# Men's Hair Loss > Introduce Yourself & Share Your Story >  Curious what norwood scale I am. Hairline corners receding for about a year

## Paulr1988

23 year old been receding for almost a year at the temples. Definitely miniaturizing toward the corners and hair is much finer than before. It seems to be getting worse month by month. I'm pretty sure I'm between a Norwood 2 And 3 but would like to get some feedback. Much appreciated. I have super thick and wavy hair when long but it's becoming harder to hide the hairline corner recession. By the way, I have been using propecia for 3 months and my father has maintained his hair for over 10 years using propecia. On the other hand, he was only experiencing crown loss with absolutely zero hairline recession. I would say he has a norwood 1 his entire life. It might be hard to notice but I can tell based off how I used to style my hair, trust me I would not be on these boards if I did not feel I had reason for concern. Any feedback is much appreciated.

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## PatientlyWaiting

I've never been good at telling NW's, but I would guess you're a NW2?

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## Paulr1988

Norwood 2? thanks for the response. That's what I figured, I just do not want it to progress if possible, so hopefully propecia will maintain.

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## Paulr1988

Does anyone think it might be a norwood 3, because I know it soon will be if it's not already and these medications do not work?

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## PatientlyWaiting

If you're a norwood 3, then i'd hate to think what that makes me. Am I Norwood 4 or 5 at 23. Unbelievable.

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## Paulr1988

I might not be there yet but I'm just worried it will get worst. If I can maintain I'll be perfectly satisfied because it looks "mature" still and basically normal to the average person and hasn't progressed to the point where it's noticeable. I've never gotten a comment from anyone so I might be a bit paranoid.

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## PatientlyWaiting

This is a norwood 3.



I'm not even there, so there's no way you're a norwood 3.

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## PatientlyWaiting

You know what, I really don't know, I might be a norwood 3. Maybe. I don't know, i'd have to show pictures of my hair loss and have people who know more than me tell me what I am. But I know your not a norwood 3, and I could even be wrong about you being a norwood 2.

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## Paulr1988

yeah man it seems really hard to tell, I guess it just depends on who you ask.

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## PatientlyWaiting

I wonder if I should just post my pics I just took on this thread, or make a separate thread?

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## Paulr1988

Patientlywaiting:

The first is what it normal looks like (without pulling it back) which pretty much shows zero balding to the average person. The second shot shows the widows peak, which I have always had but it very clear that I am experiencing MPB. The third shot is just a closeup of my hair normally. So I am probably a Norwood 2

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## Paulr1988

It's up to you, but I would be interested in seeing what level you are....

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## PatientlyWaiting

Just took this pic. This is my "bad" temple from the side.



2 years ago it was worse.

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## Paulr1988

Dude to me, it barely looks like you're balding. Are you taking propecia, if so for how long and has it maintained or regrown?

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## PatientlyWaiting

Okay, my internet connection was acting slow. Wait, you haven't seen anything yet. Let me keep showing you, you haven't seen the worst part which is my hair line.

This is my left temple.



This is the bad part of my hair loss, the hair line.

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## PatientlyWaiting

> Dude to me, it barely looks like you're balding. Are you taking propecia, if so for how long and has it maintained or regrown?


 I have been taking Finasteride 1.25 MG since November 2010. I was on and off it before that. My hairline started rapidly receding when I was 18 going to 19. I'm 23 now. We're both 23 and you're in a lot better shape than I am, way better. You're hair is thicker and longer so you can cover your receding hairline, I don't have that luxury. I also use Rogaine and Kirkland's minoxidil. But the main thing I use is Finasteride. I haven't been on Minoxidil long enough and consistent enough to get any real regrowth from it, but i'm trying. 

Fin definitely has maintained, and it probably has regrown a little bit. But I would just say that it has maintained. Probably regrew some little hairs on my temple that haven't turned in to terminal hairs.

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## Paulr1988

Honestly, I can barely tell. The problem is that we always feel our hair loss is more noticeable that it really is. To me, mine looks worse than yours.

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## PatientlyWaiting

Oh yeah and I just shaved today also.

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## PatientlyWaiting

> Honestly, I can barely tell. The problem is that we always feel our hair loss is more noticeable that it really is. To me, mine looks worse than yours.


 If you really think that, then you should get on Finasteride 1MG a day. If you see pics of me from 2009, you will see I was nearly bald. Honestly i'm not even gonna post them because they are so hideous. I don't want my ugly 2009 head floating around the internet.

Also, you can't see it from the pics I showed, but I also have Alopecia Areata on the top of my head. Which makes my hair loss even worse.

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## Paulr1988

I've been taking finasteride for 3 months now because my father has been taking it for over 10 years and it has worked for him. So obviously it has regrown for you right? I'm not so much looking for regrowth just maintenance

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## PatientlyWaiting

Man looking at your pics, I can see receding when you lift your hair but that's about it. You have a great amount of hair still, more than me trust me. There's so many kinds of hair cuts and hair styles you can pull off that I could never do in my best days. If I had your amount of hair, I would just cover my hairline with all that hair you have, take 1mg fin, and go to college happily everafter without thinking of my hair.

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## PatientlyWaiting

> I've been taking finasteride for 3 months now because my father has been taking it for over 10 years and it has worked for him. So obviously it has regrown for you right? I'm not so much looking for regrowth just maintenance


 Worst case scenario for your hair when you're on fin is that you will only maintain. Best case is you regrow.


Let me just warn you, I did get a little regrowth[little tiny hair on m temple] but it didn't happen overnight. I quit a bunch of times and have been very inconsistent. So I'm just gonna say to be very patient. You say you've been on it for 3 months. I say, wait a year to see what it's really done to your hair. I have been on it for about 1 year and 6 months and look what it did for me, just tiny little hairs and maintained what I have. You could have better luck than me since you're in better shape than I am when I was at 3 months.

So all i'm saying is to be patient.

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## Paulr1988

Yeah that's what I'm doing, I just graduated in May. I'm a bit OCD about it and am worried about it progressing. Hopefully the finasteride will maintain and I'll just forget about it

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## mpb47

> Patientlywaiting:
> 
> The first is what it normal looks like (without pulling it back) which pretty much shows zero balding to the average person. The second shot shows the widows peak, which I have always had but it very clear that I am experiencing MPB. The third shot is just a closeup of my hair normally. So I am probably a Norwood 2


 I don't think you are as high as you think. I am not a good NW guesser but I know the fact that you still have that point(Widows peak) means you are still very early in the process. When it goes, that's when you are probably a #2.

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## stratofortress

/\ Yeah, I think your widows peak makes you look more receded than you really are.

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## Paulr1988

thanks for the responses. I think the widows peak does make it look worse than it really it

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## Paulr1988

All I'm trying to do is maintain, and I'm crossing my fingers that the propecia will work because my hairline corners seem to be getting worse and worse by the day.

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## ryan555

I don't think you're even losing your hair,  I think your hairline is maturing.  A lot of guys will recede to where you are headed and then stop for many years, if their hair loss ever gets worse at all.  I'd go see a doctor who can look for miniaturization and tell you if you even need to take Propecia.  If so, I think it will definitely halt your hair loss.

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## yeahyeahyeah

> I don't think you're even losing your hair,  I think your hairline is maturing.  A lot of guys will recede to where you are headed and then stop for many years, if their hair loss ever gets worse at all.  I'd go see a doctor who can look for miniaturization and tell you if you even need to take Propecia.  If so, I think it will definitely halt your hair loss.


 Can you show me examples of this. 

My hairline is exactly the same as his, just less receeded.

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## ryan555

> Can you show me examples of this. 
> 
> My hairline is exactly the same as his, just less receeded.


 Go look at any white guy in his 30's with a full head of hair and 90% of the time you will see a hairline that is a couple centimeters higher than it was in his teens.  Look at Ryan Reynolds, Johnny Depp, Anderson Cooper, George W. Bush, etc.  Most of the celebrities who have low, juvenile hairlines have had them transplanted, like George Clooney, Sean Penn, etc.  Very few caucasian men keep the low hairline they had as children, but this is different from balding.  The poster of this thread has seen some recession at the corners and temples, but not in the front yet, so it looks more receded than it is.  If his hairline is indeed maturing, he will eventually begin to see some recession in the front so that it comes to balance with the sides and then it will stop.  The only way to tell for sure is to see a doctor who can look for miniaturization with a digital microscope or a bulk analysis tool.  If the level of miniaturization behind the hairline is the same as in the "permanent zone," then you are not balding and you don't need hair loss meds. You do have to learn to accept that your adult hairline is going to look different than when you were a child.

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## Paulr1988

> I don't think you're even losing your hair,  I think your hairline is maturing.  A lot of guys will recede to where you are headed and then stop for many years, if their hair loss ever gets worse at all.  I'd go see a doctor who can look for miniaturization and tell you if you even need to take Propecia.  If so, I think it will definitely halt your hair loss.


 Ryan555:

Thanks for the response. Although it does appear my hairline is maturing, the fact that the hairs are thinning and miniaturizing (which may be hard to see in the pictures)indicates some form of MPB. Since I have been taking propecia for 3 months given by a doc, hopefully it will work. I think my widow's week (which I have always had) accentuates my hairline corner recession

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## ryan555

> Ryan555:
> 
> Thanks for the response. Although it does appear my hairline is maturing, the fact that the hairs are thinning and miniaturizing (which may be hard to see in the pictures)indicates some form of MPB. Since I have been taking propecia for 3 months given by a doc, hopefully it will work.


 If the hair in your hairline is miniaturizing, that is all normal.  It is going to miniaturize before it falls out.  If the hair behind your hairline on the top and back of your head are showing a lot of miniaturization, then yes that would indicate hair loss.

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## Paulr1988

Ok, that's good news because I definitely am not losing any hair on the back or top of my head.

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## yeahyeahyeah

> Go look at any white guy in his 30's with a full head of hair and 90% of the time you will see a hairline that is a couple centimeters higher than it was in his teens.  Look at Ryan Reynolds, Johnny Depp, Anderson Cooper, George W. Bush, etc.  Most of the celebrities who have low, juvenile hairlines have had them transplanted, like George Clooney, Sean Penn, etc.  Very few caucasian men keep the low hairline they had as children, but this is different from balding.  The poster of this thread has seen some recession at the corners and temples, but not in the front yet, so it looks more receded than it is.  If his hairline is indeed maturing, he will eventually begin to see some recession in the front so that it comes to balance with the sides and then it will stop.  The only way to tell for sure is to see a doctor who can look for miniaturization with a digital microscope or a bulk analysis tool.  If the level of miniaturization behind the hairline is the same as in the "permanent zone," then you are not balding and you don't need hair loss meds. You do have to learn to accept that your adult hairline is going to look different than when you were a child.


 Aside from George W bush, the rest have always had the V shaped hairline.

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## ccmethinning

It's always a bit tougher to tell with guys that have a widows peak. 

What I see though is a NW 1.5 "mature hairline".

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## Paulr1988

Appreciate the replies.

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## PatientlyWaiting

> Appreciate the replies.


 Look at you all popular, getting 4 pages with your first thread.

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## Paulr1988

I wish I didnt even have to be on here, this time last year I had no clue about MPB and it never crossed my mind, but the more opinions I get the better

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## JJacobs152

> Look at you all popular, getting 4 pages with your first thread.


 I really think that you're a NW2...you have a strong mature hairline. If you look at my hairline, do a search for my threads, you can see the typical horse shoe pattern.

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## Paulr1988

Thanks for the replies minus that tool scorpion

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## PatientlyWaiting

> I really think that you're a NW2...you have a strong mature hairline. If you look at my hairline, do a search for my threads, you can see the *typical horse shoe pattern*.


 I have that too.

People are going by what they see, and they can only see the temples and hairline. I haven't showed a picture of my top. Let me see if I can take one now. But I definitely have the horse shoe shape on the top of my head, plus like three patches of Alopecia Areata hair loss.

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## Paulr1988

Is alopecia areata dht related?

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## PatientlyWaiting

Keep in my mind I shave my head in a way that would minimize the appearance of the "horse shoe pattern" but I definitely have it. Maybe you can not tell in this picture, but if I let my hair grow naturally, it shows up.

Blue and Green: MPB
Red: Alopecia Areata

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## PatientlyWaiting

> Is alopecia areata dht related?


 I don't think so. It's an auto-immune disease.

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## Paulr1988

Will that hair ever grow back/return? The alopecia areata that is.

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## PatientlyWaiting

I'm not sure, and the dermatologist don't know either. It started last year, they treated it with corticosteroid injections 4 times and it went from bald to how it is now. the spots I outlined with red were completely hairless before treatment. I'm going to get a 5th injection later this month. I'm currently on a topical ointment named Clobetasol Propionate 0.05%, which was prescribed by my dermatologist. It hasn't done anything that I can see.

It's really frustrating battling both types of hair losses at the same time. And just when I started getting good results treating MPB last ear, was when alopecia areata came through to crash the party. 

It just came like "Hold on, this party ain't over 'till I say I so hahaha *evil laugh*".

 :Frown:

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## Paulr1988

That sucks dude, now you got me paranoid thinking I might get it haha

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## Paulr1988

I'm kidding I can only worry about mpb for and hope in not the 10&#37; or whatever that sees no results

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## PatientlyWaiting

Before I got it, I read about it but never worried about it. I didn't think I was ever gonna get it. Then it just hit me midway through 22 last year.

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## PatientlyWaiting

If by any chance you saw the Spurs vs OKC game today, that's exactly the type of game i'm playing against hair loss. The refs are against me, they don't want me to win. It's rigged game. Just when I think I might win, I get hit with another BS type of hair loss.

I won't give up, not any time soon, especially not with the new treatments coming soon. But it makes it hard to keep fighting it at this moment. I've at least arrested my hair loss. I have the same amount of hair I had in 2010, minus the patches. I guess that's a positive.

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## Paulr1988

I definitely watched it I'm from Dallas but went to OU. Haha that's quite a comparison

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## Paulr1988

I keep hearing about these new treatments but I also hear doubts about them actually coming out. Hopefully I can stick with propecia (if it works) for a while and wait for something to develop. Like I said earlier, my father has been using propecia for over 10 years and has maintained just about everything in that time span

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## PatientlyWaiting

I'm not form Texas, but I grew up a Spurs fan because of Duncan and Robinson. You know the NBA wants to see OKC vs Heat. They don't want the old guys like Duncan and Garnett in the finals. So many bullsh-t calls on the Spurs, and OKC could get away with anything.

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## PatientlyWaiting

Finasteride has definitely arrested my hair loss I can't complain about that. What I haven't gotten was much regrowth not even from minoxidil.

What I think about the new treatments that are "5 years away" or are coming out in "2015", is that they will either not live up to the hype, or they will work but will cost an arm and a leg and I will just be forced to stay on finasteride or dutasteride.

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## Paulr1988

Agreed. There were definitely a number of bs calls. I strongly dislike the Spursbecause I'm a Mavericks fan, much havingmuch respect for there organization/team. Going to the University of Oklahoma, I kept hearing all these kids from OKC talk trash on the Mavs so by default I have to hate them back haha

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## Paulr1988

For some reason, I just have this fear that I'll be a non-responder.

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## PatientlyWaiting

Lol, I have family in Dallas, an uncle and two cousins. They are Mavericks fans.


How's that been going so far? The finasteride. It's been a month yet?

I remember one month in, it stopped my hair loss dead in it's tracks. And has basically kept it there for 1 year and 6 months. But you shouldn't panic if the same doesn't happen to you. I never got an initial shed or any kind of shed, which is bad for me. Because sheds mean you'll regrow I think. All fin did for me was just stop it. I have never gone through a "shed" on fin, I don't think I even get the normal shed that every one gets. I can rub my head with shampoo really hard and if i'm lucky I can see about 2-3 hairs on each hand.

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## Paulr1988

Yeah I've never had a shed. It's been about 3 months and with the minimal amount of hairloss I have, it's really hard for me to tell a difference. My crown looks much thicker, but i dont think i was losing hair there in the first place. The hairline corners still have fine hairs and are very thin  and I definitely haven't seen any regrowth. I'm not sure about maintenance, I'll have to see if it gets worse as the months go by

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## Paulr1988

You say it stopped your hair loss in one month? Were you losing hair that quick, to the point where you could see additional hairloss month to month prior to propecia?

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## PatientlyWaiting

Yeah, I was losing a crazy amount of hair. My mother was seeing the hairs every where in the bathroom. I would rub my head downward and it's like snow falling down, but only it was hair.

Then the hair fall was getting less and less noticeable by the weeks. Finally at one month, I was seeing no hair falling at all. It's been like that ever since. I might have regrown some, who knows, but it's not noticeable to me. I suspect my left temple regrew some hair and that's about it.

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## Paulr1988

I've never had a shed even before propecia, my hair has never just fallen out. Instead, it is being attacked by dht because my temple hairs are getting finer and more "see through". I'm developing that m shape and definitely experiencing minitiarization which indicates mpb? Because I know it is dht related and not some other cause, hopefully propecia will work

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## wut

somehow posted in the wrong thread.. ignore this.

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## NeedHairASAP

> I'm not sure, and the dermatologist don't know either. It started last year, they treated it with corticosteroid injections 4 times and it went from bald to how it is now. the spots I outlined with red were completely hairless before treatment. I'm going to get a 5th injection later this month. I'm currently on a topical ointment named Clobetasol Propionate 0.05%, which was prescribed by my dermatologist. It hasn't done anything that I can see.
> 
> It's really frustrating battling both types of hair losses at the same time. And just when I started getting good results treating MPB last ear, was when alopecia areata came through to crash the party. 
> 
> It just came like "Hold on, this party ain't over 'till I say I so hahaha *evil laugh*".


 Clobetasol Propionate .o5 has something to do with PGD2.....

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