! Night use I apply Regaine foam all over.

----------


## warner8

hi jazz, my regimen is

Susan mix: 12% minox, AA, tretonin, hydroxortisone, susuans 1% meltatonin, susans biotin + glutathione. I apply the minox formula first, and then add drops of the biotin+ glut. I only use the melatonin at night, although i have to admit not as religiously as the first two. I also take generic fin 1mg, once a day.
I have been on the fin since last June 2014, and susans formula since March 9, 2015 of this year. My previous regimen for the past 4 years was just generic minox at 5% when I was aged 24, at around age 27 the minox stopped effect, and i began to lose hairs rapidly. Thats when i started 1 mg fin, and the same 5% minox, but was not seeing any results in terms of hair growth, hence i got susans formula. Like I said, I've been on it 2 months now and think I've gone through a shed because my hair looks worst that ever. I just hope it means that i am going through a shed, and not that the formula or the fin is no longer working






> Hey firstly do you use a DHT blocker like Finetseride/Dutesteride or RU58841?
> 
> In Regards to
>  your question I would avoid jumping to 15%, as that will cause another shed and you will be shedding again and waiting for regrowth again! Plus 12.5% is cheaper!
> 
> Do you still use 5% minoxidil rotated with Susans 12.5% mixture?
> 
> What's your full Regime?

----------


## diffuse

Hey Jazz!
I need your advice. I've been using minox 5% since  september 2014, I got great regrowth until January than  I've been through a huge shed in February than i got regrowth and now it's  May and shedding again (second HUGE shedding in 7 months). I also started using RU 60-70mg in February when i saw my hair thinning. Now When i started noticing shedding i hopped on fin as well (i was already planning to do that) so i'm using fin for 2 weeks now. What do you think? Why are these sheds happening?  If you know Irishpride from the other forum, i got sheds like him except i never stopped any treatment.  I'm using finpecia 1mg EOD bought from pharmacy2home do you think it's fine or i should buy propecia?

FULL regimen:
RU  70 mg in ethanol/pg at night 
minox 5% at night
Finpecia EOD
Nizoral sometimes

Thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> hi jazz, my regimen is
> 
> Susan mix: 12% minox, AA, tretonin, hydroxortisone, susuans 1% meltatonin, susans biotin + glutathione. I apply the minox formula first, and then add drops of the biotin+ glut. I only use the melatonin at night, although i have to admit not as religiously as the first two. I also take generic fin 1mg, once a day.
> I have been on the fin since last June 2014, and susans formula since March 9, 2015 of this year. My previous regimen for the past 4 years was just generic minox at 5% when I was aged 24, at around age 27 the minox stopped effect, and i began to lose hairs rapidly. Thats when i started 1 mg fin, and the same 5% minox, but was not seeing any results in terms of hair growth, hence i got susans formula. Like I said, I've been on it 2 months now and think I've gone through a shed because my hair looks worst that ever. I just hope it means that i am going through a shed, and not that the formula or the fin is no longer working


 Hey the generic finesteride you use has this halted your hairloss minus the minoxidl shed? 

To me it is 2 options either your going through a shed, so i would ride out your current regime, have  you noticed any hairs growing? Or the finesteride you are using  is not working anymore!

You need to weigh out the options, if the finesteride has stopped working than Dutasteride or RU58841 is your finall powerfull option.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz!
> I need your advice. I've been using minox 5% since  september 2014, I got great regrowth until January than  I've been through a huge shed in February than i got regrowth and now it's  May and shedding again (second HUGE shedding in 7 months). I also started using RU 60-70mg in February when i saw my hair thinning. Now When i started noticing shedding i hopped on fin as well (i was already planning to do that) so i'm using fin for 2 weeks now. What do you think? Why are these sheds happening?  If you know Irishpride from the other forum, i got sheds like him except i never stopped any treatment.  I'm using finpecia 1mg EOD bought from pharmacy2home do you think it's fine or i should buy propecia?
> 
> FULL regimen:
> RU  70 mg in ethanol/pg at night 
> minox 5% at night
> Finpecia EOD
> Nizoral sometimes
> 
> Thanks


 
Right, that is one powerfull regime! The initial first shed seems like everyone else, who do not first use a DHT blocker from day one. So the first shed seems like minoxidl could only do so much, hence why you started shedding because your genetics resumed.

Now in regards to RU58841 I would drop this as a last option, we're you mixing daily batch? You have to be carefull with RU in regards to consistent/efficacy on batches/mixing !

Me personally I would get legit propecia, carry on with the 5% minoxidil and again stick to ONE brand only! Also get yourself some Regenepure DR.

Follolw this regime religiously for 6 months to determine how you respond!

----------


## warner8

Hi Jazz, I've been using the generic brand fin from the pharmacy since last june. i would say it stabilized my hairloss as it did not look like it was getting any worst or any better. I started susans formula with the 12% minox March 9 th 2015. I started buying my generic fin at Costco pharmacy, a wholesale pharmacy in the US for a fraction of the cost beginning at the end of march. so both were around the same time.

have i noticed new growth in the last two months, no. but i have seen more hairless, which i assumed meant thats susans formula was giving me a shed. Now I am unsure what do. Continue with this regimen and this generic fin, and see if i have regrowth by the end of the summer, or go to bran name fin.




> Hey the generic finesteride you use has this halted your hairloss minus the minoxidl shed? 
> 
> To me it is 2 options either your going through a shed, so i would ride out your current regime, have  you noticed any hairs growing? Or the finesteride you are using  is not working anymore!
> 
> You need to weigh out the options, if the finesteride has stopped working than Dutasteride or RU58841 is your finall powerfull option.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz, I've been using the generic brand fin from the pharmacy since last june. i would say it stabilized my hairloss as it did not look like it was getting any worst or any better. I started susans formula with the 12% minox March 9 th 2015. I started buying my generic fin at Costco pharmacy, a wholesale pharmacy in the US for a fraction of the cost beginning at the end of march. so both were around the same time.
> 
> have i noticed new growth in the last two months, no. but i have seen more hairless, which i assumed meant thats susans formula was giving me a shed. Now I am unsure what do. Continue with this regimen and this generic fin, and see if i have regrowth by the end of the summer, or go to bran name fin.


 
Right, those key words regarding you switching Finesteride brand, I know several people throughout the years who have switched brands and go through major sheds!

I can not speak for Generic stuff but from day one I have always used Merck propecia! You can search through google in regards to switching Finesteride brands, most people will tell you the disaster and major sheds! I would only stick to one brand from day one as the last thing you want to be doing is switching brands and going through major sheds which may or may not grow back!

----------


## Plan C

> Right, those key words regarding you switching Finesteride brand, I know several people throughout the years who have switched brands and go through major sheds!
> 
> I can not speak for Generic stuff but from day one I have always used Merck propecia! You can search through google in regards to switching Finesteride brands, most people will tell you the disaster and major sheds! I would only stick to one brand from day one as the last thing you want to be doing is switching brands and going through major sheds which may or may not grow back!


 Jazz - do you still use Susan's formula? I've finally run out of the two bottles I bought last October and was wondering if a) you still recommend the product and b) you think we will still have issues with customs when getting it delivered to the UK?

----------


## warner8

I'm in the same situation as you. I'm almost out of first bottle.

hows your experience thus far with susans stuff? shed? regrowth? how long have u been on it?



> Jazz - do you still use Susan's formula? I've finally run out of the two bottles I bought last October and was wondering if a) you still recommend the product and b) you think we will still have issues with customs when getting it delivered to the UK?

----------


## Plan C

> I'm in the same situation as you. I'm almost out of first bottle.
> 
> hows your experience thus far with susans stuff? shed? regrowth? how long have u been on it?


 As mentioned, have been using it since last October. Immediately noticed the vellus hairs at my temples gaining length. Recently shed them all and now have 5 or so new dark hairs growing at my temples. It's taken 8 months but I recon this stuff actually works and I'm usually extremely pessimistic about hair loss treatments. I think part of the reason for this sudden regrowth is the fact I've switched from derma rolling once a month to once a week.

----------


## warner8

Whats is in your mix.

I have 12% minox
AA 
retina a
hydrocortisone

i was thinking of bumping up to 15% minox. I was afraid of side effects jumping from 5% so i thought 12% was a good start, as recommended by susan herself. Also when did you notice a shed? I  think I'm going through a shed currently, no regrowth as yet. been using since march 9 2015.




> As mentioned, have been using it since last October. Immediately noticed the vellus hairs at my temples gaining length. Recently shed them all and now have 5 or so new dark hairs growing at my temples. It's taken 8 months but I recon this stuff actually works and I'm usually extremely pessimistic about hair loss treatments. I think part of the reason for this sudden regrowth is the fact I've switched from derma rolling once a month to once a week.

----------


## Plan C

> Whats is in your mix.
> 
> I have 12% minox
> AA 
> retina a
> hydrocortisone
> 
> i was thinking of bumping up to 15% minox. I was afraid of side effects jumping from 5% so i thought 12% was a good start, as recommended by susan herself. Also when did you notice a shed?


 Minoxidil 15%, Azelaic Acid 1.5%, Progesterone 0.25%, Tretinoin 0.025%, Hydrocortisone 0.1%, Finasteride 0.1%, Biotin 3%

In general, I barely get any sides from treatments - not even from dut or RU. So I've only had noticeable shedding once - when I started derma rolling more frequently, which was about a month ago.

----------


## warner8

do you recommend derma rolling?





> Minoxidil 15%, Azelaic Acid 1.5%, Progesterone 0.25%, Tretinoin 0.025%, Hydrocortisone 0.1%, Finasteride 0.1%, Biotin 3%
> 
> In general, I barely get any sides from treatments - not even from dut or RU. So I've only had noticeable shedding once - when I started derma rolling more frequently, which was about a month ago.

----------


## Plan C

> do you recommend derma rolling?


 Yes. It definitely helps with absorption of topical treatments - you can tell because less residue is left on your scalp. However, it is widely accepted that a 1.5mm is the best to use and they are *really* painful on the skin. To me it hurt as much as getting a tattoo done.

----------


## warner8

do it make the scalp bleed? is there scabbing?



> Yes. It definitely helps with absorption of topical treatments - you can tell because less residue is left on your scalp. However, it is widely accepted that a 1.5mm is the best to use and they are *really* painful on the skin. To me it hurt as much as getting a tattoo done.

----------


## Plan C

> do it make the scalp bleed? is there scabbing?


 Pinpricks of blood. No scabbing.

----------


## Seuxin

Only 0.1% fina ?
Hasson An Wong use a 2.5% fina in a gel !!

I use Azelaic Acid at 7% in a liquide lotion  :Big Grin: 
1.5% is very poor !

----------


## warner8

won't too much acid burn?




> Only 0.1% fina ?
> Hasson An Wong use a 2.5% fina in a gel !!
> 
> I use Azelaic Acid at 7% in a liquide lotion 
> 1.5% is very poor !

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz - do you still use Susan's formula? I've finally run out of the two bottles I bought last October and was wondering if a) you still recommend the product and b) you think we will still have issues with customs when getting it delivered to the UK?


 
Hey I still use her product as it works well for me just like Dr kleins formulas worked, so I always recommend her lotions ontop of the Big3 first. I never have issues with customs destroying my package, only issue I have sometimes is I get hit with a customs charge!

----------


## Jazz1

> Only 0.1% fina ?
> Hasson An Wong use a 2.5% fina in a gel !!
> 
> I use Azelaic Acid at 7% in a liquide lotion 
> 1.5% is very poor !


 2.5% Fina is like taking 2.5mg tablet per day when the recommended dosage is 1mg.

1.5% is not poor and Susan now uses 5% azelaic acid only!

----------


## Jazz1

> won't too much acid burn?


 Everyone reacts differently, Dr Klein used 1.5% and the picture studies showed how effective 1.5% worked in conjunction. Than again Dr Richard Lee used 5%, so I would stick to the ones that worked  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Whats is in your mix.
> 
> I have 12% minox
> AA 
> retina a
> hydrocortisone
> 
> i was thinking of bumping up to 15% minox. I was afraid of side effects jumping from 5% so i thought 12% was a good start, as recommended by susan herself. Also when did you notice a shed? I  think I'm going through a shed currently, no regrowth as yet. been using since march 9 2015.


 Why don't you bump up to the formula I use:

15% minoxidol
0.1% finesteride
5% azelaic acid
0.025% tretinoin
0.25% progesteone
0.1% Hydocortisone 
DMI

----------


## Jazz1

> Yes. It definitely helps with absorption of topical treatments - you can tell because less residue is left on your scalp. However, it is widely accepted that a 1.5mm is the best to use and they are *really* painful on the skin. To me it hurt as much as getting a tattoo done.


 
Thanks for the tip, I use to Roll and I think I might start again as I have brand new expensive Dr Derma rollers I bought in the past!

When you recently started rolling is that when you noticed the new hairs? Maybe it helps reach the lotion even deeper or possibly the wounding effect has helped heal the damaged follicles.

----------


## warner8

jazz, i think i will do just that.



> Why don't you bump up to the formula I use:
> 
> 15% minoxidol
> 0.1% finesteride
> 5% azelaic acid
> 0.025% tretinoin
> 0.25% progesteone
> 0.1% Hydocortisone 
> DMI

----------


## warner8

1. are you taking oral fin along with the topical, and whats your regimen? do you use each every other day?
2. is the progesterone a dht blocker?




> Why don't you bump up to the formula I use:
> 
> 15% minoxidol
> 0.1% finesteride
> 5% azelaic acid
> 0.025% tretinoin
> 0.25% progesteone
> 0.1% Hydocortisone 
> DMI

----------


## Eire1980

Hi Guys -whats the difference between Fin and azelaic acid? - they are both DHT blockers - correct?

I hear side effects about Fin but nothing on azelaic acid

appreciate the feedback

thank you

----------


## warner8

fin is a lot stronger, systemic, and more proven effective dht blocker. if ur gonna use one, use fin. the acid is more here say in my opinion; its good to add to an existing regiment of minoxidil and fin, but not uses solely, or in the place of fin




> Hi Guys -whats the difference between Fin and azelaic acid? - they are both DHT blockers - correct?
> 
> I hear side effects about Fin but nothing on azelaic acid
> 
> appreciate the feedback
> 
> thank you

----------


## Eire1980

> fin is a lot stronger, systemic, and more proven effective dht blocker. if ur gonna use one, use fin. the acid is more here say in my opinion; its good to add to an existing regiment of minoxidil and fin, but not uses solely, or in the place of fin


 hey thanks for replying back.

im thinking of leaving Fin out as im a bit afraid of the sides associated.

----------


## warner8

don't don't don't make the mistake a lot of us made and not getting on fin asap fearing side effects. chances are you won't get any sides at all, but there is only one way to find out. get on the fin asap.  


> hey thanks for replying back.
> 
> im thinking of leaving Fin out as im a bit afraid of the sides associated.

----------


## Eire1980

thanks for the feedback...what about starting on Fin at 0.025%?

----------


## warner8

are u talking about topical fin??? i don't think its proven so you might be wasting your time. oral fin is proven at 1 mg per day. 





> thanks for the feedback...what about starting on Fin at 0.025%?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey Guys I am sorry I have not been on much, my life has been a total disaster. My girlfriend of 5 years has left me and I am very depressed and low. I will reply soon once I get myself together, life just sucks sometimes as I really truly loved this girl so much I do not get where things have gone wrong  :Frown: .

----------


## Parsia

> Hey Guys I am sorry I have not been on much, my life has been a total disaster. My girlfriend of 5 years has left me and I am very depressed and low. I will reply soon once I get myself together, life just sucks sometimes as I really truly loved this girl so much I do not get where things have gone wrong .


 Thats fine Jazz ,

we all appreciate your help and your effort to forum members.

God bless you bro.

----------


## Jazz1

> Thats fine Jazz ,
> 
> we all appreciate your help and your effort to forum members.
> 
> God bless you bro.


 Thank You, I will try my best to reply in the next few days, as I just feel like praying right now.

----------


## Tarikko

For all the help and hope you have lent us and all your selfless services.. God bless you Jazz, keep strong... 

Hopefully it will all work out for the best for you, brother

----------


## Jazz1

> For all the help and hope you have lent us and all your selfless services.. God bless you Jazz, keep strong... 
> 
> Hopefully it will all work out for the best for you, brother


 Thank You Brother, I will try replying tonight, so hard as I really loved this girl so much  :Frown: .

----------


## Erstan

> For all the help and hope you have lent us and all your selfless services.. God bless you Jazz, keep strong... 
> 
> Hopefully it will all work out for the best for you, brother


 agree

----------


## Jazz1

> 1. are you taking oral fin along with the topical, and whats your regimen? do you use each every other day?
> 2. is the progesterone a dht blocker?


 Hey right I feel like I'm back on track thanks to praying I feel more at peace now.

I use legit 1mg finesteride alongside L-lysine together every other day and I use the topical mixture every morning. 

I beleive progesterone is known to be a DHT blocker, it's in both men/woman that helps balance the hormones etc.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Guys -whats the difference between Fin and azelaic acid? - they are both DHT blockers - correct?
> 
> I hear side effects about Fin but nothing on azelaic acid
> 
> appreciate the feedback
> 
> thank you


 Dr Richard Lee stated clearly Azelaic Acid works as a DHT blocker, most ex clients praised Dr Lee and his formulas. People used his minoxidol+azelaic acid mixtures alone and they worked superb.

Here's an interesting web page;

http://www.qdbd.com/hair_formulas_18.htm

----------


## Jazz1

> fin is a lot stronger, systemic, and more proven effective dht blocker. if ur gonna use one, use fin. the acid is more here say in my opinion; its good to add to an existing regiment of minoxidil and fin, but not uses solely, or in the place of fin


 Snap and well said, people need to realise the main bullet is the Big 3, than you can add extra additives and products to your regime to help boost better growth.

----------


## Jazz1

Murray Avenue Apothecary*

Hey Guys Susan asked me to post this out, this is a summer special for NEW clients who would like to try Susan's Minoxidol additive compound lotion/creams. They are offering $25 cash back on all NEW Client orders, plus the New/Existing clients are also eligible for 10% discount if 3 bottles are purchased in one go, this would be 10% of on the total price.

----------


## awdtnr91

Jazz.  I would like to order. How do i purchase?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz.  I would like to order. How do i purchase?


 Hey what's your current regime? What country you from and what you looking to order?

----------


## awdtnr91

I am currently on Minox 5%, Nizoral, and just quit propecia (bad depression).  I grew all of may hair back (and more) over the last 2 years with Propecia, it was awesome.  But now when I take it, I get really depressed???  Can you just give me a quick rundown of what all is entailed in this concoction?  I had read a ton, but am still a newbie.  I live in Ohio.  Thanks Jazz!

----------


## warner8

are you using generic propecia, or the brand name?




> I am currently on Minox 5%, Nizoral, and just quit propecia (bad depression).  I grew all of may hair back (and more) over the last 2 years with Propecia, it was awesome.  But now when I take it, I get really depressed???  Can you just give me a quick rundown of what all is entailed in this concoction?  I had read a ton, but am still a newbie.  I live in Ohio.  Thanks Jazz!

----------


## awdtnr91

> are you using generic propecia, or the brand name?


 I was using Finastride and cutting the tablets.

----------


## Arieux

> Dr Richard Lee stated clearly Azelaic Acid works as a DHT blocker, most ex clients praised Dr Lee and his formulas. People used his minoxidol+azelaic acid mixtures alone and they worked superb.
> 
> Here's an interesting web page;
> 
> http://www.qdbd.com/hair_formulas_18.htm


 I have serious doubts when it comes to Azelaic Acid and its effectivness. I use Revivogen Scalp Therapy (which containts AA, Zink, Saw palmetto and a lot of diffrent ingredients) since february and I didn't see any improvement. My situation is getting worse all the time. So AA is very weak blocker and in my opinion adding minox to the treatment without powerful DHT blocker is useless. Unfortunately, the only available antiandrogens (Fin, RU) may have serious sides...

----------


## Jazz1

> I am currently on Minox 5%, Nizoral, and just quit propecia (bad depression).  I grew all of may hair back (and more) over the last 2 years with Propecia, it was awesome.  But now when I take it, I get really depressed???  Can you just give me a quick rundown of what all is entailed in this concoction?  I had read a ton, but am still a newbie.  I live in Ohio.  Thanks Jazz!


 Right sorry for the late reply, you can have the mixtures made in any dosages. In your case I would suggest having Finesteride formulated in lower dosage seperate to the Minoxidol mixtures. I would use the Finesteride lotion at 0.025% and use it every 3rd day. I did this at the initial start until my body had built a tolerance and than I jumped on the full 1mg dosage and have been fine without any side effects.

The minoxidil mixture can be formulated in any %, example being 10,12.5,15,30.

You can add any additives such as:
Azelaic acid
Progesteone 
Tretinoin
Hydocortisone 
Finesteride DMI

They can be made in any base formula.

----------


## Jazz1

> I have serious doubts when it comes to Azelaic Acid and its effectivness. I use Revivogen Scalp Therapy (which containts AA, Zink, Saw palmetto and a lot of diffrent ingredients) since february and I didn't see any improvement. My situation is getting worse all the time. So AA is very weak blocker and in my opinion adding minox to the treatment without powerful DHT blocker is useless. Unfortunately, the only available antiandrogens (Fin, RU) may have serious sides...


 
I had major sides at the start on Finesteride, what sides have you experienced on finesteride?

----------


## awdtnr91

> I had major sides at the start on Finesteride, what sides have you experienced on finesteride?


 Is this something I can purchase from you Jazz?  Thank you!

----------


## Jazz1

> Is this something I can purchase from you Jazz?  Thank you!


 No as I'm a normal working guy, but this is something I set up for us forum members with the compounding pharmacy.

Where are you from? And what formulation do you want so I can help you.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I have a few updates and good news for some members I will post on Monday when I'm free from work. 

I'm sorry I have not been around much as I'm still struggling from my split and being dumped by my girlfriend of 5 years  :Frown: .

----------


## Frenchy2

> I'm sorry I have not been around much as I'm still struggling from my split and being dumped by my girlfriend of 5 years .


 I feel you bro, same thing happened to me à week ago, 5y gf.. Stay strong!

----------


## Jazz1

> I feel you bro, same thing happened to me à week ago, 5y gf.. Stay strong!


 Life sucks, but sometimes you have to stay strong bro because you Die alone! Stay positive and carry on doing good deeds, my mission in life is to help as many people and try finding a cure, even if it is impossible, do not stop dreaming!

----------


## jamesst11

> Life sucks, but sometimes you have to stay strong bro because you Die alone! Stay positive and carry on doing good deeds, my mission in life is to help as many people and try finding a cure, even if it is impossible, do not stop dreaming!


 Awesome.  could not have said it better myself.

----------


## Jazz1

FLORIDA PATIENTS:

Update:

Susan's MONOXIDIL formulas can be bought now by Florida patients,  plus they doing prp for hair loss 


The location is Simply Men's Health phone 561-459-5356

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I'm kind of back now, had so much going on in my life from being dumped! To so many weddings! 

Anyways, how is everyone doing and how's the hairloss?

----------


## thechamp

> Hey guys I'm kind of back now, had so much going on in my life from being dumped! To so many weddings! 
> 
> Anyways, how is everyone doing and how's the hairloss?


 I'm doing we'll I think my brother wants to try Susan's mix , what percentage of fin is in it ? , any way I see you broke up with your misses , any way didn't you go on this website helps with meeting and attracting women ,http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=228238, but personally I believe best way to meet girls is travel in my experience ,

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm doing we'll I think my brother wants to try Susan's mix , what percentage of fin is in it ? , any way I see you broke up with your misses , any way didn't you go on this website helps with meeting and attracting women ,http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=228238, but personally I believe best way to meet girls is travel in my experience ,


 Hey thanks for the tip, I still Love my EX so I do not plan to move away.

In regards to FIN, you can have any dosage made from 0.05% fine to 0.1% what ever suits you and she can also formulate FIN totally seperate mixture alone, so you could use it every 3rd to help minimise side effects if you do experience sides.

What's your regime now Champ? Still using the Igrow?

----------


## Jazz1

How is everyone doing? Sorry I have not been around hectic life style.

----------


## warner8

Hi Jazz, followed your instructions and got myself the Renepure DR, and my derma roller is on my way. 

I wanted to ask your thoughts on replacing fin with RU? 





> How is everyone doing? Sorry I have not been around hectic life style.

----------


## thechamp

> Hey thanks for the tip, I still Love my EX so I do not plan to move away.
> 
> In regards to FIN, you can have any dosage made from 0.05% fine to 0.1% what ever suits you and she can also formulate FIN totally seperate mixture alone, so you could use it every 3rd to help minimise side effects if you do experience sides.
> 
> What's your regime now Champ? Still using the Igrow?


 Yes igrow reganpure minoxdill thinking of getting thermadome since its stronger and covers the sides of the head and you?

----------


## doke

A change in subject just seen a video of conference with George Cotsarelis and although complex seems to make sence on how different scalp in mpb is in men and woman who suffer to normal scalp with full head of hair.
Also on the web site i noticed that the team all had a thick head of hair i wonder whether they have been using the scalp wounding and topical pgd2 or pgj2 blocker.
They seem to have a few companies involved with this but only tested on mice unless george has already been using it himself? it still seems a long way till it comes on the market as human trials need to go ahead.
I thought kane was going to produce a topical already mixed pgd2 blocker but has not as yet.
Forgot this may be interesting for you link www.folliclethought.com

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz, followed your instructions and got myself the Renepure DR, and my derma roller is on my way. 
> 
> I wanted to ask your thoughts on replacing fin with RU?


 I would advise against this, unless Finesteride or DUT has lost its efficacy. RU58841 I found to be very powerfull, I always keep it as emergency in my freezer.

In your case it sounds like your shedding from 12.5% to 15%, stay positive everything will be ok.

----------


## Jazz1

> Yes igrow reganpure minoxdill thinking of getting thermadome since its stronger and covers the sides of the head and you?


 How's yoir hairloss now? Considering you do not use a DHT blocker? Unless you suffered from stress related hairloss.

----------


## Jazz1

> A change in subject just seen a video of conference with George Cotsarelis and although complex seems to make sence on how different scalp in mpb is in men and woman who suffer to normal scalp with full head of hair.
> Also on the web site i noticed that the team all had a thick head of hair i wonder whether they have been using the scalp wounding and topical pgd2 or pgj2 blocker.
> They seem to have a few companies involved with this but only tested on mice unless george has already been using it himself? it still seems a long way till it comes on the market as human trials need to go ahead.
> I thought kane was going to produce a topical already mixed pgd2 blocker but has not as yet.
> Forgot this may be interesting for you link www.folliclethought.com


 Hey thanks il check tommorow as I have a headache now and tired from work. Last I remember someone mentioned something about a compound people were going to trial from Kane, beginning with S, Sep something?

----------


## jjo

> Murray Avenue Apothecary*
> 
> Hey Guys Susan asked me to post this out, this is a summer special for NEW clients who would like to try Susan's Minoxidol additive compound lotion/creams. They are offering $25 cash back on all NEW Client orders, plus the New/Existing clients are also eligible for 10% discount if 3 bottles are purchased in one go, this would be 10% of on the total price.


 Hey is this offer still up for grabs? i've been thinking about ordering for a long time now.

If I just order minox 10% / AA / Ret A do I still need a prescription? I'm on dut and don't need propecia in my formula.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey is this offer still up for grabs? i've been thinking about ordering for a long time now.
> 
> If I just order minox 10% / AA / Ret A do I still need a prescription? I'm on dut and don't need propecia in my formula.


 Hey you 100% need a prescription, anything over 5% and other additives requires a prescription bro. Where are you from?

----------


## jjo

> Hey you 100% need a prescription, anything over 5% and other additives requires a prescription bro. Where are you from?


 i'm in canada.. what would it cost me for minox 10%, AA, Ret A ?  If I have to get the prescription i'd want to buy 6 months supply at once per day

----------


## Jazz1

> i'm in canada.. what would it cost me for minox 10%, AA, Ret A ?  If I have to get the prescription i'd want to buy 6 months supply at once per day


 
Hey I have put everything in this thread, I also added list and explanation how to order.

What's your current regime? So I can try guiding you or try to maximise more hair growth.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## diffuse

Hey Jazz, You've helped me before maybe you don't remember because you're helping a lot of people! My hair is ok right now i'm taking finasteride, using RU and minox, but i think fin and minox helped me a lot. i'm using fin for 6 months and i have low libido and my erectionts are not that hard and long lasting. I'm taking it everyday i've read before if i remember well that you had the same problem and now you re taking it EOD. And you also recommended some supplements, what was that? I should take zinc, l-arginine.. etc?
I'm quite sure that the side effect are estrogen related because i have a small gyno for years and it became sensitive.. So maybe i'll try arimidex later if i dont have any other choice because i won't quit finasteride!

Thanks for your help!

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, You've helped me before maybe you don't remember because you're helping a lot of people! My hair is ok right now i'm taking finasteride, using RU and minox, but i think fin and minox helped me a lot. i'm using fin for 6 months and i have low libido and my erectionts are not that hard and long lasting. I'm taking it everyday i've read before if i remember well that you had the same problem and now you re taking it EOD. And you also recommended some supplements, what was that? I should take zinc, l-arginine.. etc?
> I'm quite sure that the side effect are estrogen related because i have a small gyno for years and it became sensitive.. So maybe i'll try arimidex later if i dont have any other choice because i won't quit finasteride!
> 
> Thanks for your help!


 Hey I'm back now, right how are the libido side effects? One key point is to not STRESS. You must relax your  knd, if you have a partner or even watch your favourite porn. You must control the mind in order to block the side effects, I found thinking and watching porn with my favourite wildest fantasies helped me. 

Also to add have you tried horny goat weed? I would also consider using finesteride EOD, you use 1mg right?

----------


## Jazz1

> i'm in canada.. what would it cost me for minox 10%, AA, Ret A ?  If I have to get the prescription i'd want to buy 6 months supply at once per day


 Hey everything is on the first page in this thread I created to help any looking for guidance.

Let me know if you require further assistance or help.
https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

Right guys! I am half back and managed to pick myself up since my EX left me Brocken in pieces.

This is what I enjoy doing helping others in my spare time, looking for alternatives and searching for cures.

I have decided I'm going to dedicate more time helping others, researching more in the hope I might find a cure for us all.

Anyways to anyone who requires my help or advice shoot away I'm back now.

----------


## Eire1980

> Right guys! I am half back and managed to pick myself up since my EX left me Brocken in pieces.
> 
> This is what I enjoy doing helping others in my spare time, looking for alternatives and searching for cures.
> 
> I have decided I'm going to dedicate more time helping others, researching more in the hope I might find a cure for us all.
> 
> Anyways to anyone who requires my help or advice shoot away I'm back now.


 Hey Jazz,

Good to see your back on form.
What's the story with reordering from Susan? 
The prescription I have is still in date.
Also how you getting on with her other products, melatonin etc

Cheers

----------


## Eire1980

> Right guys! I am half back and managed to pick myself up since my EX left me Brocken in pieces.
> 
> This is what I enjoy doing helping others in my spare time, looking for alternatives and searching for cures.
> 
> I have decided I'm going to dedicate more time helping others, researching more in the hope I might find a cure for us all.
> 
> Anyways to anyone who requires my help or advice shoot away I'm back now.


 Hey Jazz,

Good to see your back on form.
What's the story with reordering from Susan? 
The prescription I have is still in date.
Also how you getting on with her other products, melatonin etc

Cheers

----------


## Eire1980

Anyone know how to reorder? 

Don't see it on their website.

Any help appreciated
Thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Anyone know how to reorder? 
> 
> Don't see it on their website.
> 
> Any help appreciated
> Thanks


 Hey I am sorry I have been away I needed more space to myself.

Right, how much prescription have you got
Left? If you still have prescription left over than call Susan direct and pay for a refill.
Let me know if you need further help, I been so busy working, as I do shift work plus the depression from my EX, I promise once I'm stable I will spend time helping people.

----------


## diffuse

> Hey I'm back now, right how are the libido side effects? One key point is to not STRESS. You must relax your  knd, if you have a partner or even watch your favourite porn. You must control the mind in order to block the side effects, I found thinking and watching porn with my favourite wildest fantasies helped me. 
> 
> Also to add have you tried horny goat weed? I would also consider using finesteride EOD, you use 1mg right?


 I haven't changed anything and i don't have libido issues now i has simply went away.. instead my hair is shedding.
f*ck the shedding i hoped that fin will stabilize the situation but my hair is shedding then grows back it's good for 1 or 2 months then shedding again..

----------


## Parsia

> Anyone know how to reorder? 
> 
> Don't see it on their website.
> 
> Any help appreciated
> Thanks


 Hello Eire
I think the best thing is call or email her. 
I've got susan lotion 15 % for 6 months supply and I'm curious to do the same if I get any result.
So far I'm on it for less than 3 months , may I ask if you get any result so far or not please?

----------


## Eire1980

> Hello Eire
> I think the best thing is call or email her. 
> I've got susan lotion 15 % for 6 months supply and I'm curious to do the same if I get any result.
> So far I'm on it for less than 3 months , may I ask if you get any result so far or not please?


 Hey mate, thanks for the feedback.
I did end up ringing Susan.
I have been alternating from minox 12.5 with fin 0.05 and minox without fin just because I was afraid of sides..my crown has got worse though..so I've just ordered 3 bottles of minox 12.5 with fin and will stick to that daily and see how I go..are you seeing anything after 3 months?

----------


## Parsia

> Hey mate, thanks for the feedback.
> I did end up ringing Susan.
> I have been alternating from minox 12.5 with fin 0.05 and minox without fin just because I was afraid of sides..my crown has got worse though..so I've just ordered 3 bottles of minox 12.5 with fin and will stick to that daily and see how I go..are you seeing anything after 3 months?


 Thanks buddy , Actually I used lipogaine before and get some result , After 3 months of using susan lotion I haven't seen anything special yet , if that would be the case in the next 
couple months and don't get any regrowth I will drop it , and its very pricey.

----------


## warner8

i am kind of with you on this one, i bought the 12% with no results after 4 months, and then jumped to the 15% with progesterone, and still nothing after 3 months. if nothing by december (f it last till then), i won't be reordering from her. 




> Thanks buddy , Actually I used lipogaine before and get some result , After 3 months of using susan lotion I haven't seen anything special yet , if that would be the case in the next 
> couple months and don't get any regrowth I will drop it , and its very pricey.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I would allow 6 months as 3 months is very early, sound the 6 month is when one should determine if you are obtaining any regrowth.

Also I always advice using the same mixture additives as me to benefit maximum results.

Hit me with any questions and your regime and time frames so I can see what's going wrong or determine the shedding phase.

----------


## Jazz1

What about the rest using her products any luck or results? 

I added her glutathione mixtures and melatonin recently so will keep you guys updated as I have alot of vellus hairs around my temples I'm trying to make terminal.

----------


## thechamp

> What about the rest using her products any luck or results? 
> 
> I added her glutathione mixtures and melatonin recently so will keep you guys updated as I have alot of vellus hairs around my temples I'm trying to make terminal.


 Jazz I kneed your help , I'm starting to find pillow hairs and not so many in the shower , now I think I needs Susan's details , and prescriptions I can't tolerate fin I tried lipogaine but got a fast heart rate , you said minoxidil with Azelic is better with cream less side effects , or maybe I'll just get a cream minoxidil stronger one made up ? With a Dht blocker if I can't Handel Azelic acid ? Please get back to me ASAP thanks.

----------


## thechamp

3.) Melatonin I would recommend that you just use this first before the spirolactolone as it does the same thing spiro does: It competes for the Androgen receptors and fits into them like a key into a lock so that 

there is already a melatonin molecule in it when the DHT comes by, so that the DHT cant do any damage. Spiro does offer more powerful results, but melatonin is 80% as effective for a fraction of the cost. A bottle of melatonin will run you about 10 bucks a month.
Take one pill of 3g melatonin, and place it in that clean right guard cap you already cleaned out, angle it a bit, then put about 2-3 ml of water in there and watch the pill rapidly fall apart and dissolve. 
How to Use: This can be done right after you towel dry your hair, your hair can be still wet with this. Simply mix thoroughly with the rogaine applicator stick in the right guard cap with the water, suck it up and out of the stick a few times to completely mix it, then apply the water/melatonin mixture with the rogaine stick directly to the scalp all over. Afterwards yuur hair will be dripping with the melatonin/water solution so you can just towel dry your hair again as you previously did when you just stepped out of the shower. Dont worry, you wont rub off the melatonin with a towel, its in your receptors on your scalp. Especially if your hair is still moderatly thick. If your hair is really thin, slightly rub the towel over those areas. But someone with my thick hair? I towel dry it with gusto.
Once the scalp is totally dry by air drying or blow drying your hair, you can then apply an application of  rogaine on top of it.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz I kneed your help , I'm starting to find pillow hairs and not so many in the shower , now I think I needs Susan's details , and prescriptions I can't tolerate fin I tried lipogaine but got a fast heart rate , you said minoxidil with Azelic is better with cream less side effects , or maybe I'll just get a cream minoxidil stronger one made up ? With a Dht blocker if I can't Handel Azelic acid ? Please get back to me ASAP thanks.


 
Right explain to me your full regime first and what's going wrong? What's caused this sudden panick? Relax I will help you lol take a deep breathe as it sounds like your panicking.......

----------


## Jazz1

> 3.) Melatonin I would recommend that you just use this first before the spirolactolone as it does the same thing spiro does: It competes for the Androgen receptors and fits into them like a key into a lock so that 
> 
> there is already a melatonin molecule in it when the DHT comes by, so that the DHT cant do any damage. Spiro does offer more powerful results, but melatonin is 80% as effective for a fraction of the cost. A bottle of melatonin will run you about 10 bucks a month.
> Take one pill of 3g melatonin, and place it in that clean right guard cap you already cleaned out, angle it a bit, then put about 2-3 ml of water in there and watch the pill rapidly fall apart and dissolve. 
> How to Use: This can be done right after you towel dry your hair, your hair can be still wet with this. Simply mix thoroughly with the rogaine applicator stick in the right guard cap with the water, suck it up and out of the stick a few times to completely mix it, then apply the water/melatonin mixture with the rogaine stick directly to the scalp all over. Afterwards yuur hair will be dripping with the melatonin/water solution so you can just towel dry your hair again as you previously did when you just stepped out of the shower. Dont worry, you wont rub off the melatonin with a towel, its in your receptors on your scalp. Especially if your hair is still moderatly thick. If your hair is really thin, slightly rub the towel over those areas. But someone with my thick hair? I towel dry it with gusto.
> Once the scalp is totally dry by air drying or blow drying your hair, you can then apply an application of  rogaine on top of it.


 Hey thanks for this tip as I had been mixing the stuff when I apply spiro S5 cream.

----------


## thechamp

> Hey thanks for this tip as I had been mixing the stuff when I apply spiro S5 cream.


 Thanks jazz just more shedding think it's nothing hairs still thick I just want a Dht blocker , so is Susan mixing melatonin with minoxidil or seperate it sounds promising for me since I can't Handel propecia ?

----------


## thechamp

Reganpure Igrow minoxidil and its stable and thick

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks jazz just more shedding think it's nothing hairs still thick I just want a Dht blocker , so is Susan mixing melatonin with minoxidil or seperate it sounds promising for me since I can't Handel propecia ?


 She sells melatonin seperate I'm using it now so can't say anything just yet. 

Her proven topical mixture which I use since Dr Klein passed away consists of;

15% minoxidol
0.1% finesteride 
5% azelaic acid
0.25% progesterone
0.025% tretinoin 
0.1% Hydocortisone 

Why can't you handle propecia? I mean what's your current full regime?

----------


## Jazz1

> Reganpure Igrow minoxidil and its stable and thick


 Wow man your lucky lol, ok in that case have you looked into those Divine herbal oils I suggested, as they contain more natural DHT blockers. I mean if you combined those with Susan's higher strength minoxidol, instead of melatonin I would use her Acetyl Glutathione/biotin mixture as that would be more effective.

----------


## thechamp

Jazz Susan recccomended, I do like the topical Melatonin but our AG with Biotin 3% is a stronger antioxidant and helps the follicle mature Michael.

Ag with biotin what's your thoughts on this ?

----------


## thechamp

AG with Biotin 3% is a stronger antioxidant and helps the follicle mature ,Keep the follicles healthy, keep antioxidants high in the hair.
Acetyl Glutathione with Biotin is a no brainer addition is 3 percent too strong jazz ??? You think if I shed hair from this it will grow back ?

----------


## Jazz1

> AG with Biotin 3% is a stronger antioxidant and helps the follicle mature ,Keep the follicles healthy, keep antioxidants high in the hair.
> Acetyl Glutathione with Biotin is a no brainer addition is 3 percent too strong jazz ??? You think if I shed hair from this it will grow back ?


 
Hey I can not comment yet as I just recently added them alongside Folligen cream to help thicken my vellus hairs. I read upon Acetyl Glutathione to be the most powerfull antioxidant, but in men's case we suffer MPB so we need a DHT blocker before even considering other alternative topicals to work alone. That's why I never recommend this stuff alone as it won't work as effective than finesteride due to you suffering MPB.

You also considered S5 spiro cream from ************? What shampoo are you using? I always recommend Regenepuren DR, Ketaconazole helps inhibit DHT.

----------


## thechamp

> Hey I can not comment yet as I just recently added them alongside Folligen cream to help thicken my vellus hairs. I read upon Acetyl Glutathione to be the most powerfull antioxidant, but in men's case we suffer MPB so we need a DHT blocker before even considering other alternative topicals to work alone. That's why I never recommend this stuff alone as it won't work as effective than finesteride due to you suffering MPB.
> 
> You also considered S5 spiro cream from ************? What shampoo are you using? I always recommend Regenepuren DR, Ketaconazole helps inhibit DHT.


 I use reganpure my hair loss must be stress related because I can not take a Dht blocker because of weight gain, seems the ketaconazole twice a day ten mins and minoxidil and Igrow were enough for me Atm , but I always want thicker but I'm scared to add another treatment and get shedding and it doesn't grow back so I'm hesitant , you recommend folligen cream ?

----------


## Jazz1

> I use reganpure my hair loss must be stress related because I can not take a Dht blocker because of weight gain, seems the ketaconazole twice a day ten mins and minoxidil and Igrow were enough for me Atm , but I always want thicker but I'm scared to add another treatment and get shedding and it doesn't grow back so I'm hesitant , you recommend folligen cream ?


 Hey Folligen 100% helps as when I had AA on my beard few years back minoxidol grew my hairs back very fine thin white. When I applied Folligen they grew back terminal black.

In reads to DHT, you considered those Divine oils they contain natural DHT blockers. Also you could get Susan to formulate you higher % minoxidil or even add a very low dosage of Finesteride like 0.05% or 0.025%?

----------


## jamesst11

Jazz, 
   Do you get any positive results from the formula you mentioned?  I am considering trying this... is it greasy?

----------


## Tarikko

Hey guys,

I haven't posted here for almost a year..

Latest update, i switched the Belgravia liquid solution for Susan's one... 15% minox, progesterone, Finasteride, AA, hydrocortisone... and my hair became thicker than ever...

However recently, as i was telling bro Jazz on whatsapp, i incorporated the hair signals cream therapy... which combines saw palmetto, tea extracts among other ingredients... and I experienced a shed...

for a month or so.. or past week, my hair has picked up again and hopefully ill gain some more ground..

My latest craze is the onion juice... started 2 days ago... i chop fresh onions into a juice and i apply all over my scalp andleave for half an hour.. my hair feels amazing after the shower and the shampoo never lathered so beautifully for some reason.. only downside is the stink and no matter how many times i wash my hair, you can still smell it if you step close enough lol... nevertheless i've decided to carry on with it and add it to my intense regimen..

I will keep you posted  :Smile:

----------


## warner8

man I've been on her 15% with all the stuff you listed minus the fin, and all i did was shed, and i have not had any regrowth or thickening. I've been on it since july go this year, so 3 months. when did you start seeing good results, and did you shed? also do you think the topical fin in the mixture makes the real diff, or is it the higher percent of the minox?
thanks
[/QUOTE]


> Hey guys,
> 
> I haven't posted here for almost a year..
> 
> Latest update, i switched the Belgravia liquid solution for Susan's one... 15% minox, progesterone, Finasteride, AA, hydrocortisone... and my hair became thicker than ever...
> 
> However recently, as i was telling bro Jazz on whatsapp, i incorporated the hair signals cream therapy... which combines saw palmetto, tea extracts among other ingredients... and I experienced a shed...
> 
> for a month or so.. or past week, my hair has picked up again and hopefully ill gain some more ground..
> ...

----------


## Tarikko

Hey Warner,

My regimen is so intense that i almost lose track of what I put on my hair... but one thing i noticed, whenever i add a new treatment i experience a minor shed...

I only been on susan stuff for 2-3 months now... definitely seen improvement.. im not sure why you keep shedding.. maybe bodies react differently..

This is my regimen as of now:

Minox 5% foam, once a day.. down from twice

Susan Lotion, everyday morning time

Belgravia 12.5% minox cream, every night

Fina pills, i take 0.5mg EOD

Hair signals cream, daily

Laser helmet 3 times a week

Onion juice, started 3 days ago, planning to use it 5 times a week.. the stink persists, i dunno what to do about it for now but im planning to keep going

Vitamins and supplements

Divine herbals 3 times a week

Emu Oil and Castor oil 3 times a week..

I might have missed something.. will update if so later.. but this is the bulk

I think the topical fin in the mixture is a big plus.. now im taking it orally and topically.. but cannot be certain.. as too many treatments are involved.

----------


## thechamp

> Hey Folligen 100% helps as when I had AA on my beard few years back minoxidol grew my hairs back very fine thin white. When I applied Folligen they grew back terminal black.
> 
> In reads to DHT, you considered those Divine oils they contain natural DHT blockers. Also you could get Susan to formulate you higher % minoxidil or even add a very low dosage of Finesteride like 0.05% or 0.025%?


 Even the lowest dose of fin will still cause it to go systematic and I'll gain weight , unless there's a way to stop it going systematic but there's been talk of this before , I can't Handel Azelic acid with minoxidil , so can you think of a minioxdill with Dht blockers I could have ? Also this folligen cream did you buy it from Amazon how does it work ? And does it block Dht ?
 Any sides ?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz, 
>    Do you get any positive results from the formula you mentioned?  I am considering trying this... is it greasy?


 Hey I can not say as I was prior using Dr Kleins original formula that gave me results, when he passed away I found this new pharamcy. 1 year on and I'm still maintaining, so it works exactly the same and I'm very happy.

There are some other guys using the formula and getting results, again everyone is different.

What's your current regime and hairloss?

----------


## Jazz1

> man I've been on her 15% with all the stuff you listed minus the fin, and all i did was shed, and i have not had any regrowth or thickening. I've been on it since july go this year, so 3 months. when did you start seeing good results, and did you shed? also do you think the topical fin in the mixture makes the real diff, or is it the higher percent of the minox?
> thanks


 [/QUOTE]

As mentioned bro I would add topical finesteride, i been using both internal and topcical. As above Tarikko has also added 0.1% topical nd he used internal Finesteride every other day.

You ideally want to give it your best shot at all angles, you also using a Ketaconazole shampoo?

----------


## Jazz1

> Even the lowest dose of fin will still cause it to go systematic and I'll gain weight , unless there's a way to stop it going systematic but there's been talk of this before , I can't Handel Azelic acid with minoxidil , so can you think of a minioxdill with Dht blockers I could have ? Also this folligen cream did you buy it from Amazon how does it work ? And does it block Dht ?
>  Any sides ?


 I mean Folligen cream alone won't do much in blocking DHT, it's more to thicken existing vellus hairs. As above Tarriko uses the hair signals one which contains saw palmetto, for me thay cream made me very horny, everyone is different. I only use the Folligen cream now as I'm trying to thicken some vellus hairs around my hairline.

I would consider those Divine herbal hair oils both Divine oil and boosting, as they contain natural DHT blockers. My first choice of defence is Finesteride  :Smile: .

----------


## thechamp

> I mean Folligen cream alone won't do much in blocking DHT, it's more to thicken existing vellus hairs. As above Tarriko uses the hair signals one which contains saw palmetto, for me thay cream made me very horny, everyone is different. I only use the Folligen cream now as I'm trying to thicken some vellus hairs around my hairline.
> 
> Where do you buy folligen cream ? Any sides 
> I would consider those Divine herbal hair oils both Divine oil and boosting, as they contain natural DHT blockers. My first choice of defence is Finesteride .


 
Where do you buy folligen cream ? Any sides And does it have a shedding period ?

----------


## Jazz1

> Where do you buy folligen cream ? Any sides And does it have a shedding period ?


 I buy from a seller on eBay Uk, just type Folligen cream on eBay Uk and you will see X2 Folligen cream for sale. I experienced no shedding, only slight irritated scalp of I use too much, it's bit like the Folligen spray that also stings.

I would add this plus those oils, that should do the trick if your hairloss is ok and your looking for thickening.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey champ did you find the Folligen cream?

----------


## thechamp

> Hey champ did you find the Folligen cream?


 Haven't added yet after seeing Swiss temples results , I asked Susan if she could make a natural version of that as a topical , also have you seen herbilisers results on this forum impressive .

----------


## thechamp

http://yournextremedy.blogspot.com.a...-work.html?m=1

----------


## Jcm800

What's this crock of shit scam? Wasn't trx2 bad enough??

----------


## Jcm800

Looks like it's made by those conning bastards too.. Clever tactics...

----------


## hawk64hk

It take me more than a month to go over all the pages in this thread. Really gain a lot of knowledge from the thread. Thanks to those who has shared their experience in this thread so that I can learn from them

I've suffered from diffuse thinning for some time. I've once use Dr. Lee ******* but it's long time ago. Then 3 years ago, I start using Lipogaine but it gradually lose its strength so that I switch to 5% foam. However, I've serious sleep disorder with this stuff. If I apply the foam,  I ends up staying awake on the bed for 2 hours before I can sleep. This's really abnormal to me. Do you guys have any issue with using the 5% foam?

Besides, I want to try Susan product but I have no idea what ingredient for the foam and regime I should use. Jazz1, Can I send  mail to your mail A/C for your advice?

THX

----------


## warner8

you just missed out on a 20% off sale Susan was having. a bottle of the compounded minox cost 90 dollars. so with the discount it was more affordable. she rarely gives discounts on her products. 



> It take me more than a month to go over all the pages in this thread. Really gain a lot of knowledge from the thread. Thanks to those who has shared their experience in this thread so that I can learn from them
> 
> I've suffered from diffuse thinning for some time. I've once use Dr. Lee ******* but it's long time ago. Then 3 years ago, I start using Lipogaine but it gradually lose its strength so that I switch to 5% foam. However, I've serious sleep disorder with this stuff. If I apply the foam,  I ends up staying awake on the bed for 2 hours before I can sleep. This's really abnormal to me. Do you guys have any issue with using the 5% foam?
> 
> Besides, I want to try Susan product but I have no idea what ingredient for the foam and regime I should use. Jazz1, Can I send  mail to your mail A/C for your advice?
> 
> THX

----------


## warner8

you just missed out on a 20% off sale Susan was having. a bottle of the compounded minox cost 90 dollars. so with the discount it was more affordable. she rarely gives discounts on her products. 



> It take me more than a month to go over all the pages in this thread. Really gain a lot of knowledge from the thread. Thanks to those who has shared their experience in this thread so that I can learn from them
> 
> I've suffered from diffuse thinning for some time. I've once use Dr. Lee ******* but it's long time ago. Then 3 years ago, I start using Lipogaine but it gradually lose its strength so that I switch to 5% foam. However, I've serious sleep disorder with this stuff. If I apply the foam,  I ends up staying awake on the bed for 2 hours before I can sleep. This's really abnormal to me. Do you guys have any issue with using the 5% foam?
> 
> Besides, I want to try Susan product but I have no idea what ingredient for the foam and regime I should use. Jazz1, Can I send  mail to your mail A/C for your advice?
> 
> THX

----------


## hawk64hk

Thanks for let me know of the discount. But, first of all, I need to write to Jazz1 for his advice on the regime.

----------


## hawk64hk

Warner8, By the way, do you have any experience using Susan product?

----------


## charlie76761

Jazz - i know you're a massive fan of Susan's mix and very keen to push on such insight to the wider community 

However, i had to throw away her stuff as it's so thick and oily, i can't use it as makes my hair so very oily that when i put it on you can see so much scalp. 

I've gone back to Dr Klein's original product, hairgrowthmd, which is back up and running under a chap called Dr Adam Miller who is very switched on and knowledgeable with hair loss developments which is refreshing to know (ended up talking to him for about 20 mins on various hair loss topics when i had my consultation with him)

I should receive their 5% and 10% which comes in a spray form (should be v light/less oily) in a week or two. Will feedback

----------


## warner8

yes since march of this year, but not with any success

i used the 12%, then the 15% and now i will try the 30% with the addition of topical fin (they had a 20% off sale last week friday so i took advantage of it). this is my last attempt with susans products. the products are expensive, but pure,BUT  i have not seen any results to justify continue using them if the 30% doesn't do a thing. I'm only trying the 30% as a last option on the advice of another member on the various forums kgatton suggested i give it a try who also uses her products. the problem is every time  u want to bump up the minox you have to get a new scrip from this medical wellness pharmacy online and it costs $60. you get the script back the same day though. susan then charges about $90 to compound it and it takes a week or more for delivery. so its a $150 commitment just to start. 

some have had success with it, other have not. i was a great responder to minox in my early 20's using generic 5% and now longer get that response despite adding fin to my regimen. i thought that increasing the minox % would do the trick, but not so confident in that anymore. i also think you should get on topical RU if you have not yet, and start incorporating castor/coconut/emu and other oils. basically slam this thing at different angles and don't wait on it. i think minox, fin, RU and oils are the best treatment options available at the moment. 





> Warner8, By the way, do you have any experience using Susan product?

----------


## Parsia

> Jazz - i know you're a massive fan of Susan's mix and very keen to push on such insight to the wider community 
> 
> However, i had to throw away her stuff as it's so thick and oily, i can't use it as makes my hair so very oily that when i put it on you can see so much scalp. 
> 
> I've gone back to Dr Klein's original product, hairgrowthmd, which is back up and running under a chap called Dr Adam Miller who is very switched on and knowledgeable with hair loss developments which is refreshing to know (ended up talking to him for about 20 mins on various hair loss topics when i had my consultation with him)
> 
> I should receive their 5% and 10% which comes in a spray form (should be v light/less oily) in a week or two. Will feedback


 Thanks for the update charlie , Actually I use susan 15 % lotion ( Promox ) for more than 4 months and I have seen significant regrowth 
in my frontal scalp , I have to wait more to see the peak of my regrowth , but so far I satisfy from the result , to me its not oily at all and
very convenient to use , I keep my hair short for better absorbs , So do you use the same and its oily to you ?
I also like to use the spray , if you can please tell me more about the price for 10% .

----------


## warner8

hey parse, are u using the fin in 15% minox from susan?




> Thanks for the update charlie , Actually I use susan 15 % lotion ( Promox ) for more than 4 months and I have seen significant regrowth 
> in my frontal scalp , I have to wait more to see the peak of my regrowth , but so far I satisfy from the result , to me its not oily at all and
> very convenient to use , I keep my hair short for better absorbs , So do you use the same and its oily to you ?
> I also like to use the spray , if you can please tell me more about the price for 10% .

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys sorry I have been away on holiday I will reply tommorow, as above I did try Dr Kleins new formula and I found that extremly stickyl. I still have Dr Kleins old original formula which in my eyes was perfectly clean, the new pharamcy they are using is very sticky the 10% sprays.

Anyways I will reply to posts tommorow as I'm tired from a long day at work from shift work!

----------


## Jazz1

I am also sorry I have not been around much to help people, I did need some time out. Since my EX cheated on me I have and still am trying to battle my depressed state of mind. To those who genuinely know me I am always keen and passionate to help anyone in my spare time. I will reply tommorow, have a good night.

----------


## JohnMPB

Can someone besides jazz show me some pictures of these compounded minox forumals providing good regrowth? I understand these are individually customized and compounded but they charge a lot of $ for these formulas. I don't think I've seen anyone but jazz show me a case where there was a good amount of regrowth.

And by the way jazz, you seem like a very good guy. I hope your pain regarding your recent breakup passes soon. Take care bud

----------


## doke

> I am also sorry I have not been around much to help people, I did need some time out. Since my EX cheated on me I have and still am trying to battle my depressed state of mind. To those who genuinely know me I am always keen and passionate to help anyone in my spare time. I will reply tommorow, have a good night.


 Sorry to here that jazz you are a good guy and are trying to help people on here so its her loss not yours.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I'm sorry for the late reply I have been extremely busy. Anyways I'm back now, in regards to pictures a few people have shown me who I have been helping. I am not posting anything, if they wish to post to help others that's entirely their choice.

Also to add guys, please don't think these are miracle products, as finesteride itself is not the cure. These products assist better much better if you respond well to finesteride in my eyes. What I have learned over the years is by adding these mixtures in conjunction to my routine, I could not be happier and I hope I can hold on until better treatments come out.

I also keep DUT and RU58841 in my fridge with Stemoxydine 5% just incase Finetseride efficacy fails on me.

Anyways any questions or anyone needs help just shoot me with questions, if I can assist to help anyone I will  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys if anyone uses or did use Dr Sandra Browns formula, she has now retired. A poster created a thread on the other forums and was unhappy as he had been using it for years, it's some special mixture of tretinoin and Hydocortisone. Susan had been in touch with her as I emailed her Dr Sandra Browns details. I will check tommorow if she had any luck in carry on creating her product.

----------


## johnnyboots

> Hey guys if anyone uses or did use Dr Sandra Browns formula, she has now retired. A poster created a thread on the other forums and was unhappy as he had been using it for years, it's some special mixture of tretinoin and Hydocortisone. Susan had been in touch with her as I emailed her Dr Sandra Browns details. I will check tommorow if she had any luck in carry on creating her product.


  Any word on this ?

----------


## thechamp

Jazz add this shampoo to your stack Amazing shampoo , working better for me than reganpure and nizoral , my brother also suffers from hair loss , it's a olive oil shampoo with essential oils I know your a fan of oils they have a conditioner too  but seriously it can not hert to add this to your daily routine. , it's only 12.99 you can get a conditioner too, my brother couldn't get rid of his itch or dandruff with nizoral , but this did this is not a
Miracle product but it a must add make existing hair healthier .

Product Description

KEY ACTIVE INGREDIENTS

• Olive Oil—a gentle and natural emollient.
• Vitamin E – antioxidant to nourish and repair damaged skin.
• Evening Primrose Oil & Vitamin B5—improves skin quality, suppleness and softness.
• Essential Oils—relieve itching and irritation.

UNIQUE FEATURES

• Enriched with natural olive oil.
• Soothes itching, relieves dryness, cleanses.
• Balanced to the skin’s pH level.
• FREE from Propylene Glycol, Lanolin and Fragrance
• Ideal for daily use.
• Enriched with Vitamins E & B5, Evening Primrose Oil and Essential Oils to nourish and soothe a dry, itchy scalp
• Gentle lathering system cleanses without drying.
• Gentle on eyes and sensitive skin on face and body.

METHOD OF USE

• Apply a liberal amount of Michael’s Olivara Shampoo or Michael’s Olivara Conditioner onto hands and gently massage into hair and scalp before rinsing
• Recommended as a daily shampoo and conditioner for all scalp types.
• Use with Michael’s Olivara Skin Cream, Michael’s Olivara Skin Lotion and Michael’s Olivara Skin Wash.
• Suitable for infants, children and adults.
http://www.michaelsproducts.com/dry-scalp-shampo

Also honesty my brothers dandruff was bad until this shampoo fixed it.

----------


## thechamp

Jazz add this shampoo to your stack Amazing shampoo , working better for me than reganpure and nizoral , my brother also suffers from hair loss , it's a olive oil shampoo with essential oils I know your a fan of oils they have a conditioner too  but seriously it can not hert to add this to your daily routine. , it's only 12.99 you can get a conditioner too, my brother couldn't get rid of his itch or dandruff with nizoral , but this did this is not a
Miracle product but it a must add make existing hair healthier .

Product Description

KEY ACTIVE INGREDIENTS

 Olive Oila gentle and natural emollient.
 Vitamin E  antioxidant to nourish and repair damaged skin.
 Evening Primrose Oil & Vitamin B5improves skin quality, suppleness and softness.
 Essential Oilsrelieve itching and irritation.

UNIQUE FEATURES

 Enriched with natural olive oil.
 Soothes itching, relieves dryness, cleanses.
 Balanced to the skins pH level.
 FREE from Propylene Glycol, Lanolin and Fragrance
 Ideal for daily use.
 Enriched with Vitamins E & B5, Evening Primrose Oil and Essential Oils to nourish and soothe a dry, itchy scalp
 Gentle lathering system cleanses without drying.
 Gentle on eyes and sensitive skin on face and body.

METHOD OF USE

 Apply a liberal amount of Michaels Olivara Shampoo or Michaels Olivara Conditioner onto hands and gently massage into hair and scalp before rinsing
 Recommended as a daily shampoo and conditioner for all scalp types.
 Use with Michaels Olivara Skin Cream, Michaels Olivara Skin Lotion and Michaels Olivara Skin Wash.
 Suitable for infants, children and adults.
http://www.michaelsproducts.com/dry-scalp-shampo

Also honesty my brothers dandruff was bad until this shampoo fixed it.

----------


## warner8

does this regrow hair or is it just for dandruff??




> Jazz add this shampoo to your stack Amazing shampoo , working better for me than reganpure and nizoral , my brother also suffers from hair loss , it's a olive oil shampoo with essential oils I know your a fan of oils they have a conditioner too  but seriously it can not hert to add this to your daily routine. , it's only 12.99 you can get a conditioner too, my brother couldn't get rid of his itch or dandruff with nizoral , but this did this is not a
> Miracle product but it a must add make existing hair healthier .
> 
> Product Description
> 
> KEY ACTIVE INGREDIENTS
> 
> • Olive Oil—a gentle and natural emollient.
> • Vitamin E – antioxidant to nourish and repair damaged skin.
> ...

----------


## warner8

does this regrow hair or is it just for dandruff??




> Jazz add this shampoo to your stack Amazing shampoo , working better for me than reganpure and nizoral , my brother also suffers from hair loss , it's a olive oil shampoo with essential oils I know your a fan of oils they have a conditioner too  but seriously it can not hert to add this to your daily routine. , it's only 12.99 you can get a conditioner too, my brother couldn't get rid of his itch or dandruff with nizoral , but this did this is not a
> Miracle product but it a must add make existing hair healthier .
> 
> Product Description
> 
> KEY ACTIVE INGREDIENTS
> 
>  Olive Oila gentle and natural emollient.
>  Vitamin E  antioxidant to nourish and repair damaged skin.
> ...

----------


## Eire1980

> Jazz add this shampoo to your stack Amazing shampoo , working better for me than reganpure and nizoral , my brother also suffers from hair loss , it's a olive oil shampoo with essential oils I know your a fan of oils they have a conditioner too  but seriously it can not hert to add this to your daily routine. , it's only 12.99 you can get a conditioner too, my brother couldn't get rid of his itch or dandruff with nizoral , but this did this is not a
> Miracle product but it a must add make existing hair healthier .
> 
> Product Description
> 
> KEY ACTIVE INGREDIENTS
> 
>  Olive Oila gentle and natural emollient.
>  Vitamin E  antioxidant to nourish and repair damaged skin.
> ...


 Hey champ..anywhere this can be bought in Europe?..thanks

----------


## warner8

don't waste your time on shampoos for either regrowth or halting hairless, if thats what ur looking 4


> Hey champ..anywhere this can be bought in Europe?..thanks

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I'm back, as above shampoo will only work to a certain degree, my favourite daily shampoo is Regenepure DR not harsh for daily use cosnidering it contains Ketaconazole.

----------


## Jazz1

> Any word on this ?


 Hey I will call tommorow the last I spoke she was trying to get in touch as Dr Sandra Brown completely vanished. I truly hate people like her, I mean she has helped people with hairloss for years and now her retirement she just vanishes, when she still has the opportunity to help her existing clients through someone else like Susan!

----------


## Jazz1

How is everyone hairloss?

----------


## Rocky870

Hey Jazz,

Been following your thread bud, still looking for the magic Dr. Klein formula, I was about to order from Susan tomorrow but now you say she has retired. Is the site from your original thread still reliable to order from. Also its been a little more than a year since you first started her lotion, is it still just as good at Klein's?

Appreciate all your help and your contributions to this site.

Also My Curren Regimen:
Finasteride  .25mg a day
Rogaine 2x a day (just started)
Nizoral Shampoo 3x a week
(Thinking of starting RU)

----------


## Rocky870

Thanks Waren8, 
hard to find reputable information on forums, but its all we got. I'm glad there's good people still looking out for each other. Guess I'll just bite the bullet on the RU

----------


## warner8

her formula is just hydrocortisone n retina a anyways, which are at best additives to a minox n fin program, but def will not grow hair in any great capacity, she tis just a scammer like 99% of the hairless industry


> Thanks Waren8, 
> hard to find reputable information on forums, but its all we got. I'm glad there's good people still looking out for each other. Guess I'll just bite the bullet on the RU

----------


## jamesst11

I just got an email saying, "dr. klein's original formula is back and better than ever!"...but it is by hairgrowthMD? Is this any good? has anyone used this stuff with results?

----------


## jamesst11

> How is everyone hairloss?


 Jazz,
    Medical wellness center prescriptions for murray ave. apothecary - 
         15% compounded minoxidil cream with finasteride, progesterone, tretinoin, azeliac acid and hydrocortisone

Have you tried this or have you encountered someone who has?  I am screwed with oral fin, it just speeds up my MPB 10 fold.  I am considering trying oral DUT EOD and I am going to order this formula and use it with dermarolling at night and S5 cream during the day.  what are your thoughts.  You seem experienced in this field and their consultation form even had your name as a reference!  :Smile:   Thanks bud.

----------


## Eire1980

> How is everyone hairloss?


 Not good at  :Frown: 

My crown and front hairline are getting worse.

Regaine foam 5% in morning
Susan's mix at night - pretty much what you said ingredients wise except 12.5%minox
Nizoral and regenepure (daily)
Just started using divine herbal oil yesterday 
Also using jamaican castor oil occasionally

Take zinc, lysine, chlorella, macha green tea, olive leaf extract..all of these more for health reasons

Feel like throwing in the towel..starting to think fin is making it worse. Was on 0.05% and moved up to 0.1% about two months ago
Starting to question susans mixtures :Frown:  as I have no improvement just getting worse  :Mad:

----------


## Jazz1

I will reply later at work now, Susan has not retired, Dr Sandra Brown has retired.

The original Dr Klein formula is not the same, they use a new compound pharmacy, the old pharmacy was much better.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz,
> 
> Been following your thread bud, still looking for the magic Dr. Klein formula, I was about to order from Susan tomorrow but now you say she has retired. Is the site from your original thread still reliable to order from. Also its been a little more than a year since you first started her lotion, is it still just as good at Klein's?
> 
> Appreciate all your help and your contributions to this site.
> 
> Also My Curren Regimen:
> Finasteride  .25mg a day
> Rogaine 2x a day (just started)
> ...


 Hey Susan has not retired I was referring to Dr Sandra Brown who sold Hydocortisone mixture she has retired from the community.

I now use Susans mixture since Dr Klein passed away, the new Dr Klein clinic use a new pharamcy which I didn't like very sticky formula. A real shame as their old pharamcy was the best, last I spoke to Tony they did not want to know anything anymore with supplying the old mixtures! 

How is your hairloss on the current regime? Have you managed to halt the hairloss?

Here's thread on how to order, but what are you aiming to regrow hair? How long you been on 0.025mg finesteride per day?

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks Waren8, 
> hard to find reputable information on forums, but its all we got. I'm glad there's good people still looking out for each other. Guess I'll just bite the bullet on the RU


 
Hey why you wanting to use RU as a first resort? I always keep RU in my freezer from Kane as back up. RU is more potent, your first option should always be finesteride!

----------


## Jazz1

> her formula is just hydrocortisone n retina a anyways, which are at best additives to a minox n fin program, but def will not grow hair in any great capacity, she tis just a scammer like 99% of the hairless industry


 Dr Sandra Brown Hydocortisone mixture was slightly different, alongside the Big 3 it worked superb. The problem is there was more to her mixture than Hydocortisone and Tretinoin.

----------


## Jazz1

> I just got an email saying, "dr. klein's original formula is back and better than ever!"...but it is by hairgrowthMD? Is this any good? has anyone used this stuff with results?


 Last I tried the formula was sticky, you can see my threads on hairlosshelp I was always a fan of Dr Klein. The problem is they use a new pharmacy, the old original pharmacy who formulated the mixtures perfect do not want anything to do with hairloss industry anymore since Dr Klein passed away!

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz,
>     Medical wellness center prescriptions for murray ave. apothecary - 
>          15% compounded minoxidil cream with finasteride, progesterone, tretinoin, azeliac acid and hydrocortisone
> 
> Have you tried this or have you encountered someone who has?  I am screwed with oral fin, it just speeds up my MPB 10 fold.  I am considering trying oral DUT EOD and I am going to order this formula and use it with dermarolling at night and S5 cream during the day.  what are your thoughts.  You seem experienced in this field and their consultation form even had your name as a reference!   Thanks bud.


 
Hey yes i currently use her formula but there's no point using her mixtures if finesteride does not work for you!

Elaborate more, how long you been using finesteride, what brand? The other option is DUT than RU58841. The new current option people are using on the other forums is CB-03-01.

----------


## Jazz1

> Not good at 
> 
> My crown and front hairline are getting worse.
> 
> Regaine foam 5% in morning
> Susan's mix at night - pretty much what you said ingredients wise except 12.5%minox
> Nizoral and regenepure (daily)
> Just started using divine herbal oil yesterday 
> Also using jamaican castor oil occasionally
> ...


 How long you been on finesteride and her mixtures now? The problem you need to check is finesteride working or not! There is also a case of minoxidil shed, do you currently suffer from the dreaded MPB itch?

The final options are DUT, RU58841, CB-03-01.

----------


## Eire1980

> How long you been on finesteride and her mixtures now? The problem you need to check is finesteride working or not! There is also a case of minoxidil shed, do you currently suffer from the dreaded MPB itch?
> 
> The final options are DUT, RU58841, CB-03-01.


 Hey Jazz

Thanks for taking the time to respond.
I'm on her mixtures with fin since June..0.05% and I moved up to 0.1% in early December..no I don't have any real itch nothing out of ordinary anyway.
Any other advice?..cheers

----------


## jamesst11

I just received my formula from murray's ave apothecary and I am honestly impressed so far.  It is 15% minox w/ fin, progesterone, AA, hydrocortisone.. It is kind of expensive, but I am hoping it's worth it.  It is a nice smooth cream and you can actually apply to a clean scalp AND still style your hair afterwards.  I like to put a little 5% foam on my scalp, then apply a modest portion of this cream.  It has only been 3 days and HONESTLY my scalp feels better... I started DUT at the same time (after 10 months on fin), so I don't know which one is having this effect - but, the itching, tingling, burning has never been so minimal.  maybe, just MAYBE I will get lucky with hair loss for once.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz
> 
> Thanks for taking the time to respond.
> I'm on her mixtures with fin since June..0.05% and I moved up to 0.1% in early December..no I don't have any real itch nothing out of ordinary anyway.
> Any other advice?..cheers


 Right so I can try and help you and I promise il do my best to save your hair!

When you started any hairloss treatments (finesteride) did you experience the dreaded MPB itch? Also to add you just recently added 0.1% in December which is the recommended dosage so this may take some time to have an effect. 

Tell me your full regime again please, you also take internal finesteride? I do both topical and internal 1mg every other day. 

Let me check what your currently taking, that way you have other options like DUT/RU58841/CB-03-01 so please don't panick or throw the towel in as I promise il save your hair  :Smile: .

----------


## Tarikko

I am baffled that some people are giving Jazz a hard time despite all the help he offered.

Bro Jazz was amazing all throughout. 

He helped me the minute i joined the forums a year and half ago and honestly all the progress i made was primarily due to his advice.

I was going BALD and now my hair has come leaps and bounds since that phone call.. right bro?  :Big Grin: 

We still talk regularly on whatsapp and he still gives me advice and updates me on new products


If anything, we need more people like him

Assalam brother Jazz and God bless you

----------


## Tarikko

Apologies about the confusion..

Thought Jazz was under attack for a minute there.. Seems he is ok 


To update you all, i just ordered the second 6 months batch from Susan and i got myself two bottles of Acetyl, Biotin and Vitamin E.. to see if i can get those new baby hairs on my temple to grow into terminal ones.. fingers crossed

So far, the treatment is excellent and i'm improving by the day.. almost a year and half in now

Compared to baseline, it is a miracle

I also have an organic treatment added to the chemical mix

I will post my full regimen soon

Take Care all

----------


## Rocky870

Thanks for the reply Jazz, I do appreciate all your advice bud,

Since I have had aggressive diffuse thinning throughout the scalp I would like to start a using anti-androgens topically, I will make sure to place an order with Susan with the strongest minoxidil as well as the other additives you suggested, was it the cream or lotion?

Also I did some research on CB-03-01 and I found it to be the better option. From what I understand, once it passes the trans dermal barrier of the body it is less likely to bind with receptors not in the scalp, like organs causing less side effects. Do you have any suggestions where to purchase the purest form of this compound and what vehicle to use?
Thanks Again

----------


## Eire1980

> Right so I can try and help you and I promise il do my best to save your hair!
> 
> When you started any hairloss treatments (finesteride) did you experience the dreaded MPB itch? Also to add you just recently added 0.1% in December which is the recommended dosage so this may take some time to have an effect. 
> 
> Tell me your full regime again please, you also take internal finesteride? I do both topical and internal 1mg every other day. 
> 
> Let me check what your currently taking, that way you have other options like DUT/RU58841/CB-03-01 so please don't panick or throw the towel in as I promise il save your hair .


 HI Jazz,

Appreciate the feedback and your commitment to the forum - Many Thanks!
ok so at the min the below is pretty much what I am doing

Regaine foam 5% in morning
Susan's mix at night - pretty much what you said ingredients wise except 12.5% minox instead of 15%
 Nizoral and Regenepure NT (daily) - I was using both DR & NT, just need to order more
 Just started using divine herbal oil yesterday - They are expensive but initial thoughts are that they are a great addition and smell good too.
 Also using jamaican dark castor oil occasionally..also cold pressed coconut oil on occasion

 Take zinc, lysine, chlorella, macha green tea, olive leaf extract..all of these more for health reasons

I have no real knowledge on CB,RU etc...

I have lost about an inch on the templates and my crown is noticeable to people now...the paranoia has set in..lol

Not sure what else I can add at this point. I was pretty nervous about using Fin hence why I started at 0.05..i was hoping to maintain what I got but upped it as the thinning continued. I don't notice any significant hair in sink, shower or pillow (not sure if this info is even relevant  :Smile:  )
as for the itch, became more noticeable after you mentioned it...haha...but nothing that has me scratching or driving me mad  :Smile: 
Many Thanks again for your time

@Tarikko - can you expand on the organic approach you have? - thanks

----------


## Eire1980

> Right so I can try and help you and I promise il do my best to save your hair!
> 
> When you started any hairloss treatments (finesteride) did you experience the dreaded MPB itch? Also to add you just recently added 0.1% in December which is the recommended dosage so this may take some time to have an effect. 
> 
> Tell me your full regime again please, you also take internal finesteride? I do both topical and internal 1mg every other day. 
> 
> Let me check what your currently taking, that way you have other options like DUT/RU58841/CB-03-01 so please don't panick or throw the towel in as I promise il save your hair .


 HI Jazz,

Appreciate the feedback and your commitment to the forum - Many Thanks!
ok so at the min the below is pretty much what I am doing

Regaine foam 5% in morning
Susan's mix at night - pretty much what you said ingredients wise except 12.5% minox instead of 15%
 Nizoral and Regenepure NT (daily) - I was using both DR & NT, just need to order more
 Just started using divine herbal oil yesterday - They are expensive but initial thoughts are that they are a great addition and smell good too.
 Also using jamaican dark castor oil occasionally..also cold pressed coconut oil on occasion

 Take zinc, lysine, chlorella, macha green tea, olive leaf extract..all of these more for health reasons

I have no real knowledge on CB,RU etc...

I have lost about an inch on the templates and my crown is noticeable to people now...the paranoia has set in..lol

Not sure what else I can add at this point. I was pretty nervous about using Fin hence why I started at 0.05..i was hoping to maintain what I got but upped it as the thinning continued. I don't notice any significant hair in sink, shower or pillow (not sure if this info is even relevant  :Smile:  )
as for the itch, became more noticeable after you mentioned it...haha...but nothing that has me scratching or driving me mad  :Smile: 
Many Thanks again for your time

@Tarikko - can you expand on the organic approach you have? - thanks

----------


## Tarikko

Hello Eire,

I will list for you my full regimen below:

Minox 5% foam once a day

Belgravia 12.5% cream once a day

Susan lotion (12.5% minox + AA + Fin + Progesterone...) once a day

I just bought and started a week ago the Acetyl + biotin solution from Susan... 

Folligen Hair Signal Therapy Cream once a day.. it has saw palmetto, copper peptides and tea extracts

Divine herbal oils, 3 times a week

Oral finasteride 0.5 mg EOD

Multivitamins and supplements.. biotin, vitamin c, e, zinc, magnesium....


I was also using the laser helmet for more than a year but now it stopped working  :Frown: 

As for my organic mix

I started this like 2 months ago and my hair received a boost since..

3 times a week.. maybe it's an overkill and should bring it down to twice a week:

red Onion, garlic, avocado, egg, black coffee, olive oil, mint and apple cider vinegar.. i make it into a paste and apply to my head.

Problem though, despite all the washing, the smell persists.. i even wash my hair with pure lemon juice but you still smell like a curry... not sure if this is sustainable  :Smile:  I will keep it for now.. as long as your hair is dry, it doesn't waft.. only when wet you realize, God i still smell


The above all work in synergy i believe 

My regimen is so extensive i think i might have missed something.. will update if so 

Peace!

----------


## Eire1980

> Hello Eire,
> 
> I will list for you my full regimen below:
> 
> Minox 5% foam once a day
> 
> Belgravia 12.5% cream once a day
> 
> Susan lotion (12.5% minox + AA + Fin + Progesterone...) once a day
> ...


 Hey Tarikko..thanks for the quick response..glad it is all working for you bar the smell 😉..question why use fin as a topical and tablet? ..thanks again :Wink:

----------


## cardib

when you say boost? you mean what? regrowth? thickening of the hair shaft? luster?


> Hello Eire,
> 
> I will list for you my full regimen below:
> 
> Minox 5% foam once a day
> 
> Belgravia 12.5% cream once a day
> 
> Susan lotion (12.5% minox + AA + Fin + Progesterone...) once a day
> ...

----------


## Tarikko

Well Jazz suggested this and he said it's better to tackle hair loss on all fronts, and I believe there is truth in this.

Luckily i had zero sides on Fin.. and don't forget im taking a quarter of the daily dose orally.. i take 0.5mg EOD while you should be taking 1mg ED


@Cardib

The hair looks thicker and healthier since i added the organic... i got a few stubborn baby hairs on my temples that grew slightly thicker/darker as well.. 

It is a bit early to tell but you see how extensive my regimen is, so i can't pinpoint what is working and what is not.. but no doubt i did notice an overall improvement by adding the organic to the chemical

I doubt the organic by itself will lead to any results.. remember they all work in synergy.

----------


## Jazz1

Guys I'm sorry I'm not around, I know I promised people I would help and the ones who truly know me genuinely know I LOVE helping anyone and everyone to make a change around the world. I have had alot of issues in my life last year, times I feel low and depressed example being the girl I loved leaving me, to my dream car project that never seems to be ending.

I never normally ask anyone for anything apart from give, give, give and help as many people with the same issues I had in my life. Right now if I could ask all the people who genuinely know me, the only help I would ask is please pray for me that my life issues get solved that I heal away from my past.

I normally mediate and pray daily to ask God for a cure to guide me so I could help as many people. To those who genuinely need my help, all I ask is pray things get better with me so that I can be in the right frame of mind to carry on helping more people.

Thanks, will be back soon once I feel better  :Frown: .

----------


## Tarikko

No worries Jazz bro, take your time.. I myself im aware of what you went through the past year.

I'm here bro should you need me

----------


## hyong

Do i need a perscribtion to get the compound? 
Currently residing in Canada, any issues with customs? , new to this forum, desperate for help though.

regards

----------


## cardib

what do u think in your organic mix, is main ingredient that works? i know its all about energy, but the onion juice is the only one I've ever read about in regards to hairloss, and even the whole onion juice is controversial


> Well Jazz suggested this and he said it's better to tackle hair loss on all fronts, and I believe there is truth in this.
> 
> Luckily i had zero sides on Fin.. and don't forget im taking a quarter of the daily dose orally.. i take 0.5mg EOD while you should be taking 1mg ED
> 
> 
> @Cardib
> 
> The hair looks thicker and healthier since i added the organic... i got a few stubborn baby hairs on my temples that grew slightly thicker/darker as well.. 
> 
> ...

----------


## Eire1980

> Guys I'm sorry I'm not around, I know I promised people I would help and the ones who truly know me genuinely know I LOVE helping anyone and everyone to make a change around the world. I have had alot of issues in my life last year, times I feel low and depressed example being the girl I loved leaving me, to my dream car project that never seems to be ending.
> 
> I never normally ask anyone for anything apart from give, give, give and help as many people with the same issues I had in my life. Right now if I could ask all the people who genuinely know me, the only help I would ask is please pray for me that my life issues get solved that I heal away from my past.
> 
> I normally mediate and pray daily to ask God for a cure to guide me so I could help as many people. To those who genuinely need my help, all I ask is pray things get better with me so that I can be in the right frame of mind to carry on helping more people.
> 
> Thanks, will be back soon once I feel better .


 Hey mate, 
Hope you are feeling better
If you are feeling low please make sure that you talk to someone you feel comfortable with..family, friends or even someone off here that you trust...main thing is talking will help take the load off you

Keep the head up and come back to the forum when you are ready..be sure to know you are helping many people on this

Take it easy

----------


## Tarikko

> what do u think in your organic mix, is main ingredient that works? i know its all about energy, but the onion juice is the only one I've ever read about in regards to hairloss, and even the whole onion juice is controversial


 Well Cardib, if it's not working, it is definitely not harming

And I'm 100% certain my hair feels better after i added the organic to my chemical mix.

Funny enough, we use the same word for onion and the hair follicle in Arabic.. "basleh"

----------


## Jazz1

> No worries Jazz bro, take your time.. I myself im aware of what you went through the past year.
> 
> I'm here bro should you need me


 Thanks bro, I feel like I'm in the right frame of mind today to reply and help others  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Do i need a perscribtion to get the compound? 
> Currently residing in Canada, any issues with customs? , new to this forum, desperate for help though.
> 
> regards


 Yes like any medication you need a prescription, if you check my threads I created one guiding how it all works.

In regards to your hairloss, what are you currently using and how is your current hairloss state? That way we can try and help you in the right direction  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> what do u think in your organic mix, is main ingredient that works? i know its all about energy, but the onion juice is the only one I've ever read about in regards to hairloss, and even the whole onion juice is controversial


 The main ingredients that always work is the Big 3, anything proven alongside is an additional icing to help stimulate more healthy growth. The whole Onion theory has been around for time, I believe onions contain sulphar which helps reduce shedding plus stimulate blood circulation just like the stinky garlic method!

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey mate, 
> Hope you are feeling better
> If you are feeling low please make sure that you talk to someone you feel comfortable with..family, friends or even someone off here that you trust...main thing is talking will help take the load off you
> 
> Keep the head up and come back to the forum when you are ready..be sure to know you are helping many people on this
> 
> Take it easy


 Hey thanks after some time out and meditation I have starterted to clear my negative thoughts and depressed feeling, plus stopped alcoholism!

Anyways now that I feel back on track to help others, how is your hairloss did you try what I previously mentioned?

----------


## johnnyboots

> Hey thanks after some time out and meditation I have starterted to clear my negative thoughts and depressed feeling, plus stopped alcoholism!
> 
> Anyways now that I feel back on track to help others, how is your hairloss did you try what I previously mentioned?


 Any word on the Saba gel you were discussing with Susan ?

----------


## coolhairgone

does susan offer foam?

----------


## Eire1980

> Hey thanks after some time out and meditation I have starterted to clear my negative thoughts and depressed feeling, plus stopped alcoholism!
> 
> Anyways now that I feel back on track to help others, how is your hairloss did you try what I previously mentioned?


 Hey Jazz, 
Good to see you back.
It's not great..I feel like the crown is getting worse..defo more reseeding on the right temple...I'm doing as I said in a previous post. I'm in ireland so only proscar is available 1.25 if split 4 ways and only by prescription.
I'm heading to Spain in April I might try getting propecia in the pharmacy.

----------


## Jazz1

> Any word on the Saba gel you were discussing with Susan ?


 Hey the last I spoke to Susan she said Dr Sandra Brown stopped replying to her emails and vanished.

Thanks for reminding I will try calling her again on my break at work tommorow to see if anything can still be done.

----------


## Jazz1

> does susan offer foam?


 I can ask her when I call in regards to Johny, the only foam I would use and still use alongside her product is Regaine foam.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, 
> Good to see you back.
> It's not great..I feel like the crown is getting worse..defo more reseeding on the right temple...I'm doing as I said in a previous post. I'm in ireland so only proscar is available 1.25 if split 4 ways and only by prescription.
> I'm heading to Spain in April I might try getting propecia in the pharmacy.


 Hey thanks, right let me start again because I have so much on my plate I can not recall your full regime.

Post me your full regime from the start, including Susan's mixture, what other products your using or dropped and what Branded products you used or still are using from when you started to now. 

Also I want to know prior to any treatments did you experience any MPB itch, that may have subsided when you started propecia?

As I want to determine if propecia is too weak for you and you may need Dutasteride or RU58841 more potent.

I know I mentioned adding internal propecia, you also have to understand it can take some time to take effect. Alongside Susans mixture do you use any other minoxidol 5%?

----------


## Eire1980

> Hey thanks, right let me start again because I have so much on my plate I can not recall your full regime.
> 
> Post me your full regime from the start, including Susan's mixture, what other products your using or dropped and what Branded products you used or still are using from when you started to now. 
> 
> Also I want to know prior to any treatments did you experience any MPB itch, that may have subsided when you started propecia?
> 
> As I want to determine if propecia is too weak for you and you may need Dutasteride or RU58841 more potent.
> 
> I know I mentioned adding internal propecia, you also have to understand it can take some time to take effect. Alongside Susans mixture do you use any other minoxidol 5%?


 Hey Jazz, 

Thanks for the response

Regaine foam 5% in morning
Susan's mix at night 
      12.5% minoxidol 
0.01% finesteride - since early December - 0.05% since June
5% azelaic acid 
0.25% progesterone 
0.025% tretinon

----------


## doke

Hi jazz1  as you may know Dr Klines treatments are available at a new site, but you have to fill in a form which does not tell you how much they are have you tried that site? also what are you using now and what would you say is the best you get from susan and can we get the same script as yours as in formula.
How much including post would say 3 months treatment is it cheaper than Dr Klines formulas.
Do you phone her? I know we have to pay a consultation fee is that still the same.

----------


## Eire1980

> Hey thanks, right let me start again because I have so much on my plate I can not recall your full regime.
> 
> Post me your full regime from the start, including Susan's mixture, what other products your using or dropped and what Branded products you used or still are using from when you started to now. 
> 
> Also I want to know prior to any treatments did you experience any MPB itch, that may have subsided when you started propecia?
> 
> As I want to determine if propecia is too weak for you and you may need Dutasteride or RU58841 more potent.
> 
> I know I mentioned adding internal propecia, you also have to understand it can take some time to take effect. Alongside Susans mixture do you use any other minoxidol 5%?


 Hey Jazz, 

Thanks for the response

Regaine foam 5% in morning

Susan's mix at night 
12.5% minoxidol 
0.01% finesteride - since early December - 0.05% previously since June
5% azelaic acid 
0.25% progesterone 
0.025% tretinon

Nizoral (couple times a week) and regenepure (daily)
divine herbal oil - couple times a week
Also use Pukka organic castor oil couple times a week

Take zinc, lysine, chlorella, macha green tea, olive leaf extract..all of those more for health reasons

I used to use Polaris 7.5% minox with AA - NO Fin - but dropped that after I went onto Susan's mix's in June last year

As regards MPB itch - I cant say I ever had that - just regular itch from time to time - nothing that I would be overly conscious of or annoyed by.

My crown is getting worse along with the temples - the 2nd one on the left becoming noticeable as the left

hope this is clear
Many Thanks for the help

----------


## Jazz1

Hey I will reply later tonight after work.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz, 
> 
> Thanks for the response
> 
> Regaine foam 5% in morning
> 
> Susan's mix at night 
> 12.5% minoxidol 
> 0.01% finesteride - since early December - 0.05% previously since June
> ...


 
Hey your regime looks on point, also to add you upped the dosage in december has that not helped a slight bit? As taking an effect takes some time! 

Although I would personally try this option if you feel that's not enough, add internal 1mg propecia every other day. Alongside your 0.1% in your topical mixture, as that's the method I use, 0.1% daily in the lotion and I also take 1mg every other day.

The Final bullet which as an alternative you could instead of adding 1mg internally take DUT every other day. 

The above fails than you have RU58841 or CB-03-01, the good part you can easily mix this stuff with neogenic and can be purchase through Kane.

That's the only options we all have at the moment bro, I'm pretty confident if the FIN/DUT method fails than RU58841 or CB-03-01 is the way forward for you. As I mentioned give the FIN/DUT option a go, if that fails than il help guide you accordingly on the other options as I have a lot of knowledge from other forums on this topic  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi jazz1  as you may know Dr Klines treatments are available at a new site, but you have to fill in a form which does not tell you how much they are have you tried that site? also what are you using now and what would you say is the best you get from susan and can we get the same script as yours as in formula.
> How much including post would say 3 months treatment is it cheaper than Dr Klines formulas.
> Do you phone her? I know we have to pay a consultation fee is that still the same.


 Hey bro I can't say about Dr Klein as the last I spoke to Tony he had left the company and sold it. They did make me trial their stuff and I never liked it, was nothing like the good old formula that I loved.

The Medicall Wellness prescribe Susan's stuff, they charge $49 for 6 months, there after they charge $84 discount price for a whole years worth prescription.

Susan's prices vary depending on which % Minoxidil formula you want, the prices are fixed but all additives can be added part of that price. I did my best in trying to reduce the cost for us forum members. So typically she agreed to give 10% discount if you purchase 3 bottles, each bottle will last you 2 months. So 6 months worth is enough time to calculate if the product is working for you or not.

What are you currently using now? What % minoxidol you want 15%?

----------


## Eire1980

> Hey your regime looks on point, also to add you upped the dosage in december has that not helped a slight bit? As taking an effect takes some time! 
> 
> Although I would personally try this option if you feel that's not enough, add internal 1mg propecia every other day. Alongside your 0.1% in your topical mixture, as that's the method I use, 0.1% daily in the lotion and I also take 1mg every other day.
> 
> The Final bullet which as an alternative you could instead of adding 1mg internally take DUT every other day. 
> 
> The above fails than you have RU58841 or CB-03-01, the good part you can easily mix this stuff with neogenic and can be purchase through Kane.
> 
> That's the only options we all have at the moment bro, I'm pretty confident if the FIN/DUT method fails than RU58841 or CB-03-01 is the way forward for you. As I mentioned give the FIN/DUT option a go, if that fails than il help guide you accordingly on the other options as I have a lot of knowledge from other forums on this topic .


 Thanks for replying mate.
It feels like since I upped to 0.1 in December my hair has gone to shit. I got a short haircut and was embarrassed by the state of my crown. Also my hairline is fading away. I'm starting to think the fin has done this...there has been zero improvement just further thinning..I'm not sure whether to stick it out and hope but again I keep asking myself if it is fin ruining my hair. Not sure whether to ditch lotion and try just 1.25 proscar..head is wrecked at the min...

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for replying mate.
> It feels like since I upped to 0.1 in December my hair has gone to shit. I got a short haircut and was embarrassed by the state of my crown. Also my hairline is fading away. I'm starting to think the fin has done this...there has been zero improvement just further thinning..I'm not sure whether to stick it out and hope but again I keep asking myself if it is fin ruining my hair. Not sure whether to ditch lotion and try just 1.25 proscar..head is wrecked at the min...


 To clarify you also added internal 1mg right? I'm talking about the legit brand? Or consider adding DUT every other day?

If yes to the above I would ride it out and be consistent on the regime, to further see if any hair regrow.


The final option would be RU58841 or CB-03-01.

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for replying mate.
> It feels like since I upped to 0.1 in December my hair has gone to shit. I got a short haircut and was embarrassed by the state of my crown. Also my hairline is fading away. I'm starting to think the fin has done this...there has been zero improvement just further thinning..I'm not sure whether to stick it out and hope but again I keep asking myself if it is fin ruining my hair. Not sure whether to ditch lotion and try just 1.25 proscar..head is wrecked at the min...


 Hey how's it going?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys how's it going for everyone  :Smile: .

----------


## jamesst11

I've been using the Murray Ave. Apothecary 15% minox w/ AA, RA and hydrocortisone for almost three months now.  I like it!  With the fin it irritated the hell out of my scalp.  Without it, it's been like magic.

----------


## JohnMPB

98 pages and still the only pics posted in this thread showing results are from jazz....this must be a quality product

----------


## Jazz1

> I've been using the Murray Ave. Apothecary 15% minox w/ AA, RA and hydrocortisone for almost three months now.  I like it!  With the fin it irritated the hell out of my scalp.  Without it, it's been like magic.


 Sweet, what's your full regime you take internal finesteride?

----------


## jamesst11

> Sweet, what's your full regime you take internal finesteride?


 Did for a year and it totally f*cked my hair bad.  using RU-10% in neogenic and this MAA's magical solution.  It's been about 2.5 months now on both.  I am starting to think I have scalp sensitivity to the PG in this solution, so will be trying the 15% without PG soon.  Still balding like crazy, but the shed has been reduced, literally a lot less hair falling out.  We will see!  I think Jesus just doesn't want me to have hair period. hahaha

----------


## Jazz1

> Did for a year and it totally f*cked my hair bad.  using RU-10% in neogenic and this MAA's magical solution.  It's been about 2.5 months now on both.  I am starting to think I have scalp sensitivity to the PG in this solution, so will be trying the 15% without PG soon.  Still balding like crazy, but the shed has been reduced, literally a lot less hair falling out.  We will see!  I think Jesus just doesn't want me to have hair period. hahaha


 Haha, prior to using any hair loss medication did you experience the dreaded MPB itch? If yes has that itch now subsided? Obviously regrowth and stabalized hairloss takes a minimum 6 months. 

Once you start to get regrowth I can recommend some cheap add ons to help gain more  :Smile: .

----------


## JohnMPB

Jazz or anyone else in this thread:

Do you guys have any other pics of people with temple regrowth/thickening using Susans formula? I was a former dr lee patient but never got a chance to use his high strength minox solutions. I'm looking at other similar treatments but not entirely decided yet.

----------


## JohnMPB

Double post

----------


## Jazz1

Hey John I can not provide my own pictures as I was previously using another clinic and switched to Susan when Dr Klein passed away so I maintained my previous regworth..

There are members who have had results, Unfortunatly I can not force anyone to post their pictures which is a shame. 

On the plus note my cousin is using her products alongside my regime and is getting good results. I will get him to soon post pictures as he agreed to help others.

----------


## minoxiDjunkie

hey jazz old buddy
its been a long time (hope you still remember me ;] )

i was wondering,
since i've been looking and researching a lot about topical spiro (in particular 5%), and found that almost nothing other than pure DMSO would dissolve spiro to a 5% concentration,
how does susan compounds it ?
i mean - she'd probably wont tell the whole process since its her living, but she must list the ingredients at least, right ?

im on the verge of starting with low dose oral spiro since i've seen people get unbeliveable results from it (though from high doses)
i thought maybe go on 25mg for like 2 or 3 months and than 25x2 times a day, and than just maybe going up to 50x2

i've had to stop my treatment a year back due to rehab (it's all in hairlosshelp), in short they didnt allowed me to take dut since i had no prescription,
so i stopped for a few months, than got on fin,
but just now, a few days ago, i started again everything - 
fin orally
dut orally
minox&fin&dut topically ('dualgen plus' mixed with 10% DMI and 0.5% dut and some bima)
and just yesterday i began to smear some retin a

but to be honest i dont belive it'll get my temples back,
ill be lucky if ill regrow the top diffused i have now, since in the last year i lost a lot of ground, in temples and on top which is now super thinned and diffused.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey John I can not provide my own pictures as I was previously using another clinic and switched to Susan when Dr Klein passed away so I maintained my previous regworth..
> 
> There are members who have had results, Unfortunatly I can not force anyone to post their pictures which is a shame. 
> 
> On the plus note my cousin is using her products alongside my regime and is getting good results. I will get him to soon post pictures as he agreed to help others.


 Thanks jazz. Any updates on those pics?

----------


## Jazz1

> hey jazz old buddy
> its been a long time (hope you still remember me ;] )
> 
> i was wondering,
> since i've been looking and researching a lot about topical spiro (in particular 5%), and found that almost nothing other than pure DMSO would dissolve spiro to a 5% concentration,
> how does susan compounds it ?
> i mean - she'd probably wont tell the whole process since its her living, but she must list the ingredients at least, right ?
> 
> im on the verge of starting with low dose oral spiro since i've seen people get unbeliveable results from it (though from high doses)
> ...


 Hey long time bro, I really do not know how she compounds her formula, I mean you could phone her  :Smile: .

Any pictures of your hair?

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks jazz. Any updates on those pics?


 Hey yes I have him taking pictures, I will messsage him tommorow to get some updated pictures. How you been? How's the hair.

----------


## minoxiDjunkie

> Hey long time bro, I really do not know how she compounds her formula, I mean you could phone her .
> 
> Any pictures of your hair?


 nope, dont have pictures (im actually trying to be descrete thats why i never posted pics.. dont have a facebook page too  :Smile: )
in short my hair is not really good...
nw3 hairline with diffused top, i wear it a bit long so im able to hide it a little bit, but it is noticable.

anyway im going to add oral spiro soon... i dropped off the idea of topical..
oral seems better to me..
im gonna give it a try for at least a year from the time that i'd take 100mg a day (i plan to start with 25, and very very slowly increasing the dose up to 100).
im gonna get 3 months worth of tamoxifen as well, just in case of anything...

----------


## Jazz1

> nope, dont have pictures (im actually trying to be descrete thats why i never posted pics.. dont have a facebook page too )
> in short my hair is not really good...
> nw3 hairline with diffused top, i wear it a bit long so im able to hide it a little bit, but it is noticable.
> 
> anyway im going to add oral spiro soon... i dropped off the idea of topical..
> oral seems better to me..
> im gonna give it a try for at least a year from the time that i'd take 100mg a day (i plan to start with 25, and very very slowly increasing the dose up to 100).
> im gonna get 3 months worth of tamoxifen as well, just in case of anything...


 Oral Spiro is some strong stuff man! So be carefull! Hopefully we will be saved soon with new future treatments like CB-03-01 or even better Replicel.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey yes I have him taking pictures, I will messsage him tommorow to get some updated pictures. How you been? How's the hair.


 Sorry to keep pestering but did you get the pics?

I'm shedding and scalp is inflamed. They seem to go hand in hand for me.

----------


## Jazz1

> Sorry to keep pestering but did you get the pics?
> 
> I'm shedding and scalp is inflamed. They seem to go hand in hand for me.


 Hey sorry was working crazy shift pattern work sleep work sleep now back to normal. Right I just message him now, your shedding as in losing ground or seasonal shed? What exactly you using now?

----------


## JohnMPB

I think I'm losing ground. I have massive inflammation and that is never a good sign. I use big 3 plus tricomin daily. Thanks jazz, looking forward to the pics.

What do you recommend I add since I been on fin for 10 years? Tried dut a few times buy feel like I lost ground.

----------


## Jazz1

> I think I'm losing ground. I have massive inflammation and that is never a good sign. I use big 3 plus tricomin daily. Thanks jazz, looking forward to the pics.
> 
> What do you recommend I add since I been on fin for 10 years? Tried dut a few times buy feel like I lost ground.


 DUT never worked? You considered adding RU58841 or even CB-03-01? This is very easy to mix as most people purchase from Kane, stemoxydine is used to mix RU58841, works effectively for the people who have failed years later on FIN/DUT.

I know a member on the other forums who is now using CB and has maintained his hair, he lost ground on FIN/DUT. This guy has been battling hairloss for 20 years and has managed to maintain his hair via the use of RU58841 and now CB-03-01.

----------


## JohnMPB

> DUT never worked? You considered adding RU58841 or even CB-03-01? This is very easy to mix as most people purchase from Kane, stemoxydine is used to mix RU58841, works effectively for the people who have failed years later on FIN/DUT.
> 
> I know a member on the other forums who is now using CB and has maintained his hair, he lost ground on FIN/DUT. This guy has been battling hairloss for 20 years and has managed to maintain his hair via the use of RU58841 and now CB-03-01.


 Seemed like my hairline took a hit on dut. I bought premixed ru from Kane but I just don't trust these obscure Chinese chemicals.

Any update on the pics?

----------


## JohnMPB

> DUT never worked? You considered adding RU58841 or even CB-03-01? This is very easy to mix as most people purchase from Kane, stemoxydine is used to mix RU58841, works effectively for the people who have failed years later on FIN/DUT.
> 
> I know a member on the other forums who is now using CB and has maintained his hair, he lost ground on FIN/DUT. This guy has been battling hairloss for 20 years and has managed to maintain his hair via the use of RU58841 and now CB-03-01.


 Seemed like my hairline took a hit on dut. I bought premixed ru from Kane but I just don't trust these obscure Chinese chemicals.

Any update on the pics?

----------


## jamesst11

I am starting to think, at least in my personal case and from others i've heard from, that high percentage minox may be a bad idea.  I don't know if it's the retinol, azeliac acid, or what not... but damn did I have a weird reaction to that stuff.  I am not trying to scare anyone, rather depict my situation.  My resting heart rate, at night was like 85-90.  it's normally 50.  I have been off it for just a week, and it has dropped back down to normal levels.  Also, the shedding was out of control!! I am done with both higher percentage and specially compounded minoxidil.  5% with dermarolling is the way to go.

----------


## Jazz1

> Seemed like my hairline took a hit on dut. I bought premixed ru from Kane but I just don't trust these obscure Chinese chemicals.
> 
> Any update on the pics?


 Hey Kane is legit, I would personally mix RU/CB with stemoxydine. He has sent me some pictures, I will post next couple of days as I need to go through past pictures on my phone.

Also I have been doing some research and I have something cheap and effective for regrowth. Keep track of a new thread i will be creating to test my new method on my cousins friend.

----------


## Jazz1

> I am starting to think, at least in my personal case and from others i've heard from, that high percentage minox may be a bad idea.  I don't know if it's the retinol, azeliac acid, or what not... but damn did I have a weird reaction to that stuff.  I am not trying to scare anyone, rather depict my situation.  My resting heart rate, at night was like 85-90.  it's normally 50.  I have been off it for just a week, and it has dropped back down to normal levels.  Also, the shedding was out of control!! I am done with both higher percentage and specially compounded minoxidil.  5% with dermarolling is the way to go.


 
Hey in regards to 15% everyone reacts different, I starts with 5%. In regards to Derma rolling keep track of a new thread I'll be creating you will be very interested in regards to regrowth on my method  :Wink:

----------


## cardib

why do you say 5 % with derma rolling is the way to go? did you get regrowth and thickening? can you further expand


> I am starting to think, at least in my personal case and from others i've heard from, that high percentage minox may be a bad idea.  I don't know if it's the retinol, azeliac acid, or what not... but damn did I have a weird reaction to that stuff.  I am not trying to scare anyone, rather depict my situation.  My resting heart rate, at night was like 85-90.  it's normally 50.  I have been off it for just a week, and it has dropped back down to normal levels.  Also, the shedding was out of control!! I am done with both higher percentage and specially compounded minoxidil.  5% with dermarolling is the way to go.

----------


## cardib

i agree with James. I have used 12% and 15% minox from Murray Ave Pharmacy since March 2014, and in my opinion a higher strength minoxidil does not make a difference. I will not longer be continuing the higher strength after the bottle is over over as its quite expensive, and thee was really no results from it. 

I use to be a stellar responder to  5% minox back in 2009-2012, but as I got older I found that the minox was losing effect as I assume the DHT levels in my scalp rose with age. Despite going on Fin, and using 5%, and up to 15% min, I was never able to get the great regrowth i saw originally on fin. I thought the higher percent minox would do the trick, but after 5% i do not think it is dose dependent. and all the other additives such as AA, progesterone are just a waste of time in my opinion as well. 

so my advice to those who are considering using Murray ave or Susans formula, if your new to minox try a generic 5% first, and if you dont respond to that, then its kind of a dead end.  and if your already on min with no results, then its kind of dead end there. maybe looks into experimental, but i wouldn't suggest trying a higher percent fin as i have.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey Kane is legit, I would personally mix RU/CB with stemoxydine. He has sent me some pictures, I will post next couple of days as I need to go through past pictures on my phone.
> 
> Also I have been doing some research and I have something cheap and effective for regrowth. Keep track of a new thread i will be creating to test my new method on my cousins friend.


 Looking forward to the pics

What ever happened to mark? He used to sing praises for all kinds of treatments like ru and proxiphen then he just disappeared.

----------


## Transam

> Hey in regards to 15% everyone reacts different, I starts with 5%. In regards to Derma rolling keep track of a new thread I'll be creating you will be very interested in regards to regrowth on my method


 Hi Jazz, I'm new to this site, but not hairloss forums in general. I noticed how you have experience with different types of Minox...What's your opinion on 'Polaris Labs'? I've heard great things about the brand. I just got my hands on NR10. I'd love to use it, but I don't want to waste my time with Snake Oil.
My 5% Rogaine Foam isn't working like it used to, when I first tried it back in 2011. I took a long break from it, & DHT absolutely killed my follicles.
Now I'm on DUT, FIN & Estradiol. Hopefully NR10 with 16% Minox can be the icing on the cake....Sorry to ramble lol

----------


## Transam

> Hey in regards to 15% everyone reacts different, I starts with 5%. In regards to Derma rolling keep track of a new thread I'll be creating you will be very interested in regards to regrowth on my method


 double post. sorry

----------


## JohnMPB

Still holding my breath waiting for pics...

----------


## Jazz1

> Looking forward to the pics
> 
> What ever happened to mark? He used to sing praises for all kinds of treatments like ru and proxiphen then he just disappeared.


 
Hey sorry I been so busy extremely busy lately working, my cousin failed to provide me decent pictures. The sad part I have helped so many people and they fail to post pictures to help the community.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz, I'm new to this site, but not hairloss forums in general. I noticed how you have experience with different types of Minox...What's your opinion on 'Polaris Labs'? I've heard great things about the brand. I just got my hands on NR10. I'd love to use it, but I don't want to waste my time with Snake Oil.
> My 5% Rogaine Foam isn't working like it used to, when I first tried it back in 2011. I took a long break from it, & DHT absolutely killed my follicles.
> Now I'm on DUT, FIN & Estradiol. Hopefully NR10 with 16% Minox can be the icing on the cake....Sorry to ramble lol


 Wow you are on a strong regime, Unfortunatly minoxidol can only hold your hair so much! You need to determine if DUT is working first? Another stronger option is RU58841 or CB-03-01.

I tried the Polaris stuff I did not like their gritty mixture, I have heard mixed results so I guess you can try  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> Still holding my breath waiting for pics...


 Hey John I wish the people I have helped and used her lotions ould post their pictures. Shame as their are a few guys on this thread that don't wish to post!

----------


## Jazz1

Guys I been doing something different, I been dermarolling once per day on 1mm needle. I did at first use those cheap eBay ones, they kept pulling my hair out. Now I'm using the Dr Derma roller at 1mm and this one slightly more expensive does not pull my hair one bit, I will post pictures later. I tested this on my forehead with Susan's mixture and now my forehead has become like a ware wolf! I been taking regular pictures I will update to show what I mean  :Smile: .

----------


## Eire1980

> Hey John I wish the people I have helped and used her lotions ould post their pictures. Shame as their are a few guys on this thread that don't wish to post!


 HI Jazz,

thanks for your continued activity on this thread and site in general.
I am using Susan's lotions but to be honest I see not improvement, actually more thinning of the crown and temples.

I just bought a dera roller yesterday and going to try that with minox.
good to hear you are having success.
any advice on this please?

----------


## Jazz1

> HI Jazz,
> 
> thanks for your continued activity on this thread and site in general.
> I am using Susan's lotions but to be honest I see not improvement, actually more thinning of the crown and temples.
> 
> I just bought a dera roller yesterday and going to try that with minox.
> good to hear you are having success.
> any advice on this please?


 Funny you replied I been derma rolling at 1mm needle with Dr Derma roller now but cheap one worked aswell, only difference the Dr derma roller does not pull my hair. My forehead has tons of hairs, I look like a wolf. I will post pictures tommorow, on the other hand have you halt your hairloss? Is finesteride working? Minoxidil can not work unless you have blocked the DHT. Unless you need a stronger regime like, DUT/RU58841/CB-03-01.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I been derma rolling 1mm needle every other day, plus wounding on 1.5mm needle, my forehead has a line of new hairs I look like a wolf  :Smile: . I started my whole scalp now, the cheap needles work but for long scalp hair they pull, the Dr derma roller I bought doesnt seems to pull my hair, cost slightly more.

I have promised pictures please give me time as I'm tracking the progress and allowing my hair to grow, these are vellus hairs maybe few turned terminal around temples hairline region. I'm going to try Folligen route to see if the vellus ones turn terminal.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys how is everyone? I was away on holiday just got back, i started to derma roll again as I saw some sweet results when I was derma rolling on the following method. I didn't use Susan's lotion after derma rolling in the morning as that gave me a bad headache, instead I do the 5% regaine after at night.

I bought the Dr Derma roller that seem to not pull my hair, the cheap ones on eBay work but they pulled my hair when long.

The method I'm doing is;

1mm every other day lightly for absorption, I tend to use this on the days I use hair oils.

1.5mm once a week, slight wounding to create stem cell reaction. 

Also to add one of my work friends just had a transplant in India he payed £1500 for 8,000 plus grafts FUE 3 day procedure. I saw him the other day 8months post op and his results are Amazing considering what he payed! He was a NR7 and now looks NR1 scale whole scalp coverage.

----------


## k9gatton

Just wanted to say I am currently taking thirty percent Minoxidil, mixed with topical Finasteride and Progesterone. Never tried Promax, but I might some day in the future.

----------


## Jazz1

> Just wanted to say I am currently taking thirty percent Minoxidil, mixed with topical Finasteride and Progesterone. Never tried Promax, but I might some day in the future.


 
Wow, how you finding it? What did you use prior to 30% as that's a big step. Any results or headache etc? Be carefull not to derma roll and apply that straight after!

----------


## k9gatton

> Wow, how you finding it? What did you use prior to 30% as that's a big step. Any results or headache etc? Be carefull not to derma roll and apply that straight after!


 It's here: https://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com
The price is 49.99, for a six month prescription. For the thirty percent, it's 99.00 per month (60 ml tube). If they approve you, you are charged 49.99.

Susan Mernstein makes it. And she used to make medications for the late Dr. Klein. (The only place you can get it at is Murray Avenue Alcotherapy, located in Pittsburgh PA, US. She owns Murray Avenue Alcotherapy. 

The _Progesterone_ is doing the most work though. Highly recommend it. The thirty percent is growing my hair really fast, which is what I want at this point in my life. As for my own experience, that is when my hair started to grow back. And I'm not a young guy.

----------


## k9gatton

> Wow, how you finding it? What did you use prior to 30% as that's a big step. Any results or headache etc? Be carefull not to derma roll and apply that straight after!


 The only side effect I got was swelling in my ankles. That was when I put too much on (more than prescribed amount). I put four times that amount on my hair. Wasn't a good choice on my part.

----------


## Jazz1

> It's here: https://www.medicalwellnesscenter.com
> The price is 49.99, for a six month prescription. For the thirty percent, it's 99.00 per month (60 ml tube). If they approve you, you are charged 49.99.
> 
> Susan Mernstein makes it. And she used to make medications for the late Dr. Klein. (The only place you can get it at is Murray Avenue Alcotherapy, located in Pittsburgh PA, US. She owns Murray Avenue Alcotherapy. 
> 
> The _Progesterone_ is doing the most work though. Highly recommend it. The thirty percent is growing my hair really fast, which is what I want at this point in my life. As for my own experience, that is when my hair started to grow back. And I'm not a young guy.


 Haha, that's why I created this thread, I found her when Dr Klein passed away. I was a EX Dr Klein patient until he passed away, than I switched to Susan's stuff ever since and does a fantastic job.

----------


## Jazz1

> The only side effect I got was swelling in my ankles. That was when I put too much on (more than prescribed amount). I put four times that amount on my hair. Wasn't a good choice on my part.


 
Any pictures, imagine derma rolling with 30% I reckon that would be awesome regrowth, although a bit risky in regards to side effects.

----------


## k9gatton

> Any pictures, imagine derma rolling with 30% I reckon that would be awesome regrowth, although a bit risky in regards to side effects.


 That would be crazy, and in a bad way. Would never even think of dermarolling with a thirty percent.

So, what do you currently get from Susan's pharmacy? What percentage, and what mixture?

----------


## Jazz1

> That would be crazy, and in a bad way. Would never even think of dermarolling with a thirty percent.
> 
> So, what do you currently get from Susan's pharmacy? What percentage, and what mixture?


 Hey I been using her;

15% minoxidil
0.1% finesteride 
5% azelaic acid
0.025% tretinoin 
0.25% progesteone 

I use 1% Hydocortisone once week, most people also add 0.1% Hydocortisone.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys how is everyone, I'm still about to help anyone needing my help. Also to add guys worth adding a derma roller in your regime as 1mm alongside 1.5mm needle works with wounding once a week and rolling every other day. I seen a huge improvement in the amount of hairs around my forehead and temples.

----------


## sleeme

Hi Jazz1,
How long have you been using all these ingredients.  I am 27 and just stopped propecia a month ago.  I had good results but needed to stop for for blood work and now I don't really want to take it everyday for years and years.   I hope you don't mind me asking but at what age did you notice hair loss?  I am looking for a good topical but I am concerned that 15% minoxidil is too high of amount to start with.  And my doctor said Progesterone will feminize me so now I am concerned about the progesterone.   Did you notice that the topical stopped hair loss or do you use any oral medications for hair loss.   I wonder if the Finesteride with low dose minoxidil would be good.  OR low dose minoxidil with azelaic acid and tretinoin.  If you can let me know your thoughts.  
Thanks!

----------


## sleeme

Hi Jazz1,
How long have you been using all these ingredients.  I am 27 and just stopped propecia a month ago.  I had good results but needed to stop for for blood work and now I don't really want to take it everyday for years and years.   I hope you don't mind me asking but at what age did you notice hair loss?  I am looking for a good topical but I am concerned that 15% minoxidil is too high of amount to start with.  And my doctor said Progesterone will feminize me so now I am concerned about the progesterone.   Did you notice that the topical stopped shedding or do you use any oral medications for hair loss.   I wonder if topical Finesteride with low dose minoxidil would be good.  OR low dose minoxidil with azelaic acid and Tretinoin.  If you can, let me know your thoughts.  
Thanks!

----------


## funkville

> Hi Jazz1,
> How long have you been using all these ingredients.  I am 27 and just stopped propecia a month ago.  I had good results but needed to stop for for blood work and now I don't really want to take it everyday for years and years.   I hope you don't mind me asking but at what age did you notice hair loss?  I am looking for a good topical but I am concerned that 15% minoxidil is too high of amount to start with.  And my doctor said Progesterone will feminize me so now I am concerned about the progesterone.   Did you notice that the topical stopped shedding or do you use any oral medications for hair loss.   I wonder if topical Finesteride with low dose minoxidil would be good.  OR low dose minoxidil with azelaic acid and Tretinoin.  If you can, let me know your thoughts.  
> Thanks!


 Jazz will give u advise on this but I will give u my experience with progesterone. I have used progesterone from belvravia in 8% with caffeine and Susan's which is natural in different strengths minoxidil. I got no sidea which affect turned melts  feminine.  I  still lean and very athletic. I don't have man boobs. The ingredient I got sides from was fin. I got depressed, Lost a lot of muscle and sexual sides. 

Do your own research. You will find that synthetic and natural progesterone react differently to the body and that synthetic is what has been largely studied. 

Start here:

http://www.lifeextension.com/magazin...terone/page-01

Oh I started progesterone at 28

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz1,
> How long have you been using all these ingredients.  I am 27 and just stopped propecia a month ago.  I had good results but needed to stop for for blood work and now I don't really want to take it everyday for years and years.   I hope you don't mind me asking but at what age did you notice hair loss?  I am looking for a good topical but I am concerned that 15% minoxidil is too high of amount to start with.  And my doctor said Progesterone will feminize me so now I am concerned about the progesterone.   Did you notice that the topical stopped hair loss or do you use any oral medications for hair loss.   I wonder if the Finesteride with low dose minoxidil would be good.  OR low dose minoxidil with azelaic acid and tretinoin.  If you can let me know your thoughts.  
> Thanks!


 Hey firstly did your doctor recommend you stop finesteride? were you experiencing any side effects?, finesteride is way more strong than progesterone in regards to gyno/feminize effects. Long term use is fine, the guys who normally have an issue with side effects like me are the ones who need to build tolerance to the drug. Initially when i first took 1mg finesteride i had major libido loss for one month. a few tips via internet alongside less panic, i was able to restart me erectile issues. I had to use topical 0.025% every 3rd day, this worked a treat until my body built tolerance. Today i use 1mg totally fine without any issues, so my advice i would always recommend finesteride if you have no issues, as this is the current first protocol in regards to hairloss. Dr Klein always told me himself before he passed away that spiro/progesterone are very weak topically compared to finesteride. Obviously they are 2 different type of chemical structures, hence why the combination works a treat. One is a DHT inhibitor, whilst the others are ANTI-ANDROGEN/GROWTH/.

I would agree, starting with 5% is always the first protocol, as you want your body to build tolerance with minoxidil, 15% is way strong. Although i have known a lot of people who have used 15% without any issues, i initially had few sides when i went from 5% to 15%, nothing major few headaches etc.

----------


## bornthisway

So if you add all additives to minoxidil how does the price change? Is there any reason the 30% minoxidil is actually being absorbed moreso than the 15%? I saw online testimonials claiming the 30% to be superior and thus faster acting with an improvement over 15%. My concern at 30% is what are the adverse effects such as on your heart? I personally recall old discussions claiming the difference ought to be negligible, I believe due to the assumption 30% wouldn't absorb sufficiently. I am thinking of placing an order but unsure as to the strength and which additives to add if not all. Progesterone from what I recall had a sweet spot close to 2%, too little or too much more being less effective.

----------


## bornthisway

What about starting at 30% to jump start things and tapering down to 15% the following month and then soon after sticking at 5% for maintenance? Or would you reduce hair yield by reducing the dosage?

----------


## k9gatton

> So if you add all additives to minoxidil how does the price change? Is there any reason the 30% minoxidil is actually being absorbed moreso than the 15%? I saw online testimonials claiming the 30% to be superior and thus faster acting with an improvement over 15%. My concern at 30% is what are the adverse effects such as on your heart? I personally recall old discussions claiming the difference ought to be negligible, I believe due to the assumption 30% wouldn't absorb sufficiently. I am thinking of placing an order but unsure as to the strength and which additives to add if not all. Progesterone from what I recall had a sweet spot close to 2%, too little or too much more being less effective.


 
It does lower my blood pressure if I use more than the prescribed amount, which I do a lot. The prescribed amount is a gram, or pea sized amount over the bald area, once daily.  


Sometimes I use it twice.


One time I used ten grams at once, and my ankle swelled up. The prescribed amount is one gram. It's a cream, you have to
eye ball it. But the script says "pea sized amount" which ~ one gram.


You will still have to supplement with regular, if you want the "temporary" effects of Minoxidil, which can last up to years.


Minoxidil has to hit the scalp for it to work. And it can't really be done with less volume.

----------


## bornthisway

> It does lower my blood pressure if I use more than the prescribed amount, which I do a lot. The prescribed amount is a gram, or pea sized amount over the bald area, once daily.  
> 
> 
> Sometimes I use it twice.
> 
> 
> One time I used ten grams at once, and my ankle swelled up. The prescribed amount is one gram. It's a cream, you have to
> eye ball it. But the script says "pea sized amount" which ~ one gram.
> 
> ...


 Based on the prescription instructions I guess the pea sized amount is meant to be sufficient for the entire scalp? Have you tried using a pea sized amount and rubbing it in your crown area and spreading it out as much as you can and seeing if it was just as effective? What concentration are you using, if 30% do you notice a difference from where you used 15%? I remember old posts claiming liquid were superior to cream but I don't really remember and specifics or know how valid that is. I know for the liquid they wanted it touching all parts of the scalp ideally... That's not feasible with cream it seems given the small quantity you are allowed to use, but maybe you don't have to based on how well it's absorbed?

----------


## bornthisway

I sort of get what you're saying.. the pea sized amount isn't enough to address all balding areas so you supplement with 5%. I guess you want the pea sized on the hardest hit area then.

----------


## funkville

you have a choice of using liquid or cream. i know that from 5-15 percent you can choose liquid or cream. in liquid 6 pumps is 1ml.

----------


## k9gatton

> I sort of get what you're saying.. the pea sized amount isn't enough to address all balding areas so you supplement with 5%. I guess you want the pea sized on the hardest hit area then.


 

Exactly. You want it on the baldest areas. 


The Finasteride didn't keep my hair in. The Progesterone does.


I've only used this single topical application for a year (with 30%).


It will be interesting to see how long the Minoxidil will keep
my hair in.

----------


## bornthisway

> Exactly. You want it on the baldest areas. 
> 
> 
> The Finasteride didn't keep my hair in. The Progesterone does.
> 
> 
> I've only used this single topical application for a year (with 30%).
> 
> 
> ...


 How has your hair changed with the 30% pea sized? Do you all think the cream is just as effective carrier? I think creams are easier to apply generally and less messy (no run off). I have only used up to 5% before and my hair is thin. I'm wondering since I've lost a lot of ground if I really should start at 12.5% or 30%. With using a pea sized amount of cream are the sides still just as likely (I'd guess sides are dependent on how well it's absorbed)? What's the cost for 12 5%? Given every additive has a proven track record, it seems like a good idea to include each as you'd target hair loss from a lot of angles. I'd guess the ingredients are complimentary and synergistic since they can be combined.

----------


## funkville

the lotion is not very runny it is like baby lotion in texture. when jazz first helped me i started with 7.5% and my hair grew like crazy. im ging back to 7.5% with progesterone and azelaic acid. fin gives me sides i dont need retin-a as i use it every evening. k9 and jazz have been using susan for a long time so they are best to advise. 

She is ill at the moment and back on tuesday so give her a call and ask for her advise.

----------


## bornthisway

> the lotion is not very runny it is like baby lotion in texture. when jazz first helped me i started with 7.5% and my hair grew like crazy. im ging back to 7.5% with progesterone and azelaic acid. fin gives me sides i dont need retin-a as i use it every evening. k9 and jazz have been using susan for a long time so they are best to advise. 
> 
> She is ill at the moment and back on tuesday so give her a call and ask for her advise.


 I didn't really have a response to 5%. Was that your first time using minoxidil and you responded really well?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys I will reply tommorow, as I work shifts.

----------


## sleeme

Thanks for responding to my questions! I am having a hard time deciding what to use.  I stopped Propecia because all my hormone levels are sky high out of range and my doctor told me to stop the medication to see if they return to normal.  I am waiting now for the results and its been four weeks since i took the last Propecia 1mg.  I have had NO side effects from the drug except for high Testosterone, estrogen, SHBG and for the last year, my doctor thought I had a benign condition of the liver but I recently tested my liver while off Propecia and the tests all came back normal. So now I am thinking Propecia has caused all this. Maybe this is how some people crash after taking the medication for years.  They don't know unless they monitor their hormone levels and eventually it all comes crashing down.  As of now I want to do something and wanted a topical so I thought maybe the 0.01%  topical Finasteride would work. Or maybe mixing Retinoic Acid or Azelaic acid with minoxidil? I also didn't know if I should add progesterone in the topical?  I was even thinking of possible micro dosing Propecia. I might respond to it since I think 1mg was a bit much.  It just seems like I can't get any advice and don't know who to believe when it comes to hair loss issues. Is it too much to take on a daily basis? Is it dangerous to mix all of those things together? Won't the Retinoic acid eat up your skin and is topical Finasteride with an alcohol base safe and does it work?  I read about Hussan and Wong, they are in Canada and they use a lipid base that is not legal in the US.... Thanks for any advice.  I know its a lot to take and I have many questions, so I appreciate any information you can give!!

----------


## funkville

> I didn't really have a response to 5%. Was that your first time using minoxidil and you responded really well?


 I started with 12.5% from belgravia in London uk. I respond to minoxidil very well. I do fell I should have started lower but I didn't know. The 7.5% respond well to me as I respond well to minoxidil. Maybe go higher. 

The best think to do is call up on Tuesday and ask to speak To Susan. She is very knowledgable. On the other hand jazz or k9 can help. Jazz was the person to get her to make the dr klein formula so they have had a working relationship for some time now.

----------


## funkville

> Thanks for responding to my questions! I am having a hard time deciding what to use.  I stopped Propecia because all my hormone levels are sky high out of range and my doctor told me to stop the medication to see if they return to normal.  I am waiting now for the results and its been four weeks since i took the last Propecia 1mg.  I have had NO side effects from the drug except for high Testosterone, estrogen, SHBG and for the last year, my doctor thought I had a benign condition of the liver but I recently tested my liver while off Propecia and the tests all came back normal. So now I am thinking Propecia has caused all this. Maybe this is how some people crash after taking the medication for years.  They don't know unless they monitor their hormone levels and eventually it all comes crashing down.  As of now I want to do something and wanted a topical so I thought maybe the 0.01%  topical Finasteride would work. Or maybe mixing Retinoic Acid or Azelaic acid with minoxidil? I also didn't know if I should add progesterone in the topical?  I was even thinking of possible micro dosing Propecia. I might respond to it since I think 1mg was a bit much.  It just seems like I can't get any advice and don't know who to believe when it comes to hair loss issues. Is it too much to take on a daily basis? Is it dangerous to mix all of those things together? Won't the Retinoic acid eat up your skin and is topical Finasteride with an alcohol base safe and does it work?  I read about Hussan and Wong, they are in Canada and they use a lipid base that is not legal in the US.... Thanks for any advice.  I know its a lot to take and I have many questions, so I appreciate any information you can give!!


 A lot of the points you bring up I can not respond to but on Retinoic acid I can confirm as I use it everyday on my face (Retin-a) it doesn't eat away at your skin. I also used it with Susan's formula of dr klein and my skin was fine. Your skin peels which is normal. The amount in the topical is soooo small compared to what I use on my face. With my face I use a pea size and I must wear sun block during the day.

----------


## bornthisway

> I started with 12.5% from belgravia in London uk. I respond to minoxidil very well. I do fell I should have started lower but I didn't know. The 7.5% respond well to me as I respond well to minoxidil. Maybe go higher. 
> 
> The best think to do is call up on Tuesday and ask to speak To Susan. She is very knowledgable. On the other hand jazz or k9 can help. Jazz was the person to get her to make the dr klein formula so they have had a working relationship for some time now.


 Being a lot older (30s) I don't consider myself a responder given how much my hair recessed on dutasteride and loss is rather aggressive (losing hair 13+ years). I'm just not sure if I should start on 30% cream with all additives or the 12.5% cream. I'd like to gain ground faster/sooner and the higher percentage seems like if minoxidil will do anything it probably will. K9 mentioned he's older as well and I believe 30% was a game changer for him. I think my situation would be closer to his probably.

I'm considering getting the S5 Cream Plus because of the tempol. It may be an aggressive way to attack this. Also includes alfatradiol and spiro.

----------


## sleeme

So which of these products do you guys think I should start with.  Being off of Propecia now for a month and possibly will try to restart with micro dosing but I am waiting to get hormone levels down  to normal.   I was going to start with 5 or 7.5% minoxidil but I am skeptical of the other products and the Progesterone. Maybe not take all the products everyday and switch off with minoxidil alone and them with all the products?  I wonder how much of the topical Finasteride works in the blood serum and if it works at all.  Any experience with these products with not taking the oral Propecia?? 
 Tretinoin (RA) 0.025%  
 Azelaic Acid 5%  
 Progesterone 0.25% 
 Finasteride  0.1% 
 Hydrocortisone 0.1% 
 Vitamin E 0.1% 
 DMI

----------


## k9gatton

> So which of these products do you guys think I should start with.  Being off of Propecia now for a month and possibly will try to restart with micro dosing but I am waiting to get hormone levels down  to normal.   I was going to start with 5 or 7.5% minoxidil but I am skeptical of the other products and the Progesterone. Maybe not take all the products everyday and switch off with minoxidil alone and them with all the products?  I wonder how much of the topical Finasteride works in the blood serum and if it works at all.  Any experience with these products with not taking the oral Propecia?? 
>  Tretinoin (RA) 0.025%  
>  Azelaic Acid 5%  
>  Progesterone 0.25% 
>  Finasteride  0.1% 
>  Hydrocortisone 0.1% 
>  Vitamin E 0.1% 
>  DMI


  .1% Finasteride  * 1 gram topical = 1 milligram oral Finasteride. They are equal.

 topical Finasteride DHT Reduction = ~76% (average).
 oral Finasteride DHT Reduction     = ~70% (average).

They probably also have the same side effects for PFS, although there's not a lot
of study on that. 

 Personally I would not recommend supplementing with Tretinoin acid. My scalp
 seemed to lose hair when I added it into the mix. (For people who don't know, I 
 take Minoxidil, Finasteride, Hydrocortisone, and Progesterone in the same 
 topical solution).

 My own personal experience - The Tretinoin burned my scalp. 

 If anybody doesn't believe me, I will be more than happy to provide photographic evidence.

 Also Azelaic Acid is questionable. I really don't take it, so I don't know very much about it.

----------


## sleeme

so taking it topically is the same as oral? Then more men should use topical if the reduction is higher   What about processing through the liver on topical?  All this is so confusing.

----------


## k9gatton

> so taking it topically is the same as oral? Then more men should use topical if the reduction is higher   What about processing through the liver on topical?  All this is so confusing.


 
That's exactly right. To give you the short answer, marketing for Merk is
the reason it's oral.


In the US, Propecia (1 mg Fin) came out in 1997. At the time, their biggest
competitor was Rogaine (script only). 


So to make it look easier for men to use, it was once a day pill versus
twice a day topical Minoxidil.

----------


## Jazz1

> So if you add all additives to minoxidil how does the price change? Is there any reason the 30% minoxidil is actually being absorbed moreso than the 15%? I saw online testimonials claiming the 30% to be superior and thus faster acting with an improvement over 15%. My concern at 30% is what are the adverse effects such as on your heart? I personally recall old discussions claiming the difference ought to be negligible, I believe due to the assumption 30% wouldn't absorb sufficiently. I am thinking of placing an order but unsure as to the strength and which additives to add if not all. Progesterone from what I recall had a sweet spot close to 2%, too little or too much more being less effective.


 I highly do not suggest 30% unless you have not tried 15%, all depends what you currently use? I combine my 15% mixture with my 5% regaine foam. The price to add all additives remains the same, if you check the previous threads I posted I explained the set prices I done for us forum guys, she also gives 10% discount if you purchase 3 bottles in one go. Also to add only 1ml is required per day, no more! 3 bottles will last 6 months, mine last slightly more as I use 4 squirts to save more money.

----------


## Jazz1

> you have a choice of using liquid or cream. i know that from 5-15 percent you can choose liquid or cream. in liquid 6 pumps is 1ml.


 Adding 0.1% Hydocortisone regardless will make the lotion thicker, so depends on the additives added.

----------


## Jazz1

> Exactly. You want it on the baldest areas. 
> 
> 
> The Finasteride didn't keep my hair in. The Progesterone does.
> 
> 
> I've only used this single topical application for a year (with 30%).
> 
> 
> ...


 Hey how is the progesterone lotion bottles, does it leave your hair greasy or dry quick? I might add them on my next order.

----------


## Jazz1

> How has your hair changed with the 30% pea sized? Do you all think the cream is just as effective carrier? I think creams are easier to apply generally and less messy (no run off). I have only used up to 5% before and my hair is thin. I'm wondering since I've lost a lot of ground if I really should start at 12.5% or 30%. With using a pea sized amount of cream are the sides still just as likely (I'd guess sides are dependent on how well it's absorbed)? What's the cost for 12 5%? Given every additive has a proven track record, it seems like a good idea to include each as you'd target hair loss from a lot of angles. I'd guess the ingredients are complimentary and synergistic since they can be combined.


 What's your current regime? That way I can help guide you, here's the other thread on price list and how to order.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for responding to my questions! I am having a hard time deciding what to use.  I stopped Propecia because all my hormone levels are sky high out of range and my doctor told me to stop the medication to see if they return to normal.  I am waiting now for the results and its been four weeks since i took the last Propecia 1mg.  I have had NO side effects from the drug except for high Testosterone, estrogen, SHBG and for the last year, my doctor thought I had a benign condition of the liver but I recently tested my liver while off Propecia and the tests all came back normal. So now I am thinking Propecia has caused all this. Maybe this is how some people crash after taking the medication for years.  They don't know unless they monitor their hormone levels and eventually it all comes crashing down.  As of now I want to do something and wanted a topical so I thought maybe the 0.01%  topical Finasteride would work. Or maybe mixing Retinoic Acid or Azelaic acid with minoxidil? I also didn't know if I should add progesterone in the topical?  I was even thinking of possible micro dosing Propecia. I might respond to it since I think 1mg was a bit much.  It just seems like I can't get any advice and don't know who to believe when it comes to hair loss issues. Is it too much to take on a daily basis? Is it dangerous to mix all of those things together? Won't the Retinoic acid eat up your skin and is topical Finasteride with an alcohol base safe and does it work?  I read about Hussan and Wong, they are in Canada and they use a lipid base that is not legal in the US.... Thanks for any advice.  I know its a lot to take and I have many questions, so I appreciate any information you can give!!


 
Hey just to add even topical finesteride will absorb into your blood stream, just less side effect compared to oral use. Tretinoin AKA retinoids will not eat your skin away, they just remove a thin layer. The percentage used won't cause long term side effects, I have been using it since Dr Klein days, over 3 years now. The good part about using tretinoin it helps counter the skin thinning side effects from Hydocortisone.

Personally Finetseride is your main bullet to saving hair, as mentioned before finesteride is a DHT inhibitor whilst the rest are Anti Angrogen/Growth.

----------


## Jazz1

> Being a lot older (30s) I don't consider myself a responder given how much my hair recessed on dutasteride and loss is rather aggressive (losing hair 13+ years). I'm just not sure if I should start on 30% cream with all additives or the 12.5% cream. I'd like to gain ground faster/sooner and the higher percentage seems like if minoxidil will do anything it probably will. K9 mentioned he's older as well and I believe 30% was a game changer for him. I think my situation would be closer to his probably.
> 
> I'm considering getting the S5 Cream Plus because of the tempol. It may be an aggressive way to attack this. Also includes alfatradiol and spiro.


 Hey do not waste your money on S5 cream unless you have responded to Finetseride or Dutasteride. Please do not fall for these mixtures to be a cure unless you respond to Fiensteride or Dutasteride! 

Tell me more what have you used from the start and what's failing to work, as the best option besides Finesteride and Dutasteride are RU58841 or CB-03-01.

----------


## Jazz1

Topical is a better option as your correct you by pass most the organs. That does not mean it fails to reach the blood stream! 

I had to use topical at the start as i had side effects taking it orally. Now I can use both fine oral or topical. I used 0.025% topically every 3rd to build my tolerance at the beginning until my body built tolerance.

----------


## sleeme

> Hey just to add even topical finesteride will absorb into your blood stream, just less side effect compared to oral use. Tretinoin AKA retinoids will not eat your skin away, they just remove a thin layer. The percentage used won't cause long term side effects, I have been using it since Dr Klein days, over 3 years now. The good part about using tretinoin it helps counter the skin thinning side effects from Hydocortisone.
> 
> Personally Finetseride is your main bullet to saving hair, as mentioned before finesteride is a DHT inhibitor whilst the rest are Anti Angrogen/Growth.


 I know Finesteride is the best defense from hair loss but do you think the topical will help work as well?  I was told since I am 27 to start with 0.025% topical Finesteride.   I have been off Propecia now for 6 weeks with no hair loss yet but I am getting concerned.  Do you think I should use any of these products instead or both the minoxidil and topical Finesteride?  I also was told to take Propecia in micro doses.  HELP!  I need advice on what to do or take.  Thanks! 
Here are the ingredients from the wellness center. I was thinking starting with topical finesteride with no additives or a few of these ingredients like Minoxidil  5%, Azelaic Acid, Tretinoin and maybe the progesterone.  I appreciate any help on where to start to keep my hair I have from Propecia using of the last 18 months.

Minoxidil  5% - 30%  
 Tretinoin (RA) 0.025%  
 Azelaic Acid 5%  
 Progesterone 0.25% 
 Finasteride  0.1% 
 Hydrocortisone 0.1% 
 Vitamin E 0.1% 
 DMI

----------


## sleeme

Jazz1,

Hope you don't mind another question but when you were using topical Finasteride was that the only treatment you were using?  And did it stop your hair loss? If the topical stops side effects then how can it cause hormone levels to be the same as oral?  I also saw a You Tube video they said to start with 0.05% topical Finasterdie.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys will reply later after work.

----------


## sleeme

i can't send or receive messages on my account.  Does anyone know why? I sent a message to the webmaster but no response.

----------


## sleeme

Where do you buy RU58841 or CB-03-01 and what is SS cream?  Where do these products come from and what country?  I mean are these products safe to use.  I am new to all this hair loss stiff and find it all so confusing.  I have read so much I don't know what to believe.  I have been to several doctors and each one tells me different.  I know Propecia is the best defense but I took it for 18 months and my bloodbwork was so sky high that it concerns me to continue for now. That's why I wanted to know of other good treatments to save what I have from propecia and or maybe consider the topical porpecia that is from a compounding pharmacy.  Any advice form you guys.  I am getting stressed over all this and rally confused.

----------


## funkville

> i can't send or receive messages on my account.  Does anyone know why? I sent a message to the webmaster but no response.


 I'm not sure also. I was trying to pm doke but there is not option other than aol messages which both needs to have

----------


## bornthisway

> I highly do not suggest 30% unless you have not tried 15%, all depends what you currently use? I combine my 15% mixture with my 5% regaine foam. The price to add all additives remains the same, if you check the previous threads I posted I explained the set prices I done for us forum guys, she also gives 10% discount if you purchase 3 bottles in one go. Also to add only 1ml is required per day, no more! 3 bottles will last 6 months, mine last slightly more as I use 4 squirts to save more money.


 
I just am on dut. If it's just a pea sized amount at 30% of minox cream, shouldn't the side effect profile be similar to that of 15% cream? I have used up to 5% long ago. The idea of 30% was mostly to target it somewhat aggressively but safely.

----------


## bornthisway

Btw guys what's the price of 12.5%? I'm still debating whether I'll start low or high.

----------


## Jazz1

> Where do you buy RU58841 or CB-03-01 and what is SS cream?  Where do these products come from and what country?  I mean are these products safe to use.  I am new to all this hair loss stiff and find it all so confusing.  I have read so much I don't know what to believe.  I have been to several doctors and each one tells me different.  I know Propecia is the best defense but I took it for 18 months and my bloodbwork was so sky high that it concerns me to continue for now. That's why I wanted to know of other good treatments to save what I have from propecia and or maybe consider the topical porpecia that is from a compounding pharmacy.  Any advice form you guys.  I am getting stressed over all this and rally confused.


 I discovered about these chemicals on hairlosshelp, than joined here and old school users who eventually went downhill on finesteride and DUT are now using these chemicals. I know a user on hairlosshelp that has maintained a full head of hair for over 20 years, now he is using CB-03-01.

Kane is the guy that sells these chemicals, the website is http://anageninc.com/. I have tried RU58841, 100% works but for me finesteride is still working great.

----------


## Jazz1

> I just am on dut. If it's just a pea sized amount at 30% of minox cream, shouldn't the side effect profile be similar to that of 15% cream? I have used up to 5% long ago. The idea of 30% was mostly to target it somewhat aggressively but safely.


  Than in that case I would only suggest using 30% in weak areas tiny amount, rotate it with 5%. I use the 15% only on my weak areas and it works a treat especially with derma rolling every other day. Although carefull not to use 15% after derma rolling as the absorption gave me a very bad headache! On the plus side my forehead is like a werewolf as derm rolling 100% works when combined with treatments.

----------


## Jazz1

> Btw guys what's the price of 12.5%? I'm still debating whether I'll start low or high.


 I have posted everything here, don't forget to take advantage of the 10% discount I done for us forum guys, if you purchase 6 months supply in one go. Personally I would go with 12.5% or 15% if you have never used either one, as 30% is too extreme if you have never used 15%!

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys, who else is using her progesterone leave in lotion? I am thinking of ordering this on my next order.

----------


## Jazz1

Hi guys how is everyone?

----------


## JohnMPB

Jazz

You claim you know a bunch of people including family members that use this product successfully. You said for months you would post pics of your family and friends success yet we are still waiting to see one pic of anyone having success with these lotions besides just you.

I just don't get it...

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz
> 
> You claim you know a bunch of people including family members that use this product successfully. You said for months you would post pics of your family and friends success yet we are still waiting to see one pic of anyone having success with these lotions besides just you.
> 
> I just don't get it...


 Hey I regards to my success I just carried on maintening my hair since Dr Klein passed away. The further success I had was vellus forehead hairs from derma rolling plus this lotion. Unfortunately like others my cousin has failed to send me further pictures, I can not force people to send pictures. 

I am not here to sell you anything and neither was this thread created to for that purpose. I created this thread to help people to an alternative when Dr Klein passed away. Yes I have had success I am an Nowrwood one and have been for the past 4+ years since using the products, 2 years on Dr Klein lotions and now Susan's-Murray Avenue lotion.

I can take pictures of my hair if that helps, in regards to the rest I can not help you out, as people are very selfish these days in wanting to help others, sorry.

----------


## JohnMPB

My point is I haven't seen anyone else claim success (backed up with evidence) from this compounded lotion except you. Even on other forums I have encountered a handful of people that claim these lotions did nothing for them and they dropped them.

There is actually more photographic proof of people getting results from belgravia 12.5% minox.

My main point is these products are extremely expensive. If a young college age student is getting persuaded by your posts and buys this lotion they have a lot on the line to lose financially compared to investing in the standard  big 3.

----------


## k9gatton

> Hey how is the progesterone lotion bottles, does it leave your hair greasy or dry quick? I might add them on my next order.


 On the vertex the Progesterone is helping.

On the temples, not as much. There is some terminal hairs, but it's not enough
density to lower my Norwood level.

Currently my hair isn't greasy. It's really only .25%. I'm going to try to get my .5% 
up to 1% (it took me a long time to get them to give me higher dosages).

----------


## Jazz1

> My point is I haven't seen anyone else claim success (backed up with evidence) from this compounded lotion except you. Even on other forums I have encountered a handful of people that claim these lotions did nothing for them and they dropped them.
> 
> There is actually more photographic proof of people getting results from belgravia 12.5% minox.
> 
> My main point is these products are extremely expensive. If a young college age student is getting persuaded by your posts and buys this lotion they have a lot on the line to lose financially compared to investing in the standard  big 3.


 That's a shame as the people who I spoke to using it still carry on having results I.E. Tariq one guy on here you can message.

I totally understand your point, as I mentioned Dr Klein was in business for years and had so many clients still to this date so obviously staying in business all these years it must have an effect on clients. The same goes with the BIG3 I have seen tons of people who have success, than vanish once they achieve results. I can not help you much, I have used the Belgravia clinic and trust me they are a complete RIP off regarding students, try purchasing a years 12.5% than let me know how your wallet feels  :Smile: .

As mentioned I did not create this thread to pull in new clients or help promote a business. The thread was created to HELP existing DR KLEIN patients like myself for an alternative when DR KLEIN passed away, as his clinic stopped selling the lotions leaving so many existing clients in the ditch.

----------


## Jazz1

> On the vertex the Progesterone is helping.
> 
> On the temples, not as much. There is some terminal hairs, but it's not enough
> density to lower my Norwood level.
> 
> Currently my hair isn't greasy. It's really only .25%. I'm going to try to get my .5% 
> up to 1% (it took me a long time to get them to give me higher dosages).


 
Thanks for the input I just bought 4 bottles to use twice a week. I have found after my intense gym sessions my scalp does itch, after applying this tends to ease the itch down after Revita shampoo in the morning.

----------


## cardib

the only ppl who have had success with susans lotion from murray ave are kgatton, and jazz, and their hairloss is not that bad. we all wish we had the set of hair they did. so i dont even think its a realistic claim. 

 I have not heard or seen anyone else with success. i myself used everything from the 12.5% all the way up to 30% from susan for over a year with no results, so i stopped wasting my money on it. when i emailed her(Susan the companys owner) to ask what can i do since ive tried all the products  she sells, she never got back to me. now what does a woman with a full head of hair know about hairloss. i dont care if shes a pharmacist, shes not MD or PHD. She simply saw the opportunity that opened up when Dr Klein passed away to sell high strenght minox, and imo exploits hair loss sufferers like ourselves who think that a higher strength minoxidil is what he need to start responding to min again. 

So for future forum members considering buying her products, know that it is really just a bust. only 2 ppl have seen results from it even though scores of ppl have used it including myself. higher strenght minox doesnt work and will lead to health side effects, some internal that are not seeing on the outside.

and all the additives to her formula, the progesterone, the AA, the retin A dont do jack shit either. just because theres a study saying it helped with hairloss on mice or some human hair follicles in a petri dish in a study in 2002 doesnt mean it works on a real human in real life. and dont even get me started on the topical fin she puts in the formula. topical fin doesnt do shit for the scalp.

STOP wasting money on Murray avenue products.

----------


## cardib

> My point is I haven't seen anyone else claim success (backed up with evidence) from this compounded lotion except you. Even on other forums I have encountered a handful of people that claim these lotions did nothing for them and they dropped them.
> 
> There is actually more photographic proof of people getting results from belgravia 12.5% minox.
> 
> My main point is these products are extremely expensive. If a young college age student is getting persuaded by your posts and buys this lotion they have a lot on the line to lose financially compared to investing in the standard  big 3.


 the only ppl who have had success with susans lotion from murray ave are kgatton, and jazz, and their hairloss is not that bad. we all wish we had the set of hair they did. so i dont even think its a realistic claim. 

I have not heard or seen anyone else with success. i myself used everything from the 12.5% all the way up to 30% from susan for over a year with no results, so i stopped wasting my money on it. when i emailed her(Susan the companys owner) to ask what can i do since ive tried all the products she sells, she never got back to me. now what does a woman with a full head of hair know about hairloss. i dont care if shes a pharmacist, shes not MD or PHD. She simply saw the opportunity that opened up when Dr Klein passed away to sell high strenght minox, and imo exploits hair loss sufferers like ourselves who think that a higher strength minoxidil is what he need to start responding to min again. 

So for future forum members considering buying her products, know that it is really just a bust. only 2 ppl have seen results from it even though scores of ppl have used it including myself. higher strenght minox doesnt work and will lead to health side effects, some internal that are not seeing on the outside.

and all the additives to her formula, the progesterone, the AA, the retin A dont do jack shit either. just because theres a study saying it helped with hairloss on mice or some human hair follicles in a petri dish in a study in 2002 doesnt mean it works on a real human in real life. and dont even get me started on the topical fin she puts in the formula. topical fin doesnt do shit for the scalp.

STOP wasting money on Murray avenue products.

----------


## Jazz1

> the only ppl who have had success with susans lotion from murray ave are kgatton, and jazz, and their hairloss is not that bad. we all wish we had the set of hair they did. so i dont even think its a realistic claim. 
> 
> I have not heard or seen anyone else with success. i myself used everything from the 12.5% all the way up to 30% from susan for over a year with no results, so i stopped wasting my money on it. when i emailed her(Susan the companys owner) to ask what can i do since ive tried all the products she sells, she never got back to me. now what does a woman with a full head of hair know about hairloss. i dont care if shes a pharmacist, shes not MD or PHD. She simply saw the opportunity that opened up when Dr Klein passed away to sell high strenght minox, and imo exploits hair loss sufferers like ourselves who think that a higher strength minoxidil is what he need to start responding to min again. 
> 
> So for future forum members considering buying her products, know that it is really just a bust. only 2 ppl have seen results from it even though scores of ppl have used it including myself. higher strenght minox doesnt work and will lead to health side effects, some internal that are not seeing on the outside.
> 
> and all the additives to her formula, the progesterone, the AA, the retin A dont do jack shit either. just because theres a study saying it helped with hairloss on mice or some human hair follicles in a petri dish in a study in 2002 doesnt mean it works on a real human in real life. and dont even get me started on the topical fin she puts in the formula. topical fin doesnt do shit for the scalp.
> 
> STOP wasting money on Murray avenue products.


 
Hey I'm sorry to hear you did not have success, the same goes with the BIG 3 guys. To also clarify a few things you had issues with finesteride right? Killed your libido?

Correct me if I'm wrong?

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...gra?highlight=

No product will work unless you halt Hairloss, you can slap a million things on your head, but I'm sorry to say if you haven't halt your Hairloss with a DHT blocker like finesteride or DUT your wasting your money.

As mentioned before I DO NOT care if you don't buy from her or if anyone else buys from her. You should stick to the BIG 3, my opinion go buy yourself some 1mg legit propecia, 5% minoxidil foam and some 2% keto shampoo. 

That fails to work don't slate the forums or Merck for creating a tablet that gave you libido issues. Now on the other hand if you had asked me for advice regarding your libido issues I would have gratefully recommended few things to help you. 

To add I'm from the UK, Susan is based in USA, I used to buy 12.5% minoxidil with added Azelaic acid from the Belgravia clinic that charged me double the price. Their website has tons of pictures people using finesteride and their 12.5% with success. 

So just to add guys you have variable options to buy from different sources as I'm only here to help. Also to add if FINESTERIDE does not halt your Hairloss than forget all other options you will be wasting your money  :Smile: .

----------


## Tarikko

Hey guys

I haven't posted here in ages


I been on Susan's lotion for over two years now I think, and eventhough I had a hair transplant (fue 1200) to my frontal area, I experienced great improvement 


The area in the Middle was sparse and the back of my head I had a clear empty circle of no hair

Now it's all black (no more hole) and thick 

My 2 cents

----------


## coolhairgone

You can't really tell if a product works or not based on the comments on forums, because those who have good results probably will no longer show up in forums and those who are disappointed will more likely come there to vent. It is just my 2 cents.

----------


## cardib

susan's lotion cost $90for the tube and $60 for the med consult, so its a $150 investment just to try it. so yes, sometimes you got to depend on forums for real reviews of products before you waste your money, or at least be warned before you waste your money, bc susan is not going to tell you her products doesn't work on the grand majority of everyone that buys it


> You can't really tell if a product works or not based on the comments on forums, because those who have good results probably will no longer show up in forums and those who are disappointed will more likely come there to vent. It is just my 2 cents.

----------


## cardib

so your saying it helps with transplanted hairs? what about those of us sanz transplant????? we are talking about susans lotion for regular non transplanted hair... 
your two cents only help ppl with transplants...

----------


## cardib

lets also not forget for those that have even tried susans lotion, and have had to use the medical wellness pharmacy to get the prescription, that it asks you how did you hear about purchasing this products, and Jazz's name is on of the boxes you click. So i dont know if he gets commission whenever anyone clicks his name or what, but its suspicious. if he's not getting a percentage of the sales, why would his name even be on there?

----------


## k9gatton

> so your saying it helps with transplanted hairs? what about those of us sanz transplant????? we are talking about susans lotion for regular non transplanted hair... 
> your two cents only help ppl with transplants...


 
Appreciate your quote about my hair. Actually, I am a Norwood three, but my hair is growing back. Not much at the hairline.


I'm always posting pictures here. Don't want people to think I'm just talk. I'm not.


The Progesterone was the break through for me. With my hair, it really did help. And doubling it did the trick, to .5%.


They still won't give me one percent. Just got a refill script in the beginning of March.
They say it's too high (it would be the equivalent of ten milligrams, per one gram).

----------


## k9gatton

> the only ppl who have had success with susans lotion from murray ave are kgatton, and jazz, and their hairloss is not that bad. we all wish we had the set of hair they did. so i dont even think its a realistic claim. 
> 
>  I have not heard or seen anyone else with success. i myself used everything from the 12.5% all the way up to 30% from susan for over a year with no results, so i stopped wasting my money on it. when i emailed her(Susan the companys owner) to ask what can i do since ive tried all the products  she sells, she never got back to me. now what does a woman with a full head of hair know about hairloss. i dont care if shes a pharmacist, shes not MD or PHD. She simply saw the opportunity that opened up when Dr Klein passed away to sell high strenght minox, and imo exploits hair loss sufferers like ourselves who think that a higher strength minoxidil is what he need to start responding to min again. 
> 
> So for future forum members considering buying her products, know that it is really just a bust. only 2 ppl have seen results from it even though scores of ppl have used it including myself. higher strenght minox doesnt work and will lead to health side effects, some internal that are not seeing on the outside.
> 
> and all the additives to her formula, the progesterone, the AA, the retin A dont do jack shit either. just because theres a study saying it helped with hairloss on mice or some human hair follicles in a petri dish in a study in 2002 doesnt mean it works on a real human in real life. and dont even get me started on the topical fin she puts in the formula. topical fin doesnt do shit for the scalp.
> 
> STOP wasting money on Murray avenue products.


 Again, Appreciate the comment about my hair. If you saw how bad I was in 2013, you would know that
it was almost a lost cause for me. I was probably even worse than a Norwood 4. 

To be honest, it was the Progesterone that did the work for me. 

Check out my Progesterone thread pictures. Look at my 2013 picture. My hair is horrible, and it's obvious it's balding.

Doubling the Progesterone amount was the smartest move I made. It's hard, because usually both the doctors at Med Wellness center or Susan will deny requests for higher amounts of Progesterone. I tried one percent, but I still get .5%. The max amount on their site is .25%.

----------


## Jazz1

> lets also not forget for those that have even tried susans lotion, and have had to use the medical wellness pharmacy to get the prescription, that it asks you how did you hear about purchasing this products, and Jazz's name is on of the boxes you click. So i dont know if he gets commission whenever anyone clicks his name or what, but its suspicious. if he's not getting a percentage of the sales, why would his name even be on there?


 To clarify this I never asked for my name to be published, yes she does give me extra discount, which again I didn't ask. I recently spent over $200 with her and I'm happy to provide proof of my purchases before you get it twisted I'm some sort of sales person.

As stated I'm sorry if the product didn't help you, as mentioned people try the BIG 3 before purchasing any lotion potions. 

Also may I ask you, what are you currently using, or what did you use prior to that lotion? Finesteride?

----------


## Jazz1

> so your saying it helps with transplanted hairs? what about those of us sanz transplant????? we are talking about susans lotion for regular non transplanted hair... 
> your two cents only help ppl with transplants...


 What about the BIG3, you not tried the basics? 1mg oral tablet, 5% minoxidil, Keto shampoo?

To also add you can track all my posts on all forums from when I used Dr Klein, go check my posts on hairlosshelp I been a member since 2010. 

Re-read my first post, I created this thread to help existing Dr Klein patients, when Dr klein passed away his clinic stopped selling his lotions to me. I never created this thread to become a sales rep, I created this thread to help people.

I bet you never responded well to the BIG3?

----------


## Jazz1

> lets also not forget for those that have even tried susans lotion, and have had to use the medical wellness pharmacy to get the prescription, that it asks you how did you hear about purchasing this products, and Jazz's name is on of the boxes you click. So i dont know if he gets commission whenever anyone clicks his name or what, but its suspicious. if he's not getting a percentage of the sales, why would his name even be on there?


 Check all my posts I was a previous 2 year Dr Klein patient and always rated his products before he passed away. Thats when I looked for alternatives and even tried the Polaris range without success until I found Susan. So before you get it twisted I'm some sort of sales rep, go do your research before trying to make me look bad, when all i have done is provide help back on the forums!

Also maybe you should try the Polaris stuff, you can get it from the internet without prescription and it's cheaper with similar ingredients. As mentioned before what about the BIG3? Does it not work for you? 

http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/m...ighlight_key=y

----------


## JohnMPB

Jazz what ever happened to mark from *** and hlh?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz what ever happened to mark from *** and hlh?


 Funny you mentioned him, I spoke to him the other day via watts app. The guy still has a full set of hair, considering all the products he has used, bless.

I think he was not too well last year, plus he's been focusing on his new house.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Funny you mentioned him, I spoke to him the other day via watts app. The guy still has a full set of hair, considering all the products he has used, bless.
> 
> I think he was not too well last year, plus he's been focusing on his new house.


 Do you know what's in his regimen now? I remember the guy was literally on everything

----------


## JohnMPB

> Funny you mentioned him, I spoke to him the other day via watts app. The guy still has a full set of hair, considering all the products he has used, bless.
> 
> I think he was not too well last year, plus he's been focusing on his new house.


 Do you know what's in his regimen now? I remember the guy was literally on everything 

Also y did he quit posting on forums?

I don't see you posting on other forums either

----------


## Jazz1

> Do you know what's in his regimen now? I remember the guy was literally on everything


 Hey mentions other day he just using DUT and natural oils, knowing Mark he probably using more than mentioned.

----------


## Jazz1

> Do you know what's in his regimen now? I remember the guy was literally on everything 
> 
> Also y did he quit posting on forums?
> 
> I don't see you posting on other forums either


 Last year he was not very well, plus he's been busy with his new house and life.

----------


## k9gatton

> Check all my posts I was a previous 2 year Dr Klein patient and always rated his products before he passed away. Thats when I looked for alternatives and even tried the Polaris range without success until I found Susan. So before you get it twisted I'm some sort of sales rep, go do your research before trying to make me look bad, when all i have done is provide help back on the forums!
> 
> Also maybe you should try the Polaris stuff, you can get it from the internet without prescription and it's cheaper with similar ingredients. As mentioned before what about the BIG3? Does it not work for you? 
> 
> http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/m...ighlight_key=y


 
Their lotion, which I also get for myself, has a smaller tube. I just noticed that (a half inch maybe?).


Kind of pissed off, to be honest. I asked Susan this.


Did you see the same thing?

----------


## Eire1980

Hey all...I've used susans minix/fin combo for the last 2yrs and my hair loss has still progressed..not to say it doesn't work just that maybe I'm in the minority..I have an appointment with my GP this week with the aim of getting a prescription for proscar...given susans topical isn't working as well for me do you think it's worth taking tablet form or am I just not a good responder and screwed..any thoughts? ..sorry dint mean to hijack the thread..cheers

----------


## k9gatton

> Hey all...I've used susans minix/fin combo for the last 2yrs and my hair loss has still progressed..not to say it doesn't work just that maybe I'm in the minority..I have an appointment with my GP this week with the aim of getting a prescription for proscar...given susans topical isn't working as well for me do you think it's worth taking tablet form or am I just not a good responder and screwed..any thoughts? ..sorry dint mean to hijack the thread..cheers


 It probably doesn't work for some people. Did you just try standard amounts?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hey all...I've used susans minix/fin combo for the last 2yrs and my hair loss has still progressed..not to say it doesn't work just that maybe I'm in the minority..I have an appointment with my GP this week with the aim of getting a prescription for proscar...given susans topical isn't working as well for me do you think it's worth taking tablet form or am I just not a good responder and screwed..any thoughts? ..sorry dint mean to hijack the thread..cheers


 I would consider DUT if you fail to respond to finesteride, more powerfull drugs would be the experimental RU58841 or CB-03-01. All the research I done, RU is a good bet as you can up the dosage, I would consider DUT as a second protocol.

----------


## aexit123

should I buy from here: https://02db4e6.netsolhost.com/anagen.net/remin.htm

----------


## Jazz1

> should I buy from here: https://02db4e6.netsolhost.com/anagen.net/remin.htm


 Hey everything is explained in this thread;

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## JohnMPB

Make sure to click the box that says jazz refered you so he can get his kickback from Susan

----------


## Jazz1

> Make sure to click the box that says jazz refered you so he can get his kickback from Susan


 Guys do not click my name, as I mentioned before I never asked for my name to be put on their site. Also as previously mentioned I never created this thread to gain any beneficial means for myself, I created this thread to help existing Dr Klein patients who were struggling to purchase 15% when Dr Klein passed away.

So before you guys start to slate me, go back to the initial post on this thread. All I have done since I suffered myself and learnt from the forums is provide help back. I pay for all my products I purchase from Susan as mentioned yes I do get a slight extra discount again which I never asked and I am more than happy to post my bank statement for all my transactions.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Guys do not click my name, as I mentioned before I never asked for my name to be put on their site. Also as previously mentioned I never created this thread to gain any beneficial means for myself, I created this thread to help existing Dr Klein patients who were struggling to purchase 15% when Dr Klein passed away.
> 
> So before you guys start to slate me, go back to the initial post on this thread. All I have done since I suffered myself and learnt from the forums is provide help back. I pay for all my products I purchase from Susan as mentioned yes I do get a slight extra discount again which I never asked and I am more than happy to post my bank statement for all my transactions.


 Jazz
Why don't u promote the newest company (regenere) that uses dr. Klein's EXACT formula rather than Susan's attempt at a copy of klein's formula?

----------


## JohnMPB

Double post

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz
> Why don't u promote the newest company (regenere) that uses dr. Klein's EXACT formula rather than Susan's attempt at a copy of klein's formula?


 I did try their formula when they reopened, the lotion left hard sticky residue in my scalp. 

You can reverse check how I used to always praise Dr Klein formula. I even sent both Dr Klein original formula to both clinics including his DMI 10% sprays at the initial start at my own cost as I wanted his exact original formula. Susan or the current clinic couldn't duplicate the exact original formula. I wish I could have found out who formulated the original formula, personally I think Dr Klein use to make the lotions as Tony would have used the original pharmacy when he sold the company.

Shame as when Dr Klein passed away I use to think Tony was a great guy. They both turned out to be goons, unwilling to help all they were interested at the time was selling the company and money.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz
> Why don't u promote the newest company (regenere) that uses dr. Klein's EXACT formula rather than Susan's attempt at a copy of klein's formula?


 
That's why I don't understand, I don't think there was an old pharmacy. Tony did email me before he sold the company telling me he had helped the new owners and the lotions/sprays will be the exact same etc. That was the case Tony would have used the exact original pharmacy for the exact formulation they used for years instead they using a new pharmacy. My own cost from the UK I sent the original formulations I had left over at the time they still couldn't copy the exact formula.

That's why I come to the conclusion that when Dr Klein was alive he probably made the formulations himself. I loved his old formulations including the DMI sprays. Big shame if their was a pharmacy that formulated the old formula I would without hesitation go back to the original formula.

The UK only has one clinic that charges 3x the amount for 12.5% and the only additive added is azelaic acid.

----------


## JohnMPB

> That's why I don't understand, I don't think there was an old pharmacy. Tony did email me before he sold the company telling me he had helped the new owners and the lotions/sprays will be the exact same etc. That was the case Tony would have used the exact original pharmacy for the exact formulation they used for years instead they using a new pharmacy. My own cost from the UK I sent the original formulations I had left over at the time they still couldn't copy the exact formula.
> 
> That's why I come to the conclusion that when Dr Klein was alive he probably made the formulations himself. I loved his old formulations including the DMI sprays. Big shame if their was a pharmacy that formulated the old formula I would without hesitation go back to the original formula.
> 
> The UK only has one clinic that charges 3x the amount for 12.5% and the only additive added is azelaic acid.


 Interesting info. I didn't know u sent them the old formulas. Did you try them yourself after they mixed them up and is that how u found out they werent the same? I used to use dr. Klein's spiro lotion and it was extremely clean- dare I say better than dr. Lee.

Again, you seem like a genuine guy jazz. Didn't mean to come off harsh, been having a rough week on my end here and fed up with losing more hair. 

Take care

----------


## Jazz1

> Interesting info. I didn't know u sent them the old formulas. Did you try them yourself after they mixed them up and is that how u found out they werent the same? I used to use dr. Klein's spiro lotion and it was extremely clean- dare I say better than dr. Lee.
> 
> Again, you seem like a genuine guy jazz. Didn't mean to come off harsh, been having a rough week on my end here and fed up with losing more hair. 
> 
> Take care


 
Hey it is ok, yes I sent Tony the original bottles, at the time he forwarded them to the new owners and even I spoke to their new pharmacist at the time. All I wanted was the original formula exactly the same, as Tony mentioned their current pharmacy does not want to sell anymore(personally I think he was telling lies as Dr Klein was their pharmacist). Susan could not copy the DMI sprays although her lotion is clean, non sticky. 

Either way non of them compare to the original formula, I think I might still have a bottle laying about, as I use to buy a whole years supply, the more you bought the more discount. I still have proof purchasing lotion from the new pharmacist and was refunded as I sent them back, due to them being sticky.

Shame as I never had a chance to use Dr Lee I heard he was the best guy with these lotion potions. I did purchase ******* before it closed, but never used it due to closure. That's when I discovered Dr Klein, he seemed genuine and his products worked superb for me, BIG shame he passed away. 

I will be making a fresh thread I been doing some research and this might help you. This method is cheap/effective and will help so many people who can not afford products or the people who can not use medication.

Keep track of my new thread I will creating this weekend, stay positive.

What are you currently using and how is your hair?

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey it is ok, yes I sent Tony the original bottles, at the time he forwarded them to the new owners and even I spoke to their new pharmacist at the time. All I wanted was the original formula exactly the same, as Tony mentioned their current pharmacy does not want to sell anymore(personally I think he was telling lies as Dr Klein was their pharmacist). Susan could not copy the DMI sprays although her lotion is clean, non sticky. 
> 
> Either way non of them compare to the original formula, I think I might still have a bottle laying about, as I use to buy a whole years supply, the more you bought the more discount. I still have proof purchasing lotion from the new pharmacist and was refunded as I sent them back, due to them being sticky.
> 
> Shame as I never had a chance to use Dr Lee I heard he was the best guy with these lotion potions. I did purchase ******* before it closed, but never used it due to closure. That's when I discovered Dr Klein, he seemed genuine and his products worked superb for me, BIG shame he passed away. 
> 
> I will be making a fresh thread I been doing some research and this might help you. This method is cheap/effective and will help so many people who can not afford products or the people who can not use medication.
> 
> Keep track of my new thread I will creating this weekend, stay positive.
> ...


 Jazz,
I've been on fin and niz since 2006
Minoxidil and tricomin since roughly 2008
I used topical spiro on and off and dr. Lees seemed to provide results. The others weren't as good.

I was about nw3 when I started and during my peak results 2008-2010 I reached about a nw 2.5 and thickened up nicely. I've lost a lot of ground since then and I think I'm at about baseline. I tried RU on my hairline the last ~7 months with no results. I'm thinking of adding dut. My scalp gets inflamed often and I have Revita on the way right now. Kind of adamant on using Revita as it has silicones and that can potentially prevent topicals from absorbing into the scalp as it coats the scalp and hair.

----------


## k9gatton

> lets also not forget for those that have even tried susans lotion, and have had to use the medical wellness pharmacy to get the prescription, that it asks you how did you hear about purchasing this products, and Jazz's name is on of the boxes you click. So i dont know if he gets commission whenever anyone clicks his name or what, but its suspicious. if he's not getting a percentage of the sales, why would his name even be on there?


 You are so right my friend, as usual. That said, I actually gained (lost) one full Norwood number on Progesterone. It's definitely not a Norwood II. But I went from a "classic" Norwood four (hairline, then vertex loss), to a SOLID Norwood three. And I'm NOT talking
about Norwood 3V (vertex, and severely receding hairline). It's a solid three.

It did much more for my vertex than hairline, on the other hand, I need to try dermarolling. Big mistake on my part.

Live and learn I guess.

----------


## k9gatton

For the record, Dr. Klein formula is decent, in my opinion.

Recently purchased it, had no issues at all, except the Pay Pal was a little suspicious, in my own
opinion. Had to make a Pay Pal account to pay them.

Other than that, it is very smooth. It's less solid than Murray's, but I still think Murray has a much superior
quality to it. So, I can't really bad mouth Murray's, because I've been using them since 2012. 

That said, I'm equally impressed with Promox (Klein's product) as well.

----------


## k9gatton

> Their lotion, which I also get for myself, has a smaller tube. I just noticed that (a half inch maybe?).
> 
> 
> Kind of pissed off, to be honest. I asked Susan this.
> 
> 
> Did you see the same thing?


 Was definitely wrong about this. They just had a supply order issue during April, and they have the longer tubes.

It is by weight, and the weight was the same.

@Administrator - Could you please remove blog number 1087?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz,
> I've been on fin and niz since 2006
> Minoxidil and tricomin since roughly 2008
> I used topical spiro on and off and dr. Lees seemed to provide results. The others weren't as good.
> 
> I was about nw3 when I started and during my peak results 2008-2010 I reached about a nw 2.5 and thickened up nicely. I've lost a lot of ground since then and I think I'm at about baseline. I tried RU on my hairline the last ~7 months with no results. I'm thinking of adding dut. My scalp gets inflamed often and I have Revita on the way right now. Kind of adamant on using Revita as it has silicones and that can potentially prevent topicals from absorbing into the scalp as it coats the scalp and hair.


 Hey sorry to hear and sorry about the late reply, what dosage were you trying RU? Same dosage as Fiensteride? RU is more powerfull than DUT, maybe you were using less dosage?

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey sorry to hear and sorry about the late reply, what dosage were you trying RU? Same dosage as Fiensteride? RU is more powerfull than DUT, maybe you were using less dosage?


 I was just using on hairline. So 1/4 of a ml of 50g/ml solution which comes out to about 12.5g.

As a side note, I've bought the litre bottle of Revita and like it to far. Really helps with inflammation. However I notice the ingredients have silicone. I've read on the UK website for rogaine that users should use a shampoo without silicones as they can potentially coat the scalp and limit absorption. What are your thoughts on this?

What shampoos do you use and on what frequency?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey I use Regenepure Dr and Revita been doing so for the past 3 years.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey I use Regenepure Dr and Revita been doing so for the past 3 years.


 Both daily? Alternate? Please more info

----------


## Jazz1

> Both daily? Alternate? Please more info


 Yes have been doing so for 3 years, I pre cleanse with Nioxin and scrubber.

Morning time I use 925ml Revita and night use Regenepure Dr. Than twice a week I had some 2% nizoral to my Regenepure shampoo.

----------


## meep

Anyone get Susan's stuff analyzed by an independent lab? I used Dr. Lee's x.a.n.d.ro.x. AND IT WORKED. I'm going to try su's stuff, depending...BUT Ive been using dutasteride since Lee disappeared and it's been good at holding off worsening balding, not much regrowth, it is dose dependent though. I use .5 mg a day with grapefruit juice. going to try 1.5mg a day or every other day based on this- http://www.hairlosscure2020.com/duta...ge-discussion/

----------


## k9gatton

> Anyone get Susan's stuff analyzed by an independent lab? I used Dr. Lee's x.a.n.d.ro.x. AND IT WORKED. I'm going to try su's stuff, depending...BUT Ive been using dutasteride since Lee disappeared and it's been good at holding off worsening balding, not much regrowth, it is dose dependent though. I use .5 mg a day with grapefruit juice. going to try 1.5mg a day or every other day based on this- http://www.hairlosscure2020.com/duta...ge-discussion/


 
Tried the same thing you did. Two formulas that have worked for me are Susan's (Medical Wellness Center), and Promox (Regenere). Both have really helped me a lot. The formula above I have used. It worked for a friend of mine, but not for me.

----------


## Jazz1

> Tried the same thing you did. Two formulas that have worked for me are Susan's (Medical Wellness Center), and Promox (Regenere). Both have really helped me a lot. The formula above I have used. It worked for a friend of mine, but not for me.


 What do you use now?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey guys anyone tried the new Hemp stuff for hairloss? I can not use it as I get random drug test at work. I wonder if the Hemp stuff works for hairloss?

----------


## gynx09

> Hey guys anyone tried the new Hemp stuff for hairloss? I can not use it as I get random drug test at work. I wonder if the Hemp stuff works for hairloss?


 Wow im really interested in trying this. Can we send in our own prescription?

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey guys anyone tried the new Hemp stuff for hairloss? I can not use it as I get random drug test at work. I wonder if the Hemp stuff works for hairloss?


 Who offers it? I didn't see it on medical wellness center site. What is the method of action?

----------


## Jazz1

> Wow im really interested in trying this. Can we send in our own prescription?


 Hey I am pretty sure you can, so long as it is prescribed via an doctor.

----------


## Jazz1

> Who offers it? I didn't see it on medical wellness center site. What is the method of action?


 I just done my last order and they mentioned the new product. Unfortunately due to where I work in the U.K. we get tested at work. 

I do not know if natural hemp might show up within the system? Also I wonder how well it might work for hairloss?

----------


## doke

What about hairloss md the company selling Dr Klines remox and promox i keep getting emails from them and discounts.

----------


## Jazz1

> What about hairloss md the company selling Dr Klines remox and promox i keep getting emails from them and discounts.


 I don't know as I currently use Susan's stuff now, how is your hairloss? Have not heard from you in a long time  :Smile: .

----------


## doke

Hi Jazz  no i just buzz my hair when it needs it saves on hair cuts i went back on proscar and found it really did not do much i am still using theradome laser helmet on the 148 treatment i have kept some hair.
It is very strange that proscar does not seem to do much in some and wondering if there is a lot more involved more than the old dht thing.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz  no i just buzz my hair when it needs it saves on hair cuts i went back on proscar and found it really did not do much i am still using theradome laser helmet on the 148 treatment i have kept some hair.
> It is very strange that proscar does not seem to do much in some and wondering if there is a lot more involved more than the old dht thing.


 
Hey doke you used the Igrow before right? Is the Theradome better? 

As above have you considered cutting Gluten from your diet? As I read a thread on the bodybuilding forums a guy degree his hair by changing his diet etc.

You been checked for MPB? Maybe you might need something like Avodart.

----------


## doke

I did have the igrow and i do think its better but only if you deo not pay full price shop around its no miracle though but i like keeping what i have still.

----------


## Jazz1

> I did have the igrow and i do think its better but only if you deo not pay full price shop around its no miracle though but i like keeping what i have still.


 Right so Igrow is better than the Theradome? As I was thinking about switching next year the Theradome is more expensive!

----------


## doke

Jazz if i was to buy theradome now i still would not pay unless i got it for the price i paid new £490 which the aberdeen hairloss clinic charged me on ebay and buy the way there service was good i had a problem with the rechargable battery and they sent me another free.
The thing is the official uk seller did not like the aberdeen hair clinic under cutting them and caused a bit of trouble so they had to stop the discount although its worth phoning them in scotland to see if they may have a good price.
By the way Jazz has anyone tried hairgrowth md selling Dr Klines products as they have a combo which contains minoxidil and dht inhibitor plus a choice for a small extra price bimatoprost.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz if i was to buy theradome now i still would not pay unless i got it for the price i paid new £490 which the aberdeen hairloss clinic charged me on ebay and buy the way there service was good i had a problem with the rechargable battery and they sent me another free.
> The thing is the official uk seller did not like the aberdeen hair clinic under cutting them and caused a bit of trouble so they had to stop the discount although its worth phoning them in scotland to see if they may have a good price.
> By the way Jazz has anyone tried hairgrowth md selling Dr Klines products as they have a combo which contains minoxidil and dht inhibitor plus a choice for a small extra price bimatoprost.


 Awesome you have their details please as I defiantly want to switch over from the Igrow. I know one guy who tried their products and found them sticky. They have switched pharmacies so the products are not like the original Dr Klein formula. I still have some left over the original Dr Klein formula from when he passed away.

----------


## JohnMPB

Look guys jazz is famous, even has his pics posted on Murray avenue website: https://maapgh.com/hair-growth-solutions.html

Jazz,
I know you said you get a slight discount but has Susan given u anything for these pics?

I also think it's deceiving how she's using these pictures to show your regrowth. That hair loss and growth you had was due to alopecia areata. Most guys using these formulations are using it for mpb hence all the antiandrigen additives in her minox formulations. Also there is no mention of any other products u were using in your regimen and it's a bit shady to claim all the regrowth is a result of her formulas.

----------


## Jazz1

> Look guys jazz is famous, even has his pics posted on Murray avenue website: https://maapgh.com/hair-growth-solutions.html
> 
> Jazz,
> I know you said you get a slight discount but has Susan given u anything for these pics?
> 
> I also think it's deceiving how she's using these pictures to show your regrowth. That hair loss and growth you had was due to alopecia areata. Most guys using these formulations are using it for mpb hence all the antiandrigen additives in her minox formulations. Also there is no mention of any other products u were using in your regimen and it's a bit shady to claim all the regrowth is a result of her formulas.


 John it is easy to jump the bandwagon and assume I'm doing wrong than good. When I use to post on hairlosshelp people use to assume I was a sales rep for Dr Klein! 

My regrowth was from Dr Kleins formula, I do suffer from MPB and unfortunately at the time I only have one picture showing my MPB.

Yes I did also suffer from Alopecia Areata and yes there were few things in combination I used at the time that worked everything is mentioned in my previous threads if you care to check? So I am not hiding anything! See what I still use besides Susan's products, go check all my previous threads.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...ead?highlight=

This thread was created to HELP people, especially EX Dr Klein patients at the time of Dr Kleins death!

As many like myself who used his products with success, we was left stranded when he passed away! When he passed away I was left with 3 remaining products and they were no longer willing to supply his formula to anyone! That's when I searched and searched online and luckily found Susan. 

I tried her products 2 years back as I had no choice and they have worked exactly the same as Dr Kleins old formula as the ingredients remain the same etc. The only difference is the texture in the lotion. 

That's why I created this thread John to pass on the advice and options available for his existing clients at the time.

I offered to give Susan my pictures as she ASKED me. Plus you can go buy another formula from else where with the same ingredients I'm sure it will work. Also to add as good gesture she does give me extra discount. Again i never asked for nothing besides the same products as Dr Klein. I live in the UK and here we only have one place that charge us 4 times the amount for 12.5% Belgravia Center, hence why I always buy from America!

I always pay for my products and I am willing to show proof of my recent order transaction. Again I have nothing to hide, but I can understand your false assumptions as it's hard to believe these days people do GOOD for FREE!

Either majority of the people I have helped over the years and even recently will know what other natural methods I have suggested. I have done tons of research over the years and I believe in HUMANITY, I believe in helping one another.

Remember it is easy to do BAD than GOOD, it is easy to LIE than to NOT LIE. I am not perfect John but I sure am no lier.

Good luck and I hope one day you will realise I am not lying in anyway, I will always speak the TRUTH as I believe in KARMA.

----------


## Jazz1

> Look guys jazz is famous, even has his pics posted on Murray avenue website: https://maapgh.com/hair-growth-solutions.html
> 
> Jazz,
> I know you said you get a slight discount but has Susan given u anything for these pics?
> 
> I also think it's deceiving how she's using these pictures to show your regrowth. That hair loss and growth you had was due to alopecia areata. Most guys using these formulations are using it for mpb hence all the antiandrigen additives in her minox formulations. Also there is no mention of any other products u were using in your regimen and it's a bit shady to claim all the regrowth is a result of her formulas.


 John it is easy to jump the bandwagon and assume I'm doing wrong than good. When I use to post on hairlosshelp people use to assume I was a sales rep for Dr Klein! 

My regrowth was from Dr Kleins formula, I do suffer from MPB and unfortunately at the time I only have one picture showing my MPB.

Yes I did also suffer from Alopecia Areata and yes there were a few things in combination I used at the time that worked everything is mentioned in my previous threads if you care to check? So I am not hiding anything! See what I still use besides Susan's products, go check all my previous threads.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...ead?highlight=

This thread was created to HELP people, especially EX Dr Klein patients at the time of Dr Kleins death!

As many like myself who used his products with success, we was left stranded when he passed away! When he passed away I was left with 3 remaining products and they were no longer willing to supply his formula to anyone! That's when I searched and searched online and luckily found Susan. 

I tried her products 2 years back as I had no choice and they have worked exactly the same as Dr Kleins old formula as the ingredients remain the same etc. The only difference is the texture in the lotion. I tried to stop using the products and after a week my scalp started to ITCH with hair fall in the itching areas!

That's why I created this thread John to pass on the advice and options available for his existing clients at the time.

I offered to give Susan my pictures as she ASKED me. Plus you can go buy another formula from else where with the same ingredients I'm sure it will work. Also to add as good gesture she does give me extra discount. Again i never asked for NOTHING  besides the same products as Dr Klein. I live in the UK and here we only have one place that charge us 4 times the amount for 12.5% Belgravia Center, hence why I always buy from America!

I always pay for my products and I am willing to show proof of my recent order transaction. Again I have nothing to hide, but I can understand your false assumptions as it's hard to believe these days people do GOOD for FREE!

Either majority of the people I have helped over the years and even recently will know what other natural methods I have suggested. I have done tons of research over the years and I believe in HUMANITY, I believe in helping one another.

Remember it is easy to do BAD than GOOD, it is easy to LIE than to NOT LIE. I am not perfect John but I sure am no lier.

Good luck and I hope one day you will realise I am not lying in anyways, I will always speak for TRUTH as I believe in KARMA.

----------


## Jazz1

Guys also to add to the above before people assume I am selfish. I am the one who pushed Susan for the 10% discount for all forum members. So everyone is eligible for 10% discount, again John no one has thanked me for my efforts yet people are quick to think negative. So next time before you assume, dig deep to my old threads dating back to 2010 onwards even on the other hair forums.

On the other note I have pictures I will post up of regrowth from my work friend using her 15% mixture. Unfortunately most people who have regrowth do not wish to share their success pictures.

----------


## JohnMPB

> John it is easy to jump the bandwagon and assume I'm doing wrong than good. When I use to post on hairlosshelp people use to assume I was a sales rep for Dr Klein! 
> 
> My regrowth was from Dr Kleins formula, I do suffer from MPB and unfortunately at the time I only have one picture showing my MPB.
> 
> Yes I did also suffer from Alopecia Areata and yes there were few things in combination I used at the time that worked everything is mentioned in my previous threads if you care to check? So I am not hiding anything! See what I still use besides Susan's products, go check all my previous threads.
> 
> https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...ead?highlight=
> 
> This thread was created to HELP people, especially EX Dr Klein patients at the time of Dr Kleins death!
> ...


 Jazz,
Reread my post. I said "I also think it's deceiving how SHE is using these pictures." Very irresponsible of her to post ur pics and take full credit for your regrowth and not even make any mention that the results are for alopecia areata or that you're using a combination approach in terms of treatments. Imagine some young 19 year old sees those pics in hopes of achieving regrowth like that and spends hundreds trying to treat his mpb with her lotions and does not get regrowth?

Very misleading

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz,
> Reread my post. I said "I also think it's deceiving how SHE is using these pictures." Very irresponsible of her to post ur pics and take full credit for your regrowth and not even make any mention that the results are for alopecia areata or that you're using a combination approach in terms of treatments. Imagine some young 19 year old sees those pics in hopes of achieving regrowth like that and spends hundreds trying to treat his mpb with her lotions and does not get regrowth?
> 
> Very misleading


 Hey John you have a clear point, in the past I have had AA twice and on the first occasion I used 12.5% minoxidil that worked where as 5% did not work. That was the cream I purchased in the UK from the Belgravia clinic.

Now in regards to this mixture I have proof it works, plus I have pictures of my friend suffering from MPB at work and regaining full regrowth souly on the lotion mixture and Keto shampoo. I can post pictures if you could guide me to a free web posting photo site as photobucket has blocked them all for public use.

I just want to add aswell John that I am not the only one benefiting from the discount. I pushed hard for maximum discount for forum members and they do provide 10% discount. So I did my best as I wanted to help others and allow others to gain some benefit.

The issue for some people is they can not use internal finesteride due to severe side effects. Topical finesteride can cause side effects but to a less degree, this I can vouch from my own experience.

I totally understand your point John, but I wanted to make my point clear. I am here to help people, I always recommend different products and natural methods to each individual I can provide help whilst working full time it is hard to dedicate my time. I owe the forums big time as without the forums I would have lost my hair.

I hope your Hairloss is stabilised now, like mentioned before if there is anyway I can help you just hit me up.

----------


## JohnMPB

Jazz,
Months ago I asked you for photos of people you claimed were seeing results with these mixtures. Frankly, ur the only person I've seen with pictures growing hair with them. U said ur cousin had seen great results and you'd post pictures. I waited about a month and got nothing. Then you finally said ur cousin refused to send them and u don't have any other pics. You claimed many friends are seeing results, where is the proof?

Now u have another coworker who is seeing results and now u have pics again? Ok please post them. http://www.imagebam.com is free.

I'll be patiently waiting ur response

Thanks

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz,
> Months ago I asked you for photos of people you claimed were seeing results with these mixtures. Frankly, ur the only person I've seen with pictures growing hair with them. U said ur cousin had seen great results and you'd post pictures. I waited about a month and got nothing. Then you finally said ur cousin refused to send them and u don't have any other pics. You claimed many friends are seeing results, where is the proof?
> 
> Now u have another coworker who is seeing results and now u have pics again? Ok please post them. http://www.imagebam.com is free.
> 
> I'll be patiently waiting ur response
> 
> Thanks


 Hey John I can not post other people’s  pictures who sent me updates as they will not post pictures via themselves etc! As for my cousin I am sorry to say he is complete utter useless and has not sent me updates. 

This work colleague who asked me to provide him guidance. I mentioned the BIG3 as a first protocol and he was against taking internal pills. So I explained other methods and he was happy to try that route. I also have another 2 work colleagues who have agreed to take before/after pictures and let me use them for the forums to help other people. I have suggested different methods for the other two guys considering their Hairloss is more extreme. Mainly they have all decided on the lotion as I could not convince them regarding internal use on finesteride. They all read horror stories and were convinced for topical use (personally I believe it is a psychological factor).

The regime;

1.15% minoxidil with all additives and finesteride.
2. 5% Kirkland foam.
3. Revita 925ml shampoo.
4. Divine herbal oil non boosting.
5. Clean diet reduced carbs.
6. Derma roller 1mm slight pressure EOD without wounding.

This picture was taken is April 2017 prior to starting treatment:

 

Link:
http://www.imagebam.com/image/557936615541253

This picture was taken July 2017, the growth is slowly coming and his Hairloss has stabilised. Obviously the fine hair growth are slowly turning terminal over time. I will try asking him or taking a picture when I see him next at work. 

 

Link:
http://www.imagebam.com/image/54eb35615541333

----------


## doke

Hi Jazz that is very good regrowth have you seen anyone with the classic horseshoe mpb at front and on crown get regrowth, also as to the igrow i advise you to keep using that unless you really want a theradome and if you do i can get you the aberdeen clinics tel number.
With the 15% you minox you are using do you use it once or twice a day and has anyone had any side affects.

----------


## doke

Forgot to ask how much would  murrey clinics with the 10% discount be for 3 months 15% formula jazz as you may know i have used 5% minox with progestorone bought in uk from compounding  chemist.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz that is very good regrowth have you seen anyone with the classic horseshoe mpb at front and on crown get regrowth, also as to the igrow i advise you to keep using that unless you really want a theradome and if you do i can get you the aberdeen clinics tel number.
> With the 15% you minox you are using do you use it once or twice a day and has anyone had any side affects.


 Hey Doke in regards to any treatment I want to clarify everyone responds in a different manner. I just try my best to help individual people based on my own experience and research through trial and errror these past 8 years.

Yes the combination of different methods has worked on some guys with the horseshoe MPB but as mentioned above they themselves have to post on the forums. As each person I dedicate my time the only thing I ask in return is HELP other people via the forums etc.

I use 15% in conjunction with 5%, once per day as 1ml of 0.1% finesteride is equivalent of 1mg.

I might invest in the Theradome next year as seems more convenient compared to the Igrow plug/play system.

----------


## Jazz1

> Forgot to ask how much would  murrey clinics with the 10% discount be for 3 months 15% formula jazz as you may know i have used 5% minox with progestorone bought in uk from compounding  chemist.


 Hey Doke everything was posted in this thread below. You will need to purchase 3 bottles to be eligible for 10% discount. Anytime you place an order just mention your a member on the Hairloss forums. 15% with all additives is $89 and that one bottle at 1ml per day will last 2 months. They sell different combination at different prices.

https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...%21?highlight=

----------


## doke

Hi Jazz i contacted the murrey pharmacy and they said i could have the 10% off of 3 months minoxidil and i did say i wanted the Dr Klines formula ingredience and they suggested 15% minoxidil with azelaic acid and finasteride no mention of progestorone as i want an all in one.
Now this they say is $89 a bottle without the consultation price? then the treatment on its own would be for 3 months supply $240 so with 10% off about £182 uk without postage costs works out expensive.
And with minoxidil available at 15% with aa you can buy a lot cheaper if you can find a uk compounding pharmacy but the doctors prescription would still be required.
So i also do not like aa as it tends to make minoxidil like glue on your hair and there is no proof its a good anti dht i think ru or the cosmo topical when available will be better or even progestorone which i can get in uk.

----------


## JohnMPB

You came through with some pics. Very cool.

That is good regrowth/thickening your work colleague has gotten.

How old is he? How often is he using minox foam and revita? Any reason why u had him double up on strong 15% minox and 5% foam?

Do u have any pics of hairline regrowth as many move up to high concentration minox to address hairline issues. I know Belgravia makes their 12.5% cream specifically for hairline problems.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz i contacted the murrey pharmacy and they said i could have the 10% off of 3 months minoxidil and i did say i wanted the Dr Klines formula ingredience and they suggested 15% minoxidil with azelaic acid and finasteride no mention of progestorone as i want an all in one.
> Now this they say is $89 a bottle without the consultation price? then the treatment on its own would be for 3 months supply $240 so with 10% off about £182 uk without postage costs works out expensive.
> And with minoxidil available at 15% with aa you can buy a lot cheaper if you can find a uk compounding pharmacy but the doctors prescription would still be required.
> So i also do not like aa as it tends to make minoxidil like glue on your hair and there is no proof its a good anti dht i think ru or the cosmo topical when available will be better or even progestorone which i can get in uk.


 Hey Doke just to clarify 3 months is not $240, one bottle for 15% minoxidil is $89 you can pick/choose in that set price maximum or minimum additives.

One bottle will last you 2 months at 1ml per day, so 3 bottles will last you 6 months not 3 months. I purchase from The Belgravia clinic and trust me 12.5% with AA is not cheap for a years supply, the America stuff works out so much cheaper and better in regards to additives.

What do you currently use? Any pictures of your Hairloss?

----------


## Jazz1

> You came through with some pics. Very cool.
> 
> That is good regrowth/thickening your work colleague has gotten.
> 
> How old is he? How often is he using minox foam and revita? Any reason why u had him double up on strong 15% minox and 5% foam?
> 
> Do u have any pics of hairline regrowth as many move up to high concentration minox to address hairline issues. I know Belgravia makes their 12.5% cream specifically for hairline problems.


 Hey John I think he is around mid 30’s I work in a big section and he is fairly new. In regards to this combination I had copied this method when I first went to The Belgravia clinic in the UK, they tend to combine 5% with 12.5% hence their success rate. So based on my own knowledge/research I use the combination.

That’s why the 15% is better for the hairline growth, as 5% for the whole scalp and mainly target the 15% around the frontal region. 

I do have another 2 work colleagues which I have personally taken their scalp Hairloss pictures. I will update IF/when they obtain regrowth as they have recently started Susan’s lotions. 

I will keep you guys posted, as for the rest of the people I have helped John unfortunately not everyone is determined to post pictures or help anyone.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey John I think he is around mid 30’s I work in a big section and he is fairly new. In regards to this combination I had copied this method when I first went to The Belgravia clinic in the UK, they tend to combine 5% with 12.5% hence their success rate. So based on my own knowledge/research I use the combination.
> 
> That’s why the 15% is better for the hairline growth, as 5% for the whole scalp and mainly target the 15% around the frontal region. 
> 
> I do have another 2 work colleagues which I have personally taken their scalp Hairloss pictures. I will update IF/when they obtain regrowth as they have recently started Susan’s lotions. 
> 
> I will keep you guys posted, as for the rest of the people I have helped John unfortunately not everyone is determined to post pictures or help anyone.


 How often did u instruct him to use minox foam and the 15% minox cream?
Does he use revita daily?

Does the tretinoin irritate ur scalp?

If I see convincing hairline regrowth I'll even think about giving it a shot.

----------


## Jazz1

> How often did u instruct him to use minox foam and the 15% minox cream?
> Does he use revita daily?
> 
> Does the tretinoin irritate ur scalp?
> 
> If I see convincing hairline regrowth I'll even think about giving it a shot.


 
The first question for you I would ask is have you stabalized your Hairloss? What do you currently use etc?

He uses Revita 925ml bottle-3 times per week, where as my other colleague use Revita everyday and combines 2% nizoral 3 times per week. 

He uses 5% morning and waits 10 minutes before applying Susan’s mixture.
Than uses 5% before bed and applies the hair oils half hour later. That’s only on the days he has to use the hair oil. Plus he derma rolls every other day only at night. So derma rolling first than applies the 5%. I have derma roller when applying the 15% and that did give me a head rush! Hence I only recommend derma rolling than using the 5%.

Tretinoin at first did irritate my scalp as I only use this around the frontal region. After about 2 months this subsided and I no longer have an irritated scalp. Again not everyone has had an irritated scalp from Tretinoin.

Aaron on here did have hairline growth, although he himself will not post pictures! As for the other two work colleagues we will have to wait and see. Unfortunately I can not help you with the rest as they themselves are not willing to post pictures!

----------


## JohnMPB

> The first question for you I would ask is have you stabalized your Hairloss? What do you currently use etc?
> 
> He uses Revita 925ml bottle-3 times per week, where as my other colleague use Revita everyday and combines 2% nizoral 3 times per week. 
> 
> He uses 5% morning and waits 10 minutes before applying Susan’s mixture.
> Than uses 5% before bed and applies the hair oils half hour later. That’s only on the days he has to use the hair oil. Plus he derma rolls every other day only at night. So derma rolling first than applies the 5%. I have derma roller when applying the 15% and that did give me a head rush! Hence I only recommend derma rolling than using the 5%.
> 
> Tretinoin at first did irritate my scalp as I only use this around the frontal region. After about 2 months this subsided and I no longer have an irritated scalp. Again not everyone has had an irritated scalp from Tretinoin.
> 
> Aaron on here did have hairline growth, although he himself will not post pictures! As for the other two work colleagues we will have to wait and see. Unfortunately I can not help you with the rest as they themselves are not willing to post pictures!


 No currently my loss is not stabilized. I've been on fin for the last 11 years. I'd say the last 6 years I've been steady losing. I was at a horrible job for 7 years that caused me lots of stress/anxiety/depression and this definitely sped up my loss. I finally got to courage to leave and now I'm trying to find ways to stop and/or regrow my hair. Most of my loss is at the front/temples. Here's what I've been using:

Fin: 11+ years
Min foam: 9+ years
Niz: 12+ years
Copper peptides (tricomin now folligen): 8+ years
Various shampoos: coal tar, tea tree oil, piroctone olamine

I've just added in dut 3x a week to see if this will make a difference.

I used revita for a few months. I still have the huge pump bottle but stopped. It has silicones and I read that can interfere with absorption of minox. The company also told me it only contains .25% keto.

----------


## Jazz1

> No currently my loss is not stabilized. I've been on fin for the last 11 years. I'd say the last 6 years I've been steady losing. I was at a horrible job for 7 years that caused me lots of stress/anxiety/depression and this definitely sped up my loss. I finally got to courage to leave and now I'm trying to find ways to stop and/or regrow my hair. Most of my loss is at the front/temples. Here's what I've been using:
> 
> Fin: 11+ years
> Min foam: 9+ years
> Niz: 12+ years
> Copper peptides (tricomin now folligen): 8+ years
> Various shampoos: coal tar, tea tree oil, piroctone olamine
> 
> I've just added in dut 3x a week to see if this will make a difference.
> ...


 Hey I might be able to recommend few products that might help you. 

DUT is first protocol after finesteride, you still have few options like RU58841 or CB-03-01. 

I will let you know by tomorrow.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey I might be able to recommend few products that might help you. 
> 
> DUT is first protocol after finesteride, you still have few options like RU58841 or CB-03-01. 
> 
> I will let you know by tomorrow.


 Looking forward to it...

----------


## Jazz1

> Looking forward to it...


 Right, before I try recommending few products or even you considering the 15% mixture.

How is your Hairloss currently on DUT stabalized? How’s your stress levels now? Next time take Melatonin ideally 3mg to help with anxiety/stress.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Right, before I try recommending few products or even you considering the 15% mixture.
> 
> How is your Hairloss currently on DUT stabalized? How’s your stress levels now? Next time take Melatonin ideally 3mg to help with anxiety/stress.


 I started taking pics the other month as I ramped up to dut 3x a week with fin In between. Will take pics again in a few weeks to compare.

Anxiety and stress is better but not 100% ideal. How do u use melatonin? Just before sleep? Does it have any effect on stress/anxiety besides helping with better sleep? Is it safe for long term?

----------


## k9gatton

> No currently my loss is not stabilized. I've been on fin for the last 11 years. I'd say the last 6 years I've been steady losing. I was at a horrible job for 7 years that caused me lots of stress/anxiety/depression and this definitely sped up my loss. I finally got to courage to leave and now I'm trying to find ways to stop and/or regrow my hair. Most of my loss is at the front/temples. Here's what I've been using:


 I hear you. Having a stressful job does add to hair loss.

For my experience, it wasn't until I added Progesterone with the Finasteride when my hair loss stopped.

I raised the dosage on one medication I'm taking. 

I'm only getting vertex regrowth, that's it. It sucks. My hairline is still a Norwood three hairline. My density on top though, is starting to look _SEMI_ normal.

----------


## k9gatton

> the only ppl who have had success with susans lotion from murray ave are kgatton, and jazz, and their hairloss is not that bad. we all wish we had the set of hair they did. so i dont even think its a realistic claim.


 No offense cardib, but my hairline looks like shit. If you saw it, you wouldn't be saying that.

It's true Susan's formula helped my vertex. As for my hairline, it didn't do anything.

----------


## JohnMPB

Paging jazz

----------


## Jazz1

> I started taking pics the other month as I ramped up to dut 3x a week with fin In between. Will take pics again in a few weeks to compare.
> 
> Anxiety and stress is better but not 100% ideal. How do u use melatonin? Just before sleep? Does it have any effect on stress/anxiety besides helping with better sleep? Is it safe for long term?


 Ok as the first steps you need to determine before trying any 15% mixtures has your Hairloss been stabalized. I can suggest few things to add within the regime but again, you need to determine first if your Hairloss has stabalized with DUT.

In regards to melatonin the stuff is amazing hands down. I suffer from sleep disorder and anxiety, I can assure you it does help etc. As with anything too much may have some side effects, natural occurring compound within the body, I would say 3mg is fine, thats my opinion. Also their is a guy on the other forums who started to regrow some hair whilst using melatonin 3mg.

----------


## JohnMPB

Jazz
I thought u liked helping people. What happened?

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz
> I thought u liked helping people. What happened?


 What do you mean? I still do try my best to help people with my own knowledge and research. Also to add I work shifts and can get tied down with work. I always promised I will try my best to help people.

So I do not understand your statement?

----------


## JohnMPB

> What do you mean? I still do try my best to help people with my own knowledge and research. Also to add I work shifts and can get tied down with work. I always promised I will try my best to help people.
> 
> So I do not understand your statement?


 
My bad. Somehow I missed ur post on the 26th.

So if loss has stabilized u basically recommend 15%. Do u recommend all the additives? I'm a fairly hairy guy as is, in ur experience will it increase facial/body hair? Do u recommend anything else once the loss has stabilized besides high strength minox? 

On ur recommendation I've bought some melatonin. I have 3mg and .5 mg pills. How often do u use them?

Thanks jazz

----------


## Jazz1

> My bad. Somehow I missed ur post on the 26th.
> 
> So if loss has stabilized u basically recommend 15%. Do u recommend all the additives? I'm a fairly hairy guy as is, in ur experience will it increase facial/body hair? Do u recommend anything else once the loss has stabilized besides high strength minox? 
> 
> On ur recommendation I've bought some melatonin. I have 3mg and .5 mg pills. How often do u use them?
> 
> Thanks jazz


 
Hey John before you spend more money and before I recommend any other additional treatments I want to know has your Hairloss stabalized on DUT? Yes I do recommend adding all additives and again I can also suggest few add on products fairly cheap to add within the regime.

There’s no point adding extra products if finesteride/dutasteride is not halting your Hairloss. As the main purpose of trying to regrow hair with 15% plus derma roller etc is if the Hairloss has stabalized.

The melatonin at 3mg is fine, I would not use anything over as that becomes very strong! Also try not to use it daily, ideally when you have sleep issues or stress issues. Susan does topical melatonin, I discarded topical melatonin as I already use the 15% and her Acetyl Glutathione mixture was too much for me to use within one day! I just use the Acetyl glutathione every other day.

Depending upon your Hairloss stabalizing, these are the add on I use;

15% mixture,
2% topical progesterone lotion 3 times per week,
Divine herbal oils,
Derma roller, 1mm every other day, 1.5mm once per week for wounding,
OGV method twice per week.

Then to add a good diet, high alkaline, juicing with added turmeric, flax seeds, pumpkin seeds, beetroot, kale, spinach, broccoli, carrots, ginger, garlic etc.

Try to avoid foods high in sugar, bread/wheat etc, a good clean diet can also help contribute to DHT levels.

----------


## JohnMPB

> Hey John before you spend more money and before I recommend any other additional treatments I want to know has your Hairloss stabalized on DUT? Yes I do recommend adding all additives and again I can also suggest few add on products fairly cheap to add within the regime.
> 
> There’s no point adding extra products if finesteride/dutasteride is not halting your Hairloss. As the main purpose of trying to regrow hair with 15% plus derma roller etc is if the Hairloss has stabalized.
> 
> The melatonin at 3mg is fine, I would not use anything over as that becomes very strong! Also try not to use it daily, ideally when you have sleep issues or stress issues. Susan does topical melatonin, I discarded topical melatonin as I already use the 15% and her Acetyl Glutathione mixture was too much for me to use within one day! I just use the Acetyl glutathione every other day.
> 
> Depending upon your Hairloss stabalizing, these are the add on I use;
> 
> 15% mixture,
> ...


 I'm tracking with monthly pictures so hopefully I will know by 6 months or a year.

What is the acetyl gluthothione good for? This is the first I heard about it and I don't think medical wellness center offers a prescription for it.

Any reason behind derma rolling so often? I think the official Indian/Dhurat study only did it once a week? Do u still apply high strength minox after rolling/wounding?

I didn't know Susan offers topical progesterone. Again I didn't see an rx for it on medical wellness center site. Doesn't the 15% already contain progesterone? Is this dangerous if it goes systemic for males?

Also, what is OGV method? I googled it and couldn't find anything.

Great health/nutrition advice btw. Do u workout? Have any advice on how to treat shoulder tendinitis?

Thanks jazz

----------


## Jazz1

Hey John give me few days reply as I’m flying out on holiday.

----------


## JohnMPB

Jazz, hello?

----------


## Jazz1

I am in India for one week holiday WiFi restricted, so I will reply when I’m back  :Smile: .

----------


## Jazz1

> I'm tracking with monthly pictures so hopefully I will know by 6 months or a year.
> 
> What is the acetyl gluthothione good for? This is the first I heard about it and I don't think medical wellness center offers a prescription for it.
> 
> Any reason behind derma rolling so often? I think the official Indian/Dhurat study only did it once a week? Do u still apply high strength minox after rolling/wounding?
> 
> I didn't know Susan offers topical progesterone. Again I didn't see an rx for it on medical wellness center site. Doesn't the 15% already contain progesterone? Is this dangerous if it goes systemic for males?
> 
> Also, what is OGV method? I googled it and couldn't find anything.
> ...


 Right I have some WiFi in this small village area. The funny part majority of the guys in India are not balding! Even the woman have thick long hair and yet in the western society woman/men bald. I have noticed the food is less contaminated plus the water. The milk is taken direct from the cow and the chicken is cut fresh without any hormone injection. Alot of the guys are blaming the water in the west when they travelled down to the UK they noticed an increase in shedding. Plus some guys I work with who have migrated to the UK are balding, yet when they were living in India the did not suffer Hairloss/MPB.

Right back to your questions, I would wait and see on your shedding/Hairloss if DUT has managed to halt your hair shedding/loss. The only other powerful methods beside Finesteride/Dutasteride is RU-58841 or CB-03-01.

Susan mentioned to me about her range of Acetyl Glutathione and the benefits as a powerful antioxidant. I have read studies in relation to MPB and some studies seem promising. I use it every other day, you do not need a prescription for it and Susan sells it with added biotin and vitamin E. As per before you can see the benefits of melatonin for hair growth.

I read several studies in regards to derma rolling and started with 1mm every other day plus 1.5mm for wounding. Obviously my Hairloss is intact so the only place I could test my results were on the forehead below the hairline/temples. After a few months I had a line of new longish vellus hairs in the line I derma rolled etc. So in theory the stuff 100% works, I only used it at night and then applied the 5% straight after derma rolling as applying the 15% straight after would give me a head rush/headache etc.

Progesterone is safe to use as you can obtain it from most cream/face products etc. Males/Females both produce progesterone and yes I decided to use the extra lotion based 2% conditioner alongside the added small percentage of 0.25% in her 15% lotion. The reason I added the conditioner this year was because a member on here saw extra results whilst he was already on finesteride. Considering it was fairly cheap to add I decided to add this as I never used a conditioner and tend to wash my hair twice per day although I do oil my scalp daily at night.

OGV method is Onion-Garlic-Apple Cider Vinegar method. You can YouTube OGV Hairloss and will see some videos especially one guy who regrew his hair. I was very interested in this method as Garlic kills any bacteria and onion has high Sulphur which is great for hair growth.   

I use to work out a lot but due to life circumstances I have been lazy. Diet is a key point to healing your body internally. As for shoulder tendinitis you could YouTube again several methods are provided on YouTube by great physicians/PT instructors show to heal shoulder injuries with certain exercise etc.

I hope that answers your questions, anything else  :Smile: .

----------


## JohnMPB

Thanks for the thorough response Jazz. The 2% conditioner is rx only? Will medicalwellnesscenter provide an rx? I will track and see how it goes. Then I'll decide where I can make extra additions. Have fun on your trip

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks for the thorough response Jazz. The 2% conditioner is rx only? Will medicalwellnesscenter provide an rx? I will track and see how it goes. Then I'll decide where I can make extra additions. Have fun on your trip


 Hey I am pretty sure it is NON RX, again do not quote me. Yes they will provide an RX for all prescription medication. Susan will not sell any medication without an RX, so I’m not sure if an RX is required for 2% progesterone. I will find out for you?

----------


## Jazz1

Hey John I got an email back from the pharamacist who works with Susan.

Quote:

“You do not need a prescription for the 2% progesterone leave-in.

Sometimes progesterone can be tricky with shipping to other countries (other than UK) because the prescription status varies between countries – if it is prescription in the country the client resides in we cannot legally send it without a prescription, also we cannot send it to countries who have customs restrictions on hormones or OTC pharmaceuticals.

Hope this helps!”

As mentioned before in the UK you can purchase over the counter steroids and progesterone face creams online without prescription. So you would need to check with them direct depending on your country.

----------


## JohnMPB

Thanks jazz, I appreciate it

----------


## Jazz1

> Thanks jazz, I appreciate it


 No worries, anything else? My best advice see how your Hairloss progresses within next 6 months on DUT, adding progesterone is fairly cheap so maybe give it a try and see if that would help alongside your regime.

Otherwise you would probably need more powerful compounds like RU58841 or CB-03-01.

----------


## Jazz1

Bump, anyone been using progesterone lotion?

----------


## Plan C

Hi Jazz,

Long time no speak. I am still using Susan's 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid 1.5%, finasteride 0.1%, retinoic acid 0.025%, progesterone 0.25%, hydrocortisone 0.1% and biotin 3%) every other day.

She has said in the past that the bottles remain good for 6 months. Do you agree?

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz,
> 
> Long time no speak. I am still using Susan's 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid 1.5%, finasteride 0.1%, retinoic acid 0.025%, progesterone 0.25%, hydrocortisone 0.1% and biotin 3%) every other day.
> 
> She has said in the past that the bottles remain good for 6 months. Do you agree?


 Hey mate how is it going? I always keep my bottles in the fridge. That is correct as she has had them tested for expiry of 6 months, thats why I buy 3 every time I order.

----------


## k9gatton

Progesterone in hair conditioner is a bunch of S**T. That doesn't work. So, I wouldn't believe anybody who says otherwise.

If you are going to get something from Medical Wellness Center, make sure that it is Doctor prescribed. I wouldn't get things directly at the pharmacy. Remember the source who is telling you to do that.

----------


## k9gatton

Both Promox and Medical Wellness Center have good prescribed medications you can take.

I should know. Not sure why this thread is saying Promox is gone, they're definitely not.

----------


## Jazz1

> Both Promox and Medical Wellness Center have good prescribed medications you can take.
> 
> I should know. Not sure why this thread is saying Promox is gone, they're definitely not.


 This thread was created at the time Dr Klein passed away. I was an EX Dr Klein patient for years until his EX wife Dorrie and her husband Tony who worked at Dr Kleins clinic decided to scrap promox and stopped selling the products at the time.

Thats when I found Murray Avenue Apothecary, also to add Promox is no longer shipped international at this current time, so patients like me and other international clients use The Medical Wellnes Center.

----------


## Plan C

> Both Promox and Medical Wellness Center have good prescribed medications you can take.
> 
> I should know. Not sure why this thread is saying Promox is gone, they're definitely not.


 I thought that Promox was dead and MWC just did prescriptions? What's the highest % minoxidil that they do as a liquid solution?

----------


## k9gatton

Promox sells 15%, but they would probably do higher if you asked them to (and the doctor approved it).

That said, I didn't think Murray did their 30% scripted product to people living outside the United States? That's news to me. 

I purchase non hair related medication, from MedicalWellnessCenter.com.

----------


## Plan C

> This thread was created at the time Dr Klein passed away. I was an EX Dr Klein patient for years until his EX wife Dorrie and her husband Tony who worked at Dr Kleins clinic decided to scrap promox and stopped selling the products at the time.
> 
> Thats when I found Murray Avenue Apothecary, also to add Promox is no longer shipped international at this current time, so patients like me and other international clients use The Medical Wellnes Center.


 Jazz - thanks for getting back to me. It's good to hear from you.

I like the 15% lotion, but if I use too much it makes me feel grotty and tired the next day, and I find it difficult to apply as my hair is long.

I wonder if Susan is able to produce the formula as a spray/liquid solution?

----------


## Plan C

> Promox sells 15%, but they would probably do higher if you asked them to (and the doctor approved it).
> 
> That said, I didn't think Murray did their 30% scripted product to people living outside the United States? That's news to me. 
> 
> I purchase non hair related medication, from MedicalWellnessCenter.com.


 I like the look of the Promox 10% spray but it doesn't appear that they ship outside of the US.

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz - thanks for getting back to me. It's good to hear from you.
> 
> I like the 15% lotion, but if I use too much it makes me feel grotty and tired the next day, and I find it difficult to apply as my hair is long.
> 
> I wonder if Susan is able to produce the formula as a spray/liquid solution?


 Hey I am well mate, always busy working and hectic life. In regards to the lotion I measured the pump, as mentioned before 6 squirts will be 1ml. 1ml is the recommended dosage, so only use 6 squirts. Also to add I use mine in the morning as it is 15%.

My hair is currently long and I know what you mean. I part my hair with a comb and create a scalp line, then I apply the lotion directly on the scalp and massage for a couple seconds, try this method.

----------


## k9gatton

> Well fingers crossed and it's better for you as they based in US where I'm in the uk, that's what I really want aswell they already formulate the lotion and cream side of things. But the pharmacist is 100% confident she can formulate the spray, they use proper lab equipment il post full details once they confirm everything. Right now I need to post them the products I have on Tuesday, luckily I have some 10% DMI prescription spray left. I'm also trying to make sure they charge us the same price we payed Dr Klein, I'm going to tell them to lower cost as possible so all his ex patients can give them the business and we can carry on getting what we use currently.
> 
> I have given up on Dorrie at Dr kleins office, I been feeling low since he passed away, I been messaging Dorrie to help find a doctor and I had no luck! Also the fact they only selling 5% bloody minxodiol means us old patients could lose ground as some of us have been using high grade stuff for years!


 You're just getting money off these people. Let me say this, your name is still on the medicalwellnesscenter list. I don't believe you at all. And Regenere sells everywhere in the United States.

You are such a con artist.

They can get ******* from Canada if they're interested in that.

----------


## k9gatton

For people that are reading these posts, If you live in the UK, there are a LOT more options
for getting high Minoxidil than the United States. There's MinoxidilKing, and lots of others.

I wouldn't really listen to what is being said here. Also, Regenere DOES sell Promox, and has
been doing so for some time.

----------


## Jazz1

> You're just getting money off these people. Let me say this, your name is still on the medicalwellnesscenter list. I don't believe you at all. And Regenere sells everywhere in the United States.
> 
> You are such a con artist.
> 
> They can get ******* from Canada if they're interested in that.


 Thats fine I respect your views, as mentioned before if you care to check all threads and posts dating back to 2012, plus when Dr Klein passed away you will understand the reason behind my threads and posts. I always praised Dr Klein for years until he passed away.

In regards to my name being placed on their website, I never asked for this and neither do I make money or gain any monetary needs from any company. I pay for my products and I am more than happy to proof. As mentioned I have nothing to prove to you or anyone as I help people from my heart not for money needs like most people in this world.

----------


## Jazz1

> For people that are reading these posts, If you live in the UK, there are a LOT more options
> for getting high Minoxidil than the United States. There's MinoxidilKing, and lots of others.
> 
> I wouldn't really listen to what is being said here. Also, Regenere DOES sell Promox, and has
> been doing so for some time.


 
This is fantastic do they also contain finesteride?

----------


## Jazz1

> For people that are reading these posts, If you live in the UK, there are a LOT more options
> for getting high Minoxidil than the United States. There's MinoxidilKing, and lots of others.
> 
> I wouldn't really listen to what is being said here. Also, Regenere DOES sell Promox, and has
> been doing so for some time.


 Right to add can you provide us forum members that are based in the U.K. with an alternative then? Considering your bashing me for trying to help everyone I will let you help everyone now as you seem so smart.

We U.K. patients want the same topical formula, I do not want a simple based 15% minoxidil without any additives, as the above mentioned site does not provide any DHT or Anti androgen blockers in their formula.

15% minoxidil 
5% azelaic acid
0.1% finesteride 
0.25% progesterone 
0.025% tretinoin
0.1% hydrocortisone.


Hope you can help us now, as you seem very smart  :Smile: . To add guys minoxidil alone regardless what Strenght will not prevent Hairloss, unless combined with DHT blockers or Anti androgen blockers.

----------


## k9gatton

> I like the look of the Promox 10% spray but it doesn't appear that they ship outside of the US.


 They don't.

If you live in Europe, there are a lot of other high Minoxidil sellers. Quite a lot, actually.

----------


## Plan C

> Right to add can you provide us forum members that are based in the U.K. with an alternative then? Considering your bashing me for trying to help everyone I will let you help everyone now as you seem so smart.
> 
> We U.K. patients want the same topical formula, I do not want a simple based 15% minoxidil without any additives, as the above mentioned site does not provide any DHT or Anti androgen blockers in their formula.
> 
> 15% minoxidil 
> 5% azelaic acid
> 0.1% finesteride 
> 0.25% progesterone 
> 0.025% tretinoin
> ...


 Jazz - just applied for a new prescription with MWC. I noticed that, as per your quoted message, Susan's 15% formula now contains azelaic acid 5% rather than 1.5% and no biotin 3%? Any idea why?

Thanks for your ongoing help and apologies that my posts seem to have earned you a bit of a bashing!

----------


## Jazz1

> Jazz - just applied for a new prescription with MWC. I noticed that, as per your quoted message, Susan's 15% formula now contains azelaic acid 5% rather than 1.5% and no biotin 3%? Any idea why?
> 
> Thanks for your ongoing help and apologies that my posts seem to have earned you a bit of a bashing!


 Hey no worries, I can understand certain people being fustrated as mentioned before I have nothing to prove to anyone. I do not get paid a single penny, I mentioned before in this post the only monetary gains is slight extra discount and I never asked MWC to publish my name on their site, as mentioned as good gesture they have given me extra discount!. 

Lets rephrase when Dr Klein passed away I was the one who searched and set this up for the members to help everyone along with myself. People who panicked were left stranded without 15% mixture! Also to add the fact Murray Avenue at the time was the only place providing the mixture when Dr Klein passed away. I was the one who set up and pushed Murray Avenue to provide the forum members with 10% discount on 3 bottles purchased.

I have nothing to hide and as mentioned I am more than happy to post my receipts as I pay for my products, I truly enjoy helping members and to the people who know me, you know exactly my nature. 

Lets also add the members who have offered to PayPal me GIFT money for helping them! Never once have I taken a single penny for helping anyone and I never will as thats not my nature!

Right back on topic, I also added 5% azelaic acid to my mixture from 1.5%, as Dr Lee used 5% in his mixtures.

The biotin was never added to the minoxidil mixtures? I always purchased their Acetyl Glutathione/Biotin/Vitamin E mixture.

I would consider a complete diet remape, have a good liquid multi vitamin/mineral formula, Natures Alive brand is the one I use. Also cut down on acidic foods, as high acidic foods upregulate type 2 DHT in the scalp. I am not claiming food will cure your Hairloss, it will sure help along side Finasteride and work alongside your bodies chemistry.


What is you full regime and current state of your Hairloss? Maybe I might be able to suggest extra additional products to add in your regiment, not too expensive to help your Hairloss.

----------


## Plan C

> Hey no worries, I can understand certain people being fustrated as mentioned before I have nothing to prove to anyone. I do not get paid a single penny, I mentioned before in this post the only monetary gains is slight extra discount and I never asked MWC to publish my name on their site, as mentioned as good gesture they have given me extra discount!. 
> 
> Lets rephrase when Dr Klein passed away I was the one who searched and set this up for the members to help everyone along with myself. People who panicked were left stranded without 15% mixture! Also to add the fact Murray Avenue at the time was the only place providing the mixture when Dr Klein passed away. I was the one who set up and pushed Murray Avenue to provide the forum members with 10% discount on 3 bottles purchased.
> 
> I have nothing to hide and as mentioned I am more than happy to post my receipts as I pay for my products, I truly enjoy helping members and to the people who know me, you know exactly my nature. 
> 
> Lets also add the members who have offered to PayPal me GIFT money for helping them! Never once have I taken a single penny for helping anyone and I never will as thats not my nature!
> 
> Right back on topic, I also added 5% azelaic acid to my mixture from 1.5%, as Dr Lee used 5% in his mixtures.
> ...


 Hi Jazz,

Mine definitely contains 3% biotin (looking at the formula on the bottle as I type). Do you think that I should continue to request that they include it?

Up until last week, I was using 5% RU58441 and Susan's 15% minoxidil on alternate days, as well as dut every day. This has maintained excellent density but has not quite stopped the receding at my temples.

I'm now trying 7.5% RU58441 and Susan's 15% minoxidil every day. I'm seriously considering switching dut for fin, due to an issue it is causing 'downstairs', which I'll cover in a separate thread.

----------


## Jazz1

Hey I will reply tonight as I am heading to work now, what other products besides the above do you use? Shampoo? Oils? What other additives are added in your 15% from Susan?

----------


## k9gatton

> Thats fine I respect your views, as mentioned before if you care to check all threads and posts dating back to 2012, plus when Dr Klein passed away you will understand the reason behind my threads and posts. I always praised Dr Klein for years until he passed away.
> 
> In regards to my name being placed on their website, I never asked for this and neither do I make money or gain any monetary needs from any company. I pay for my products and I am more than happy to proof. As mentioned I have nothing to prove to you or anyone as I help people from my heart not for money needs like most people in this world.


 Yeah right. You don't make money off of it, but your name is on their website as to who referred you. You are so full of crap. Nobody believes you.

----------


## Jazz1

> Hi Jazz,
> 
> Mine definitely contains 3% biotin (looking at the formula on the bottle as I type). Do you think that I should continue to request that they include it?
> 
> Up until last week, I was using 5% RU58441 and Susan's 15% minoxidil on alternate days, as well as dut every day. This has maintained excellent density but has not quite stopped the receding at my temples.
> 
> I'm now trying 7.5% RU58441 and Susan's 15% minoxidil every day. I'm seriously considering switching dut for fin, due to an issue it is causing 'downstairs', which I'll cover in a separate thread.


 Hey I would request keeping biotin at no additional request, be carefully to add multi vitamin and not too much biotin as you might break out in cystic acne if you deplete pantothenic acid but taking too much biotin, keep it balanced.

What have you added in Sudans 15% mixture as I always mentioned previously regardless of high grade minoxidil it will not do much if your not blocking the DHT cause.

I always cleanse my scalp daily with Dawn and then I use a mixture of different shampoo twice per day. I use kETACONAZOLE based and PIROCTONE OLAMINE. I also oils my scalp every other day considering Im stripping my scalp clean. I would cos order checking your diet and also your tap water/drinking water.

A good website regarding diet scalp calcification, whilst I do not advocate diet curing Hairloss, it can possibly help with the body chemistry regarding DHT and Androgen regulators.

Whats your full regime and products with all additives and ingredients?

----------


## Jazz1

> Yeah right. You don't make money off of it, but your name is on their website as to who referred you. You are so full of crap. Nobody believes you.


 Hey thank you for your input view, I will take your response as a compliment as I know 100% I do not get paid I work full time in the U.K. and I know my heart. As mentioned dig my name on all forums and threads/posts you will seek the answers. I am more than happy to provide proof of my payment receipts as I have nothing to hide. 

Thats like saying SPEX is getting paid because I purchased a packet of Wellman Hairfollic recently from his threads and website via this forum, you dont see me bashing the guy. Instead I praise him for his contribution regardless if he is getting paid or not, the product contains a good source of nutrients for my hair.

So good luck I do not have time for negative comments, as Im here to help anyone who needs help with my knowledge. I work full time I pay for my products. I was given good gesture discount due to my honest nature and I also set up good discount for forum members, so be gratefully rather than spiteful not everyone is out their to make money. Their are genuine people who truly want to help people in this world without expecting a penny in return.

----------


## Plan C

> Hey I would request keeping biotin at no additional request, be carefully to add multi vitamin and not too much biotin as you might break out in cystic acne if you deplete pantothenic acid but taking too much biotin, keep it balanced.
> 
> What have you added in Sudans 15% mixture as I always mentioned previously regardless of high grade minoxidil it will not do much if your not blocking the DHT cause.
> 
> I always cleanse my scalp daily with Dawn and then I use a mixture of different shampoo twice per day. I use kETACONAZOLE based and PIROCTONE OLAMINE. I also oils my scalp every other day considering Im stripping my scalp clean. I would cos order checking your diet and also your tap water/drinking water.
> 
> A good website regarding diet scalp calcification, whilst I do not advocate diet curing Hairloss, it can possibly help with the body chemistry regarding DHT and Androgen regulators.
> 
> Whats your full regime and products with all additives and ingredients?


 Hi,

So up until recently I was using:
- 0.5mg dutasteride every day
- 85mg RU58841 in 0.5ml PG & 1.25ml ethanol on alternate days
- 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid 1.5%, finasteride 0.1%, retinoic acid 0.025%, progesterone 0.25%, hydrocortisone 0.1% and biotin 3%) on alternate days

For the past few weeks, I've changed to:
- 0.5mg dutasteride every day (might switch to finasteride when I've run out)
- 75mg RU58841 in 0.3ml PG & 0.7ml ethanol every day
- 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid 1.5%, finasteride 0.1%, retinoic acid 0.025%, progesterone 0.25%, hydrocortisone 0.1% and biotin 3%) every day

The only shampoo I use is Jason Thin to Thick, which is biotin-rich and SLS-free. I take a multivitamin, omega 3 and bacopa monnieri as supplements.

Funnily enough, since I've switched to using the minoxidil compound every day, I've broken out in acne (which is very unusual for me). Looks as though I've messed up my pantothenic acid levels, as you predicted.

I bought more minoxidil from Susan yesterday with the standard formula, i.e. 5% azelaic acid rather than 1.5% and no biotin. Apparently, she stopped including biotin as it made the compound unstable and too viscous.

My view is that I wasn't benefiitting from the RU or minoxidil by using them on alternate days. Hopefully using them every day will produce the results I'm after, and I'll be able to switch dutasteride for finasteride. With zero biotin in the new minoxidil compound, I assume acne won't be an issue. Using 0.75ml less solution with the RU is helping it absorb much quicker, allowing me enough time to use minoxidil afterwards.

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## Jazz1

> Hi,
> 
> So up until recently I was using:
> - 0.5mg dutasteride every day
> - 85mg RU58841 in 0.5ml PG & 1.25ml ethanol on alternate days
> - 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid 1.5%, finasteride 0.1%, retinoic acid 0.025%, progesterone 0.25%, hydrocortisone 0.1% and biotin 3%) on alternate days
> 
> For the past few weeks, I've changed to:
> - 0.5mg dutasteride every day (might switch to finasteride when I've run out)
> ...


 Excuse my previous spelling as sometimes I only have free time at work to reply. I am a bit baffled regarding your Hairloss as your regime is pretty dam strong! 

Your diet on point? I would considering keeping it more alkaline as that may contribute to your Hairloss. Avoid too much sugar, IE wheat. I also use Jason Thin To Thick and their conditioner, amazing shampoo range but it will not do much for Hairloss. I would consider adding Nizoral/Regenepure DR as they both contain Ketaconazole. I remember when I used 10,000 MCG biotin I broke out crazy in acne for months. Than after discontinuing internally, I kept breaking out when using Jasons thin to thick, due to the biotin. I then had to take tetracycline to re-balance my body and drink loads of mineral water to hydrate my skin until everything cleared. Now I can use Jasons thin to thick without any issues. So remember to keep your vitamins especially the B-complex balanced.  

You buying your RU from Kane? The RU dissolving/mixing ok? Im just trying to determine why you would still be losing hair on such a strong regime. As mentioned consider cutting wheat and have an clean alkaline diet. Check out the hairlossrevolution website the guy has some
serious information regarding Hairloss.

Also avoid the generic brand DUT or Finesteride as I have read tons of stories where people have used legit brand DUT/Propecia and then switches to generic that then lead to Hairloss. The consistency is a huge difference in generic and legit brand. 

You also considered mixing your RU in stemoxydine neogenic?

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## Alex5

Hey

I'm new here so sorry for being clueless. I'm currently using 10% minoxidil cream from Belgravia hair clinic which is costing £150 every 3 months  :Frown: 

I read some of the posts here and keep seeing the name Susan and  "Susan's 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid".

Would getting this be a better than the Belgravia's 10% formula? Also how much does it cost?

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## Jazz1

> Hey
> 
> I'm new here so sorry for being clueless. I'm currently using 10% minoxidil cream from Belgravia hair clinic which is costing £150 every 3 months 
> 
> I read some of the posts here and keep seeing the name Susan and  "Susan's 15% minoxidil (w/ azelaic acid".
> 
> Would getting this be a better than the Belgravia's 10% formula? Also how much does it cost?


 Hey Im from London and I use to buy the 12.5%, this works out much cheaper than Belgravia. What do you currently use? Just minoxidil or finesteride aswell?

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## angelogab

Hey Jazz1, I am experiencing thinning all over my scalp or DUPA. I was wondering if you know someone who has a success story with DUPA?  i'm thinking of trying Susan's formula but not sure if it will work since apparently minox and fin doesn't work well with DUPA.

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## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz1, I am experiencing thinning all over my scalp or DUPA. I was wondering if you know someone who has a success story with DUPA?  i'm thinking of trying Susan's formula but not sure if it will work since apparently minox and fin doesn't work well with DUPA.


 Hey I will reply on Sunday as Im currently on shifts at work, il try my best to help you.

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## doke

I still see hairgrowth md is running Dr Klines promox and remox and you can add extra $20 latisse to the formula they are also selling higher strength minoxidil you only thing is you have to pay $65 for a consultation before you can order like susans made up formulas not sure if jazz has tried it or anyone else myself now i have hit 60yrs old am tired of applying chems to me scalp and now using new schwarzkopf 3D man shampoo which contains taurine and L Carnitine i also added 5% L carnitine and melotonin powder to the mix.

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## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz1, I am experiencing thinning all over my scalp or DUPA. I was wondering if you know someone who has a success story with DUPA?  i'm thinking of trying Susan's formula but not sure if it will work since apparently minox and fin doesn't work well with DUPA.


 Hey mate from what I know about DUPA, or Diffuse Unpatterned Alopecia, is a fairly rare form of Male Pattern Hair Loss it*is still a progressive hair loss condition correct? Which I guess means that it will continue to cause your hair to thin if left untreated and may ultimately result in baldness. 

How long have you been experiencing this condition?
Have you been diagnosed or did you self diagnose? 
What have you used or currently use?

I could suggest a combination of products to work synergistically, but the hair follicles need to be alive in order for treatments such as high strength minoxidil to work! You could target with a Derma Roller and diet.

You could try:

1. Susans 15% minoxidil mixture with all    additives and finesteride.
2.  Nizoral
3.  Platelet rich plasma
4.  low level laser therapy
5.  Derma Roller
6.  Hair oils or divine herbal oil
7.  Kirkland foam.
8.  Diet?

I could suggest a strong regime to try, but again it all depends on your tests or the severity of the condition.

Post some pictures and let me know on the above questions.

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## Jazz1

> I still see hairgrowth md is running Dr Klines promox and remox and you can add extra $20 latisse to the formula they are also selling higher strength minoxidil you only thing is you have to pay $65 for a consultation before you can order like susans made up formulas not sure if jazz has tried it or anyone else myself now i have hit 60yrs old am tired of applying chems to me scalp and now using new schwarzkopf 3D man shampoo which contains taurine and L Carnitine i also added 5% L carnitine and melotonin powder to the mix.


 Hey they currently do not ship world wide, also Dr lewenbergs office no longer sells his formulas after 30 odd years. 

How is your current Hairloss now? As I remember we spoke a while back.

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## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz1, I am experiencing thinning all over my scalp or DUPA. I was wondering if you know someone who has a success story with DUPA?  i'm thinking of trying Susan's formula but not sure if it will work since apparently minox and fin doesn't work well with DUPA.


 To add with my previous reply,

Diffuse hair loss is due to low T3 the active thyroid hormone and estrogen dominance inactivating the T3 in the follicle.
You had any test Free for T3, Free T4, TSH, and antiTPO antibodies?

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## angelogab

Hey Jazz1, thanks for the reply!

Here are my answers:
How long have you been experiencing this condition? Started since I was about 15
Have you been diagnosed or did you self diagnose? I went to a hair transplant doctor and he said I wasn't a good candidate for it. That was 3 years ago.
What have you used or currently use? I used finasteride for 6 months before but I read that it doesn't work well for people with DUPA so I stopped.As of now, I'm not using anything. Just Nizoral to control my seborrheic dermatitis.

I had some tests for hypo/hyperthyroidism and they came out as normal. No test for deficiencies tho. I also got SMP since my top is diffused but now I'm starting to see the horseshoe hairloss in MBP.

What I'm thinking then is that I am now going thru the norwood scale after my scalp has diffused all over.  I'm just not sure if fin or minoxidil would work since almost everyone who has this condition didn't achieve results (or they just stopped talking in the forums).

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## Jazz1

Hey I will reply tommorow, been on shifts at work.

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## Jazz1

> Hey Jazz1, thanks for the reply!
> 
> Here are my answers:
> How long have you been experiencing this condition? Started since I was about 15
> Have you been diagnosed or did you self diagnose? I went to a hair transplant doctor and he said I wasn't a good candidate for it. That was 3 years ago.
> What have you used or currently use? I used finasteride for 6 months before but I read that it doesn't work well for people with DUPA so I stopped.As of now, I'm not using anything. Just Nizoral to control my seborrheic dermatitis.
> 
> I had some tests for hypo/hyperthyroidism and they came out as normal. No test for deficiencies tho. I also got SMP since my top is diffused but now I'm starting to see the horseshoe hairloss in MBP.
> 
> What I'm thinking then is that I am now going thru the norwood scale after my scalp has diffused all over.  I'm just not sure if fin or minoxidil would work since almost everyone who has this condition didn't achieve results (or they just stopped talking in the forums).


 Hey I spoke to Susan owner Murray Avenue Apothecary, for you as she has more knowledge in this subject. The email reply I received is below:

Quote:

We have a product called Thyroid Support and an actual thyroid glandular as well as blood spot testing for thyroid hormones I recommended

I would also suggest a high Alkaline diet, reduce stress and plenty of mineral water.

I wish I could help you more on this subject, my advice to anyone is Never Give Up!

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## shininghead

I don't know if this thread is dead but I will still try my chance...

I want to start using Promox which contains Azelaic Acid, Finasteride, Progesterone, Tretinoin, Hydrocortisone, Biotin with %5 minoxidil. I am using Remox right now which does not have finastereide. However, even progesterone kind of creeps me out. I have heard that it is a strong compound that even people who wants to change gender as a woman use it. I don't know how true is that, I just wanted to bring it up here and wanted to ask your opinions. 

I really don't know what to believe but I want to use Promox because other compounds with minoxidil were not very helpful for me. What do you think of using Promox which includes Finastereide? Does anybody have any issue with using topical Finastereide?I believe it might have possible lesser side effects compared to the pill. I'd appreciate if you guide me through this

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## doke

Hi shinning i used minoxidil 5% with progestorone in the 1990s and you can still buy it in uk from a pharmacy if an existing customer i did find the only problem i ever had was tiredness at times during the day but not enough to stop using and it did work for me but as i got older i got fed up with using it.
There are some better options like trying duelgen quick dry with minoxidil and azelaic acid and a sensitive version if minox gives you an itchy scalp.
Im not convinced that using high strength minox is either safe or works better than 5% and if it does you can use tretinoin or retina a to add at night to increase the 5% absorbtion.

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## funkville

i used both belgraiva minoxidil with progesterone and also promax without fin. i can tell you that i became extremely ripped and my sex drive so so high that it started to become a problem lol.

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## Jazz1

Hey I will reply on the weekend as Im on funny shifts at work.

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## HairGuru

I been using Murray Avenue Apothecary 15% mixture with added finesteride and I am having decent results thanks for sharing this information Jazz.

I done some research on Dr Lewenberg formula to add for night use the 5% minoxidil with added tretinoin as I done some research. 

I have one question anyone try Dr Lewenberg formula? I have placed an order via Murray Avenue Apothecary as bald spot no longer sell Dr Lewenberg 5%.

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## LAMB

> Hi Guy's - i was thinking of going with NR-8, dp you know if the website below legit?
> 
> http://www.minoxidil15express.com/
> 
> if so whats with the once off shipping of £10.95
> 
> thanks!


 That is the place i got my treatments they are very legit as all of there topical solutions are made in USA and the company itself is based in USA with real address so no doubt they are inspected on regular basis , The one off shipping charge is per order regardless of quantity but that £10.95 is for countries in the EU i was charged £12.95 to USA but it came very fast via DHL just started about 5 days ago so will see if there is any difference.

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## Jazz1

> That is the place i got my treatments they are very legit as all of there topical solutions are made in USA and the company itself is based in USA with real address so no doubt they are inspected on regular basis , The one off shipping charge is per order regardless of quantity but that £10.95 is for countries in the EU i was charged £12.95 to USA but it came very fast via DHL just started about 5 days ago so will see if there is any difference.


 
Hey how are you results?

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## Minoxidil

************ offers two different versions of topical dutasteride solution at 0.1%. One version is specially formulated for sensitive skin. Explore our site for more info. dutasteride

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