# Men's Hair Loss > Introduce Yourself & Share Your Story >  Treatment Protocol?

## tedwuji

Hello, my name is Adam and this is my introduction and story. I am a 32 year old guy. I first began noticing hair loss at age 25 or 26. I was nearly 27 when I started finasteride. It has halted my loss almost completely and that is after some minor reverse miniaturization during the first two years of use. My side effects have been minor to zero. I will attach a word doc with my family history and more details about my finasteride experience. I will also attach some photos of my hair.  My microscopic hair mapping for miniaturization and hair bulk analysis showed 38% loss in density in the leading 3 inches of the front of my scalp. I have about 20% miniaturization on the top of my head and roughly 10% on my crown. The top and crown pretty much appear normal with no loss. The front has clearly lost density but the hairline itself is still pretty much in it's original starting place, despite the lost density. I have always had a naturally high hairline and as you can see by some of my photos I can still style my hair with wax or pomade to maintain a relatively full look. However, this is only an illusion... especially in the frontal area.

I am not sure if I should get a transplant now or wait until I lose more hair. I want some advice on my most appropriate treatment protocol. Any constructive input would be much appreciated. If a posted photo is NOT dated then assume it is recent as most photos here are.

Thank you.

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## suarez

Just my tuppence worth , but if I were you I'd wait a while . You're still young and your hair loss doesn't look that advanced .You've already been on the meds for a while which will hopefully keep it stabilised for a good while longer .

I suppose it all comes down to how much it bothers you .

Good research on the family history by the way - I can get as far as my Dad and that's about it !

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## tedwuji

> Just my tuppence worth , but if I were you I'd wait a while . You're still young and your hair loss doesn't look that advanced .You've already been on the meds for a while which will hopefully keep it stabilised for a good while longer .
> 
> I suppose it all comes down to how much it bothers you .
> 
> Good research on the family history by the way - I can get as far as my Dad and that's about it !


 Thanks, it may be the way I am leaning until age 35 or so.

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## Artista

*HELLO  Tedwuji !* 
Im here-lol.

*Ted' your hair looks GREAT now!* 
Good for you!! 
I too have been on Finasteride. I have been using that med' since Aug. 2013
'My side effects have been minor to zero' as well!

Now that you are 32 years old, you are starting to have proper and GOOD foresight now, the ability to predict the consequences of your actions. 
That being said, you would *not ALLOW hairloss to ruin your emotions and your life*-which is great.
To your point,,,
*It doesn't seem like you really need to have hair transplantation as yet but that is really up to you ..*
*If you would like, set up a consultation with Dr. Carlos Wesley, ("Pilofocus").*
He is there in New York City, Manhattan!

* He is VERY SINCERE* and would not fool you into thinking that it was seriously needed .
He would give you very good objective advice.
(I have been the second patient of his Pilofocus 3rd phase testings~ last Nov. 2015) 

*Cheers !*

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## tedwuji

> *HELLO  Tedwuji !* 
> Im here-lol.
> 
> *Ted' your hair looks GREAT now!* 
> Good for you!! 
> I too have been on Finasteride. I have been using that med' since Aug. 2013
> 'My side effects have been minor to zero' as well!
> 
> Now that you are 32 years old, you are starting to have proper and GOOD foresight now, the ability to predict the consequences of your actions. 
> ...


 Yeah thanks for the reply bro.... i would love to get a scarless procedure like PiloFocus with some possible regen... assuming it all pans out that way!

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## Artista

*Im glad that you know a bit about Pilofocus and Dr. Wesley's Phase Testings which is ongoing of course.*
*HOPEFULLY, his 'new science' turns out to be verified as a 'game-changer'* 
Until that time,,lets ALL of us live our lives as positive as we all can!! 
No reason not too.
I wish my hair looked like yours Ted' ,,lol,,but true.

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## JoeTillman

I'm answering after Ted sent me his photos as well as a very detailed background on what he's done to fight his hair loss as well as family history.

Well, here is my thought. Don't get any surgery. Your hairline looks great. It is natural and frames your face well. Nothing can imitate nature as well as nature. You are taking a gamble with any surgery. Besides, being 32 you look like you are 25 as is. The top looks very full and given your age I'd be surprised if you even hit a NW3A much less a 5A as long as you maintain your medical regimen. In your email to me you asked if it were ok to go ahead and get a lower, dense pack NW2 hairline. Your hairline is already a NW2 and to make it any more aggressive right now is not only messing with perfection, it's just downright greedy :Smile:  

I would avoid any more consultations, and avoid the forums. Just move on and if you see things progressing THEN you can come back and start talking about options.

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## tedwuji

> I'm answering after Ted sent me his photos as well as a very detailed background on what he's done to fight his hair loss as well as family history.
> 
> Well, here is my thought. Don't get any surgery. Your hairline looks great. It is natural and frames your face well. Nothing can imitate nature as well as nature. You are taking a gamble with any surgery. Besides, being 32 you look like you are 25 as is. The top looks very full and given your age I'd be surprised if you even hit a NW3A much less a 5A as long as you maintain your medical regimen. In your email to me you asked if it were ok to go ahead and get a lower, dense pack NW2 hairline. Your hairline is already a NW2 and to make it any more aggressive right now is not only messing with perfection, it's just downright greedy 
> 
> I would avoid any more consultations, and avoid the forums. Just move on and if you see things progressing THEN you can come back and start talking about options.


 Ah... great reply, Joe. Your advice is directly inline with what IAHRS surgeon Dr. Robert Haber told me. Which was to wait because there's not enough loss.

I admit to some hair greed, but being 32 and a half (25% the way thru my 30s) i am feeling a bit safe in any approach i may take because of such a good response to finasteride. My loss since 2010 when i started the drug has been figuratively or maybe literally 0. Truly halted and in combination with my age makes me feel greedy and "brave". Thanks again for the reply!

PS your website rocks and was easy to use!

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## Artista

Great advice given to Ted' , Joe Tillman! 
Hey Ted' ~ Joe certainly does KNOW what he's talking about and his advice to you is very commonsense!!
It was very good and REAL commonsense  advice Joe!!

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## jamesst11

> Hello, my name is Adam and this is my introduction and story. I am a 32 year old guy. I first began noticing hair loss at age 25 or 26. I was nearly 27 when I started finasteride. It has halted my loss almost completely and that is after some minor reverse miniaturization during the first two years of use. My side effects have been minor to zero. I will attach a word doc with my family history and more details about my finasteride experience. I will also attach some photos of my hair.  My microscopic hair mapping for miniaturization and hair bulk analysis showed 38% loss in density in the leading 3 inches of the front of my scalp. I have about 20% miniaturization on the top of my head and roughly 10% on my crown. The top and crown pretty much appear normal with no loss. The front has clearly lost density but the hairline itself is still pretty much in it's original starting place, despite the lost density. I have always had a naturally high hairline and as you can see by some of my photos I can still style my hair with wax or pomade to maintain a relatively full look. However, this is only an illusion... especially in the frontal area.
> 
> I am not sure if I should get a transplant now or wait until I lose more hair. I want some advice on my most appropriate treatment protocol. Any constructive input would be much appreciated. If a posted photo is NOT dated then assume it is recent as most photos here are.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
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 It was so weird reading your post, because your hair loss is like IDENTICAL to mine, with a little more thinning in the crown. It is like looking at pictures of myself.  I also want to go the transplant route, but agree with these other guys.  It's just too risky.  You are transplanting into still a lot of native hair.  I learned my lesson the HARD way, by getting one and losing a LOT of hair because of it.  An HT, like Joe and spex and other mentors say, should be like a last resort.  Exhaust all your possibilities first, because one of them may work well, and then you will save a lot of time, hassle and money.   I am where you are at right now.  I can tell how you style your hair exactly like me too, that it can get frustrating, always worrying about it.

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## tedwuji

> Great advice given to Ted' , Joe Tillman! 
> Hey Ted' ~ Joe certainly does KNOW what he's talking about and his advice to you is very commonsense!!
> It was very good and REAL commonsense  advice Joe!!


 Yes, due to Joe's advice from here and thru his website i will not be getting a hair transplant this month.

I will most likely wait until I am 35 and reassess my transplant options.

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## tedwuji

> It was so weird reading your post, because your hair loss is like IDENTICAL to mine, with a little more thinning in the crown. It is like looking at pictures of myself.  I also want to go the transplant route, but agree with these other guys.  It's just too risky.  You are transplanting into still a lot of native hair.  I learned my lesson the HARD way, by getting one and losing a LOT of hair because of it.  An HT, like Joe and spex and other mentors say, should be like a last resort.  Exhaust all your possibilities first, because one of them may work well, and then you will save a lot of time, hassle and money.   I am where you are at right now.  I can tell how you style your hair exactly like me too, that it can get frustrating, always worrying about it.


 Yeah my crown looks 100% normal even upon close inspection. The scalp you see might just be my hair "whorl" that ive had since childhood. I have no visible crown loss and i only know its had 10% reduction in density due to microscopic inspection by a hair surgeon (minaturization mapping).

I am glad i have not yet gotten a transplant, but my high hairline has always kinda bugged me.

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## jamesst11

> Yeah my crown looks 100% normal even upon close inspection. The scalp you see might just be my hair "whorl" that ive had since childhood. I have no visible crown loss and i only know its had 10% reduction in density due to microscopic inspection by a hair surgeon (minaturization mapping).
> 
> I am glad i have not yet gotten a transplant, but my high hairline has always kinda bugged me.


 Yeah, my crown is shot...it's become SO thin after 11 months on finasteride.  I wish the drug worked for me, but it just caused horrible scalp conditions and very very rapid loss.  I am trying RU and 15% minox right now.

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## tedwuji

> Yeah, my crown is shot...it's become SO thin after 11 months on finasteride.  I wish the drug worked for me, but it just caused horrible scalp conditions and very very rapid loss.  I am trying RU and 15% minox right now.


 I myself have considered minoxidil foam for added benefit. How is the Minox working for you? Is it sticky and gross? How do you get as high as 15%? Cool

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## jamesst11

> I myself have considered minoxidil foam for added benefit. How is the Minox working for you? Is it sticky and gross? How do you get as high as 15%? Cool


 I get a 15% minox compounded with .1% finasteride, hydrocortisone, AA, progesterone... I get it through murray ave. apothecary.  I was on 5% foam for like 3 years, so I thought it couldn't hurt to up it and have it compounded.  It is a cream.  My hair is pretty diffuse, so I can rub it into the scalp.  It actually makes my hair look thicker when some gets into it.  It honestly feels friggin great.  I lightly dermaroll before applying and for the first time in a year my scalp doesn't feel like a damn war zone. I think there are a few places you can get it too. Just need to fill out an online prescription.

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## tedwuji

> I get a 15% minox compounded with .1% finasteride, hydrocortisone, AA, progesterone... I get it through murray ave. apothecary.  I was on 5% foam for like 3 years, so I thought it couldn't hurt to up it and have it compounded.  It is a cream.  My hair is pretty diffuse, so I can rub it into the scalp.  It actually makes my hair look thicker when some gets into it.  It honestly feels friggin great.  I lightly dermaroll before applying and for the first time in a year my scalp doesn't feel like a damn war zone. I think there are a few places you can get it too. Just need to fill out an online prescription.


 That's cool, yeah I figured you were having a pharmacy whip that up for you... it is quite the recipe. I was just concerned about putting things in my hair in the morning because my girl complains if my hair is too sticky or "wet" because she runs her hands through it most of the time, etc.
I wanna try Minox but it seems a bit more "involved" than just quickly poppin Fin when I take my standard multivitamin everyday. Would love to thicken the density in the front by noninvasive means.

also putting things in my hair at night might mess with my skin... for example if i go to bed with a bunch of pomade in my hair then it gets all over my forehead/pillow in the night, its asking for problems and has caused them in the past. does it give you any skin irritation? I am not sure if minox would be the same.

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## tedwuji

http://www.bernsteinmedical.com/rese...ts-and-safety/


Anyone have any experience beyond 5 years? I am hoping my next 5 are as successful as the previous.

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## jamesst11

> That's cool, yeah I figured you were having a pharmacy whip that up for you... it is quite the recipe. I was just concerned about putting things in my hair in the morning because my girl complains if my hair is too sticky or "wet" because she runs her hands through it most of the time, etc.
> I wanna try Minox but it seems a bit more "involved" than just quickly poppin Fin when I take my standard multivitamin everyday. Would love to thicken the density in the front by noninvasive means.
> 
> also putting things in my hair at night might mess with my skin... for example if i go to bed with a bunch of pomade in my hair then it gets all over my forehead/pillow in the night, its asking for problems and has caused them in the past. does it give you any skin irritation? I am not sure if minox would be the same.


 Foam minoxidil does not make your hair stick at all... also, this 15% cream dries up pretty quick and does not leave any stick residue... you can order it in any concentration minox (5, 10, 15, 20%) and have it compounded with anything you want (fin, AA, hydrocortisone, progesterone, etc...)  I like it with hydrocortisone because I believe it really helps the scalp itch.

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## tedwuji

> Foam minoxidil does not make your hair stick at all... also, this 15% cream dries up pretty quick and does not leave any stick residue... you can order it in any concentration minox (5, 10, 15, 20%) and have it compounded with anything you want (fin, AA, hydrocortisone, progesterone, etc...)  I like it with hydrocortisone because I believe it really helps the scalp itch.


 With 5 years of isolated Fin response data at my disposal I am considering adding Minox to see what added benefit it provides. I may even track my progress in a new thread over the course of a year or so. I already know Fin works for me, personally because I used it alone for so long. Pretty satisfied about that.

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## bmoreno515

heyy Ted how would you describe the thickness of your hair? Do you have thick hair or thin? Your hair looks great too I wanna see if I can do a few of those hair styles cause they look good! Also wohld you say finasteride made your hair more thick?

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## tedwuji

> heyy Ted how would you describe the thickness of your hair? Do you have thick hair or thin? Your hair looks great too I wanna see if I can do a few of those hair styles cause they look good! Also wohld you say finasteride made your hair more thick?


 Originally before MPB, my hair has always been fine in texture, a bit thin but near enough to average it looks normal.

After thinning further in the frontal area due to standard MPB it looks more thin, but I use a volumizing shampoo to add density. Also I use hair wax or pomade for styling and this can add some volume too. These of course are only temporary and cosmetic advantages however. Finasteride did make my hair more thick and is the real McCoy in my bag o' trix.

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## tedwuji

Thanks for your compliments on my style bro. 

My ex gf was a personal stylist for celebrities.

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## tedwuji

> Yes, due to Joe's advice from here and thru his website i will not be getting a hair transplant this month.
> 
> I will most likely wait until I am 35 and reassess my transplant options.


 More like waiting until 40, actually.

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## Sean

> More like waiting until 40, actually.


 Ted, if you ever get surgery in future, carfully analyze a doctor's surgical protocol.  I can't stress that enough.

Who is doing incisions?  
Who is doing extractions?
Will the doc be with you entire time or do they have other patients to tend to? 
Will you get refund if it goes awry?
Will doc extract 2000 grafts when you are told 1000(as an example)?
Do they have history of patients with damaged donor areas or halos?
Do they have history of poor recipient growth and etc?  
What tools are used?
These are just basic questions to ask before even sitting in the chair.  All these questions should be answered by a doc in writing.  If they cant answer them directly or clearly, do not go to that doc at all.

As for now, preserve what you got and try to sustain it.  Trust me on that one.  A procedure can really screw you up if proper protocols are not followed and etc.  Some folks wish they can turn back time.  Only small samples report feedback on forums.

In order for you to get real answers from those that had surgery, you need to talk to patients with no interests and unfortunately that is a smaller number on forums.  

But do not do anything at the moment, wait it out, you do not want to suffer nor be hounded publically if it is terrible.  Trust me, it isnt worth the risk, esp if you end up having a rookie do it.

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## tedwuji

> Ted, if you ever get surgery in future, carfully analyze a doctor's surgical protocol.  I can't stress that enough.
> 
> Who is doing incisions?  
> Who is doing extractions?
> Will the doc be with you entire time or do they have other patients to tend to? 
> Will you get refund if it goes awry?
> Will doc extract 2000 grafts when you are told 1000(as an example)?
> Do they have history of patients with damaged donor areas or halos?
> Do they have history of poor recipient growth and etc?  
> ...


 I agree 100% about asking good questions and educating yourself thoroughly about the specific surgeons tactics, as well as in general.

I will be going to Hasson and Wong or Rahal at 40, assuming I get one at all. Never a rookie.

Thanks for your input.

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## tedwuji

> I agree 100% about asking good questions and educating yourself thoroughly about the specific surgeons tactics, as well as in general.
> 
> I will be going to Hasson and Wong or Rahal at 40, assuming I get one at all. Never a rookie.
> 
> Thanks for your input.


 Hasson&Wong at 40.

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## Sean

Ted, pace yourself and dont jump into anything without seeing some in person actual results that had similar hairloss as yours.  It would be great if some nonclinic presented patients are willing to show you how it looks in person as well.  See if meds work or help you retain and be careful. Your safety is paramount and professionals should perform surgery without adding any extra risks your way.  Waiting it out is a good thing.  

Honestly, sometimes typing starts to get frustrating, as i couldve sworn, but I really hope you the best in whatever you decide.  As you get informed and learn on best ways to proceed, remember a doc should do what is best and safe for you.  Good luck.

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## tedwuji

> Ted, pace yourself and dont jump into anything without seeing some in person actual results that had similar hairloss as yours.  It would be great if some nonclinic presented patients are willing to show you how it looks in person as well.  See if meds work or help you retain and be careful. Your safety is paramount and professionals should perform surgery without adding any extra risks your way.  Waiting it out is a good thing.  
> 
> Honestly, sometimes typing starts to get frustrating, as i couldve sworn, but I really hope you the best in whatever you decide.  As you get informed and learn on best ways to proceed, remember a doc should do what is best and safe for you.  Good luck.


 I agree 100%. Over 30 & 5 years success on Fin, yet still waiting it out as you said. Thanks man.

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## tedwuji

> Ted, pace yourself and dont jump into anything without seeing some in person actual results that had similar hairloss as yours.  It would be great if some nonclinic presented patients are willing to show you how it looks in person as well.  See if meds work or help you retain and be careful. Your safety is paramount and professionals should perform surgery without adding any extra risks your way.  Waiting it out is a good thing.  
> 
> Honestly, sometimes typing starts to get frustrating, as i couldve sworn, but I really hope you the best in whatever you decide.  As you get informed and learn on best ways to proceed, remember a doc should do what is best and safe for you.  Good luck.


 I agree 100%. Over 30 & 5 years success on Fin, yet still waiting it out as you said. Thanks man.

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## tedwuji

Double post. Mods please correct. Thanks.

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## JohnMPB

Adam,
Do you use brand name or generic fin? Where do u purchase it from? Also, using nizoral? What % and how often?
Thanks

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## tedwuji

> Adam,
> Do you use brand name or generic fin? Where do u purchase it from? Also, using nizoral? What % and how often?
> Thanks


 I only use finasteride and nothing else. All my result these past 5+ (almost 6 now) years is directly from that drug without any question. I do not use Nizoral shampoo.

I use a generic form of Proscar which I quarter using a 99cent pill splitter. I buy from a reputable national chain brick-and-mortar pharmacy in the USA and I recommend never buying online. Go to Walmart, Walgreens, etc.

My results have been great and I am sure I would have much less hair without this drug.


- Walmart is $9 dollars for 30 5mg pills  30x4(quartered) is 120 doses or days of use. 
- I spend about 27 dollars per year and 15 seconds a day to keep a Norwood 2 hairline.

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## tedwuji

> Adam,
> Do you use brand name or generic fin? Where do u purchase it from? Also, using nizoral? What % and how often?
> Thanks


 I suggest starting with a single treatment alone so you can have isolated results. Otherwise you will not know which treatment is working and which is a waste of time and money.

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## JohnMPB

> I suggest starting with a single treatment alone so you can have isolated results. Otherwise you will not know which treatment is working and which is a waste of time and money.


 Good call. You do have an awesome head of hair. Any reason besides the above to not use nizoral? It has a few good studies backing it up and helps with dandruff (not sure if you suffer from dandruff or not). It's also otc and you only have to use it a few times a week.

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## tedwuji

> Good call. You do have an awesome head of hair. Any reason besides the above to not use nizoral? It has a few good studies backing it up and helps with dandruff (not sure if you suffer from dandruff or not). It's also otc and you only have to use it a few times a week.


 I am not fully convinced of it's benefit as it is not FDA approved for hair loss. I know of which studies you speak, however I have seen other ones that contradict them. To answer your question I have never had any dandruff issues. My guess is that nizroal shampoo would be a very marginal benefit for hair loss when used alone, at best.

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## tedwuji

> I am not fully convinced of it's benefit as it is not FDA approved for hair loss. I know of which studies you speak, however I have seen other ones that contradict them. To answer your question I have never had any dandruff issues. My guess is that nizroal shampoo would be a very marginal benefit for hair loss when used alone, at best.


 I have been considering using minoxidil ever since i passed the 5 year mark with finasteride, but it seems too involved for me. I think I won't do that either. Maybe I will just keep doing what works.

Oh and thanks for the compliments on my mop head of hair!   :Smile:

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## JohnMPB

> I have been considering using minoxidil ever since i passed the 5 year mark with finasteride, but it seems too involved for me. I think I won't do that either. Maybe I will just keep doing what works.


 If you are comfortable with your hair (pretty sure 99.9% of guys on here would be) then I agree-stick to what's working and what's easy. Given the 10 year fin results I'm sure you have nothing to worry about. Good luck

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## JohnMPB

Oh and btw I doubt the company that makes nizoral would ever consider getting it approved for mpb. Just putting it thru the FDA trials would cost them hundreds of millions of dollars. They would never make that money back given that it's an 11 dollar bottle of shampoo. I can think of 3-4 small to medium scale results that show it is helpful. Doubt anymore studies will be done to show its efficacy. My thinking of adding it was it has some decent independent studies, it's relatively inexpensive, and I have to shampoo anyway. Anyway, That's just my lil rant.

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## tedwuji

> Oh and btw I doubt the company that makes nizoral would ever consider getting it approved for mpb. Just putting it thru the FDA trials would cost them hundreds of millions of dollars. They would never make that money back given that it's an 11 dollar bottle of shampoo. I can think of 3-4 small to medium scale results that show it is helpful. Doubt anymore studies will be done to show its efficacy. My thinking of adding it was it has some decent independent studies, it's relatively inexpensive, and I have to shampoo anyway. Anyway, That's just my lil rant.


 It wouldn't be unreasonable to add it. I have also considered all the things you have accurately pointed out here.  John can I ask are you using anything now? What is going on with your hair? Are you very bald or just slightly recessed?

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## JohnMPB

I def have less hair than you. I'm 30 years old and a nw3. My loss is mainly concentrated at the front 1/3 of my scalp. I started balding very young- 15 or 16. I've been on fin, minox, tricomin, and nizoral for many years (8+). I'm trying to start a last ditch effort to try and gain some ground on my hairline- deciding between adding retin-a, high strength minoxidil, or dr proctors prescription proxiphen. Either way I'm not holding my breath because I'm almost entirely sure to get the nw2 hairline I want I would need a ht.

I've been on various hairloss forums since 2005 so I've seen many fads come and go and hopes for cures crash and burn. I think if you can stop your loss and get a good ht you are golden at least for your younger years.

Anyway, you're very lucky with your head of hair. I'd happily take yours in a heart beat haha.

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## tedwuji

> I def have less hair than you. I'm 30 years old and a nw3. My loss is mainly concentrated at the front 1/3 of my scalp. I started balding very young- 15 or 16. I've been on fin, minox, tricomin, and nizoral for many years (8+). I'm trying to start a last ditch effort to try and gain some ground on my hairline- deciding between adding retin-a, high strength minoxidil, or dr proctors prescription proxiphen. Either way I'm not holding my breath because I'm almost entirely sure to get the nw2 hairline I want I would need a ht.
> 
> I've been on various hairloss forums since 2005 so I've seen many fads come and go and hopes for cures crash and burn. I think if you can stop your loss and get a good ht you are golden at least for your younger years.
> 
> Anyway, you're very lucky with your head of hair. I'd happily take yours in a heart beat haha.


 Thanks again for your comments on my hair. I do appreciate the advantage finasteride has given me. I will be 33 before 2016 is over and I have a similar hairline to age 23. This absolutely would not be the case without the fin. 

You being a norwood 3 post-30 is not all that bad, i suppose... of course it is normal to want more, but i feel society would consider your loss age appropriate. Also starting at age 15 id expect more loss. What do you feel is the most effective treatment you are currently using? Did you start all those things at the same time? How do you gauge which is doing what?

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## tedwuji

There is a poll with voting at top of page.

3,000+ views and 7 voters.

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## JohnMPB

> Thanks again for your comments on my hair. I do appreciate the advantage finasteride has given me. I will be 33 before 2016 is over and I have a similar hairline to age 23. This absolutely would not be the case without the fin. 
> 
> You being a norwood 3 post-30 is not all that bad, i suppose... of course it is normal to want more, but i feel society would consider your loss age appropriate. Also starting at age 15 id expect more loss. What do you feel is the most effective treatment you are currently using? Did you start all those things at the same time? How do you gauge which is doing what?


 Yeah, still chasing my dream of being a norwood 2. Even though I'll be 31 in less than 3 months, I just got out of a long term relationship with a serious gf. Now that I'm back on the market I know from prior experience how much looks matter at least in the beginning to attract a mate.

I would say anyone starting to battle mpb needs to start out with fin as its:
1. Proven efficacy
2. Addresses the root cause of mpb (androgens)
3. Easy to take- just swallow a pill daily
4. Has long term studies  (10 years as shown by the Italian Rossi et al study)

Then I'd say nizoral is a good and easy addition especially if you suffer from scalp issues. And let's face it you need to shampoo anyway. Good studies to back it up too. 

Then if you need regrowth ir thickening like I did go ahead and add rogaine. I've only used the foam and irritation potential seems to be low. Again it's efficacy is proven. The only thing that seems to be an issue is patient compliance. Although you can get away with once per day application that's as far as I would take it.

So no surprise my recommendation is ultimately the big 3. Anything else is just icing on the cake and your returns will likely be minimal.

I started first with Propecia and niz for 2 years. Wasn't happy with where I was and added rogaine. 9 months to a year later added tricomin. I routinely took pictures to gauge where I was. Which reminds me I haven't done that in ages and really should.

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## allTheGoodNamesAreTaken

Those pictures are great, you can't even tell. You have what people going in for a transplant should be hoping to achieve, don't **** with it.

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## tedwuji

> Yeah, still chasing my dream of being a norwood 2. Even though I'll be 31 in less than 3 months, I just got out of a long term relationship with a serious gf. Now that I'm back on the market I know from prior experience how much looks matter at least in the beginning to attract a mate.
> 
> I would say anyone starting to battle mpb needs to start out with fin as its:
> 1. Proven efficacy
> 2. Addresses the root cause of mpb (androgens)
> 3. Easy to take- just swallow a pill daily
> 4. Has long term studies  (10 years as shown by the Italian Rossi et al study)
> 
> Then I'd say nizoral is a good and easy addition especially if you suffer from scalp issues. And let's face it you need to shampoo anyway. Good studies to back it up too. 
> ...


 This is a good post and interesting read. I agree with everything you've said for the most part. What did you see in terms of progress during that 9 months you simply added Rogaine to your daily regimen? You used it only once per day, correct?

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## tedwuji

> Those pictures are great, you can't even tell. You have what people going in for a transplant should be hoping to achieve, don't **** with it.


 Yeah I agree my hair does look like a Norwood 3A who transplanted to a traditional Norwood 2 (as that guy would never have 100% density in his newly transplanted area, just like me). I would however, love to have a slightly lower midpoint to my hairline though, in addition to more density in entire frontal region. This may just be hair greed however as I do realize my hair looks good in most cases. The average woman does not consider me to be balding at all. That is great. Thanks for your post. What is your regimen?

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## JohnMPB

> There is a poll with voting at top of page.
> 
> 3,000+ views and 7 voters.


 Don't even think about HT with that head of hair. 99% of girls won't notice like you said. Also with that much native hair you can risk shock loss. You can have pretty much any hair style you want. Just monitor and continue treatments. 

As a,side, have you experienced any side effects...real or perceived?

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## JohnMPB

> This is a good post and interesting read. I agree with everything you've said for the most part. What did you see in terms of progress during that 9 months you simply added Rogaine to your daily regimen? You used it only once per day, correct?


 I would say based on pics I saw some fine regrowth and some thickening of the hairline. I got excited at first because it took me to what I perceived as a nw2.5. Sadly, I've lost most of that regrowth after about 2 years or so. Can't stop rogaine now because I'm not sure what kind of effect it's having and I don't wanna risk it. Some people are lucky and regrow with rogaine and maintain for many years, but I guess I wasn't the case.

I know most here will disagree with me (except maybe artista) but I am a FIRM believer that emotional stress and things like lack of sleep speed up hair loss. During engineering school I she'd massive amounts of hair and I was super stressed and not sleeping well (think 3-4 hours a night) also had a greedy gf at the time that added to the stress. During that time my scalp was in horrible shape- tons of inflammation, redness, flaking.

During my first job out of school (very stressful) I noticed an increase in shedding and bad scalp.condition. that's around the same time I lost whatever regrowth I had too. Now whenever I skimp on sleep or stress about big things like buying a new home, you guessed it- scalp goes to chit and shedding starts. Moral of the story- reduce stress and stay on a good sleep schedule. IMO that's very important.

I used to work out frequently  (currently recovering from shoulder surgery) this is totally anecdotal but I felt like lifting heavy may contribute a bit to shedding due to the temporary spike in test. I didn't really let that stop me though cuz I guess I rather be more healthy. What are your thoughts on this? Do you work out?

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## tedwuji

> I would say based on pics I saw some fine regrowth and some thickening of the hairline. I got excited at first because it took me to what I perceived as a nw2.5. Sadly, I've lost most of that regrowth after about 2 years or so. Can't stop rogaine now because I'm not sure what kind of effect it's having and I don't wanna risk it. Some people are lucky and regrow with rogaine and maintain for many years, but I guess I wasn't the case.
> 
> I know most here will disagree with me (except maybe artista) but I am a FIRM believer that emotional stress and things like lack of sleep speed up hair loss. During engineering school I she'd massive amounts of hair and I was super stressed and not sleeping well (think 3-4 hours a night) also had a greedy gf at the time that added to the stress. During that time my scalp was in horrible shape- tons of inflammation, redness, flaking.
> 
> During my first job out of school (very stressful) I noticed an increase in shedding and bad scalp.condition. that's around the same time I lost whatever regrowth I had too. Now whenever I skimp on sleep or stress about big things like buying a new home, you guessed it- scalp goes to chit and shedding starts. Moral of the story- reduce stress and stay on a good sleep schedule. IMO that's very important.
> 
> I used to work out frequently  (currently recovering from shoulder surgery) this is totally anecdotal but I felt like lifting heavy may contribute a bit to shedding due to the temporary spike in test. I didn't really let that stop me though cuz I guess I rather be more healthy. What are your thoughts on this? Do you work out?


 That's tempting with the rogain and i think stress could probably exacerbate the progression of balding in those already vulnerable. As far as lifting goes, it is hard to say. I workout 5 days per week with weights and/or cardio, i dont think that alone effected my hair loss, but maybe that is because my fin response is pretty good.

Side effects from fin are nearly zip, thankfully.

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## JohnMPB

What side effects exactly do you experience if you don't mind?

I feel like as im now getting up in age, my sex drive isn't what it used to be compared to my late teens early twenties. But it also makes me wonder how much fin is affecting it.

Oh and BTW I always tried to use Rogaine twice a day, I left that part out.

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## tedwuji

> What side effects exactly do you experience if you don't mind?
> 
> I feel like as im now getting up in age, my sex drive isn't what it used to be compared to my late teens early twenties. But it also makes me wonder how much fin is affecting it.
> 
> Oh and BTW I always tried to use Rogaine twice a day, I left that part out.


 Sorry for late reply, been busy.

Finasteride makes semen watery and maybe erections 10% less frequent but stil feeling pretty good these days. No complaints from women!  :Smile:

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## JohnMPB

Without getting into too much details I still experience your first side. My ex even commented on it. Seems like it's not one of the sides that goes away.

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## tedwuji

> Without getting into too much details I still experience your first side. My ex even commented on it. Seems like it's not one of the sides that goes away.


 Yeah the medical literature documents that one pretty well. Oh well, gotta take the pros with the cons i guess.

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## tedwuji

Glad I did not get a transplant. Content with my situation.

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## Zdude

Good. Your hairline is fine.

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## tedwuji

> Good. Your hairline is fine.


 Yeah, it would be nice if it was a tad lower (1-2cm) but this is not an unmanageable scenario from a style or aesthetic point if view. Thanks.

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## tedwuji

.

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## tedwuji

Over 6 years on finasteride.

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## tedwuji

In general, what is the ideal age for a hair transplant?

What is the age which ethical surgeons would unanimously agree it is "safe" to get a transplant assuming no donor thinning or any other abnormal occurences? I.e. a good transplant candidate.

Just looking for maybe an average age as everyone is different.  I am guessing it is around 35 as Spencer Kobren said he doesnt recommend any guy get FUT under 35 on the radio show before. Thoughts?

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## Sean

I wouldnt think there really is a set age as it is based on your own physiology and circumstances. 


However,  if you are balding fast in your 20s and a Norwood 4 by 24, then id wait at least over 35 to see how this is headed or if it stabilizes.  Then decide if you are comfy with a procedure and if any meds work on you.

If you are receding very slowly and still holding ground well at age 30 the you may consider one around that time.  

Some decisions may need to be made depending on hair loss in your family overall.

Its best if you do not have to get a procedure, but if you do and the circumstances are right, then age 30+ should be a good starting point imo. 


I know some known docs that did fut to kid out of high school.   This was for a natural hairloss case.  That id disagree with.

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## tedwuji

> I wouldnt think there really is a set age as it is based on your own physiology and circumstances. 
> 
> 
> However,  if you are balding fast in your 20s and a Norwood 4 by 24, then id wait at least over 35 to see how this is headed or if it stabilizes.  Then decide if you are comfy with a procedure and if any meds work on you.
> 
> If you are receding very slowly and still holding ground well at age 30 the you may consider one around that time.  
> 
> Some decisions may need to be made depending on hair loss in your family overall.
> 
> ...


 Yes i am well aware all people are different but for example some doctors simply will not work on balding men under age 25. Its a fast rule of thumb for some very renowned AHLA surgeons. I think 35 would be safe for almost anyone to decide if they are a candidate or not.

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## tedwuji

> These are very tough questions to answer. In my experience, I think most doctors will at least say that 25 is a general threshold to consider but, as with anything, caveats exist. The idea is that FUE is "safer" so younger patients can be accepted but I've got mixed feelings about that. A bad result is still a bad result, regardless of the technique. One thing that I've learned is that the technique is irrelevant when you're talking to a patient that feels "butchered" and that includes FUE patients. The bad FUE results of today are no different, psychologically, than the bad plug patients of thirty years ago. I'm currently in regular contact with multiple patients that have had FUE and are in various states of depression due to unnatural results, over harvested donor zones, or a combination of effects. 
> 
> For strip, I think 30 is the threshold, especially now with the negative image it has in the market. Most patients considering strip now, in 2016/2017 are doing so only because they've really thought long and hard about what it involves and the side effects that are unique to strip alone.


 
https://www.baldtruthtalk.com/thread...ht=#post244387


Well said Joe Tillman.

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## tedwuji

Joe says age 30 is a good threshhold for FUT safety.

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## tedwuji

I heard Spencer Kobren say on the radio show that men should not get a strip procedure before age 35.

Anyone have thoughts?

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## Sean

35 and if possible then get no procedure.  Having no procedure is probably best.  You do not want to end up chasing procedures to get things resolved if you get screwed.  

I think that would be the best statement for this procedure.

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## tedwuji

> 35 and if possible then get no procedure.  Having no procedure is probably best.  You do not want to end up chasing procedures to get things resolved if you get screwed.  
> 
> I think that would be the best statement for this procedure.


 Do you feel the same way about an FUE procedure?

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## Rizaan

You're very lucky to have that hair at 32. i'm almost 21, and way, way worse

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## tedwuji

> You're very lucky to have that hair at 32. i'm almost 21, and way, way worse


 I'm 33 now and still the same.

I suggest Propecia.

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## Rizaan

> I'm 33 now and still the same.
> 
> I suggest Propecia.


 When did you start using it? How much did you regrow?

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## tedwuji

> When did you start using it? How much did you regrow?


 I started finasteride at age 26, almost 27 (26.8 years old to be exact).

During the first two years I saw the thickening of miniaturized hairs. After the initial progress I maintained at that level or very near it until the present time. I feel I may have more hair now than I did at age 26. This is amazing.

It is worth mentioning that finasteride is the only thing I have ever used in my life to treat hair loss. There are no additional varibales in my case. My case study data as a finasteride user has no compounding variables.

Also, I actually have always used a generic form of Proscar. That is 5mg quartered, since day one. I have never actually paid full price for brand name Propecia or brand name Proscar. I found a reputable generic that works and I never changed.

9 dollars for a 4-month supply of medicine at Wal-Mart. That is about $27 USD per year to keep the hair you see on my opening post. It has been the better part of a decade and the medicine is still doing it's job perfectly.

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## Rizaan

Any you've had literally zero side effects, I presume?

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## tedwuji

> Any you've had literally zero side effects, I presume?


 No serious sides. Certainly none that are going to make me stop the medicine and go from what I got to a Norwood 4.

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## tedwuji

I am American and live in USA, but spend a lot of time teaching in Seoul.

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## tedwuji

.

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## tedwuji

I moved to New Zealand for a computer job.

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## Hairhope4ever

Hi Ted,

First and foremost I would like to commend you on your regiment, and your patience for holding out on a surgery. A transplant is a huge decision that can have both positive, and negative ramifications depending on due diligence and clinic of choice. 

Unfortunately, unlike yourself, I jumped and had my first procedure at 19 because of my hair loss commencing at age 17. I felt like my youth and college years were robbed from me. It was the biggest mistake of my life, and one that led to me getting on a "transplant treadmill." I had 3 additional botched FUE procedures after my first procedure, which was a strip. The last 2 of those FUE procedures were attempted repairs by the same clinic due to the egregious result and scarring I was left with.

Long story short, I had my only successful procedure with Dr. Sanusi Umar last January for 6500 FUE head (the little of it I had left), body, and beard grafts. He is the only surgeon who was transparent with me, who did not monetize me, and  most importantly the only one that gave me the result he said he would give me. I have my second and final procedure with him scheduled in October. Final because I feel that after this procedure I have officially beaten hair loss. If you look at my blog, I went from a NW6 to a full restoration.

My advice to you is to let your hair loss continue to evolve. Definitely use rogaine foam, and fin if you do not have any detrimental side effects from it. When you feel that your hair loss has reached its apex, due your due diligence regarding which clinic you go to. Most importantly, take your time with the decision.

Good luck my friend.


http://hairtransplanttestimonial.blogspot.com/

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## tedwuji

I have never had a hair transplant in my life.    All my hair is my own natural hair.


I have decided not get a hair transplant, ever.


Thanks.

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## JohnMPB

> Hi Ted,
> 
> First and foremost I would like to commend you on your regiment, and your patience for holding out on a surgery. A transplant is a huge decision that can have both positive, and negative ramifications depending on due diligence and clinic of choice. 
> 
> Unfortunately, unlike yourself, I jumped and had my first procedure at 19 because of my hair loss commencing at age 17. I felt like my youth and college years were robbed from me. It was the biggest mistake of my life, and one that led to me getting on a "transplant treadmill." I had 3 additional botched FUE procedures after my first procedure, which was a strip. The last 2 of those FUE procedures were attempted repairs by the same clinic due to the egregious result and scarring I was left with.
> 
> Long story short, I had my only successful procedure with Dr. Sanusi Umar last January for 6500 FUE head (the little of it I had left), body, and beard grafts. He is the only surgeon who was transparent with me, who did not monetize me, and  most importantly the only one that gave me the result he said he would give me. I have my second and final procedure with him scheduled in October. Final because I feel that after this procedure I have officially beaten hair loss. If you look at my blog, I went from a NW6 to a full restoration.
> 
> My advice to you is to let your hair loss continue to evolve. Definitely use rogaine foam, and fin if you do not have any detrimental side effects from it. When you feel that your hair loss has reached its apex, due your due diligence regarding which clinic you go to. Most importantly, take your time with the decision.
> ...


 I had a consult with Umar years back. First of all he's the only doc I know of that charges for a consult, most docs are free. He seemed pretty willing to do surgery on a guy in his early 20s with not much hesitation. He also claims to be a board certified dermatologist so I began to ask him questions regarding scalp issues and he just cut me off and wrote an rx for a topical steroid.

There was no followup- nothing.

He's not a guy that only focuses on hair loss as he does botox, fillers, lasers, etc. I did not feel comfortable after meeting him. I've seen he has taken on some difficult repair cases and helped some ppl out (but believe me those ppl paid a fortune). 

I'm just sharing my experience for anyone put there reading. Good luck to all

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## JohnMPB

> I moved to New Zealand for a computer job.


 That sounds awesome ted. Congrats. Vacation out in SE Asia for me and let me know how it goes. How did u land this gig if u don't mind me asking? I remember u said u used to teach English in asia.

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